The Mourinho Thread: Should he stay or go? | Sacked

[cheeky_backheel]

The same alderweireld who is having a poor season and is injury prone? Perisic has 2 goals and 2 assists this season and he would have replaced Martial. I don't see the improvement

This was about last season, where Perisic finished with 11 goals + 9 assists. Also Perisic's style of play would have suited Lukaku better and he can play on either flank, so there wouldnt be a specific need to drop martial.

Alderweireld is one of the best PL defenders and better than all of our current CBs. Prior to last season, when he had a major hamstring injury, he started 38 and 30 league games in his previous two seasons for Spurs. This season, he has been available for all CL and PL games and started all games except two. That is a lot of appearances for a guy that you claim is injury prone.

Those players would not have guaranteed winning the league but they would have improved our chances of doing so. We would have been able to put pressure on Citeh and no one knows how they would have responded under pressure.

The valid objection is the age of the players, though its a lesser concern with Alderweireld.

 

[roonster09]

This was about last season, where Perisic finished with 11 goals + 9 assists. Also Perisic's style of play would have suited Lukaku better and he can play on either flank, so there wouldnt be a specific need to drop Martial.

Alderweireld is one of the best PL defenders and better than all of our current CBs. Prior to last season, when he had a major hamstring injury, he started 38 and 30 league games in his previous two seasons for Spurs. This season, he has been available for all CL and PL games and started all games except two. That is a lot of appearances for a guy that you claim is injury prone.

Those players would not have guaranteed winning the league but they would have improved our chances of doing so. We would have been able to put pressure on Citeh and no one knows how they would have responded under pressure.

The valid objection is the age of the players, though its a lesser concern with Alderweireld.

Perisic stats look good but his general play was average last season and even poor this season. It would have been one more expensive old player warming our bench.

Also Martial contributed as many goals and assists in limited playing time and no, Perisic is a left winger and played all his Inter career as left winger where he was impressive. Again, one more player who would have better suited as LW and would have been out of position as RW.

I don't understand why people want player to be signed and then want him to play in different position. We should either sign a proper RW or just shut up instead of wasting even more money.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Unfortunately most members didnt see buying Matic that way when he was initially bought.

Even at the end of last season many still didnt see it coming (https://www.redcafe.net/threads/Matic-debut-season-review.438495/). Some went as far as claiming he was the best signing by Mourinho yet and he was indeed instrumental last season. So criticism of buying Matic is being done now by most with the benefit of hind sight.

But to me it was obvious (Nemanja Matic| BBC says deal agreed) and anyone in a position to approve transfers should have known they would likely be getting 2yrs max from him and should have factored it in to the price negotiated and made plans for a timely replacement. Even if Matic was Mourinho's prime target, that fault still lies with Ed for approving the transfer as he has the final say.

No manager should have their transfers be automatically secured (after all what if it would bankrupt the club). What needs to be accepted is the needs identified by the manager but his list of candidates is just a small set of possible candidates to address the identified need. That list is not exhaustive (and usually can never be), as it is limited to the manager's subjective judgement of only the players the he is aware of. It is the responsibility of whoever has the final say on transfers to ensure the club explores beyond the list and in fact should be part of due diligence. It is only required that the input of the manager be considered in the final choice.

To be absolutely fair, plenty didn't want Matic and were extremely vocal about it. The problem was after the West Ham game where he started well, anyone that didn't want him got abused and ganged up on by the condescending folk who 'told us all' that he was still the dogs bollox. Remember all the green similes after his first few games with the hilarious gags about his age etc (you know the ones, oh 29 was apparently the new 40 lol bantz brigade at play). Shockingly, all these posters seem to have vanished without a trace, funny that. Have a look at the early stuff in here. Funnily enough, he won me over by his start and I wondered was I maybe wrong about him and he had just gone stale at Chelsea and needed a change. Turns out I was absolutely spot on and he was completely past it when he came here bar his false dawn of a start.

At the end of the day this transfer is totally on Mourinho's head. His lack of ability to think outside the box and constantly having to go with what he knows has cost us big time. Now we are left with a horrendous Matic that is starting every single game and is clearly a huge issue for us.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

To be absolutely fair, plenty didn't want Matic and were extremely vocal about it. The problem was after the West Ham game where he started well, anyone that didn't want him got abused and ganged up on by the condescending folk who 'told us all' that he was still the dogs bollox. Remember all the green similes after his first few games with the hilarious gags about his age etc (you know the ones, oh 29 was apparently the new 40 lol bantz brigade at play). Shockingly, all these posters seem to have vanished without a trace, funny that. Have a look at the early stuff in here. Funnily enough, he won me over by his start and I wondered was I maybe wrong about him and he had just gone stale at Chelsea and needed a change. Turns out I was absolutely spot on and he was completely past it when he came here bar his false dawn of a start.

At the end of the day this transfer is totally on Mourinho's head. His lack of ability to think outside the box and constantly having to go with what he knows has cost us big time. Now we are left with a horrendous Matic that is starting every single game and is clearly a huge issue for us.

That is where I disagree. Getting Matic wouldnt have been a bad deal if we didnt pay 40m for him. If we had gotten him for free or cheap and gotten a young talent along with him, we wouldn't be too remiss of his decline.

Ed felt paying 40m for Matic was a better deal than getting Dier or any other younger alternative. Its no different from how he made the judgement call on Perisc (which i agreed with), and, on Sanchez, Fred and Lukaku (which I disagreed with). He cannot be credited for not going through with some deals but Mourinho then gets the blame for the bad buys. Ed is responsible for all buys and contracts - good and bad, cos he has the final say and chooses when to approve and when not to.

To make matters worse, Mourinho has a par record at best on transfers (guy bought quaresma at Inter, who was voted the worst footballer in serie A at the end of the season - wtf!). You shouldnt rely entirely on Mourinho for transfer target evaluations unless you have cash to burn Inter has been the club that got the most out of Mourinho and they did that by accommodating his views and addressing his identified needs, without surrendering entirely to his whims or player preferences (if they had, Inter would have likely mortgaged the entire club to secure Deco and Carvalho who Mourinho wanted at all cost but surprisingly won the treble without them.)

If Ed doesnt know the strengths and weaknesses of Mourinho, (which are pretty well known to even fans of the game), then he has no business managing transfers.

 

[Dembeza]

Other than Pep, who has outspent Mourinho since he has been our manager?

 

[Rash Decision]

To be absolutely fair, plenty didn't want Matic and were extremely vocal about it. The problem was after the West Ham game where he started well, anyone that didn't want him got abused and ganged up on by the condescending folk who 'told us all' that he was still the dogs bollox. Remember all the green similes after his first few games with the hilarious gags about his age etc (you know the ones, oh 29 was apparently the new 40 lol bantz brigade at play). Shockingly, all these posters seem to have vanished without a trace, funny that. Have a look at the early stuff in here. Funnily enough, he won me over by his start and I wondered was I maybe wrong about him and he had just gone stale at Chelsea and needed a change. Turns out I was absolutely spot on and he was completely past it when he came here bar his false dawn of a start.

At the end of the day this transfer is totally on Mourinho's head. His lack of ability to think outside the box and constantly having to go with what he knows has cost us big time. Now we are left with a horrendous Matic that is starting every single game and is clearly a huge issue for us.

I think Matic had a good half season last season and finished as one of our better players overall (not much competition there in fairness). This season yeah he has been awful. Still I'm reluctant to judge him too harshly given the chaotic "system" we play now. Even with Pereira and Fred in the side Leicester still dominated the midfield against us.

 

[Adisa]

I find it incredible that some are saying a negative GD after 12 games does not matter.
What the feck is wrong with some of you?

 

[JPRouve]

Yea, math was incorrect. I was doing the points, not just the wins. Points are more important than straight up wins so I assumed that it was that percentage being shown which was incorrect.

He managed Sporting for 2 seasons and Real for 1. At both clubs if you don't finish top 3 you've done a horrible job. He lost 10 matches in the league with Real which is bad and he got knocked out of the CL by Monaco and he had Zidane, Ronaldo, Figo and Casillas and Raúl in their prime. That's what he's done at club level which is what matters. Half of his stats are with Iran, Portugal, South Africa and UAE. We took on LvG after he did well with Netherlands. It's not the same thing.

I don't understand what you are doing here, you used a simple data to make a point and that simple data at 55% is actually good. That's what I said and I'm right, at no point I told you that he had a good career or that it was a good reflection of his career which is why I said that it was surprising.

Just to illustrate my point, with SCP he had a 66% win percentage that's good and with Real Madrid 57% that's also good even though it wasn't enough to keep his job. Del Bosque during his second stint at Madrid has a 55,6 win percentage, he stayed 4 seasons and won the league twice. At the time in Spain with 21 wins you were in a close title race, Madrid were champions with 22 the previous season.

 

[Minimalist]

I find it incredible that some are saying a negative GD after 12 games does not matter.
What the feck is wrong with some of you?

Because we've apparently being playing well lately.

Fecking news to me.

 

[Mainoldo]

Goretzka.

I do not know if his suggestions were falling on deaf ears - was it Mourinho or was it Woodward (who loves signings that sell shirts - and Can and Goretzka dont sell shirts)

We will never know the inner workings of the club. But one thing is obvious, theres no better run club than City at the moment and no worse than United and that shows on the pitch as well.

Till we fix the administrative side of the club i.e. Woodward- nothing will change. Mourinho isnt the biggest problem at our club. I firmly believe that theres no manager in football that can win a major trophy with this squad. Yes we need a better manager. But more than that we need better players.

That can only happen when the club is run in an organized way with a group of experts and a world class DOF in-charge of recruitment.

No they don’t. But Fred does? Little things like that it’s like people don’t think when they write. Woody doesn’t care about selling shirts. Yes he will buy a superstar. But there’s a reason that they are a superstar. I.e. there pretty frigging good.

There’s nothing to fix, we just need a manager who can bring success. Everything’s broke when the football on the pitch is crap. No one cares about the board when we are successful. It’s just how it goes. You say City are well run but they’ve missed out on Sanchez and Jorginho lately. If for instance Liverpool has the same squad base of us when Klopp took over these no signings could be costing Pep the league right now.

 

[Murray3007]

still needs to go for me, yes we have been better this last month but only if we go behind, the city game was just as rubbish, every goal we conceded was poor from our point of view, we need a new manager in, players as well, would you really trust Jose to buy anymore players with how his transfers have been ?

 

[Judas]

I think people who are saying Woodward has already decided to bin off Jose at the end of the season are kidding themselves a bit. We've had leaks a plenty when big decision have been made at the club lately, as soon as we see ones alluding to a new manager again I'll start being Jose's days are truly numbered.

 

[VP89]

I think people who are saying Woodward has already decided to bin off Jose at the end of the season are kidding themselves a bit. We've had leaks a plenty when big decision have been made at the club lately, as soon as we see ones alluding to a new manager again I'll start being Jose's days are truly numbered.

I think he will ditch him if a big name manager were to be available in the summer. Heck, he may well have sacked him earlier than today if he had an alternative.

 

[Adisa]

big name

Depressing thing about Woodward. I have no faith in him picking the right man. Isntead I fear he will look for bright lights.

 

[Greck]

I find it incredible that some are saying a negative GD after 12 games does not matter.
What the feck is wrong with some of you?

It's so wrong because they assume we're just going to make up a quarter season's worth of goal difference the rest of the way. All signs signify we won't get enough to edge the 4th on the table. An inferior goal difference means we need an additional point to match whoever is in top 4. That 7 point gap is actually 8

 

[Judas]

Depressing thing about Woodward. I have no faith in him picking the right man. Isntead I fear he will look for bright lights.

Basically. If Tom Cruise announced he fancied managing a football team, Woody would be all over it.

 

[Fracture90]

Once we attacked in the second half at Stamford Bridge they looked quite ordinary. It's a big underrating of our squad to suggest we can't compete with Chelsea.

Iirc when Mourinho was appointed (especially after his first transfer window) it was almost unanimous concensus that only City had a slightly better squad than ours, whilst we had squad that was better than other rival squads.

Fast forward 2+ years, lot's of player stagnating and regressing, as well as £400 million spent on a whole lot of poor recruitments and we get to that. All of a sudden our squad is poor...

Sarri has been bang average so far.

Conte first season they were brilliant.

They miss Diego Costa a lot.

I'm curious, for the sake of argument, if you consider Sarri to have been bang average so far, how do you see Mourinho so far this season?

If Guardiola was the coach of this United team he would not win anything.

Our biggest problem is our recruitment. It is abysmal.

That's kinda unfair comparison to make but even still I'm pretty sure we would at least be playing some much better football. Him not winning anything isn't really a big change considering we're not winning anything this season with Mourinho either, right?

Now imagine if Guardiola took over instead of Mourinho and if he had the same amount to spend like Mourinho did, do you think we'd be in this mess?

I think you could levy the same accusation at Guardiola. Before Guardiola spent millions at city, he didnt win anything either. Big clubs need special managers who in turn need special players.

I dont think theres any doubt that Mourinho needs to spend money to succeed. But the club knew that when they hired him. Any club that hires Jose knows this. I wont defend Mourinho's football philosophy, its boring. But if he's given all the players he wants, he usually gets results and wins trophies.

That pretty much fits with Mourinho's "it's never my fault" mantra.

Can you point at the manager that has been given all the players he wanted?

So you think Perisic and Alderweireld wouldnt have made us a better team last season. We finished second without them and probably would have had a shot at the title with them.

The problem is their age/longevity but they definitely would have made us more competitive for the league title.

That's you assuming they'd fit right in and start producing from the get go, something not many of Mourinho's signings have done.

 

[tonnas]

Can't understand after all this torture of performance, there is still even 1 fan that supports Mourinho. To make it worse we are presumably giving a 1 year contract to both young and Valencia. We are a shambles, from the board to the manager.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

[QUOTE="Fracture90, post: 23296590, member: 105538"IThat's you assuming they'd fit right in and start producing from the get go, something not many of Mourinho's signings have done.[/QUOTE]
Aldeweireld is local to the PL and should have no difficulty going into the starting lineup directly, as happens with many intra PL transfers.

Perisic is a higher risk but he is quite matured and has played in multiple leagues. He shouldnt require more than half the season to settle in.

 

[CM]

That is where I disagree. Getting Matic wouldnt have been a bad deal if we didnt pay 40m for him. If we had gotten him for free or cheap and gotten a young talent along with him, we wouldn't be too remiss of his decline.

Ed felt paying 40m for Matic was a better deal than getting Dier or any other younger alternative. Its no different from how he made the judgement call on Perisc (which i agreed with), and, on Sanchez, Fred and Lukaku (which I disagreed with). He cannot be credited for not going through with some deals but Mourinho then gets the blame for the bad buys. Ed is responsible for all buys and contracts - good and bad, cos he has the final say and chooses when to approve and when not to.

To make matters worse, Mourinho has a par record at best on transfers (guy bought quaresma at Inter, who was voted the worst footballer in serie A at the end of the season - wtf!). You shouldnt rely entirely on Mourinho for transfer target evaluations unless you have cash to burn Inter has been the club that got the most out of Mourinho and they did that by accommodating his views and addressing his identified needs, without surrendering entirely to his whims or player preferences (if they had, Inter would have likely mortgaged the entire club to secure Deco and Carvalho who Mourinho wanted at all cost but surprisingly won the treble without them.)

If Ed doesnt know the strengths and weaknesses of Mourinho, (which are pretty well known to even fans of the game), then he has no business managing transfers.

What kind of revisionist history is this? Mourinho was the one who actively pushed to get Matic and even made a point of saying so at the time. He's only cemented that with his 'island of personality' comments at the end of last season and his unquestioning faith in playing him at every possible opportunity since.

You talk as though Woodward has picked and chosen which transfers he wants to veto. We didn't sign Perisic because Inter wanted too much money and last summer we didn't sign a CB for similar reasons (though, as it happened, most of the ones we were linked to were shit anyway). Everything else has been Mourinho's call and he's received enormous financial backing to facilitate those requests.

One of the few positives of signing Matic is it doesn't commit us to playing a limited player in the long-term and we can break from him once a decision is made on Mourinho. It would've been an unending cycle of misery if we'd have signed Dier and he was here to hang around after Mourinho.

 

[kr0nix]

I find it incredible that some are saying a negative GD after 12 games does not matter.
What the feck is wrong with some of you?

I reckon the people that are still on the fence are concerned about the lack of a clear alternative.
Out of curiosity, how did you feel about Mourinho when he was initially hired?

 

[Cee90]

Changed my vote from 'not yet' to 'yes' as to whether or not Jose should go.

Thing is, I would let him go at the end of the season, simply because I can't think of any good replacements at this moment in time.

Also, our overall structure is a mess, so I think whoever the new manager is would encounter the same issues as Jose.

Hopefully as a club we are now working on structural changes across the organisation in preparation for our new manager next season. That includes a Director of Football, identifying transfer targets, the scouting system, training, key coaching staff, the youth setup etc.

I'd be shocked if Jose didn't leave at the end of this season or sooner.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

What kind of revisionist history is this? Mourinho was the one who actively pushed to get Matic and even made a point of saying so at the time. He's only cemented that with his 'island of personality' comments at the end of last season and his unquestioning faith in playing him at every possible opportunity since.

You talk as though Woodward has picked and chosen which transfers he wants to veto. We didn't sign Perisic because Inter wanted too much money and last summer we didn't sign a CB for similar reasons (though, as it happened, most of the ones we were linked to were
p shit anyway). Everything else has been Mourinho's call and he's received enormous financial backing to facilitate those requests.

One of the few positives of signing Matic is it doesn't commit us to playing a limited player in the long-term and we can break from him once a decision is made on Mourinho. It would've been an unending cycle of misery if we'd have signed Dier and he was here to hang around after Mourinho.

1. who decided that what inter wanted for perisic was too much?

2. who decided that 40m was an acceptable deal for Matic?

3. who decided the price asked for Alderweireld and/or Macguire was too high?

 

[Adisa]

I reckon the people that are still on the fence are concerned about the lack of a clear alternative.
Out of curiosity, how did you feel about Mourinho when he was initially hired?

I didn't want him, I will admit. But when he was announced, I quickly came round to the idea and actually actively defended him on this forum, through out the first season when we were 6th. I have always had doubts about him, since I didn't want him but I rationalised it by focusing on what we were good at as a team and what I could see improving. We were tough to beat, resilient, conceded few goals and played pretty decent football in his first season.
My patience started to run out in December last year. Too many players were off form and our football looked to be deteriorating.
Sevilla for me, broke the Camel's back. Our approach in those games, against a team that was struggling badly did it for me. I realised that my doubts about him were infact correct. Everything that has happened since February is just a confirmation of why I never wanted him.
I can say hand on heart, I have nothing against him and gave him a fair crack for the first 18/20 months of his time here.
As for what happens now. I don't think the club should sack him now, without a plan. And I'm not sure they do, which is what worries me.
If Ed Woodward, doesn't at this point know if Mourinho will be manager this time next year, he needs to be fired.
Another reason why I'm not in a rush to push him out the door is because a new DoF has to come in before a new manager. This club needs to decide how it wants to operate in the future and the values it wants to uphold on the pitch. Once that is decided with a DoF, get a new manager that fits and then look at the squad.
Until then, I'd leave things as they are but also wouldn't spend on players or renew contracts for ootentiallp fringe players. If you must soend, spend on obvious talents like Skrinnar or Dembele.

 

[Irish Jet]

Mourinho has been defined by his big money signings – And they’ve failed him big time. These were his chance to make his mark on the squad but between him and Woodward they’ve botched it in a big way. Our squad looks nearly as disjointed as when Van Gaal left – It’s a better group of players but not to the extent that it should be with the money spent. Mourinho inherited a mess but it looks like he will leave one behind too. Any worries that we had surrounding any of his signings, any red flags have all came to be – With the exception of Zlatan’s first contract.

Matic and Alexis were always a short term option with the risk of dropping off a cliff. They have both dropped off a cliff. They had shown signs of decline before we signed them – One of them under Mourinho’s management. These were disregarded and it’s backfired spectacularly.

My biggest concern with Lukaku was that he’d contribute just enough and score just enough to play regularly while always limiting the team. This has proven to be the case and it’s becoming increasingly difficult to develop a quick, fluid style with him leading the line. He’s proving to be a hindrance in big games especially as he doesn’t even provide the nuisance value or hold up play you need from a Mourinho striker. Doesn’t offer enough to justify his fee although it’s not like the other realistic striking options were great, especially in that period. Still looks a bad investment.

Bailly has struggled with injuries looks even more erratic than when he signed.

Mkhitaryan was the flake we feared he’d be.

Lindelof has just now shown anything and it’s still not a lot. Tough to know what he’s actually good at.

Fred has struggled to adapt to this point, too early to write him off but obviously would have expected more.

Pogba is the world class talent capable of anything who tries everything which leads to bizarre inconsistency. We wondered before he signed just how he’d fit and how we’d accommodate him, where his best position is – We’re still wondering. All the concerns about his agent’s f*ckery – Justified.

There were a lot of high risk/high reward signings but nearly all of them have blown up in our face and not a single one other than Zlatan exceeded expectations. Oh and Lee Grant.

Mourinho and Woodward both need to be held to account and it’s tough to trust either with another window. I don’t hate Mourinho like a lot of people on here – Was desperate for him to succeed but he hasn’t managed these signings well either – He inherited an upside down mess of a squad but has failed with his opportunities to rebuild it. The fact that we’re still so reliant on Alex Ferguson era players – Many who weren’t significant players in Fergie’s sides – Is a shocking indictment of the investments since. Woodward should be first on the chopping block – He’s the biggest fraud in football.

 

[mancan92]

This was about last season, where Perisic finished with 11 goals + 9 assists. Also Perisic's style of play would have suited Lukaku better and he can play on either flank, so there wouldnt be a specific need to drop Martial.

Alderweireld is one of the best PL defenders and better than all of our current CBs. Prior to last season, when he had a major hamstring injury, he started 38 and 30 league games in his previous two seasons for Spurs. This season, he has been available for all CL and PL games and started all games except two. That is a lot of appearances for a guy that you claim is injury prone.

Those players would not have guaranteed winning the league but they would have improved our chances of doing so. We would have been able to put pressure on Citeh and no one knows how they would have responded under pressure.

The valid objection is the age of the players, though its a lesser concern with Alderweireld.

So again the same perisic who got less goals and assists than martial whilst also playing nearly 800 minutes more........ whilst also getting less than Rashford who is backup for martial. I'm struggling to see where the improvement would be with him except from just being another squad option or the player that Jose plays to hinder martial again.

Come on mate alderweireld has been poor this season and has had many injuries. Ask Tottenham fans this season he has been poor defensively.

 

[Treble]

On our bench against City there were players for 230m! Bournemouth's entire squad is worth less than 180m. If money were that important as Jose acolytes say it would be very easy to outperform Bournemouth. There is no excuse for being so shit and being out run in every single game.

 

[fellaini's barber]

Other than Pep, who has outspent Mourinho since he has been our manager?

All Woodward signings unfortunately

Basically. If Tom Cruise announced he fancied managing a football team, Woody would be all over it.

At least he might get our players make some amazing runs every game

 

[fellaini's barber]

What really drives me crazy about this team is how we just stand there. No movement,no pressing, we just bloody stand there. An opposing player could spend a full minute dancing around the the ball and we'd all just be looking and waiting for him to pass the ball to us. Do you need 11 world class players just to press?

 

[VP89]

What really drives me crazy about this team is how we just stand there. No movement,no pressing, we just bloody stand there. An opposing player could spend a full minute dancing around the the ball and we'd all just be looking and waiting for him to pass the ball to us. Do you need 11 world class players just to press?

Weridly though, Jose has been quite vocal on how he wants the team to press and start matches quicker.

I saw a change against Juventus to be fair. The city game not so much until they scored the first goal. City might be a bad example to test however. If we don't look considerably better against the fixtures we have left for 2018 it's fair to say Mourinho's training on starting the games quicker definately isn't working!

 

[fellaini's barber]

If there's once club in the PL that shouldn't be moaning about City's spending it's us. I don't really get all this talk about their spending as if we've been spending like Burnley. They averagely sign 3-5 players every window, like us. Only difference I see between them and us is that their signings work out while ours mostly don't, and this is 100% down to the clueless managers we keep hiring. We are probably the only big club in the world who totally depend on the manager for signings,we'd sign a bloody monkey if a manager told us to,at least before Ed grew a brain this summer.

There's no excuse for us not to have a team as good as City's if we've been buying well, we just aren't. We let LVG ship in a bucketload of crap which we're still trying to get rid of, now Jose has brought in his own bucketload of crap most of whom we'll be trying to shift as soon as he leaves. This is where Ed's own stupidity comes in, renewing contracts of players we should be binning, replacing some players even if the manager won't etc. We should have learnt by now that leaving signings to managers wholly is a bad idea but we'll defintely do it again with the next manager. We'll hire Zidane, who'll bring in Benzema and other expired Madrid products and rejects and we'll be back to square one.

We really really need to get the next manager right, and have a system in place to not just wait on managers to tell us what players to get. Ed is probably dense enough to give Matic and Fellaini a renewal if Jose tells him to,we can't go on like this

 

[sincher]

It ain't all JM's fault chaps, and certainly it isn't all about 'coaching'.

I mean looking at the City match you could just look at the line ups and envisage a bit of a tonking.

De Gea - Young, Lindelof, Smalling, Shaw - Matic, Herrera, Fellaini - Martial, Lingard, Rashford

Ederson - Walker, Stones, Laporte, Mendy - Fernandinho, B.Silva, D.Silva, Sterling, Mahrez - Aguero

Gulf in quality really. Their defence is better, their midfield is WAY better, their attack is way better - and they are in great form. Some of that is Mourinho's fault, but not all. You could play that match (at the Etihad) 100 times with different tactics and coaching and what have you, and I reckon City would win 90+.

 

[fellaini's barber]

Weridly though, Jose has been quite vocal on how he wants the team to press and start matches quicker.

I saw a change against Juventus to be fair. The city game not so much until they scored the first goal. City might be a bad example to test however. If we don't look considerably better against the fixtures we have left for 2018 it's fair to say Mourinho's training on starting the games quicker definately isn't working!

I didn't see much of this pressing against Juventus. First or second leg we were just shite as usual and woke up when we were behind then got lucky with set pieces

 

[VP89]

I didn't see much of this pressing against Juventus. First or second leg we were just shite as usual and woke up when we were behind then got lucky with set pieces

I disagree we were much better against Juventus away than home and pressed them a lot more. The stats showed it and the pundits seemed to elude to it too.

Sure we leaked chances but that was bound to happen as you go more adventurous.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

So again the same perisic who got less goals and assists than Martial whilst also playing nearly 800 minutes more........ whilst also getting less than Rashford who is backup for Martial. I'm struggling to see where the improvement would be with him except from just being another squad option or the player that Jose plays to hinder Martial again.

That is only from the league. Martial had only 9 goals + 5 assists in the PL last season.

Come on mate alderweireld has been poor this season and has had many injuries. Ask Tottenham fans this season he has been poor defensively.

So you think smalling and co are better? Keeping in mind that guy that has been poor defensively has led a defence that has conceded less than half the number of goals as ours.

you guys are too willing to spew any nonsense

 

[EwanI Ted]

It ain't all JM's fault chaps, and certainly it isn't all about 'coaching'.

I mean looking at the City match you could just look at the line ups and envisage a bit of a tonking.

De Gea - Young, Lindelof, Smalling, Shaw - Matic, Herrera, Fellaini - Martial, Lingard, Rashford

Ederson - Walker, Stones, Laporte, Mendy - Fernandinho, B.Silva, D.Silva, Sterling, Mahrez - Aguero

Gulf in quality really. Their defence is better, their midfield is WAY better, their attack is way better - and they are in great form. Some of that is Mourinho's fault, but not all. You could play that match (at the Etihad) 100 times with different tactics and coaching and what have you, and I reckon City would win 90+.

Its his third season, why dont you consider Mourinho primarily responsible for building the squad we have?

 

[Treble]

I disagree we were much better against Juventus away than home and pressed them a lot more. The stats showed it and the pundits seemed to elude to it too.

Sure we leaked chances but that was bound to happen as you go more adventurous.

The game in Turin was more static than that at OT and both teams covered way more distance in Manchester than in Turin: 112km vs 106km for Juve and 105km vs 100km for us. 100km is pathetic. The alleged improvement was down to Juve being more lazy/relaxed in Turin compared to their performance in the first leg.

 

[RooneyLegend]

We know how to do this, how to deal with a record breaking team with a limitless bank balance. However it seems we've forgotten how we got it done the last time around. The plan doesnt involve spending ludicrous amounts of money on overpriced 29 year olds, i can tell you that much. It also doesn't involve playing a depressing brand of football.

The question is simple, can you build a squad as strong as Cities but on a lessor budget. Yes we can, but we need to be shrewd. This involves getting players of high value below market prices. It involves signing young players with great potential and developing them. It also involves developing whatever we from the academy.

Take for example Pool and City. Both have similar defensive records but the City backline cost 200 million while theirs cost 100 million. Cities attack cost 150 million while theirs cost 100 million. That's a combined 150 million difference but a negligible difference in quality of those two departments of their teams.

How do we know thats how to go about toppling them or at the very least competing with them? That's what we did when we were faced with a dominant Chelsea side, one that was managed by our current manager no less. However it seems Pool are using our blueprint while we are confused and without a plan.

He's not the man for such a project, at this point it should be obvious. His record with developing youth is abysmal. He doesn't have an eye for a bargain. Even the experienced ones he has nought have failed us. Under these conditions how are we supposed to get back to the top.

 

[mancan92]

That is only from the league. Martial had only 9 goals + 5 assists in the PL last season.
So you think Smalling and co are better? Keeping in mind that guy that has been poor defensively has led a defence that has conceded less than half the number of goals as ours.

you guys are too willing to spew any nonsense

In all competitions Perisic got 11 goals and assists. That is not better than martial and similar to Rashford in a less league

 

[TsuWave]

fullbacks laughing at martial tracking them back instead of attacking them