This obstinacy on this point is something else, it's from all levels too
The vaccines | vaxxed boosted unvaxxed? New poll
- Thread starter Badunk
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This obstinacy on this point is something else, it's from all levels too
I'm in an age grouping that means I'll likely be vaccinated in June/July. That means I'm more likely to get the Oxford rather than the Pfizer jab as things stand as Australia only has 10m Pfizer jabs confirmed and another 10m on option to protect against our production of the Oxford vaccine hitting trouble.
J&J Vaccine Results! Looks pretty good, considering only 1 shot.
That’s great news mate!
The state of my imagination if my split personality disorder could only drum up Boy 4 and Girl 2 as my alter-egos.
whats the good new tho?
Vaccine effects continue to be pretty clear in the proportion of hospital deaths in the over-80s. I guess the green line might start to flatten off in the next couple of weeks.
Not sure if this has been highlighted already, but the proportion of Covid deaths that are over-80s has been consistently falling throughout January (this is data for English hospitals only). Maybe an early sign that the vaccine program is having some effect?
Just been reading that. Results are great. Efficacy against SA variant even better in this analysis than they were in their first press release.
Also, UK has 30m doses ordered, which is basically enough already for every adult that hasn't already had a dose of AZ/Pfizer, so I think we should be able to mop up all the lower risk groups fairly quickly if supply comes soon, and also hopefully redistribute a chunk internationally.
Yeah, when you tot up the numbers of all the vaccines ordered by the EU/UK there’s going to be hundreds of millions of doses left over by the end of this year. Although I guess the rationale is that they don’t want to be left with their dick in their hands if it turns out the duration of response is only 6 months.
You would hope if we do have spares and no need for them that we'd donate them elsewhere, right?
More research confirming vaccine resistance of SA variant. In the discussion section of the preprint they speculate that the Brazilian/South African variants evolved because of the extremely high rates of prior infection. That gave selective pressure in favour of mutations that can escape the immune response in people who caught covid already.
Which is something that needs to be taken very seriously in countries that open up after vaccination campaigns.
It would be interesting to see if we can get some case control studies in the future with any future individuals who've had two vaccines and ended up getting severe infections/hospitalisations and identify if there are certain strains that will still wreaking havoc despite the inoculation to guide what to use as immunogen when we inevitably tinker around to update the vaccine. Perhaps maybe something to consider even with the single jab patients who are falling ill.
Also the clinical correlation to low neutralising antibody titres with infections or severe disease remains to be seen. I'd be inclined to presume so since the inverse *seems* to be true but who knows.
Also this interesting bit, possibly more optimistic bit, regarding T-cells
News today that Moderna is working on a variant-targeting "booster" jab
https://www.nbcnews.com/science/sci...er-shot-targets-south-african-variant-rcna310
https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/...vid-vaccine-address-virus-variant/6802803002/
Yeah, science!
Science will save the day, no doubt.Mind you, the more I read about these variants the more it makes me wonder if science could be causing problems too. Specifically monoclonal antibodies. Saturating the virus with a single type of antibody seems much more likely to create specific escape mutations than “natural” immunity which will blitz the virus with all sorts of different antibodies (on the plus side, hopefully this also means that homegrown immunity will still find a way to get at the virus despite lab tests showing varying degrees of resistance).
I’m sure there’ll be a tonne of interesting research in the years ahead picking the bones out of all the various innovative therapies that affected the pandemic, in positive and negative ways.
Basically, if we all put our heads together I reckon we can find a way to blame rich twats like Donald Trump and their early access to unproven treatments for making things worse for the rest of us!
Excellent. When you work in an sector where the people you look after are so vulnerable it would be criminally negligent not to make this a requirement.
The Oxford vaccine is being rolled out to those aged 60+ here in India starting a week from now. What is the latest perspective on this one, with regards to efficacy after 1 dose(in preventing deaths), and its efficacy against the new, more virulent strains?
I'm not surprised, and in the carehomes sector, I think it's easy to see the justification. You can almost create a kind of localised herd immunity if you do it right. I guess we'll soon see if they hit recruitment or other problems.
In broader society I'm more nervous, particularly as it can easily become another kind of systemic discrimination, compounding fear and conspiracy theories, rather than tackling them.
That said, I won't be surprised to see strong incentives to vaccinate coming later in the year, particularly once any adult who wants it can have it. I can imagine schemes that mean the vaccinated qualify for things like reduced testing or quarantine on foreign travel for example.
In the next few months, particularly while younger adults aren't vaccinated, I can't imagine vaccine passport style rules about pubs etc. That would just seen wrong, particularly when many of those younger ones are going to work every day.
However I can imagine them being used around some specific activities though (probably on a honesty basis, rather than an enforcement one) particularly activities that tend to have older participants. I wouldn't begrudge a 50+ fitness group, or a group of charity volunteers, or even the organisers of health walks asking members to confirm that they've been vaccinated before attending.
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I'd be all for governments hugely encouraging all vaccines with tax penalties, medicare surcharges etc
There are various things you should do to get the benefits of being part of society like pay tax and get vaccinated.
There are various things you should do to get the benefits of being part of society like pay tax and get vaccinated.
The concern would be that we could easily bake in another layer of discrimination and distrust, when encouragement and inducements would help more.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-56162075
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-56162075
Interesting results from the latest REACT study - antibodies from PBT vaccine first dose look like they start to wane slowly after about 6 weeks. Would be an argument for bringing forward some of the second doses for the initial groups, as they seem to have done in Wales. Depends on balance of supply availability and risk to the remaining unvaccinated groups, but given the current improving situation in terms of cases and hospitalisations (and the upcoming availability of the J&J single doser) I'd be in favour.
The Guardian completely ignoring it is for new staff only and going on about unfair dismissal.
It's the right policy anyway.
Interesting.
With the excellent results coming out of Israel from the use of Pfizer vaccine in elderly patients it seems even more of a bad call to not prescribe as per license in that cohort. Pushing out the second dose of the AZ vaccine always made sense but not for Pfizer. Especially for the elderly. I hope they get away with it.
Wife is a carer and she has been booked in for her 2nd Pfizer jab next week , 6 weeks after the first.
Can someone educate me on this: I was under the impression that antibodies declining is to be expected so long as the immune system is then trained to effectively produce them should it come into contact with the virus?
I think at the time it was still the right call, given the programme was constrained by supply levels, and we were going through a horrendous wave of hospitalisations, the logic of sticking as many doses in as many elderly arms as possible was the right one. I just think now, with things rapidly improving in the number of people in hospital, it would be reasonable to reassess that gap.
I guess the concern is that, if they've declined a lot, the second dose doesn't supercharge your immunity to the same level. I don't know if that's reasonable or not, and I'd say the Pfizer vaccine starts from such a high level of effectiveness based on the 21 day gap, that there's some room for manouvre in any case.
That wave passed without any real help from the vaccines though. Which we’ve seem from the data showing similar reductions in cases/hospitalisations across all age groups. Which was always likely to happen. Lockdown to control that wave, vaccinations to prevent the next one.
The UK’s accelerated vaccination program puts you in a good spot to reopen quicker than most but that should really be in a context where the vaccines have been given every possible chance for maximum efficacy. There are potentially dire consequence for everyone, all over the world, if you get another wave spreading amongst a populace with only partial protection from these vaccines. And this isn’t even being wise with hindsight. It seemed like a risky/hasty decision at the time.
Anyway, here’s hoping they follow the data now and get as many as possible back for their second jabs as quickly as possible.
Good to hear. That’s reassuring.
Yes mate , it is in North Wales .
I’d flip it, give tax incentives to those who get vaccinated
If, at the end of December/start of January, with 3k admitted a day and numbers in hospital blowing through the previous peak, you were calmly thinking lockdown would sort things out on it's own by March, then you'd have been more confident than pretty much anyone else.
Also, the vaccination programme has had a clear effect on reducing hospitalisations and deaths of the highest risk groups, above and beyond the reductions in younger age groups due to lockdown.
Wales do seem to be doing some good catch up. This guy reckons they're only 7 weeks behind 1st doses on average.
Well I’d only need to be as confident as, for example, the Israeli health service. Or any other health service in the world that decided not to risk prescribing vaccines off-license despite dealing with a horrendous wave of new cases/hospitalisations. The UK was far from the only health service under immense stress when vaccine roll-out started. If anything, it was in a better place than most, with more plentiful/earlier supplies of vaccine available so less pressure to make each vial go as far as possible.
Any impact of the vaccine on UK cases has only been evident in the last week or two. A month or so past the peak of this wave.
My dad is having his vaccine tomorrow. However my sister and her other half (Having his today I think) have both had notifications, my sister is 30 and younger than I am. My mum hasn't been messaged yet and she's in her sixties.
My sister and her boyfriend are both on the large side to put it politely which makes me wonder if they've been pushed up the list as a result of that.
Is that possible?
My sister and her boyfriend are both on the large side to put it politely which makes me wonder if they've been pushed up the list as a result of that.
Is that possible?
Could be - in terms of age bands, down to 64 are being invited, but "Group 6" - all adults with a clinical condition fromt the list here: https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...id-19-vaccination-first-phase-priority-groups are also currently being done. So, being a bit presumptious from your polite description, if they have a BMI over 40 or diabetes for example, they qualify.
We will have finished all our second Pfizer doses by mid-March to give us 3 weeks of doing exclusively first doses to get through P7, 8 and 9 cohorts. Next week people will be called as early as 5 weeks after first Pfizer dose - surprised it hasn’t made the main press yet given the huge fuss delaying it made.
Good news, innit. Doesn't sell papers.
So my dad got the J&J vaccine today. He’s a healthcare worker and is 65+, so to say I’m relieved is a massive understatement. Has there been any studies on reduced transmissibility following the J&J? I can’t find any.