The point being that Spurs are only level on points with the second placed team due to this past weekend's results and that's all it takes apparently for a team no one was talking about (Spurs) to now be the leaders (City) main rival
The Title Race 2017/18 | Done and dusted.
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The point being that Spurs are only level on points with the second placed team due to this past weekend's results and that's all it takes apparently for a team no one was talking about (Spurs) to now be the leaders (City) main rival
The thing that screams that is that we do not seem to have any urgency IMO. The Huddersfield game sort of opened my eyes to the fact that we play the same kind of football whether we are 1-0 down or 2-0 up. We don't seem to be able to increase the tempo when we are supposed to be chasing a goal and you cannot win titles playing like that. We need to change.
The media will continue doing what they are doing, change like the wind and follow whatever new storyline seem to pop up.
I was surprised so few thought of Spurs as genuine contenders earlier and everyone seemed to believe the title would end up in Manchester 100%. They are a lazy bunch. Even before the Liverpool game I wrote in this thread I haven't given up on the title, and neither should United, have some faith in the team.
Personally I think it's a 4 horse race between Chelsea, City, United and Spurs, City as favourites, but not as clear cut as some (on here) seem to believe.
Read a stat saying we have never won a game when we go behind for a year. Is that true?
There's another iirc that Mourinho has never won from 2-0 down.
We hardly broke them down, we mostly scored out of a corner or some long shot within the 1st half (Everton, Leicester, Swansea) and then when they opened up to try and get an equalizer, we hit them hard on the counter and racked up the goals.
The match vs West Ham and Crystal Palace we played some lovely stuff throughout the game.
We also have the best defensive record in all competitions in all top European leagues so far this year and this current season IIRC.TBF Mourinho teams seldom concede 2 goals.
TBF Mourinho teams seldom concede 2 goals.
18 times IIRC (2-0 down at HT and failed to win)
Spurs have always been one of the title challengers this season and to say otherwise is ignoring all evidence of the past two seasons. The only question mark was how the side adapted to Wembley but I think they are adapting well. Of course Spurs will be up there challenging, strong all over the pitch and with Kane, they have a player pumping out Ronaldo and Messi like numbers of goals. Kane could win Spurs the league for sure.
I used a lot more than just bookies odds in giving my opinion, (the opinion of professionals, pundits, along with the majority of backers and football fans). Yes you are 2nd faves as a lot of money has went on you after dismantling Liverpool which is understandable, I'd imagine a lot of pundits opinions will sway too but it doesn't change the fact United were easily 2nd favorites last season and the second most fancied team to win the league everywhere bar on Spurs boards. It's not a knock its simply a statement that millions would agree with. Why you take everything as some anti_Spurs thing is your business. Yes my opinion now runs against the majority who have changed their mind but more people still back United and have since the start of the season. But yes the opinion of the bookies has huge merit, its not often they lose a lot on football is it? If their opinion wasn't good they wouldn't make the money they do or be open.
Today you are ahead of United for the first time this season because you had a good result. Of course odds will change but lets face it a lot more money has went on United and even now with their bad form there is nothing seperating you. But yes at this exact minute you are favorites to come 2nd and have earned that through dismantling Liverpool. Next weekend you'll either take a big step on the way or United will be 2nd favorites again. It's not rocket science (opinions change). I still fancy United clearly for 2nd (along with the majority, albeit the margin is much closer in the bookies) and I expect as soon as they rediscover their form the odds will change again.
Lets recap - Last week.
United half the price of Spurs to win the league.
United ahead of Spurs
United fancied by majority of industry professionals
United with a squad 2 times the cost of Spurs
Yes, that makes them clear 2nd faves.
This week -
Spurs marginally ahead of United after hammering L'Pool (a lot of cash would go on them this week)
United still ahead of Spurs
United still fancied by the majority
United still with a squad that cost twice the cost of Spurs
United still fancied to finish 2nd according to many.
Does any of this mean you have to get your knickers all twisted like you have? Nope, not really. I was simply stating how I came to my opinion after you argued it and why I came to and trust that opinion above yours. None of this makes you a bad team. I'll stick with my opinion and what is still the opinion of the majority because there are many reasons too.
In our next 7 league games we play 6 of the current top 7 (Spurs, Chelsea, Newcastle, Watford, Arsenal, City). Gonna be a tough run, will probably define our season.
Tottenham have no back up to Kane if he gets injured.
Chelsea don't have enough after Morata (in his first season anyway).
We will have Zlatan as back up to Lukaku.
But City have Aguero and Jesus..... and the rest..
Chelsea don't have enough after Morata (in his first season anyway).
We will have Zlatan as back up to Lukaku.
But City have Aguero and Jesus..... and the rest..
Spurs have been constantly improving under Pochettino. They look better than last season. And last season they won 86 pts without having Kane for 2 months due to injuries. The Wembley factor has been silly overblown too. They can challenge for the title. They can even win it. Pochettino hasn't won tropheys but things can change quickly.
They have two big advantages over the rivals. First, they are physically more powerful than any other team. United are powerful only in terms of the height and the strength of most players but in terms of running are not very good. Many teams in the league can outrun United. City can play with great intensity but they can't match Spurs over the course of the whole season physically wise and are more likely to be tired for some games. Second, Spurs would be absolute heroes for their fans if they won it because of being a young team built without much spending. This gives them a psychological boost. By contrast, City and United have to be in the title race given their financial power.
I know that many City fans are obsessed with United but Spurs look more capable of stopping them for the title. United can be out of it after the next two games. Two draws, for instance, would make it very hard to compete.
They have two big advantages over the rivals. First, they are physically more powerful than any other team. United are powerful only in terms of the height and the strength of most players but in terms of running are not very good. Many teams in the league can outrun United. City can play with great intensity but they can't match Spurs over the course of the whole season physically wise and are more likely to be tired for some games. Second, Spurs would be absolute heroes for their fans if they won it because of being a young team built without much spending. This gives them a psychological boost. By contrast, City and United have to be in the title race given their financial power.
I know that many City fans are obsessed with United but Spurs look more capable of stopping them for the title. United can be out of it after the next two games. Two draws, for instance, would make it very hard to compete.
But what if we WANT, WANT, WANT?
That's why it's so important that we don't concede. The issue against Huddersfield wasn't the lack of creativity to offset the conceded goals but the conceded goals themselves. That's how it is with Mourinho teams, I think. Get a goal and then use that to either get more goals (counter-attack) or sit on it for the win. Winning is important to him, perhaps, but, first and foremost, we do not lose.
Sorry but that really isnt the brand of football we need if we want to be an elite team again. He didnt play like that with Chelsea, Inter, Real either, only in top matches. It's bloody Huddersfield..
I think we can still create after we've scored the first goal, I just don't think Mourinho's teams are very good at, as it were, going for it. He likes to keep it tight over the possibility of going one or two goals down.
Wouldn't two draws also put Spurs out of it as well with that logic mate.
It's well possible United v Spurs will be a draw and after they hammer Palace it's possible they will only draw at Arsenal.
Also possible City could drop 5 points in the next 2 games.
Not knocking Spurs they are a fantastic team and punching far above their financial means but they are not that much ahead of United nor are United as far behind City as people are making out.
Exactly, we do Spurs at home and all of a sudden it swings back around. Spurs are missing that x-factor, Spurs have trouble breaking down a stubborn defense. Manchester United still in the hunt, Manchester United show style and grit to push to the title. etc etc. It's still wide open.
We are nine games into the season. Nine. Nobody is nailed on for anything at this point. We've started very well, but that's all we've done. Season ends in May.
Image Tottenham beating United. Would they become City's main challengers?
If we lose to spurs, we are back in fighting for the top 4. I cannot see spurs pipping city, they are a fine team but they have that mental block and as seen in last 2 seasons, they tend to drop some silly points. I feel it is still early to decide who will challenge city for the title or will city themselves start dropping points. One thing for sure is our next two league games could make or break our season.
I disagreed with the earlier-stated notion that United were "easily 2nd favourites" to win the league. For some bizarre reason, you have tried to portray this as my being mightily upset (knickers in twist etc.), when it's simply that I don't agree with your assessment concerning United compared to Spurs.
Originally it was you who portrayed the bookies odds as representing the majority view of observers, and me who pointed out that such odds are influenced a lot by the size of bets placed (which might come from a relatively small number of people). Now you are agreeing with me: "Spurs marginally ahead of United after hammering L'Pool (a lot of cash would go on them this week)".
Your summary of last week and this week is really quite blinkered. In both cases you omit the fact that Spurs finished massively ahead of United last season - as if that fact has no relevance. And you cite an irrelevant fact, namely that "United ... with a squad that cost twice the cost of Spurs", as if this was something new that didn't apply last season.
Padr81 stop you have contradicted yourself and you are making Glaston look correct and if there is one thing I can't stand it's amateurs who give Glaston easy victories!!!
They already are according to Sky
As much as I hate to say it, this spurs team looks ruthless. It reminds me of our 08/09 team but with more strength in depth.
Really? Spurs's depth doesn't look that good on the paper.
Spurs never turn up against us. 3-1
We seem to have a mental edge over Tottenham at home and that could be a big factor. We've beaten them at OT for the last 3 seasons and that's despite them having stronger seasons then us. To prove it Harry Kane has been the league's outstanding striker for the last couple of years scoring goals for fun yet he has never scored against United. At the very least we won't lose I'm pretty sure of that.
Whichever way their depth looks on paper, they've just beaten Liverppol 4-1 on a weekend they did not start Rose, Davies, Dier, Llorente, Sissoko and have long-term injuries such as Lamela or Dembele. So I'd say they are doing just fine in that regard.
Kane scored Spurs final goal ever at White Hart Lane against United just last season ... he's not scored at Old Trafford though.
Sadly true. We would do well to remember how last season panned out after our P6 W6 D0 L0 start.
We are definitely a better side this year though - in particular in defence, which was our gigantic Achilles heal last season. And Chelsea don't look like the team they were last year either. So hopefully we'll be a lot closer to winning it this time!
Be interesting to see if Mourinho starts being happy with 1 point at home as well as 1 point away. Drawing your home games is never going to get you anywhere.
That's for sure. United are gonna be a big test for them.
You seem to keep arguing United weren't easily 2nd favorites according to the majority of the football world last week, which they were... You have a major issue with it but it's a pure fact. I've stated time and again why. I've also said the bookies are one of the many reasons and don't tend to be wrong too often.
Yes the bookies odds were clear at the start of the season on who was expected to do better. Now Spurs have made inroads, the bookies aren't so confident which means the majority of people aren't so confident... How is this not sinking in. A lot of peoples opinions have changed but not mine. I said Spurs are marginally ahead in the eyes of many. My opinion on this is clear. There are many reasons I have United as clear 2nd favorites for the title the bookies odds were just one.
It's not blinkered at all, Uniteds squad this season is far superior to last seasons.. c'mon thats clear to see. Spurs have marginally more depth than last season but there is many reasons United are seen as favorites for 2nd this season. United have added a goal scorer on a level with Kane in terms of numbers (albeit not nearly as good a player), a world class holding midfielder, until his injury had Pogba playing at almost his best.
Last season is last season. Spurs finished 8 points ahead of City last season, Liverpool ahead of United too, there are many factors in these things not just last season. The squads are different, the form is different and yes imho United are still clear 2nd favorites because Jose has a knack of grinding these things out.
Next three games are key for City to focus on themselves and nobody else - West Brom A, Arsenal H, Leicester A.
In the same time
United play Spurs H, Chelsea A, Newc H.
Spurs play United A, Palace H, Arsenal A.
In the same time
United play Spurs H, Chelsea A, Newc H.
Spurs play United A, Palace H, Arsenal A.
The best thing about this run is the meltdown on ArsenalFanTV!
They are playing City at the Etihad and then Tottenham at the emirates. They could definitely get slaughtered in both games like Liverpool.
For some reason I think they match up pretty well against City. Pretty dangerous game for city to take lightly.
With all due respect padr81, and I read all of your posts on here, I'm not sure I agree with you on this. I think Spurs are looking pretty formidable and have a number of players due back from injury. Equally, United might be better than last season but they certainly don't seem 'far superior' to last season's version. Ignoring the bookies I think I would have City as slight favourites with Spurs and United joint second. Chelsea still in with a shout as fourth favourites and Arsenal/Liverpool both fairly long-shots. The next two games though could potentially tell us a lot about City, United, Spurs and Chelsea.
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