The Mourinho Thread: Should he stay or go? | Sacked

Is Mourinho’s time as United manager up?

  • Yes

    Votes: 2,296 77.1%
  • No

    Votes: 293 9.8%
  • Not yet - needs more time to see if he can turn it around

    Votes: 388 13.0%

  • Total voters
    2,977
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The players can say whatever they want in the media, but they rarely (if ever) look like they're really enjoying themselves on the pitch. Everything looks like a chore to them.

This needed to be pointed out.

I've mentioned his post match interview and the part when he's saying that the Wolves played like him, like it's the World Cup final, clearly referring to their motivation which in itself is a big problem.

Only when your players are doubting your football style and tactics you need to motivate them for every game like it's a WC final. When players are confident in your style and tactics they are motivated no matter what and no matter who's the opponent on the other side.
 
2 micky mouse trophies against average opposition ( Soton and Ajax) prove nothing. When you struggle to outplay average teams like Leicester and Wolves at home (!) and concede more shots on target than them after having spent 400m on new players, well, something must be deeply rotten with your approach.

Well said!

It is Mourinho’s past success that allows so many on here to give him a free pass to the shite he serves up. A misguided notion that it will all just click at some point because of what he achieved a decade ago.

Unfortunately, without completely revolutionising everything about his tactics, squad management, man management and game plan I don’t see him ever winning a major league title or champions league again.

Times have changed and Mourinho hasn’t.
 
What will end up happening is that Mourinho will leave for another club and end up winning the league. We will get a new manager who will replace half the team like LVG and Mou have done, we won’t win the PL for another 3 seasons and everyone will be calling for that manager to be replaced. Rinse and repeat.
Spot on. A lot of the people here lack the depth of understanding to see that it's not just 'one big problem' that is causing our slow descend to destruction. There is no clear plan or connection between the board, upper management, Mourinho and the players. This has been quite clearly apparent to anyone with half a brain since the last few years of SAF, and it's not going to change by sacking managers. We have already gone through 3 managers and in 6 years we still look a mess with no direction as a club.

Obviously, the problem has been exacerbated by keeping (and signing) players that are just not up to the standard or lack the attitude required to see out this transition since SAF left. Much of SAF's system in the later years (2009ish-2013) was dependent on strong leaders (some of whom were also class players) on the pitch carrying the lesser ones. Ronaldo, Rooney, Vidic, Rio, Giggs, RVP etc. etc. were these players. The term "zombie football" didn't get coined for nothing, but these players made up for it. Even as we visibly declined as a team, we had enough individual strength on the pitch to eke out those final couple of league titles. Now we have lost SAF, and we also have none of these strong personalities, but our system (or lack thereof) still largely remains the same. Dependence on individual brilliance to make up for average players.

Pogba, Valencia, Di Maria, Schneiderlin, Fellaini, Lingard and co. were not, and are not these self-leading, self-motivating players we used to have. They are players that some on here rightly state, will thrive with direction and a system. Pogba at Juventus for example. Di Maria at Real. But they are never going to be the ones to grab lost games by the scruff of the neck or pull victory from the jaws of defeat, like RVP or Ronaldo could. This failure of a transfer policy with no future planning, manager appointments that were all either ill-timed or ill-advised, and just generally looking lost in terms of everything football-related, is what has left us in this hole that's going to take quite some digging to get out of.

If Mourinho goes and joins another big (or biggish) club, I have no doubt he would win a title or two in the 2-3 years he might spend there. Sure, he might do the usual 3rd year implosion trick, but Mourinho is not the one taking this club down. Granted, he is part of the problem, but that's like saying your toothache is a problem when you just broke your leg. In the same vein, bringing in another manager, even Guardiola, is not going to be an instant solve of anything. There is deadwood to clear out, there is a footballing plan to put in place, there is a need to focus more on the sport and club and less on the noodle sponsors and business profits. These things are all going to take time to sort out and it starts from the top.
 
What will end up happening is that Mourinho will leave for another club and end up winning the league. We will get a new manager who will replace half the team like LVG and Mou have done, we won’t win the PL for another 3 seasons and everyone will be calling for that manager to be replaced. Rinse and repeat.
Which club exactly? He's burned plenty bridges
 
The 2nd place last season does not reflect our on-field performance. Results/points from last season aside, if you create less chances and "concede" more chances compared to the opposition(Tottenham, Liverpool and City last season) then in the long run they will get better results/more points.
So are you saying that eventually the David De Gea freak show will not be enough?
 
He's another Luis Van Gaal. Used to be great, now isn't. The most troubling part of it is you know we are not going to act until it becomes a financial decision. This club will only sack Jose Mourinho when the cost of his failure, exceeds the cost of sacking him. This club has no vision and we are not going anywhere as a club while that lack of vision remains.
On Mourinho, I can honestly say I gave him a fair chance. In the months leading up to his appointment, my primary choice was Mauricio Pochettino. We can all talk about lack of trophies etc, I just thought he would be a better fit. I was wary of Jose but after if was announced, I warmed to the idea and Jose Mourinho has my complete support till January this year.
The minimum requirement for any manager is to make the best use of what you have, improve some players and get a team to play greater than the sum of its parts. He has consistently failed to achieve this. We constabcon have players looking like they're playing football for the first time, players that look like they didn't do anything during the week.
The excuses are wearing thin. The number of times we drop points to lower placed sides is staggering. The buck stops with him.
The club needs to plan ahead. Enough of signing the next free agent manager.
 
Most clubs in the World would happily replace their own manager with Jose. That probably includes Arsenal (though as he has just been hired, that won't happen after a few months).
It boggles the mind why so many MUFC fans berate the manager who has won 2 trophies in the last 2 seasons (more than most teams in the league). He got us our highest league placing, since SAF retired. We made the FA Cup final just a few months ago.

I can see his next club being PSG and him winning all major trophies for them.

I think I am living some sort of alternate reality. The actual reality is that we finished near the bottom of the league last season and we haven't ever won a trophy under Jose.

I am completely flummoxed.

PSG wouldn't want him, their comments when they hired Tuchel shows this.
 
Are they the second richest owners in football? Pinault(Stade Rennais) who isn't the richest owner in football, is richer than all Fosun's owners put together.
In the local paper here (Express and Star) when Fosun took over it said their assets were £55 billion and only Citys owners assets were higher.
 
PSG wouldn't want him, their comments when they hired Tuchel shows this.

Yep, no big club will touch him after us. Bayern dont want him, so that leaves out Germany. If PSG really want to go in that direction permanently, he is out of France. In England, he has been already everywhere and no top 4 club is going to hire him. Same for Spain, neither Barca, Real nor Atletico will go for him after us. I reckon the only place he could go to would be Italy (not Juve, maybe Inter or Ac Milan) or a national team (Portugal?). Winning the big trophies wont be easy for him in the future. I could really see him at Inter after Spalletti, he should be suited there with his playstyle and they still love him.
 
What will end up happening is that Mourinho will leave for another club and end up winning the league. We will get a new manager who will replace half the team like LVG and Mou have done, we won’t win the PL for another 3 seasons and everyone will be calling for that manager to be replaced. Rinse and repeat.
So whats the answer then? Let him stop for as long as he wants playing the same dire football, crowds dwindling, foreign 'fans' leaving in droves, so the money for players forever dwindles and we still dont win the league?
 
The idea you have to stick with a manager because he's won trophies at X club X years ago seems baffling. We should have stuck with LVG then?
He has spent nearly £400m and been here for close to 30 months. Most time I watch us play, I'm constantly asking myself where this £400m has gone.
 
I know it's harsh but honestly I would try playing without Lukaku. His technique is poor and he's disruptive to the fluency of our play. We've actually got a player who had a superb season (and preseason) at striker but we don't try him there for some reason. Martial may prefer to play up top but I'd chuck him on LW because he can do a decent job there if he's arsed, and he hasn't really convinced at striker so far (still needs to improve his movement by a lot though).

Lingard needs to play deeper because his strength is movement rather than in front of goal.

Not harsh - a reasonable observation. He is not a top striker and his hold up play is awful for a PL player. He's an ok/good striker overall, especially in a team with wingers, but he offers very little when teams sit back (which is 99% of the time) apart from an occasional aerial threat because he is technically average & too cumbersome to find that half yard around the box.
 
At that time, their starting line-up was something like:

Casillas (at his peak), Arbeloa (at his peak), Ramos (at his peak), Pepe (at his peak), Marcelo (at his peak), Khedira (at his peak), Alonso (at his peak), Ozil (at his peak), di Maria (quite young, but bloody good), Ronaldo (at his peak), Benzema (at his peak).

Then they had Kaka, Higuaian, Morata, Diarra, Callejon, Varane, Carvalho, Nacho, Albiol, Sahin, Altintop.

They didn't need to be coached.

So I assume they'd been bossing La Liga pre Mou then? Didn't he also sign half those players above?

By that logic Pep might as well be the waterboy given the squad's he managed.
 
Most clubs in the World would happily replace their own manager with Jose. That probably includes Arsenal (though as he has just been hired, that won't happen after a few months).
It boggles the mind why so many MUFC fans berate the manager who has won 2 trophies in the last 2 seasons (more than most teams in the league). He got us our highest league placing, since SAF retired. We made the FA Cup final just a few months ago.

I can see his next club being PSG and him winning all major trophies for them.

I think I am living some sort of alternate reality. The actual reality is that we finished near the bottom of the league last season and we haven't ever won a trophy under Jose.

I am completely flummoxed.

Really can't see it unless they are just looking for something of a big name. If it's based on his management in the last lot of years - I can't see a legit top club going for Mourinho now.
 
In the local paper here (Express and Star) when Fosun took over it said their assets were £55 billion and only Citys owners assets were higher.

But they actually have less money, their net worth is inferior. Also Gazprom owns Zenit, Exor owns Juventus, QTA owns PSG and the list goes on, they all not only have bigger assets but also far bigger net worth.
 
Really can't see it unless they are just looking for something of a big name. If it's based on his management in the last lot of years - I can't see a legit top club going for Mourinho now.

I look at a club like PSG & how they played against Liverpool - they are made for a club of individuals. Jose can for pure example tell their RB to go forward, tell there LB to focus on defending, Tell neymar to cut in whilst mbappe provides width & cavan play as a target man.

That type of management is good enough for PSG - but it isn't good enough for the PL anymore.

The PL has actual teams now where the forwards are symmetrically doing the same thing on the pitch - be it mane & Salah, be it Sterling & Sane. The midfields are doing the same thing whether it's the tenacity of widjanldum, Henderson & Milner or the possession passing ability of fernandinh0, de bryune & silva.

Jose likes things differently & individually - making our RB not attack as much as his left back, making one winger stay wide whilst the other cuts in, have one target man that brings others to play, have a midfield that has an individual that can defend, have one that can long pass and one that can make short pass.


That type of individual player management isn't going to scare teams in the PL anymore when managers like Klopp, Conte, Pep & Now sarri have focused on teams playing in a complete symmetrical way rather than making certain players do certain things in certain areas.

It's why Jose is good at winning big matches - he makes the right decision to change thing for certain players for certain games ie like Herrera marking hazard - but ultimately does not have the ability to have a DNA that flows within the squad from back to front.

Certain clubs could use his individualism if they must - we are being put behind by it.
 
Yep, no big club will touch him after us. Bayern dont want him, so that leaves out Germany. If PSG really want to go in that direction permanently, he is out of France. In England, he has been already everywhere and no top 4 club is going to hire him. Same for Spain, neither Barca, Real nor Atletico will go for him after us. I reckon the only place he could go to would be Italy (not Juve, maybe Inter or Ac Milan) or a national team (Portugal?). Winning the big trophies wont be easy for him in the future. I could really see him at Inter after Spalletti, he should be suited there with his playstyle and they still love him.
Best place for him would be Valencia. Wealthy owner (a friend of his as well), low expectations, Mendes influence, relatively uncompetitive league. He could build a team of scrappers and noone would moan about the quality of the football.

But yeah, Serie A would also be good for him, and there's always a return to Porto.
 
Which club exactly? He's burned plenty bridges

He hasn’t managed in France or Germany yet so probably a club in Bundesliga or Ligue 1. Who knows.


So whats the answer then? Let him stop for as long as he wants playing the same dire football, crowds dwindling, foreign 'fans' leaving in droves, so the money for players forever dwindles and we still dont win the league?

I am not defending him, my post is more aimed at the running of this club.
 
He hasn’t managed in France or Germany yet so probably a club in Bundesliga or Ligue 1. Who knows.

No one wants him in France, PSG's owners don't want to be associated with his preferred playing style and his PR, other clubs rely on youth development and will never go for a manager with huge wage.
 
Most clubs in the World would happily replace their own manager with Jose. That probably includes Arsenal (though as he has just been hired, that won't happen after a few months).
It boggles the mind why so many MUFC fans berate the manager who has won 2 trophies in the last 2 seasons (more than most teams in the league). He got us our highest league placing, since SAF retired. We made the FA Cup final just a few months ago.

I can see his next club being PSG and him winning all major trophies for them.

I think I am living some sort of alternate reality. The actual reality is that we finished near the bottom of the league last season and we haven't ever won a trophy under Jose.

I am completely flummoxed.

Sunama this is why you said you wanted Mourinho.

Surely you can see he’s not the man you thought you were getting.
I think Mourinho would've won the title last year.
He'd make 2-3 new additions and he would command the respect of all players from day 1. He is Mourinho, after all.
He would devise tactics for each game, designed to beat teams who have better players than ours.

This season: almost impossible to win, because we have bought too many new players, which I think LVG believes are required in the first team.
Next year: definitely. LVG himself will be embarrassed if he cant win the title after spending so much money. And to be fair any decent manager should be able to win a league title, after spending £300M - £400M, in 3 Summers.

It really bugs me that we didnt get Mourinho, because he'd have us winning the title without spending such huge sums of money. And he probably would've won the title in his first year with us.

In terms of football style, Guardiola is the only choice, to continue what LVG has started.
I though, love to win and I want MUFC to win. With this in mind, I want Mourinho to come and start doing what he does best - and win the league title in his 2nd season.
 
No one wants him in France, PSG's owners don't want to be associated with his preferred playing style and his PR, other clubs rely on youth development and will never go for a manager with huge wage.

What a load of toss. We were that club a few years ago and we hired him.

If a manager as successful as Mourinho becomes available, clubs will be falling over themselves t hire him. He is after all the most successful manager of the last 15 years.

Maybe he returns to Inter or Milan or a historically big club.
 
People forget that a lot of posters who now want Mourinho gone will happily admit they wanted him in. Its okay to admit you got it wrong - we felt desperate and Mourinho's CV (much in the same vein as LVG) made us feel like he would deliver.

But in hindsight, he was always wrong for this club.
 
Said in the summer Jose won't get a big job again after us and I still stand by it. I don't know why PSG would go anywhere near him these days. Maybe if we did the unthinkable and won the CL they might be interested, but that's pure fantasy.

Jose is outdated and quite frankly publicly to much of a headache.
 
People forget that a lot of posters who now want Mourinho gone will happily admit they wanted him in. Its okay to admit you got it wrong - we felt desperate and Mourinho's CV (much in the same vein as LVG) made us feel like he would deliver.

But in hindsight, he was always wrong for this club.

It was obvious at the time!
 
Most clubs in the World would happily replace their own manager with Jose. That probably includes Arsenal (though as he has just been hired, that won't happen after a few months).
It boggles the mind why so many MUFC fans berate the manager who has won 2 trophies in the last 2 seasons (more than most teams in the league). He got us our highest league placing, since SAF retired. We made the FA Cup final just a few months ago.

I can see his next club being PSG and him winning all major trophies for them.

I think I am living some sort of alternate reality. The actual reality is that we finished near the bottom of the league last season and we haven't ever won a trophy under Jose.

I am completely flummoxed.
I cant see PSG hiring him and even if they do, I fully expect him to bottle it in CL. With all their money and low competition in League 1, I do not see Mou winning the CL ever again. However, he can do Ancelotti at the end: get hired by a top team that is expected to win its national league, drag them a couple of places down the table and get kicked by their Board.
 
The main reason I think it isn't working at United is possibly that his last few months at Chelsea have left him a bit out of sorts and maybe he has just lost his touch also. Whether United can afford to hang on and see if he regains it and turns the ship around, who knows. Maybe his confrontational and abrasive style, allied to the "style" of football he prefers just don't work any more, or at United in any case.
Also I would say that if he does leave, as regards his possible replacement, there are a few obvious names out there but who the right one for United is, that's another debate.
 
People forget that a lot of posters who now want Mourinho gone will happily admit they wanted him in. Its okay to admit you got it wrong - we felt desperate and Mourinho's CV (much in the same vein as LVG) made us feel like he would deliver.

But in hindsight, he was always wrong for this club.

Yep, I wanted him, thought it's what we needed, thought he could implement the same sort of style he did at Madrid, where they still scored plenty of goals. It's just not worked out for him here, and that's that. He's been give two season, plenty of money, and the returns just haven't justified the tumescent shite we saw most weeks.

He probably was always the wrong man really, but I honestly thought he could at least deliver us one league before it all went pear shaped.
 
What a load of toss. We were that club a few years ago and we hired him.

If a manager as successful as Mourinho becomes available, clubs will be falling over themselves t hire him. He is after all the most successful manager of the last 15 years.

Maybe he returns to Inter or Milan or a historically big club.

What are you talking about? United have nothing to do with french clubs, they don't have the money to pay him and they rely on a business model that doesn't suit 2018 Mourinho, so unless you think that Mourinho is going to take 10 times less than he currently does and that he will rely on young cheap players, no french club will be interested. As for PSG they are a different beast, the owner do not want to be associated with the type of football that Mourinho has been successful with, apparently under Ancelotti people around him made comments about the style and he really didn't took it well, also they are a terrible fit Mourinho, El Khelaifi is a control freak and refuses to give away any sort of power or any sort of negative comments regarding the club.
 
Sunama this is why you said you wanted Mourinho.

Surely you can see he’s not the man you thought you were getting.
As you can see, I agreed with Sunama at the time despite me not liking his management style. The whole forum has lowered the bar for Mourinho. People just need to remember why he was hired for in the first place and hold him to that standard. Clearly a lot of us moved the goal posts and continue with this false hope that he'll turn things around when this long term plan was never expected, nor does he have proven experience worth believing in.
 
I don't understand why he keeps on breaking things in the team that are working.

We had a fairly good CB partnership in Blind and Smalling when he took over. He spent £60m and we have ended up with a worse one.
Herrera was brilliant as a DM in his first season and partnered well with Pogba. Almost £100m later on Matic and Fred and our midfield looks worse.
We had Martial playing fantastically on the left last season. He signed Sanchez to play instead of him and we look worse in that position too.
We had Lingard playing the best football of his career as a #10. He moved him back to right wing where he's always looked extremely average.

It's ridiculous. Watching him try to construct his United team is like watching someone do a jigsaw and every five minutes they stop and rip up the corners.
Breaking things?:lol:We finished 6th with Herrera and 2nd with Matic.
 
We hired him because he was a winner, winners mentality, would do whatever it takes to get us winning again.

But sadly, it looks like he's turned us into losers.

He did well last season, somehow got us to 2nd, but that is the peak under him.
 
The problem for me is I know the likes of Pogba, Martial, Alexis, Rashford etc aren’t bad players but under Jose the lot of them look fecking clueless.

We could go and sign Salah and Kane and we’d still somehow make them look rubbish in our system, it doesn’t seem to matter who we sign that’s the scary thing.

I honestly deep down think if we signed Messi and Bale for example we'd still be hardly any better off, yeah we would have there individual talent that might win us the odd game or point but he'd still be absolutley clueless on how to set us up attacking wise,

Our squad is severely under performing and well if he cant fix that he has to go, Chelsea's system might not be a gold standard grade to follow but look at them already this season to last.
 
Most clubs in the World would happily replace their own manager with Jose. That probably includes Arsenal (though as he has just been hired, that won't happen after a few months).
It boggles the mind why so many MUFC fans berate the manager who has won 2 trophies in the last 2 seasons (more than most teams in the league). He got us our highest league placing, since SAF retired. We made the FA Cup final just a few months ago.

I can see his next club being PSG and him winning all major trophies for them.

I think I am living some sort of alternate reality. The actual reality is that we finished near the bottom of the league last season and we haven't ever won a trophy under Jose.

I am completely flummoxed.

It's all relative. Yes he won two trophies and yes he got us to finish second but this is Manchester United. The standards are higher and we have to be more competitive playing at a higher standard. And put very simply I don't believe he's getting the best out of the squad.
 
I cant see PSG hiring him and even if they do, I fully expect him to bottle it in CL. With all their money and low competition in League 1, I do not see Mou winning the CL ever again. However, he can do Ancelotti at the end: get hired by a top team that is expected to win its national league, drag them a couple of places down the table and get kicked by their Board.

Chelsea, Spurs, Arsenal, City. None of these teams would have mourinho. He created a very bad atmosphere at Real parking the bus against Barcelona repeatedly making Ronaldo defend first. He was booted out despite winning a league. He came to Chelsea, won the league and then there was mutiny. His stock has clearly fallen.
 
Can we put to bed this idea that changing managers means we start from ground zero and won't win a league for many years? Other clubs switch managers a lot, yet still win leagues. We don't have to act like Madrid and fire managers after winning us leagues, but we'd do well to cycle through until we have someone who shows competence and has a clear direction that aligns to our attacking ethos. Mourinho is not that guy. You'd have to do mental gymnastics to convince us otherwise.
 
What will end up happening is that Mourinho will leave for another club and end up winning the league. We will get a new manager who will replace half the team like LVG and Mou have done, we won’t win the PL for another 3 seasons and everyone will be calling for that manager to be replaced. Rinse and repeat.
Mourinho isn't going to win the league after he leaves us. Not whilst Pep and Klopp are still there. And which top club is going to take him after this? And give him another 300-400 million to spend?
 
This just isn't true dude.



He subbed Martial and Mata in only to have them stay in and around the box to try and pick up some scrap if opportunity presents itself from all the hoofball's going Fellaini's way who at that moment was our target man. And no one can say it wasn't our tactics that it was Martial and Mata's own doing because we didn't even try to stretch the opposition and go wide and include them in build-up, we just hoofed everything straight from the defence or Pogba would come back, pick up the ball at our half and hoof it upfront.

I just don't see what you mean by "players hiding".

The chances may not have been abundant but we had good chances, more than just 'half' chances. This is a prime example of poor play: Martial's flick to Lukaku.

When results like this happen all the focus is on the manager, Sanchez is rightly, finally getting some stick but Lukaku has been subpar, along with a few others. We're at the point where Fellani is starting to look like our most consistent performer. These players just go unscathed because the focus is on 'Jose out' all the time instead. Some of them aren't justifying their wages but Jose can't say anything because if he does, he's a bully.
 
It's not even that - the op said it wrong - there is a difference between plotting them out on the pitch & expecting them to do the best. They need to be positioned better to get the best out of them in a regular manner where they build confidence by every match.

We have Rashford playing left & right - getting trampled on when he suddenly doesn't score upfront as a makeshift target man for the rest of the team.

Martial plays on the left when he has the best short passing, 1-2's, dribbling as well as first touch - ie he should playing central to bring others in to play in my opinion rather than expecting a world class cross again in to a single target man. Same could be said about Sanchez.

Lukaku himself is better just off the centre on the right to utilise his left foot after running behind the defence - not to be the one who initiates play from the centre.

Would Firminho be good on the left wing supplying crosses for Sturrridge? How would Salah be on the other side - he isn't all that good when Sturrridge plays himself. Just as an example - players need to be positioned well - not just put on the pitch to get the best out of a very few players.
In theory, that sounds good, but Martial would be eaten up alive in the middle, where it's much more crowded. If he keeps trying to dribble and losing the ball that much on the wing, what do you think would happen in the middle?
 
Last few months of Mourinho at United, I'm ready to be patient. Not long to go now
With you here.. Cant be long to go now.
Every game we play we look poor. Even v young boys we looked terrible for the first 30 min or so. Absolutely clue and classless, cant wait for him to leave . When we lose its the players when we win they followed his instructions, its never his fault . I have never liked him and didnt want him here but he is even worse than what I could ever have imagined, in my books he is worse than Moyes.
 
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