The RedCafe Boxing Thread

Oggmonster said:
In fairness to him both the Cleverly fights were close, albeit I do agree with your sentiment he isn't a great boxer.

Bellew is a hypocrite especially when he's the one fighting (I don't mind him as a pundit when he's impartial.) He does have a history of starting trouble with people. Cleverley, Stevenson, Flores are just 3 examples of it recently. This fight he seems to of taken the high ground narrative somewhat although I don't know how much of that is down to both of them selling the fight.

You've got to bare in mind that it's a Sky promotion, Bellew is the Sky boxer and Haye has historically always been like he is in the build up. Look at the behind the ropes stuff and Bellew was shown as the family man, loved his kids etc and Haye had nothing but a yacht and a few "fake friends." It was all set up really and done so to generate interest.

Again I'm not massive on Hearn but you've got to give him credit for some stuff. The guy rejuvenated boxing in this country. He's got probably the most exciting boxer in the world in Joshua and also a good back up stable with Brook, DeGale, Callum Smith, Crolla etc. He deserves praise for the interest that has been brought to boxing. The reality is British boxing is better with him than without him.
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True about Hearn in that sense i just can stand him, don't know what it is , of late though a lot of his cards with his boxers on have been dire, on paper looked excellent but i don't think i could name 5 cards of his that have blew my mind . Also his recent comments about only wanting elite level ppv fighters grinds my gears a bit, lets be honest he probably only has Joshua who is worthy of ppv and even then he steams through his opponents so easily it aint worth the buy. He has a lot of good boxers who win world titles against the guys who ain't the best champs in their division then when they have to go up a level get found out, Quigg, Crolla, Paul Smith, Kevin Mitchell, Murray, Mcdonnell. Yafai, Joshua and Selby are probably his only real 'elite' level fighters, but even then that doesnt make ppv sense because they are just not the best to watch in my opinion, he's almost over saturated us with his shows and although it's good boxing is getting attention again it's certainly down to quantity rather than quality , he certainly knows how to polish a turd and even admitted that in an interview of late.

It's almost a cycle of:

Sign a fighter who is going to be shown on sky as they are on matchroom
Expose them for 2 years
Get them a world title shot
Win it against the easiest of belt holders
Attempt to unify
Fail.
Move them up in weight
Get them a world title shot
Win against the easiest of belt holders
Attempt to unify
Fail
Put them on an an headline show against an up and comer domestically who's called them out
Win
Go back down in weight and then try or fail again for a title.

Im not sure he's the only promoter who has that pattern i have just noticed it emerge with a lot of his charges.

The commentary biased from sky pundits on his charges also dont help. Mcdonell for instance last weekend. I know their meant to keep it interesting but he'd lost that fight within the first round, the class was their for all to see yet they kept going on about how this guy might tire. Bore off.
 
Werder Herzog said:
True about Hearn in that sense i just can stand him, don't know what it is , of late though a lot of his cards with his boxers on have been dire, on paper looked excellent but i don't think i could name 5 cards of his that have blew my mind . Also his recent comments about only wanting elite level ppv fighters grinds my gears a bit, lets be honest he probably only has Joshua who is worthy of ppv and even then he steams through his opponents so easily it aint worth the buy. He has a lot of good boxers who win world titles against the guys who ain't the best champs in their division then when they have to go up a level get found out, Quigg, Crolla, Paul Smith, Kevin Mitchell, Murray, Mcdonnell. Yafai, Joshua and Selby are probably his only real 'elite' level fighters, but even then that doesnt make ppv sense because they are just not the best to watch in my opinion, he's almost over saturated us with his shows and although it's good boxing is getting attention again it's certainly down to quantity rather than quality , he certainly knows how to polish a turd and even admitted that in an interview of late.

It's almost a cycle of:

Sign a fighter who is going to be shown on sky as they are on matchroom
Expose them for 2 years
Get them a world title shot
Win it against the easiest of belt holders
Attempt to unify
Fail.
Move them up in weight
Get them a world title shot
Win against the easiest of belt holders
Attempt to unify
Fail
Put them on an an headline show against an up and comer domestically who's called them out
Win
Go back down in weight and then try or fail again for a title.

Im not sure he's the only promoter who has that pattern i have just noticed it emerge with a lot of his charges.

The commentary biased from sky pundits on his charges also dont help. Mcdonell for instance last weekend. I know their meant to keep it interesting but he'd lost that fight within the first round, the class was their for all to see yet they kept going on about how this guy might tire. Bore off.
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Joshua is his biggest draw that's not a doubt. I think it depends how you look at his cards though. Realistically I can't name many boxing cards that don't have a few duds. Boxing (or Hearn) don't have the luxury of the UFC System where they can stack cards as they are all under the same company. There's no way Hearn would put Joshua, Brook and Smith all on the same card for example where as UFC 205 had 3 title fights and UFC 209 has 2. Hearn has about 30 fighters so he's pretty limited what he can do. A card like Wembley will be stacked though I'd guess.

He doesn't have loads of PPV fighters but it also depends who they fight. Joshua is PPV standard whoever...even if he steamrolls opponents people pay to see it. You might not think it's worth buying but others do hence he does massive numbers. Brook vs. Spence is PPV standard, Brook vs. Khan would be PPV standard, Bellew vs. Haye is on Box Office and will do good numbers. It's all opinions. For all the shite he has put on PPV (Bellew vs. Cleverly 2 for example) he does give people a lot of fights on Sky Sports which are good quality. It can definitely be improved but it will take time. Boxing is in a much better place now than it was before Hearn though for me. He can create a bit of a circus at times with the build up of it but there's some exciting fighters at Matchroom and with stuff like the Nex Gen series he should uncover some stars. I also think it's worth noting the fighters seem to like working with him so he must be doing something right with them. I've not heard many criticise him, only Haye and Eubank. Eubank is notoriously hard to work with and Haye was building up a fight. Groves didn't say much bad about him in the build up to Froch for example.

I agree he gives his fighters easy fights at times but again to his credit look at some of his current world champions and who they're fighting:

Kell Brook is fighting Errol Spence who is regarded as the best welterweight fighter
Joshua is fighting the best heavyweight of the last 10 years
DeGale just had a unification fight with Badou Jack

Equally he has the likes of Yafai and Selby who should get big fights down the line (i.e. Selby vs. Frampton.)

As for the cycle you produce I can't think of many he's done that with really. Could you give some examples? Maybe I'm reading it wrong.
 
The uproar over Haye's comments is ridiculous. Haye is training to overpower Tony and is in that mindset.
It's just honesty. What's he meant to do? Go easy in case he hurts Bellew? If any fighter is offered a vicious knockout in the first round they would take it.
TalkSport seem to be upset that fighters want to hurt each other!
 
watching a Haye and Bellew preview and both have decent punch, but I cant see Bellew handling a Hayemaker.
Both are a pair of gobby shites, hopefully they will kick the shite out of each other.
Dont like either of them.
 
Werder Herzog said:
Only ending one way this and thats Bellew stone cold out. Bang average with the flattest footwork of a world champion i have ever seen, he just plants his feet and lets go, he has proven when stepping up in levels like against Stevenson and Cleverly first time round that he's just not good enough, the second Clev fight Clev was fighting with 1 arm so was hard to judge.

Also i am not buying into the the Haye bad guy lark in all this, Bellew before his original first scheduled fight with Clev that got postponed behaved worse than Haye ever has , Haye is just being Haye, he was far worse with Klitschko with the decapitated head shirt etc and people loved that .

I'd be foaming with if i had scousers screaming over me whilst trying to talk aswell so i'm not buying much into the him losing it lark, he's smart enough to channel that into the ring unlike say Hatton who was always clumsy with it.

Don't get me wrong Haye can be a melon but Bellew is by far from a nice guy.

I actually want Haye to smash Bellew then do Joshua because i cannot stand Eddie Hearn. Always been smug with arrogance since he has practically monopolised boxing over here for the last 6 years. Be good if his main charge took a hiding to a supposed has been.
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This is what it is all about for me too. I don't actually mind Bellew so much in the lead up to this fight and I think some of the stuff Haye has said about smashing his head in is a bit much. But I want Haye to win and hopefully get the Joshua fight to show just how over hyped Joshua really is. Problem is if Haye goes out there and blasts Bellew out in a couple of rounds Hearn will just hold a Haye v Joshua fight off even longer though. He doesn't want to risk a defeat for his golden boy Joshua so will wait until Haye is way past it before giving him the fight. This fight is just a test to see where Haye is at, if he looks good Hearn will keep Joshua as far away from him as possible until he has no other choice.
 
cyberman said:
The uproar over Haye's comments is ridiculous. Haye is training to overpower Tony and is in that mindset.
It's just honesty. What's he meant to do? Go easy in case he hurts Bellew? If any fighter is offered a vicious knockout in the first round they would take it.
TalkSport seem to be upset that fighters want to hurt each other!
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What's up with him saying he wants to knock him out and leaving it there though? Nothing. But when you say you want to cause serious harm to a fighter, then I'm sorry but that is too far. Haye would be devastated if he were to actually put him in hospital fighting for his life, wouldn't he? Too far imo, and all to sell tickets. I like Haye, always have and hope he wins, but some of the shite he's coming out with leading up to the fight is well below the belt.
 
Summit said:
What's up with him saying he wants to knock him out and leaving it there though? Nothing. But when you say you want to cause serious harm to a fighter, then I'm sorry but that is too far. Haye would be devastated if he were to actually put him in hospital fighting for his life, wouldn't he? Too far imo, and all to sell tickets. I like Haye, always have and hope he wins, but some of the shite he's coming out with leading up to the fight is well below the belt.
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Haye will try to knock him out regardless of saying he wants to seriously hurt him, it's not like Haye is going to prop an unconscious Bellew up in the corner and knock his head off.
There is a referee involved.
Unless these pundits are saying Haye should take it easy on Tony then these comments don't really change anything.
Other than Haye looking like a plank.
Personally I think he has eyes on Joshua and is painting himself as the bad man who needs to be put in his place by the golden boy of boxing.
That has Wembley potential
 
cyberman said:
Haye will try to knock him out regardless of saying he wants to seriously hurt him, it's not like Haye is going to prop an unconscious Bellew up in the corner and knock his head off.
There is a referee involved.
Unless these pundits are saying Haye should take it easy on Tony then these comments don't really change anything.
Other than Haye looking like a plank.
Personally I think he has eyes on Joshua and is painting himself as the bad man who needs to be put in his place by the golden boy of boxing.
That has Wembley potential
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I know Haye will try to knock him out regardless, but do you honestly not see the problem in Haye saying , "I don't just want to knock him out, I want to seriously cause him some damage"?
 
Summit said:
I know Haye will try to knock him out regardless, but do you honestly not see the problem in Haye saying , "I don't just want to knock him out, I want to seriously cause him some damage"?
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Its distasteful but it doesn't change how the fight will go so it doesn't really bother me other than thinking Haye is a plank.
Fights that have turned personal usually have fighters who set out to hurt each other.
I just don't believe all of this is sincere so it doesn't really bother me. Two boxers who pundit for Sky are on Sky box office and they are everywhere on fight week.
Its a shitshow all round imo.
 
Summit said:
I know Haye will try to knock him out regardless, but do you honestly not see the problem in Haye saying , "I don't just want to knock him out, I want to seriously cause him some damage"?
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It's just words. It comes down to whether you genuinely beleive Haye will go above and beyond to do more harm than necessary to Bellew. Like any boxer, if he gets an opening to knock a fighter out, he'll punch him as hard as possibly can, without care or regard as to whether he puts him in hospital or not. Safety for the opposition is secondary in the ring.
 
Sky's coverage of this is really pissing me off. It's all about Bellew, I know he's the Sky fighter, but regardless - A bit of unbias wouldn't go a miss. For the past week, the main headline on Skysports.com has been a Bellew quote.

I used to really like Haye, lost a bit of respect for him after the Wlad fight, but I fecking hate Bellew. And even more so the way he's coming across as 'I'm just treating this as a normal fight, I don't dislike anybody' - Months after foaming at the mouth while trying to get to Haye at ringside.

I hope Haye knocks him out, I hope it's within about 6 seconds. I hope Bellew fecks off forever.

Echo the sentiment about AJ too. I like AJ, but it'd be worth Haye knocking him out to see Eddie Hearns face.
 
I also want to add that few boxers get knocked cold (relatively speaking) They usually end with the ref jumping in and waving it off before any real damage is done.
Those are vicious punches. A much worse scenario is a skilled fighter who slaps his opponent round with slightly less power but is skillfull enough to dance around and carry the fight for 12 rounds.
12 rounds of that is much worse.
Ali tortured Patterson for 8(?) rounds like that. His famous ''What's my name' fight when he refused to go for the stoppage and just punished Terrell for the full fight.
So when Haye promises to hit Bellew as hard as he can it's actually the lesser of two evils.
If Haye went out to carry Bellew for 12 so he can punish him to the limit just before its stopped and then lay off.. For me that's actually dangerous and goes against the sport
 
Summit said:
What's up with him saying he wants to knock him out and leaving it there though? Nothing. But when you say you want to cause serious harm to a fighter, then I'm sorry but that is too far. Haye would be devastated if he were to actually put him in hospital fighting for his life, wouldn't he? Too far imo, and all to sell tickets. I like Haye, always have and hope he wins, but some of the shite he's coming out with leading up to the fight is well below the belt.
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I agree. I am a massive Haye fan but the things he has been saying about doing serious damage to Bellew are a bit much. It's all fun and games until something bad actually does happen. If Haye did actually do him serious permanent damage after saying those sorts of thing then I wouldn't want to be him after the fight. He would have the press destroying his life, half of Liverpool wanting to do him some serious damage and someones serious ill health or death on his conscience. Saying you are going to win by knock out is fair enough but the other stuff is too much.

I hope it's a good fight and they both come out of it safe and well.
 
It's probably gone to far with the trash talk but the reality is they're both pretty poor at it. There's not much natural wit (Haye has a bit) that other fighters have. Mayweather at his peak, Ali obviously and even the likes of Hatton's persona. Haye won't want to kill him and Bellew knows that but it's a way of selling the fight and it will work.

https://sundaypuncher.com/haye-vs-b...sh-pay-per-view-event-e2476cc3c4bb#.xhd0mopiq

That article sums it up better than I ever could.
 
Werder Herzog said:
I actually want Haye to smash Bellew then do Joshua because i cannot stand Eddie Hearn. Always been smug with arrogance since he has practically monopolised boxing over here for the last 6 years. Be good if his main charge took a hiding to a supposed has been.
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Agree with you on Hearn being smug, he is a slime ball with that grin, he loves it right now. How he talked about how "they go look what's out there, take a look around, then they come back to me" on Eubanks I think it was. So smug how he said it but then, he does have the top position right now, Frank Warren isn't as big as he was and Hennesey is nothing without Fury. Heane has made some cracking fights and put on decent shows and he's proved he can get top boxers over here, GGG etc.


Oggmonster said:
In fairness to him both the Cleverly fights were close, albeit I do agree with your sentiment he isn't a great boxer.

Bellew is a hypocrite especially when he's the one fighting (I don't mind him as a pundit when he's impartial.) He does have a history of starting trouble with people. Cleverley, Stevenson, Flores are just 3 examples of it recently.
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That's the thing, Bellew kicked all this off. As soon as he won his WBC belt he was making videos all about Haye (who was in the division above then) calling him out, literally as soon as he strapped the green belt on!! Then he won his fight and was making a scene at the ring apron. He deserves all he gets from Haye. Bellew, win or lose has talked himself into what he wanted with his antics, he's getting the money and the big fight so should except the comments and potential knockout.

Summit said:
I know Haye will try to knock him out regardless, but do you honestly not see the problem in Haye saying , "I don't just want to knock him out, I want to seriously cause him some damage"?
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I don't, no. People need to man up, al this PC stuff and the media/fashion controlled by the elites who are condition guys into wearing womens leggin tight drainpipe jeans and makeup are making us soft. The tv is showing women as tough footballers, ghostbusters and strong characters on Mad max, all known mens traditional things and men are now portrayed and therefore turning into crying babies. Man up FFS. Its boxing, there has always been fights and bad comments. Lewis and Rahman rolling about, Tyson calling the press a "f"ggot" and saying "I'll F you till you love me f*ggot" Ali's comments, the so called greatest ever was probably the worst, Hopkins saying to Calzaghe he never let a white boy beat him, the list goes on back then, this is nothing new.

Haye is clearly angered by Bellew, way more than he ever has been, wearing a mock up t-shirt of Wlad and him holding his decapitated head was nothing compared to this, the venom wasn't there, it was just a tshirt but yes even that did set the wuss brigade off. News flash, this is boxing, its a sport where you pay to see/watch two men or even women nowadays, beat the hell out of each other, you pay for blood, a knockout and not hugging and kissing. Its a sport which lets be honest should be banned, but it isn't because it makes money and the government loves people divided, aggressive and arguing hence why there's so much violence etc on tv and film.

How on earth people can like boxing, want to see a good "fight" but then want two Joshuas or Klitchkos back patting each other before they get in the ring is beyond me. All this talk of respect and being good for the sport, please!!! Haye v Bellew, Whyte v Chisora and some of the Fury stuff is press conferences has made boxing exciting again and there's no denying it. People need to toughen up, Haye saying he wants to smash his head in is nothing that doesn't get said in a pub at the weekend with people fueled on that crappy government tax drug alcohol. I think we all know Haye, Eubank, whoever, wouldn't really want to hurt people that badly, its anger or somethings in some fighters cases, ticket selling/profile raising.

Chisora nearly got banned v Whyte for his press conference, yet it made amazing entertainment, and you could say make a great fight. Even if Hayes words don't make a great fight, its been awesome to watch so far, the drama. AJ is a fake, media trained bore, who's playing the people for love but really a gangster drug dealer, Wlad is just a bore full stop. I'll be asleep all the way until Wembley date, but Haye v Bellew has gripped me all the way.
 
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Oh and too add to that, Prince Naz was the best in terms of drama and excitement, we'll never have that again but some of the examples at the minute, Haye, Fury etc are not far off. Good times, enjoy it while you can.

Can't wait to see Haye rip up Tony, but then what if Bellew pulled it off? Can you imagine it!!! Tyson Fury really has set up all this nicely with his win over Wlad, so if Haye does win, he'll probably fight Joshua or someone like Wilder for more big things. People saying Joshua is the big draw but I reckon Haye is, he was selling out London o2 to people we've never heard of for his post injury comeback fights. On the drama of the press conferences right now this Haye v Bellew could sell out Wembley or Old Trafford under Hearn no problem and its not even a title fight or a proper HW fight!! Joshua meanwhile is fight Wlad.
 
Claymore said:
Oh and too add to that, Prince Naz was the best in terms of drama and excitement, we'll never have that again but some of the examples at the minute, Haye, Fury etc are not far off. Good times, enjoy it while you can.

Can't wait to see Haye rip up Tony, but then what if Bellew pulled it off? Can you imagine it!!! Tyson Fury really has set up all this nicely with his win over Wlad, so if Haye does win, he'll probably fight Joshua or someone like Wilder for more big things. People saying Joshua is the big draw but I reckon Haye is, he was selling out London o2 to people we've never heard of for his post injury comeback fights. On the drama of the press conferences right now this Haye v Bellew could sell out Wembley or Old Trafford under Hearn no problem and its not even a title fight or a proper HW fight!! Joshua meanwhile is fight Wlad.
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Haye is still a big draw but Joshua is the biggest draw in the UK now. Just because they have built so much hype around him and all of the casual fans love him. I'm a Haye fan, not so much of a Joshua fan but right now Joshua is the bigger draw. Joshua has been fighting nobodies and still getting massive PPV numbers.

I just want to see Haye vs Joshua and Hearn better let it happen.
 
Few thoughts:

Brook vs Spence is a great fight and a pick'em; the two best welterweights in my eyes (except maybe Manny)

Thurman should school Garcia but I have a horrible feeling that he might not

Haye will destroy Bellew and then fight someone irrelevant on BT PPV next

Joshua is the 3rd biggest draw in the world after Canelo and Manny
 
Kazi said:
Few thoughts:

Brook vs Spence is a great fight and a pick'em; the two best welterweights in my eyes (except maybe Manny)

Thurman should school Garcia but I have a horrible feeling that he might not

Haye will destroy Bellew and then fight someone irrelevant on BT PPV next

Joshua is the 3rd biggest draw in the world after Canelo and Manny
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Khan is on par ability-wise if not for his glass jaw.

Hoping Thurman wins.

I doubt he'll fight somebody irrelevant next fight, especially as he wants to unify the division if he becomes Heavyweight champion again.

Joshua is a good pull, just very bland and has as much character as a tea towel. I just want somebody to show Wilder up for the fraud he is.
 
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Summit said:
What's up with him saying he wants to knock him out and leaving it there though? Nothing. But when you say you want to cause serious harm to a fighter, then I'm sorry but that is too far. Haye would be devastated if he were to actually put him in hospital fighting for his life, wouldn't he? Too far imo, and all to sell tickets. I like Haye, always have and hope he wins, but some of the shite he's coming out with leading up to the fight is well below the belt.
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Exactly right mate 100% agree. I cannot stand Bellew I think he's a fecking arsehole, the scouse accent probably doesn't help much either, and he gave an interview on Talk Sport before Christmas and was bang out of order in what he was saying, but he came back on on Tuesday and was extremely honest and respectful. He just said he hopes he knocks Haye out, but that BOTH fighters then walk out the ring and go home to their families. He went up in my estimations after that, it was nice to hear him being honest and not just a gobby twat.

Fast forward 24 hours and on comes Haye, now it's already clear in this thread how much I like Haye, and I couldn't wait to hear him big the fight up in his normal cheeky manner, but he didn't he was awful. He didn't let Jim White speak and was so angry he was constantly talking over him, sometimes for a full question, he just wasn't listening at all, and it's clear Bellew has got under his skin. The shite he was coming out with was outrageous and disgusting in my opinion. He said he wants to put Bellew in hospital, he won't be happy if Bellew walks out of the ring and he wont be happy if he's only down for 10 seconds. He also said Bellew will get a golden payday but it's pointless as he won't be able to spend the money because he will be permanently injured. What the feck is that shit? I get he's angry, but there's just no need for stuff like that. Bellew's wife or kids could have been listening, it's disgusting and Haye, someone I've always liked and defended, lost some credibility after those comments and a shit load of fans too.

He also said that when he used to play rugby and he tackled people, he didn't want to win the ball, he wanted to break their spines so they couldn't play again. He just sounded like a thug and a proper cnut to be honest. It wasn't nice listening at all and it's got sod all to do with being PC or anything like that, it's called manners, etiquette and respect. It's a sport after all, not some brawl down the pub. If Haye really wants to be like that then he should offer Bellew a fight in a park somewhere and give up the money, maybe by the sandpit at break time, after all, he sounded like he was still at school.
 
langster said:
Exactly right mate 100% agree. I cannot stand Bellew I think he's a fecking arsehole, the scouse accent probably doesn't help much either, and he gave an interview on Talk Sport before Christmas and was bang out of order in what he was saying, but he came back on on Tuesday and was extremely honest and respectful. He just said he hopes he knocks Haye out, but that BOTH fighters then walk out the ring and go home to their families. He went up in my estimations after that, it was nice to hear him being honest and not just a gobby twat.

Fast forward 24 hours and on comes Haye, now it's already clear in this thread how much I like Haye, and I couldn't wait to hear him big the fight up in his normal cheeky manner, but he didn't he was awful. He didn't let Jim White speak and was so angry he was constantly talking over him, sometimes for a full question, he just wasn't listening at all, and it's clear Bellew has got under his skin. The shite he was coming out with was outrageous and disgusting in my opinion. He said he wants to put Bellew in hospital, he won't be happy if Bellew walks out of the ring and he wont be happy if he's only down for 10 seconds. He also said Bellew will get a golden payday but it's pointless as he won't be able to spend the money because he will be permanently injured. What the feck is that shit? I get he's angry, but there's just no need for stuff like that. Bellew's wife or kids could have been listening, it's disgusting and Haye, someone I've always liked and defended, lost some credibility after those comments and a shit load of fans too.

He also said that when he used to play rugby and he tackled people, he didn't want to win the ball, he wanted to break their spines so they couldn't play again. He just sounded like a thug and a proper cnut to be honest. It wasn't nice listening at all and it's got sod all to do with being PC or anything like that, it's called manners, etiquette and respect. It's a sport after all, not some brawl down the pub. If Haye really wants to be like that then he should offer Bellew a fight in a park somewhere and give up the money, maybe by the sandpit at break time, after all, he sounded like he was still at school.
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I agree was distasteful. It actually angered me watching the presser though those dirty scousers literally not giving Haye or Shane a word though I'd probably have just walked off the stage and refused to do the presser.
 
Utdstar01 said:
I agree was distasteful. It actually angered me watching the presser though those dirty scousers literally not giving Haye or Shane a word though I'd probably have just walked off the stage and refused to do the presser.
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Oh I agree, and Haye said it really got to him, and in a way I sympathise with him because it really wasn't nice at all and he was heavily outnumbered so I can see why he's so angry. However, the phone call in to Talk Sport was different, it was a few days after and he should have had time to calm down, it was also after both fighters had been warned about their conduct by the British Boxing Board. It was a radio interview, nobody else was around, Haye was being asked questions and was just completely ignoring them and ranting inanely. He actually wasn't making much sense a lot of the time, and because he was talking over Jim all the time, you actually couldn't hear a lot of what he was saying. But Jim gave him at least 4 or 5 chances to recant what he said and to think about it more calmly but he was just way too wound up. I've no problem with him saying he wants to knock him out and even hurt him but saying he wants someone to be permanently disabled is going too far. Also, it wasn't just what he said, it was the tone in which he said it and the malice that came across as he was saying it, he's definitely pissed, there certainly wasn't any showmanship or acting involved in that, that's for sure.
 
Claymore said:
AJ is a fake, media trained bore, who's playing the people for love but really a gangster drug dealer, Wlad is just a bore full stop. I'll be asleep all the way until Wembley date, but Haye v Bellew has gripped me all the way.
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He only had intent to deal some weed mate, he's hardly the next Al Capone!

Kazi said:
Few thoughts:

Brook vs Spence is a great fight and a pick'em; the two best welterweights in my eyes (except maybe Manny)

Thurman should school Garcia but I have a horrible feeling that he might not

Haye will destroy Bellew and then fight someone irrelevant on BT PPV next

Joshua is the 3rd biggest draw in the world after Canelo and Manny
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Agree with everything here. I think Garcia points him to be honest. Garcia to win and Haye to win inside 2 rounds pays 10/1 on Sky Bet which is tempting to be honest. Just can't see it ending well for Bellew. I know Haye had had time off and fought bums but Bellew isn't that good of a boxer.
 
Belllew is going to get destroyed.
Standing side by side they have before and after bodies...
 
Bellew - 15stone, 3lbs.
Haye - 16stone, 0lbs, 9oz.
 
I really don't like Haye but from following this build up I definitely prefer him to Bellew. He looked scared as hell with his headphones on and dancing when the camera was on him - like when you are a kid and you overcompensate for being nervous by acting silly.

Also has anyone pointed out to Bellew that his whole plan of Haye tiring in the latter rounds also applies to him, especially since he is in bang average shape and they are only a few years apart in age. Genuinely made me feel ok about my rig watching him on the scales.
 
tomaldinho1 said:
Also has anyone pointed out to Bellew that his whole plan of Haye tiring in the latter rounds also applies to him, especially since he is in bang average shape and they are only a few years apart in age. Genuinely made me feel ok about my rig watching him on the scales.
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I never quite got the age thing with Bellew. He's 2 years younger than Haye and has fought nearly twice as many rounds. Whilst Bellew is younger in age I'd probably say Haye will feel the younger boxer.

Bellew has never been in great shape to look at but he still has had a few 12 rounders in fairness to him. I do think Haye beats him easily though, that weight difference is pretty ridiculous.
 
Oggmonster said:
Joshua is his biggest draw that's not a doubt. I think it depends how you look at his cards though. Realistically I can't name many boxing cards that don't have a few duds. Boxing (or Hearn) don't have the luxury of the UFC System where they can stack cards as they are all under the same company. There's no way Hearn would put Joshua, Brook and Smith all on the same card for example where as UFC 205 had 3 title fights and UFC 209 has 2. Hearn has about 30 fighters so he's pretty limited what he can do. A card like Wembley will be stacked though I'd guess.

He doesn't have loads of PPV fighters but it also depends who they fight. Joshua is PPV standard whoever...even if he steamrolls opponents people pay to see it. You might not think it's worth buying but others do hence he does massive numbers. Brook vs. Spence is PPV standard, Brook vs. Khan would be PPV standard, Bellew vs. Haye is on Box Office and will do good numbers. It's all opinions. For all the shite he has put on PPV (Bellew vs. Cleverly 2 for example) he does give people a lot of fights on Sky Sports which are good quality. It can definitely be improved but it will take time. Boxing is in a much better place now than it was before Hearn though for me. He can create a bit of a circus at times with the build up of it but there's some exciting fighters at Matchroom and with stuff like the Nex Gen series he should uncover some stars. I also think it's worth noting the fighters seem to like working with him so he must be doing something right with them. I've not heard many criticise him, only Haye and Eubank. Eubank is notoriously hard to work with and Haye was building up a fight. Groves didn't say much bad about him in the build up to Froch for example.

I agree he gives his fighters easy fights at times but again to his credit look at some of his current world champions and who they're fighting:

Kell Brook is fighting Errol Spence who is regarded as the best welterweight fighter
Joshua is fighting the best heavyweight of the last 10 years
DeGale just had a unification fight with Badou Jack

Equally he has the likes of Yafai and Selby who should get big fights down the line (i.e. Selby vs. Frampton.)

As for the cycle you produce I can't think of many he's done that with really. Could you give some examples? Maybe I'm reading it wrong.
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Ignore me i was on one yesterday, that cycle thing was my mind playing tricks on me.
 
Haye looks ripped as hell. That weight difference will go up i imagine as well between now and tomorrow night. Just looking at the Stevenson knock out of Bellew. I just don't see how he wins this at all. If Stevenson can slap him round like that then Haye will pummel him.
 
Oggmonster said:
I never quite got the age thing with Bellew. He's 2 years younger than Haye and has fought nearly twice as many rounds. Whilst Bellew is younger in age I'd probably say Haye will feel the younger boxer.

Bellew has never been in great shape to look at but he still has had a few 12 rounders in fairness to him. I do think Haye beats him easily though, that weight difference is pretty ridiculous.
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It's just a case of surviving the first 4 rounds for Bellew. If he can do it then it becomes a 50/50 fight. I'm a massive Haye fan but he's never had the greatest stamina and with him being older and heavier now it has likely got worse. He was dripping buckets of sweat and panting his arse off after just punching the pads and shadow boxing for 5 minutes in the open workout the other day so who knows how long he will last in a real fight.

Still have Haye winning this is the first 4.

Also I agree i'm not sure why people are talking so much about Hayes age when Bellew isn't much younger and is the least gifted genetically out of the two. Then again Haye does rely more on explosiveness, speed and power which is one of the first things to diminish with age where as Bellew relies on grit and determination more than his physical attributes so might not be so affected by aging in terms of his level of boxing.
 
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Werder Herzog said:
Haye looks ripped as hell. That weight difference will go up i imagine as well between now and tomorrow night. Just looking at the Stevenson knock out of Bellew. I just don't see how he wins this at all. If Stevenson can slap him round like that then Haye will pummel him.
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Bellew had spells in the Stevenson fight where he did well and had Adonis hurt at one stage before his own stoppage (round 3 or 4).

I'm not backing Tony here but just saying.
 
BringNaniBack said:
It's just a case of surviving the first 4 rounds for Bellew. If he can do it then it becomes a 50/50 fight. I'm a massive Haye fan but he's never had the greatest stamina and with him being older and heavier now it has likely got worse. He was dripping buckets of sweat and panting his arse off after just punching the pads and shadow boxing for 5 minutes in the open workout the other day so who knows how long he will last in a real fight.

Still have Haye winning this is the first 4.
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Audley Harrison survived 2 full rounds without throwing a punch. Haye is a quality counter puncher. If Bellew doesn't lead then he could get himself through a couple of rounds relatively harm free unless he leaves clear openings. That said, his last few fights have been won through blitzing opponents after initial scouting rounds. It's not unreasonable that he could start impelementing the same approach and shoot into a series of 50/50 punching exchange beteeen rounds 3-6.
 
Werder Herzog said:
Ignore me i was on one yesterday, that cycle thing was my mind playing tricks on me.
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Haha no worries mate!

BringNaniBack said:
It's just a case of surviving the first 4 rounds for Bellew. If he can do it then it becomes a 50/50 fight. I'm a massive Haye fan but he's never had the greatest stamina and with him being older and heavier now it has likely got worse. He was dripping buckets of sweat and panting his arse off after just punching the pads and shadow boxing for 5 minutes in the open workout the other day so who knows how long he will last in a real fight.

Still have Haye winning this is the first 4.
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The stamina could be an issue. I'd back Haye to land at least a few clean shots if it went past a few rounds tohugh and Bellew has never been hit as hard as Haye can hit which will have a huge effect on him.

I just can't see it ending well at all for Bellew. I reckon he gets drawn in early and it ends quick.
 
FC Ronaldo said:
Bellew had spells in the Stevenson fight where he did well and had Adonis hurt at one stage before his own stoppage (round 3 or 4).

I'm not backing Tony here but just saying.
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Fair doos ive never watched the whole fight through.

Also i would not worry about Haye gassing at all at the weight. He's not going to chase Bellew around the ring it will go at the pace he dictates. Bellew does not get a say in it. Only chance Bellew has is if Haye does something stupid and swings wildly leaving himself open.

I actually think Haye will win it with a body shot. Possibly doing Bellew's ribs.

He has been going on since it was announced about smashing his face in and he has used the word face so much i think it's a smokescreen. If it's not a body shot that ends it i rekon it's what will set the knock out up at the very least.
 
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