The Mueller Report

Billy Blaggs said:
I'd rather watch Accrinton Stanley than the Yankees or the Red Sox or whoever:D
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understand.

like watching paint dry its been said.

but I like occasionally going to ball games rather than watching it on telly.
The atmosphere and all the hoopla that goes with it.

St Paul Saints are a fun to watch too.

Its fun to watch kids baseball especially.
all the fuss that's made about it.

One of the things I love about this country.
 
Glad this nonsense is over. It's good that the report has come almost 2 years before the next election. Anytime closer and it would have been a big talking point and given Kumquat a huge boost in 2020. Always felt nothing much was going to come out of it. Felt Trump was so against the "witch hunt" because being a narcissistic asshole he couldn't tolerate people questioning the legitimacy of his win. He doesn't miss a chance to brag about the number of electoral college votes he won. Hope now that the 2020 Dem candidates can fully focus on the real issues that matter to the people in this country rather than hoping for any help from the special counsel to beat Trump.

The issue remain the same - Healthcare, income equality, the courts, systematic corruption, gun reforms, immigration reforms....the list goes on. We need to tackle Trump and the Repubs on that, not some fecking Russian collusion.

And yeah, my heart goes out to all the folks who had invested too much time and energy into this. Feel really sad that this didn't give you a chance to quote your old posts with a ':cool:' smiley.
 
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Red Dreams said:
understand.

like watching paint dry its been said.

but I like occasionally going to ball games rather than watching it on telly.
The atmosphere and all the hoopla that goes with it.

St Paul Saints are a fun to watch too.

Its fun to watch kids baseball especially.
all the fuss that's made about it.

One of the things I love about this country.
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I love the fact that this country treats kids sorts like they're professionals.
But baseball sucks.
My friend from England loves it though. Watches it on TV at home.

I tried to watch the Florida Marlins when they won the world series and I've had friends that have given me all the nuances of the game. To me its still rounders and its boring as all hell.
I told my son if he decided baseball was his thing then I promise that his mom will go to all his games.
 
ErranMorad said:
Glad this nonsense is over. It's good that the report has come almost 2 years before the next election. Anytime closer and it would have been a big talking point and given Kumquat a huge boost in 2020. Always felt nothing much was going to come out of it. Felt Trump was so against the "witch hunt" because being a narcissistic asshole he couldn't tolerate people questioning the legitimacy of his win. He doesn't miss a chance to brag about the number of electoral college votes he won. Hope now that the 2020 Dem candidates can fully focus on the real issues that matter to the people in this country rather than hoping for any help from the special counsel to beat Trump.

The issue remain the same - Healthcare, income equality, the courts, systematic corruption, gun reforms, immigration reforms....the list goes on. We need to tackle Trump and the Repubs on that, not some fecking Russian collusion.

And yeah, my heart goes out to all the folks who had invested too much time and energy into this. Feel really sad that this didn't give you a chance to quote your old posts with a ':cool:' smiley.
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I thought on the whole the discussions were good. By investing in the procedures and speculating we all learned together in spite of different political leanings. :cool:

Its not over by a long way though.
 
Billy Blaggs said:
I love the fact that this country treats kids sorts like they're professionals.
But baseball sucks.
My friend from England loves it though. Watches it on TV at home.

I tried to watch the Florida Marlins when they won the world series and I've had friends that have given me all the nuances of the game. To me its still rounders and its boring as all hell.
I told my son if he decided baseball was his thing then I promise that his mom will go to all his games.
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Funny.

Baseball reminds me more of Cricket.

ok...a kids version of the great game.:)
 
ErranMorad said:
Glad this nonsense is over. It's good that the report has come almost 2 years before the next election. Anytime closer and it would have been a big talking point and given Kumquat a huge boost in 2020. Always felt nothing much was going to come out of it. Felt Trump was so against the "witch hunt" because being a narcissistic asshole he couldn't tolerate people questioning the legitimacy of his win. He doesn't miss a chance to brag about the number of electoral college votes he won. Hope now that the 2020 Dem candidates can fully focus on the real issues that matter to the people in this country rather than hoping for any help from the special counsel to beat Trump.

The issue remain the same - Healthcare, income equality, the courts, systematic corruption, gun reforms, immigration reforms....the list goes on. We need to tackle Trump and the Repubs on that, not some fecking Russian collusion.

And yeah, my heart goes out to all the folks who had invested too much time and energy into this. Feel really sad that this didn't give you a chance to quote your old posts with a ':cool:' smiley.
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I keep reading things like this in this thread. And I can't figure out who it's aimed at. Did any Dem candidates in 2018 run on the idea of investigating Trump about Russia?
 
Look on the bright side. Trump and his team were cleared of conspiring/coordinating with the Russians and that is a good thing for the USA.
 
afrocentricity said:
"Collusion isn't a crime"
Are any presidential candidates running on it?
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Not that I know of. I do keep hear them talking about various ideas on healthcare, taxes, the economy, justice reform, guns. But most were deferring to letting Mueller finishing his investigation and drawing conclusions after reading the report. Crazy libs.
 
Red Dreams said:
I thought on the whole the discussions were good. By investing in the procedures and speculating we all learned together in spite of different political leanings. :cool:

Its not over by a long way though.
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I have no doubt Russia tried to meddle and plant seeds of discontent. Putin's life goal seems to be destabilizing the West & thwart democracy. What he found in Kumquat is a useful idiot. An egomaniac who wouldn't care about norms or the rule of law. So, he decided to put his weight behind him.

We have known this all along. Unfortunately, little has been done in those regards to create systems to better prevent these kind of interventions from Russia or China or another foreign power.

Anyway, I have always maintained the best route available to get Trump out of office is through the ballot box. Dems did well and took control of the house in '18, not because of Trump & Russia but because of Trump's nasty rhetoric & the republican policies aimed to boost the already wealthy. The same needs to be highlighted in 2020 as well. Not many give a flying feck about his Tax returns or investigations into his foundation or businesses. Not that they shouldn't be pursued, but that is not the main story here. Everyone knows, including his supporters, that his is a crook.
 
Red Dreams said:
Realise you are all puffy about this Summary Report which favoured Trump...but still did not exonerate him from Obstruction.

Lets wait for the full report and what Congress does when it gets it. Calling Mueller to testify before the committees.

I don't take back what I still believe about Trump being a Russian asset.
The basis for that is what happened after he became president . The secret meetings and Helsinki and what McCabe said to leaders of Congress.

An eternity before the primaries.

EDIT:

As to my characterization of Trump being a full blown racist, criminal and traitor, I stand by that too.
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So you're expecting the full report to provide evidence that supports the claims that...
  • Trump Jr. and Kushner are part of this criminal conspiracy and due to be prosecuted
  • Trump is on the brink of telling everything about his dealings with the Russians and resigning, to save his sons
  • Trump will be running off to the Russian consulate in the near future
  • And Pelosi will become the country's first president, this year
Really? You think by putting forward these notions, and standing by them in spite of the evidence, is a good way to support your cause? You don't think there's any harm at all in creating this image of democrats?
 
Amazing how everyone is jumping to conclusions & freaking out over the Barr report. That report is certainly not the end all be all to all investigations of Trump. It was created & delivered pretty damn quickly by someone who clearly showed bias before he became AG.

The report that is shown to the public must not have large swaths of it redacted.
 
calodo2003 said:
Amazing how everyone is jumping to conclusions & freaking out over the Barr report. That report is certainly not the end all be all to all investigations of Trump. It was created & delivered pretty damn quickly by someone who clearly showed bias before he became AG.

The report that is shown to the public must not have large swaths of it redacted.
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Do you not see how it looks, when you're questioning the legitimacy of the report and demanding more be done off the back of it? That is, explicitly, what democrats were suggesting the republicans would do when the common assumption was that the report would be damning for Trump. How can people take those views seriously, when they change so dramatically?
 
Brwned said:
Do you not see how it looks, when you're questioning the legitimacy of the report and demanding more be done off the back of it? That is, explicitly, what democrats were suggesting the republicans would do when the common assumption was that the report would be damning for Trump. How can people take those views seriously, when they change so dramatically?
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He's questioning the Barr summary, not the Mueller report. I don't think that's unreasonable at all.
 
kps88 said:
He's questioning the Barr summary, not the Mueller report. I don't think that's unreasonable at all.
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Saying that Barr's obvious bias should make people suspicious of the content of the summary, when it outlines the facts very clearly and quotes the special counsel on the key elements of it, is a huge statement.

For Barr to withhold critical information with the world watching would be ludicrous, and there's nothing he's done in his short time as AG that remotely justifies such scepticism. When you add in how little scepticism was applied to the more damaging speculation about the report just weeks prior to this, it completely undermines the legitimacy of any previous concerns about Republicans refusing to accept the results of the report.

The implication was that this scepticism of the end outcome would be completely baseless, pure partisan politics, and an indication of the ridiculous position the GOP now find themselves in. Yet now the pendulum has swung the other way, the democrats are going in the direction which just weeks ago they abhorred. Some went as far as to describe it as "un-American". Trust the process and the justice system.

It just underlines that everything here is partisan first, legitimate analysis of the facts comes second. I'm not sure why anyone thinks that is in their best interests. If the goal is to have democrats' decisions and actions be taken seriously, and viewed as being in the best interests of the country, they need to take themselves seriously first.

Also, @calodo2003's overarching point in this thread echoes many others, which is to be sceptical of the whole thing. Why did it end so soon? Why was the report produced so slowly (and now, so quickly)? What about all those unsealed indictments? Something seems fishy here.

That attitude is entirely in keeping with how they predicted "the other side" would act. Do you disagree?
 
Brwned said:
Saying that Barr's obvious bias should make people suspicious of the content of the summary, when it outlines the facts very clearly and quotes the special counsel on the key elements of it, is a huge statement.

For Barr to withhold critical information with the world watching would be ludicrous, and there's nothing he's done in his short time as AG that remotely justifies such scepticism. When you add in how little scepticism was applied to the more damaging speculation about the report just weeks prior to this, it completely undermines the legitimacy of any previous concerns about Republicans refusing to accept the results of the report.

The implication was that this scepticism of the end outcome would be completely baseless, pure partisan politics, and an indication of the ridiculous position the GOP now find themselves in. Yet now the pendulum has swung the other way, the democrats are going in the direction which just weeks ago they abhorred. Some went as far as to describe it as "un-American". Trust the process and the justice system.

It just underlines that everything here is partisan first, legitimate analysis of the facts comes second. I'm not sure why anyone thinks that is in their best interests. If the goal is to have democrats' decisions and actions be taken seriously, and viewed as being in the best interests of the country, they need to take themselves seriously first.

Also, @calodo2003's overarching point in this thread echoes many others, which is to be sceptical of the whole thing. Why did it end so soon? Why was the report produced so slowly (and now, so quickly)? What about all those unsealed indictments? Something seems fishy here.

That attitude is entirely in keeping with how they predicted "the other side" would act. Do you disagree?
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I think you're trying too hard to be perfectly neutral, almost robot like; a little personal bias is normal. Barr's letter is not the end outcome. A legitimate analysis of the facts is not yet possible as we haven't seen the full report. The wording in the Barr letter suggests there was a close case for obstruction and it's possible the report will go into that in more detail. His views on a president essentially being above the law are well publicized so his own personal interpretation is no surprise. It's possible other legal experts might have a different opinion when presented with the facts. It's also possible Trump's/his campaign's actions weren't illegal enough to indict a sitting president, but still politically damaging. And lastly, it's possible Barr summed it up perfectly but I'd like to think we've learnt to be more questioning of Trump appointees by now.

If someone says Barr is flat out making stuff up or if they still have these same questions after the full report has been released, then you can call them crazy and partisan. But I don't think many are saying that.
 
roseguy64 said:



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Kasparov is hitting the nail on the head but all this has been known for a while and it's not just happening in the US elections Putin and his "friends" are involved everywhere, they push populist and destabilizing parties in every European country because he knows that against a united front of Europe and the US he is powerless but if he sews enough distrust between former allies, manages to break the EU apart and the US to only take care of their own matters he will have free reign to do whatever he wants in eastern Europe for example because he will never be threatened with more than a disapproving speech on TV.

He also isn't alone in trying to destabilize the US and their allies. China has a very real interest in this as well and they both can wreak havoc and buy politicians left right and center as long as we don't have full transparency where every cent that finances a politician has come from.
 
Brwned said:
Do you not see how it looks, when you're questioning the legitimacy of the report and demanding more be done off the back of it? That is, explicitly, what democrats were suggesting the republicans would do when the common assumption was that the report would be damning for Trump. How can people take those views seriously, when they change so dramatically?
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Not quite sure what you are on about here. I did not question the validity of the Mueller report due to it not being public yet (no one has had a chance to read it), I did cast heavy aspersions on Barr’s memo, his ability to be impartial, & the dubious timeframe he had to look over & comment on the (described as voluminous) report, apparently less than 48 hours.
 
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