The Trump Presidency - Part 2

ok, so they shouldn't be making social media posts about this and stating how they feel swindled because their auntie has been scooped up for deportation even though they were promised it wouldn't happen to them, just the bad ones? (nobody promised them and it's clearly not just the bad ones)....
What I am trying to convey is that most U.S. Latinos do not have an undocumented aunt. Most U.S.-born Latinos do not have an undocumented parent.
sounds like your saying they wont learn from this tbh - i'm not trying to demonise or generalise so know that, but this is dumb and if it doesn't change its just self harm...... and for what?
It is us who have to learn. We have to learn who these populations actually are.

Trump has been on the ballot three times, and was already president for four years. Each time, liberals thought that there'd be some great 'anti-Trump' backlash from Latinos that will sweep him away. Not only did this never happen, he has increased his share of the Latino vote in each of the last two elections.
 
What I am trying to convey is that most U.S. Latinos do not have an undocumented aunt. Most U.S.-born Latinos do not have an undocumented parent.

It is us who have to learn. We have to learn who these populations actually are.

Trump has been on the ballot three times, and was already president for four years. Each time, liberals thought that there'd be some great 'anti-Trump' backlash from Latinos that will sweep him away. Not only did this never happen, he has increased his share of the Latino vote in each of the last two elections.
and what i'm trying to convey is that is the fecking problem right there, can you not see it?

what are you saying? that all Latinos should not have united to protect their vulnerable? that i'm wrong and there are no Latinos/Indians/Asians/etc regretting their (very misguided) vote? - whoopie they increased their vote! well done! what do they win for that?
 
It seemed completely absurd that Trump could become the GOPs presidential candidate in 2016, it seemed completely absurd that he could be reelected in 2024 and here we are. Maybe the people in the US surprise us positively this time around and eventually turn on him.

As difficult as it is, I think the most important thing will be to not villainize the folks who voted for him. If they get backed into a corner and told that what they did is unforgivable, they'll only double down and become more extreme. If we want to win back right-wing voters, we need to offer them a way to change their opinion without losing their faces.

On the other hand, the outcome of the next election will also depend on whether or not the people who didn't show up for the election can be politicised.
I do not think we as EU and single members (Germany, Italy here) are in the position to lecture anyone, though? If segments of population we expect to vote dem have turned to Trump, it’s because he is more representative of their current expectations and aspirations, whatever they are.
 
MAGA will split up into 2 factions post-Trump (Silicon Valley and more traditional working class MAGA) he’s the only one keeping them together me thinks and it will end in fireworks.
 
I do not think we as EU and single members (Germany, Italy here) are in the position to lecture anyone, though? If segments of population we expect to vote dem have turned to Trump, it’s because he is more representative of their current expectations and aspirations, whatever they are.
this too, here in UK... we gotta pay attention as we've already had recent lurches. Time will tell in the coming elections, it will show how each country shakes out at the time..... but people gotta stop voting against their interests because they bought some populist salesman lyrics. See this is another example right here if people are not learning from this then they somewhat deserve where they end up. they've been sleepwalking in this direction for a while and it seems like because the Dems were not 'something' enough they figure lets try all that again, but throw in a possible singularity situation where it makes sense to get well ahead of things as early as you can - having ai consolidated at the top is literal worst case scenarios, more corruption than ever because its not just Donnie this time.... no it's the tech industrial complex, the now distinct whiff of racism, and the utter disrespect to their people, they dont even care this time round. You're upset? You have a problem? Well stfu snowflake....

just keep that shit over there please...... fix it, but yeah.... keep it
 
I do not think we as EU and single members (Germany, Italy here) are in the position to lecture anyone, though? If segments of population we expect to vote dem have turned to Trump, it’s because he is more representative of their current expectations and aspirations, whatever they are.

I think everywhere fact and science driven political movements fail at convincing large proportions of the public. In some countries the situation is worse than in others but in the end, the psychological mechanisms the far right parties are utilizing are very similar and we need to find an answer to this.

In my opinion, the underlying issue is that liberals, greens, progressives or whatever you call them are very good at analysing problems but very bad at convincing people of their findings. They think if they're right it is enough to speak facts but in reality, large proportions of society don't build their opinions based on science. They listen to what friends and family members have to say, their societal circle so to speak, and the fear of being an outcast because your political views differ so much from the beliefs of your loved ones outweighs what unknown scientists have to say.

You have it much easier to convince people of your opinion once they grown to like you and found shared interests. In that sense, one of the major drivers of the recent success of right wing extremists is that sociel media has hardened the frontiers between groups of opposing political opinions enormously because they get exposed to differing opinions much rarer than it used to be the case. They don't know each other so they don't exchange and don't develop relationships. Their whole exchange revolves around the things they disagree on.

So if you want to win people back for your cause, you need to make it easier for them from an emotional perspective. Trying to convince somebody that their vote for a right wing party is just a political commitment but for many, it is much more than that. It means that they publicly humiliate themselves, that they admit all the angry discussions they had with their relatives and friends or the nasty stuff they said in private was wrong, that they will face backlash from their social circle, that they have to change their habits enormously, that they carry guilt and so forth. The further you shame them for voting what they voted, the further you drive them in the corner, the less likely it is you will convince them of your views because if is emotionally much more comfortable in their cognitive dissonance. On the other hand, wherever people exchange peacefully on non-political stuff, the more common ground they discover, the more compromises they find. The best prevention of extremism is connection. Villifying them won't help anybody, it only drives them further away and makes them double-down on their views.
 
I think everywhere fact and science driven political movements …

There are not, not even the so-called centrist parties are rational any more. Wise words do not solve problems: if EU people everywhere complain about immigration, it’s part nature (blatant racism), part culture (unsormountably different values); if they lament being left behind, it’s part fear (to lose a social role), part poverty (they really are losing out affordable houses, hospitals, etc.).

There are so many analogies with the mid 20s from last century it is astounding the world is just replicating the same dreadful patterns. Are we really just a new markets crash away from all going tits up?
 
i'm no expert i'm from london you might wanna do a bit of googling yourself or someone with more knowledge can chime in but there are many upset latinos on social media right now who wish they did not vote for him as he's turned around and targeted them.... theres a lot more going on too according to what I'm seeing on reputable so-me but i don't feel overly comfortable talking on it, dyor here


i dont want to derail but real talk, people need to stop voting against their interests, simple, whatever the race sex colour creed blah blah.... this current government of yours look like they are prioritising policy for a select few and are targeting DEI specifically.... as well as leaning very hard into.........

in these convos it seems like people get hung up on the words and not the message.... vote on policy not because trump told you that you specifically are special and he'll make sure you and yours will be ok.... he/they lie, you should know this, its fecking stupid, and here we are

They don't view it as voting against their self-interest though. They view it as voting for their "values". Whether it's radical social conservatism and they've bought into the whole backlash against "pronouns" and DEI or they are very religious and really believe abortion is murder because their minister in a mini-mall parking lot told them so, they've bought into the whole protectionist/mercantilist/economic populism angle and actually think tariffs are going to help them, or they just believe that Trump is a "businessman" and they buy into trickle-down narrative that they need billionaires to create jobs, minority Trump voters tend to believe they are voting in their self-interest in some form. There is also, among some immigrants, a very selfish motivation where they view immigration as very much "I got mine, I don't care if others can't get theirs" mentality, a sense that they got in before the door closed and they don't care if the door remains open, if that makes sense. Some of the harshest anti-immigration comments I've randomly heard in Los Angeles, actually, come from other immigrants (either long time first-gen or second-gen).
 

Even by Trump's standards, this all seems a bit far-fetched, doesn't it? The whole ludicrous proposal surely falls down purely on practical considerations (before we even get to the legal and moral impediments). Either Trump has gone completely mad (a distinct possibility) or his administration is attempting to reset negotiation boundaries, effectively serving as an “opening gambit” that makes any subsequent, less extreme concessions appear as progress.
 
Even by Trump's standards, this all seems a bit far-fetched, doesn't it? The whole ludicrous proposal surely falls down purely on practical considerations (before we even get to the legal and moral impediments). Either Trump has gone completely mad (a distinct possibility) or his administration is attempting to reset negotiation boundaries, effectively serving as an “opening gambit” that makes any subsequent, less extreme concessions appear as progress.

His son in law jared has been touting a development project there for at least a year. That is all he knows, and exactly how much thought has gone into it. No doubt kushner promised him a cut of the profits.
 
Even by Trump's standards, this all seems a bit far-fetched, doesn't it? The whole ludicrous proposal surely falls down purely on practical considerations (before we even get to the legal and moral impediments). Either Trump has gone completely mad (a distinct possibility) or his administration is attempting to reset negotiation boundaries, effectively serving as an “opening gambit” that makes any subsequent, less extreme concessions appear as progress.
He makes outrages claims so everyone looks at that while he's taking control of the foundations of America.
 
I reckon Trump is going to do some mental deal with Iran. That's why he's going hard on the whole let's buy Gaza stuff, as Israel won't like whatever he agrees.

I think...

Could also just be Trump.
 
I feel like this sentiment goes beyond just ethnicity though. It's not Latinos or African Americans that need to stop voting against their interests, but workers of all colors and cultural backgrounds. Besides, "Latinos" is not one voting group and neither is African Americans - depending on their heritage there are big differences. Trying to entice voters towards the Democrats based purely on their "identity" is a fools errand that is proving to be more and more meaningless.
The sentiment itself is based on a false premise anyway.
 

One of the few things In hope will actually lead to something. Mexicans themselves especially have suffered under the cartels for far too long. I just hope we don't make the same mistakes we have for decades which seems to be creating another monster while putting down in another because we fail to properly cooperate or fail to weed out corruption on the very enforcement side that is supposed to put those guys away.
 
So in magic eightball timeline theory terms, it's increasingly looking likely we've got the Trump dark timeline. God knows what things will look like if four years, and more pertinently what this will normalize and enable to come to the fray.
 
One of the few things In hope will actually lead to something. Mexicans themselves especially have suffered under the cartels for far too long. I just hope we don't make the same mistakes we have for decades which seems to be creating another monster while putting down in another because we fail to properly cooperate or fail to weed out corruption on the very enforcement side that is supposed to put those guys away.
The problem is that the intel has always been there, but the Institutions of Mexico are far too corrupt to actually do anything about it.
 
What's the deal with Musk having all these 18-24 year olds? Are they some sort of tech geniuses?
No, they all just want to get laid for the first time (and can't) and so they see this as the closest they will ever get to fecking someone (over).
 

Speaker Johnson Refuses To Say Whether Trump Should Comply With Court Orders​


JOHNSON: Well, look, there are appellate processes and all of that. I haven’t followed the latest on the litigation, but obviously we have systems that have to work… We’re fully supportive of what the DOGE effort is doing and what the president is doing. It’s a very aggressive agenda that was promised to the voters. Remember, he’s delivering on campaign promises right now. We are going to be codifying a lot of these changes. And what they’ve uncovered is frankly, shocking… This is a good development. I wish the courts would allow the executive and the legislative branches to work.

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/speaker...hether-trump-should-comply-with-court-orders/
 
Saw some clips of Trump's superbowl interview. He seems to genuinely believe part of the US total debt is made up of trade deficits. :lol:

He seems to be of the belief that the term "deficit" is related to increased total debt in all situations, and thats why he's doing all this trade stuff.

Genuinely bonkers.
 
What Australia sees right now :lol:

Z7YqKxm.jpeg
 
What's the deal with Musk having all these 18-24 year olds? Are they some sort of tech geniuses?

A) That's the age bracket he mentally views as 'cool' and so he wants to work around them and impress them

B) He's a nonce (Not by the usual definition, but close enough)
 
However, 53% is not that high for someone who just assumed office. Americans like to give new presidents a period of honeymoon. Will it last long? I don’t know.
Not since Obama's entrance really has that been the case (polarization). Biden only ever hit 57% at his highest. Trump never got that iirc during his first term. And won't, most likely, during his second either.
 
There are not, not even the so-called centrist parties are rational any more. Wise words do not solve problems: if EU people everywhere complain about immigration, it’s part nature (blatant racism), part culture (unsormountably different values); if they lament being left behind, it’s part fear (to lose a social role), part poverty (they really are losing out affordable houses, hospitals, etc.).

There are so many analogies with the mid 20s from last century it is astounding the world is just replicating the same dreadful patterns. Are we really just a new markets crash away from all going tits up?

I think the world is much more globalized and interconnected than it used to be a hundred years ago. If the US were to start a war against Canada for instance, they'd immediately face an energy crisis. Against Mexico and the food prices would skyrocket. And that's not considering the sanctions that would clme with it. The backlash from a society that has been used to democracy and modern living standards would be threatening to any government. And in this day and age, you can't censor the flow of information anymore and control the narrative like in this 1920s/30s since everybody is connected to the internet and many know people from abroad.

Self-interest is always a good predictor of what is going to happen and few super-rich people are interested in global wars because it would be detrimental to their own wealth. I think what we're witnessing right now are rather distraction tactics. They don't want people to ask the right questions (where is all the money from my work going to if not in my own pocket?) and blaming minorities and people who want something to change is always easier. And the progressives make it kind of easy for them as well.

I think if nothing changes, we're going to see wars but primarily because of resource shortages caused by climate change. The countries who will be hit the hardest won't just sit down and die peacefully.
 
And in this day and age, you can't censor the flow of information anymore and control the narrative like in this 1920s/30s since everybody is connected to the internet and many know people from abroad.
but for how long? never mind the dead internet theory - how many times have we had technology turned against us? ai is already very powerful, and very convincing.

everything changes and evolves.... do not take anything for granted