The RedCafe Boxing Thread

cyberman said:
Can't see Brook v Khan happening.
When Hearn entered the ring after brooks routine return win and started calling Amir out, it looked like the last throw of the dice. Challenge him in front of the world to shame him into accepting. Would imply negotiations were going nowhere.
I really don't like Hearn
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I don't mind Hearn most the time in fairness, he's a bit of a dick but in recent years he has brought some very good fights. This card would actually be a good Sky Sports card which is why it baffles me it's on Box Office. Brook vs. Khan seems like a Hatton vs. Witter scenario, Khan doesn't like him and won't give him the payday. Obviously Brook is a better fighter than Witter was but to me it seems like a similar logic. Hearn probably has no other choice but to try and embarrass Khan in to the fight really.
 
With Floyd done in 2 fights and Manny more or less gone, the fight to be the next faces of boxing is on and the Brook fight holds no upside for Khan.
It looks to be Canelo and GGG so Khan has to pick his opponents wisely or be left behind.
A loss guarentees no Mayweather payday, no chance to automatically jump to the front of the line with an unlikely win. If anything, Broner v Khan needs to happen before Brook.
The Brook fight will always be there for Amir, he can hold it in reserve as a career reset if he suffers a career downturn.
 
cyberman said:
With Floyd done in 2 fights and Manny more or less gone, the fight to be the next faces of boxing is on and the Brook fight holds no upside for Khan.
It looks to be Canelo and GGG so Khan has to pick his opponents wisely or be left behind.
A loss guarentees no Mayweather payday, no chance to automatically jump to the front of the line with an unlikely win. If anything, Broner v Khan needs to happen before Brook.
The Brook fight will always be there for Amir, he can hold it in reserve as a career reset if he suffers a career downturn.
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Khan's biggest problem for me is how he talks about it. If he doesn't want the fight cos he doesn't like the guy then fair enough but just come out and say that. He constantly talks about giving the public what they want etc (taking digs at Mayweather whilst doing it) yet when the public say they want him to fight Brook he doesn't do it? Someone like Algieri stands no chance against Khan really.

It would be interesting if Khan lost one of his next couple of fights, if so I'd say his career doesn't look that impressive, a record of 31-4 with Brook an unbeaten champions puts Brook in the better position for example. If Khan does lose 1 of his next few fights I'd imagine he'd be pretty desperate to fight Brook for the sake of a pay day.
 
Brit fans are pretty easy to get a big money fight out of regardless of how many losses Khan will end up with.....I mean Haye turned fights with Harrison and Chisora into very big paydays for himself somehow. Only in Britain would Harrison end up on PPV despite being "done" like 9 times previously and none of them being on PPV in the first place.
 
Kazi said:
It's not even £15, it's £17. Doubt I'll even bother finding a stream for it.

Khan Algieri intrigues me though. Been a while (first time ever?) since Khan has faced someone with a better jab than him. Big fan of Algieri, hope he puts in a good showing and makes it a fun fight.
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Big shout. Can't say I agree given the level of competition he's faced but each to their own.

Will be very surprised at anything less than a Khan 7-8 round wide UD tomorrow night. It will be volume punching that wins it for him too. Similar to how Prov hurt Algieri and how Pac floored him. A come forward volume puncher with good accuracy and a wide reach, that importantly doesn't get so close that they smother their own work as Prov ended up doing, should dispatch of him with "ease" - well as easily as a clear UD should be.

As a bloke, I like Algieri. In interviews he's so well spoken, considered and comes across as a very intelligent guy.
 
cyberman said:
If anything, Broner v Khan needs to happen before Brook.
The Brook fight will always be there for Amir, he can hold it in reserve as a career reset if he suffers a career downturn.
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Completely agree with you. Safest headline grabbing fight but I think both men are being eased into championship fights without facing each other to pocket Haymon money after Floyd.

I think Broner's flat footed style would have been the perfect set up for a Khan approach to Floyd too, much like Maidana achieved. Think Khan takes that fight be a 3 or 4 round margin if he stays disciplined. Don't think Broner could drop Khan unless he caught him completely cold coming in with a hail mary shot. The only questions I see for Khan in that fight is whether Broner can match Khan's hand speed with short work and whether Broner is confident enough to go on the front foot - worth noting that when he was aggressive on Maidana, he won rounds quite conclusively just couldn't hack it coming back at him.
 
Saturday's card is not PPV worthy for me, just like Cleverly v Bellew 2 wasn't. Hearn seems to be putting on PPVs for the card rather than the main event these days as he has failed to make the 3 biggest fights of the year: DeGale v Groves (argument it was too early anyway), Brook v Khan and Quigg v Frampton.

I think Eddie Hearn can be fun, is fresh and has definitely reignited British boxing again over the last few years however it seems his arrogance has stopped fighters and other promoters allowing him to put on the big fights.
 
Oggmonster said:
It would be interesting if Khan lost one of his next couple of fights, if so I'd say his career doesn't look that impressive, a record of 31-4 with Brook an unbeaten champions puts Brook in the better position for example. If Khan does lose 1 of his next few fights I'd imagine he'd be pretty desperate to fight Brook for the sake of a pay day.
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Don't agree with that one mate. Brook has fought 1 opponent that is championship contender level - and even within Shawn Porter's credentials there questions given Malignaggi claimed he was on PED's when they fought and the Alexander fight was close. The rest of Brook's opponents are terrible in comparison to Khan's.

Jo Jo Dan, Carson Jones and Senchenko do not compare to wins over Devon Alexander (wide points), Zab Judah (stoppage), Paulie Malignaggi (stoppage), Marcos Maidana (correct points) or even Luis Collazo. Let alone close contest with Peterson or beating an aged Barrera or schooling Danny Garcia for 2 rounds before getting sparked.

And I like Brook, love the fact he's a champ, just calling it objectively as it is. Think on that basis, plus Khan's American name and fighting style which draws crowds, he could ride a loss and still get that fight I feel too.
 
FC Ronaldo said:
Don't agree with that one mate. Brook has fought 1 opponent that is championship contender level - and even within Shawn Porter's credentials there questions given Malignaggi claimed he was on PED's when they fought and the Alexander fight was close. The rest of Brook's opponents are terrible in comparison to Khan's.

Jo Jo Dan, Carson Jones and Senchenko do not compare to wins over Devon Alexander (wide points), Zab Judah (stoppage), Paulie Malignaggi (stoppage), Marcos Maidana (correct points) or even Luis Collazo. Let alone close contest with Peterson or beating an aged Barrera or schooling Danny Garcia for 2 rounds before getting sparked.

And I like Brook, love the fact he's a champ, just calling it objectively as it is. Think on that basis, plus Khan's American name and fighting style which draws crowds, he could ride a loss and still get that fight I feel too.
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In terms of better fighters Khan would definitely have fought the better ones. I was meaning if he loses again and is a 31 or 32-4 the record on paper isn't that impressive. Khan has definitely fought the better fighters previously but if Brook has a title and defends it successfully and Khan loses in the meantime I do think it would make things interesting.

I'd imagine he could still fight Brook with a loss but it probably wouldn't be as much on his terms as it would be at the moment...rarely do you get a champion calling out a non champion and failing to get the fight!

American crowds have a habit of turning on people as well. Khan at the moment is a big name but they're not particularly loyal if someone else is on the up.

I don't particularly mind Khan, he's a better fighter than Brook as well but I do think another loss (unless it was to Mayweather) would put his career in an interesting position. Regardless of getting the better of Garcia for 2 rounds he still got knocked out there for example and thats what people remember.
 
Good points @Oggmonster. Certainly see your logic in that view on Khan there

@NextSeason - I'm sure I've seen Hearn state that he and Sky are targetting 2 PPV's per year now as a minimum. Expect it to get worse before it gets better unfortunately. Agree with your comments though. Hearn is very clever at false bravado and PR misdirection. You tend to believe what he says and what he tries but yet those 3 fights fell short when if his team were 100% as confident and behind it as he suggests then they'd have got made somehow. He's also set up about a year's worth of fights with only a handful of truly pick'em, matches that his fighters have been in, the rest have all been fodder fights generally. Yet I still like him and would still take his 2 pennies worth on board and believe him again. Weirdly likeable bloke and a bit of a lad on the beers too.

@El-Manos yeah, it's set to be a good fight and a proven test for Joshua. Johnson has lost his last 3 outings against mid-tier heavyweights however (Hammer, Chisora, Charr - all comfortable point losses) and 2 fights before that run was a complete shut out against title challenger Tyson Fury so he's lost 4 from 5.

Paulie Malignaggi is backing the American not to get knocked out but I'm yet to see anyone outside of Johnson's camp back him to cause many problems or even win sadly.

General question - what's everyone's thoughts on Tyson Fury here? Reckon he'll get it done against Wlad or become either the 65th man to lose or the 54th to be stopped?
 
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FC Ronaldo said:
General question - what's everyone's thoughts on Tyson Fury here? Reckon he'll get it done against Wlad or become either the 65th man to lose or the 54th to be stopped?
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I think he's slightly under rated really. People perceive him as this kind of idiot and I think it's mainly due to how he talks and his physique (compared to Wlad, Wilder or Joshua for example he's a bit of a lump) but he is an intelligent fighter. He gets knocked down every now and then which is a worry if he was fighting better fighters I think they'd fancy their chances of knocking him out but at the moment I'd predict he would beat everyone except Wlad and maybe Wilder, although the Wilder fight could go either way. I don't think Wlad would knock him out though but I don't think he'd go in and try and do it, if they fought it would be the kind f fight expected off Klitschko, not the best to watch but gets the job done.

The main concern for Fury is who he has fought so far. Like you rightly pointed out with Brook he's never really fought any big name. If he got in the ring with someone of close technical ability to him who was a power puncher there could be trouble, the question is though is who is good enough to be a big win for Fury really? The heavyweight division isn't full of big names at the moment. If I was Fury I'd want to fight Wilder before Wlad.
 
FC Ronaldo said:
Big shout. Can't say I agree given the level of competition he's faced but each to their own.

Will be very surprised at anything less than a Khan 7-8 round wide UD tomorrow night. It will be volume punching that wins it for him too. Similar to how Prov hurt Algieri and how Pac floored him. A come forward volume puncher with good accuracy and a wide reach, that importantly doesn't get so close that they smother their own work as Prov ended up doing, should dispatch of him with "ease" - well as easily as a clear UD should be.

As a bloke, I like Algieri. In interviews he's so well spoken, considered and comes across as a very intelligent guy.
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The jab is Algieri's bread and butter. Besides speed, I think it holds every other advantage of Khan's - range, pop, accuracy. I too think it's be a wide decision for Khan (9-3 or 10-2), but I reckon Algieri will be the guy on the outside, so it'll be interesting to see how Khan cuts off the ring. I think there is a possible scenario where Algieri outboxes Khan from the outside and catches him coming in to pick up rounds, but it is very unlikely.

On Fury, I'd pick him to win over any HW in the world except Wlad. Considering how big he is, he's a good mover and has good hand speed. Definitely can outbox most guys in his division by just keeping it simple.
 
FC Ronaldo said:
Don't agree with that one mate. Brook has fought 1 opponent that is championship contender level - and even within Shawn Porter's credentials there questions given Malignaggi claimed he was on PED's when they fought and the Alexander fight was close. The rest of Brook's opponents are terrible in comparison to Khan's.

Jo Jo Dan, Carson Jones and Senchenko do not compare to wins over Devon Alexander (wide points), Zab Judah (stoppage), Paulie Malignaggi (stoppage), Marcos Maidana (correct points) or even Luis Collazo. Let alone close contest with Peterson or beating an aged Barrera or schooling Danny Garcia for 2 rounds before getting sparked.

And I like Brook, love the fact he's a champ, just calling it objectively as it is. Think on that basis, plus Khan's American name and fighting style which draws crowds, he could ride a loss and still get that fight I feel too.
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That guy is a joke, his opinions are absolutely worthless because he contradicts himself so often. He was outmanned by a better boxer, accusing people of being on PED's when there's absolutely no evidence is such a bitch move.
 
Kazi said:
The jab is Algieri's bread and butter. Besides speed, I think it holds every other advantage of Khan's - range, pop, accuracy. I too think it's be a wide decision for Khan (9-3 or 10-2), but I reckon Algieri will be the guy on the outside, so it'll be interesting to see how Khan cuts off the ring. I think there is a possible scenario where Algieri outboxes Khan from the outside and catches him coming in to pick up rounds, but it is very unlikely.

On Fury, I'd pick him to win over any HW in the world except Wlad. Considering how big he is, he's a good mover and has good hand speed. Definitely can outbox most guys in his division by just keeping it simple.
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Even Povetkin? Fury is an underrated boxer but he is ungainly and a touch chinny.
 
evra said:
Even Povetkin? Fury is an underrated boxer but he is ungainly and a touch chinny.
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Yeah Povetkin too. It's a nice styles match-up and can understand why a lot of people would favour Povetkin. But if Fury stayed disciplined for the 12, I think he'd get the W. Povetkin is Wilder's mandatory, think that fight will happen?
 
Kazi said:
Yeah Povetkin too. It's a nice styles match-up and can understand why a lot of people would favour Povetkin. But if Fury stayed disciplined for the 12, I think he'd get the W. Povetkin is Wilder's mandatory, think that fight will happen?
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Hope so, although I'm not sure his promoter would want the Povetkin fight. My personal opinion is that Povetkin is the most talented offensive heavyweight, the only thing against him is he is only 6' 2''. It's possible that someone who is 6' 6'' or thereabouts could just neutralise him and run for 12 rounds, so I can see why you think Fury could frustrate and win. I think you would have to have elite defensive ability to do that (like Wlad) and I'm not sure Fury has that, I'm absolutely certain Wilder doesn't - he makes Fury look like Willie Pep.
 
Anyone watch Maravilla? Thoughts on Martinez? Always really liked him myself, seems to have huge heart and courage. I was totally unaware of what happened to him when Chavez took the belt, although it could have been a very biased account.
 
Probably fight Santa Cruz then surely? That Scott Quigg fight is getting further and further away it seems...can't imagine Hearn is happy hearing that.
 
Anyone got an idea what time glass jaw is coming out tonight? Seen the program starts at 2am but wanna get some sleep and set the alarm for it. Can't wait for Brook, Joshua etc tomorrow either.
 
Claymore said:
Anyone got an idea what time glass jaw is coming out tonight? Seen the program starts at 2am but wanna get some sleep and set the alarm for it. Can't wait for Brook, Joshua etc tomorrow either.
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BoxNation's twitter says 2.45am. AFAIK, only one fight on the televised undercard. If it goes the distance, then Khan-Algieri should start around 3 or just after.
 
Claymore said:
Anyone got an idea what time glass jaw is coming out tonight? Seen the program starts at 2am but wanna get some sleep and set the alarm for it. Can't wait for Brook, Joshua etc tomorrow either.
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I'm expecting Khan out in about 3 hours, maybe 3.5. 4am BST I'm thinking.
 
About to get under way, should be a cracking fight. Algieri is a tough fighter, his only loss is to Manny by UD.
 
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