The Trump Presidency - Part 2

Gandalf Greyhame said:
Yep, I get this, too. Birth tourism is an undesirable behavior for many 'developed' nations. I also don't think it's unnatural to end birth citizenzhip by itself as a policy for tourist visas, but to include it for student and work visas, coupled with 50+ year GC backlogs and application rates for Asian countries is clearly a targeted operation towards specific demographics.

It's not even close to being the worst of the EOs.
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It's intent is though because whether you agree or not the Constitution says otherwise and they are trying to twist it to suit their agenda, like they do with everything else

If they use the reasoning they used for the gun issue thru then this should not pass the SC but who knows
 
Pexbo said:
Really don’t have the energy for it this time, I just find the constant news of corruption and policy making that is designed to destroy society and destroy the planet completely and utterly exhausting. With the added misery that this time around I have a beautiful, innocent little two year old boy and it’s his world that is being corrupted and his future that is at stake and these bad actor politicians and technocrats are hell bent on creating a dystopia.
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Same boat, and I was talking with my fiancée last night about it and if it is smart to go for the second...
 
Champ said:
Whilst I don't wholly disagree with what you say, I still draw the line at wishing him to be dead.

Do I wish that his kids would have to mourn the loss of their dad? Hell no, but most people don't think of the humanity behind those kind of sentiments.

Broadly though, Trump and similar politicians/influential rich figures recently have thrived off the polarization of their characters, the more people that actively loathe them, the more fervent and entrenched their supporters get.
By stating he should be assassinated or he'd be better off dead, you are in essence pandering to what these people want, a common enemy to keep them relevant.
There's better ways to fight these cretins and killing/violence is definitely not the answer.
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One quintessential basis of democracy is that power requires control mechanisms because otherwise humans will eventually abuse it. It is the fear of consequences that keeps people's actions in check and prevents them from exploiting their influence for personal gain at the cost of the well-being of society as a whole. It is correct that polarization and separation plays into the cards of the populists but that ship has already sailed, they control the majority of US media and dictate the narratives fed to the public. Trump has proven them that they don't have to fear consequences for exploiting the power they possess and what we're witnessing now is them losing the last resemblances of shame they had, almost celebrating systemic corruption in broad daylight. They won't stop unless they learn that they're not invincible and that there will be a backlash.

And honestly, I think people are still underestimating the severity of the situation. We have the leader of the most powerful nation in the world ignoring climate change and openly discussing territory annexations of NATO partners with his supporters cheering like mindless idiots. It might very well be possible that 50 years from now, the movie thought experiment of travelling back in time to kill Trump is the new travelling back in time to kill Hitler. And he doesn't even need to be aggressive for it to happen, boycotting climate protection alone could be enough to kill billions and send the whole world in geopolitical turmoil as the leader of the nation that contributes most to the heating of the planet.
 
Gee Male said:
I don't see any argument as to why this practice should not be stamped out. Countries bear a lot of responsibilities to their citizens, obtaining citizenship just to make travel easy is not something to be encouraged.
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I doubt many, if any, are doing it to make travel easier, they are mostly doing it so their kids have a chance of a better life than they might otherwise
 
Dr. StrangeHate said:
I completely understand why MAGA wants it banned. I also understand why people will take advantage of this to get a citizenship for their child.
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And I completely understand why people would do it, but even the language you use ("take advantage of this") acknowledges that it's not right. You don't have to be MAGA to see that birth tourism isn't great.
 
Red in STL said:
I doubt many, if any, are doing it to make travel easier, they are mostly doing it so their kids have a chance of a better life than they might otherwise
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You should respond to the earlier post then as I did, where the poster specifically says it is happening so that "the child has pretty easy time of going anywhere on the planet (sic)".
 
Gee Male said:
You should respond to the earlier post then as I did, where the poster specifically says it is happening so that "the child has pretty easy time of going anywhere on the planet (sic)".
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What I meant was that they can go anywhere on the planet to have a better life and better opportunities. I think I left out the most important bit. You go from being an immigrant to an expat. Settling in the US is also an option.

I will give you an example. If I went to Abu Dhabi with my home country citizenship I will get half the pay compared to if I went there with my UK citizenship for the same job.
 
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Dr. StrangeHate said:
What I meant was that they can go anywhere on the planet to have a better life and better opportunities. I think I left out the most important bit.
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I don't see the distinction to be honest, it is still ultimately facilitating travel / mobility. Flying a pregnant mother in to give birth in a country so that the child has citizenship in that country is wrong in my view - not on the individual's part (I'm not blaming anyone here), but wrong on the part of the law that allows it.
 
Rams said:
With all this pardoning & criminalizing, if I were a Yank I’d be well confused.
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At this point I think all of us in this country should get at least one pardon to be used during our lifetimes. I shouldn't have to be a presidents buddy or rich person's vouching for me no matter how heinous my crime. all Americans should have a constitutional right to a pardon.

Then start the Purge.
 
Dr. StrangeHate said:
What I meant was that they can go anywhere on the planet to have a better life and better opportunities. I think I left out the most important bit. You go from being an immigrant to an expat. Settling in the US is also an option.

I will give you an example. If I went to Abu Dhabi with my home country citizenship I will get half the pay compared to if I went there with my UK citizenship for the same job.
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But that does nothing for the country whose citizenship allows the person the privilege of the better life and opportunities. It is a give and take relationship - every citizen of a country should have some sense of duty and belonging towards the country and contribute to its progress - birth tourism is against this ethically, and takes unfair advantage of a strong passport without providing anything in return. Hence why it makes sense that those with the country's interests in mind would be against it in principle.

As for the bit after the bolded text - why should one have the privilege of being a US expat with the option of settling in the US when they have no intention to live in the country or contribute to it through work, taxes, or investment?
 
Kinsella said:
Birthright citizenship, i.e. jus soli (“right of soil”), is only really common in the Americas.

Most countries in the rest of the world grant nationality at birth based upon the principle of jus sanguinis ("right of blood"), in which nationality is inherited through parents rather than birthplace, or a restricted version of jus soli in which nationality by birthplace is automatic only for the children of certain immigrants. Ireland was the last European country to grant nationality based on unconditional or near-unconditional jus soli, but that ended in 2004.
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Thank you for the information:+1:
 
Gandalf Greyhame said:
But that does nothing for the country whose citizenship allows the person the privilege of the better life and opportunities. It is a give and take relationship - every citizen of a country should have some sense of duty and belonging towards the country and contribute to its progress - birth tourism is against this ethically, and takes unfair advantage of a strong passport without providing anything in return. Hence why it makes sense that those with the country's interests in mind would be against it in principle.

As for the bit after the bolded text - why should one have the privilege of being a US expat with the option of settling in the US when they have no intention to live in the country or contribute to it through work, taxes, or investment?
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This is exactly it. Not only does it do nothing for the country whose strong passport is being taken advantage of, it also creates additional burden for them where people do stupid things like travel into North Korea or other normal stuff that might require consular assistance.

The ones should be on one's own country to make their own passport stronger, not to piggy back on others.
 
Not even a day in and it's constant 24hrs news cycle on the Presidency, least the News Outlets get a boost of viewership after 4 boring years of competency (okay well that's pushing it for Biden)
 
Gandalf Greyhame said:
But that does nothing for the country whose citizenship allows the person the privilege of the better life and opportunities. It is a give and take relationship - every citizen of a country should have some sense of duty and belonging towards the country and contribute to its progress - birth tourism is against this ethically, and takes unfair advantage of a strong passport without providing anything in return. Hence why it makes sense that those with the country's interests in mind would be against it in principle.

As for the bit after the bolded text - why should one have the privilege of being a US expat with the option of settling in the US when they have no intention to live in the country or contribute to it through work, taxes, or investment?
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I am just saying this is what some people I know use it for. If they can settle in the US that is their first preference but it is not always possible.

Edit: I am not justifying birth tourism.
 

Zehner said:
One quintessential basis of democracy is that power requires control mechanisms because otherwise humans will eventually abuse it. It is the fear of consequences that keeps people's actions in check and prevents them from exploiting their influence for personal gain at the cost of the well-being of society as a whole. It is correct that polarization and separation plays into the cards of the populists but that ship has already sailed, they control the majority of US media and dictate the narratives fed to the public. Trump has proven them that they don't have to fear consequences for exploiting the power they possess and what we're witnessing now is them losing the last resemblances of shame they had, almost celebrating systemic corruption in broad daylight. They won't stop unless they learn that they're not invincible and that there will be a backlash.

And honestly, I think people are still underestimating the severity of the situation. We have the leader of the most powerful nation in the world ignoring climate change and openly discussing territory annexations of NATO partners with his supporters cheering like mindless idiots. It might very well be possible that 50 years from now, the movie thought experiment of travelling back in time to kill Trump is the new travelling back in time to kill Hitler. And he doesn't even need to be aggressive for it to happen, boycotting climate protection alone could be enough to kill billions and send the whole world in geopolitical turmoil as the leader of the nation that contributes most to the heating of the planet.
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Excellent post.
 
Trump:

Controls the Presidency, House and Senate
Controls the SC
Controls the biggest Social media of news communication
Controls the military as commander in chief

What checks and balances are left?
 
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Off to a great start already. But i guess cruelty is the point
 
Gandalf Greyhame said:
But that does nothing for the country whose citizenship allows the person the privilege of the better life and opportunities. It is a give and take relationship - every citizen of a country should have some sense of duty and belonging towards the country and contribute to its progress - birth tourism is against this ethically, and takes unfair advantage of a strong passport without providing anything in return. Hence why it makes sense that those with the country's interests in mind would be against it in principle.

As for the bit after the bolded text - why should one have the privilege of being a US expat with the option of settling in the US when they have no intention to live in the country or contribute to it through work, taxes, or investment?
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No escaping tax though, US citixens are liable for and have to file tax returns no matter where they live, albeit very few probably actually have to pay any tax but they still have the expense/hassle of filing the tax returns
 
NotThatSoph said:
No, he made the inflation slightly worse by increasing public spending, partly because it was politically expedient to do so, and partly because he/the party thought the policies would be worth it. This isn't a problem, because controlling inflation isn't his job, it's the Fed's job.

You then pivot to what you think Trump did to damage the economy, because your goal the whole time has been to play politics. This is irrelevant and weird. That Biden didn't fix inflation is not an attack on him or a defense of Trump.
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The pandemic and Ukraine war were the major drivers of the spike inflation, Biden cannot be blamed for that (but Trump can: he made the pandemic worse and enabled Russia in their territorial aggression).

Worldwide, when the inflation rate was brought down, thanks to Biden‘s bills we had a much lower rate than other rich nations. This is what I‘m reffering to.

It is true that the rate has stalled at 3%. We will see where Trump takes it.
 
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