The MMA thread

JP77 said:
Which is absolute nonsense and even more so considering how over stacked the UFC are with events nowadays. CM Punk isn't taking anybodies spot, that's not how it works and it's actually a bizarre way to even look at it.
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Are you arguing that UFC are extending their cards to include a CM Punk fight? Because if you aren't, and they aren't, then he is taking up a spot that someone more deserving could be in. I don't know how you can argue otherwise. You say it doesn't work like that so maybe explain how it works?

If anything, Punk fighting could bring some extra casual viewers to the product and even help put eyes on other talents on the card he fights on.
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No one is arguing that he won't bring in pro wrestling fans. The argument is that he is a complete novice and has no business fighting in the UFC.
 
The Bloody-Nine said:
Are you arguing that UFC are extending their cards to include a CM Punk fight? Because if you aren't, and they aren't, then he is taking up a spot that someone more deserving could be in. I don't know how you can argue otherwise. You say it doesn't work like that so maybe explain how it works?


No one is arguing that he won't bring in pro wrestling fans. The argument is that he is a complete novice and has no business fighting in the UFC.
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I'm arguing that the idea he's taking some incredibly deserving guys spot is an absolutely ridiculous way to try to spin it in a sport like MMA just because you don't like the idea of Punk fighting in the UFC. You're drumming up a negative take just to complain about something you don't like.

It'll effect nobody in a negative way, it's completely harmless. Nobody will look back in five years time and say "Ah, that CM Punk guy that took the spot of that one fighter that deserved to be on that card, the bastard!". To not like it or want to watch it? Fine, but let's not start acting like this is some big deal when it really isn't.
 
JP77 said:
I'm arguing that the idea he's taking some incredibly deserving guys spot is an absolutely ridiculous way to try to spin it in a sport like MMA just because you don't like the idea of Punk fighting in the UFC. You're drumming up a negative take just to complain about something you don't like.
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Any fighter in the UFC who is there on merit is more deserving than Punk. Punk 'fighting' on a card means someone is missing out on exposure and a payday.

It'll effect nobody in a negative way, it's completely harmless. Nobody will look back in five years time and say "Ah, that CM Punk guy that took the spot of that one fighter that deserved to be on that card, the bastard!". To not like it or want to watch it? Fine, but let's not start acting like this is some big deal when it really isn't.
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Complete bullshit. Punk made half a million for his first embarrassment. You seriously don't believe that had a negative impact on established UFC guys who make a fraction of that?

Let's see what a quick google tells us.

Then [former WWE star] CM Punk [Phil Brooks] signed with the UFC, people asked me how I felt about it, and I said, "CM Punk will probably make more money than I do on his very first fight." And he did. I think his payout was $500,000. I have nothing against CM Punk, but if you look at the sheer nonsense of that, it doesn't make sense. I know you have to look at the business standpoint, that he's going to sell a lot of tickets, but he can't fight! That's why I've said the UFC should just try to sign that "Cash Me Ousside" girl, because she'll talk s--- and probably outsell everybody.
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http://www.espn.co.uk/mma/story/_/i...s-no-holds-barred-cm-punk-mayweather-mcgregor

Sure, it's affecting no one. Just pissing off every other fighter in the promotion who sees it for the joke that it is.
 
JP77 said:
Is it really a disgrace though? I just don't get the complaints.

CM Punk having another fight isn't effecting 'career MMA' guys what so ever. Nothing changes whether Punk fights again or not in those terms.
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In my opinion he is absolutely effect career MMA guys. Guys that have fought in shitty venues in front of 10 people, worked their way up the ladder, started to get noticed. Hoping to get on a UFC card and then fecking CM Punk shows up with zero experience, gets his arsed handed to him and invited back in the octagon.
 
The problem with CM Punk being in the UFC is that it brings down the whole claim of the UFC being the destination for the cream of the crop talent because we all know he is nowhere near ready. Wouldn't it be better for their image, as well as his well-being that he fights people on an independent organisation, hell even tuesday night contender series to give him some experience in the cage away from the razzmatazz of a live PPV event...

That way, he can get comfortable in the cage and fans will hopefully be treated to a better version of him on his return. He was lucky that his first fight was against Micky Gall, who is a submission specialist. It would have been horrible seeing him get sparked out by someone who is a striker...
 
SteveTheRed said:
In my opinion he is absolutely effect career MMA guys. Guys that have fought in shitty venues in front of 10 people, worked their way up the ladder, started to get noticed. Hoping to get on a UFC card and then fecking CM Punk shows up with zero experience, gets his arsed handed to him and invited back in the octagon.
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Apparently "it doesn't work like that". I am still waiting for an explanation on how it actually works.
 
Dirty Schwein said:
The problem with CM Punk being in the UFC is that it brings down the whole claim of the UFC being the destination for the cream of the crop talent because we all know he is nowhere near ready. Wouldn't it be better for their image, as well as his well-being that he fights people on an independent organisation, hell even tuesday night contender series to give him some experience in the cage away from the razzmatazz of a live PPV event...

That way, he can get comfortable in the cage and fans will hopefully be treated to a better version of him on his return. He was lucky that his first fight was against Micky Gall, who is a submission specialist. It would have been horrible seeing him get sparked out by someone who is a striker...
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The problem with that, and the reason why they haven't gone that route, is because he would get his ass handed to him, even at that level. Same reason McGregor didn't take on a lesser name in boxing before Mayweather.
 
The Bloody-Nine said:
Apparently "it doesn't work like that". I am still waiting for an explanation on how it actually works.
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I don't understand the argument that "CM Punk brings in more casual viewers so it's good for the sport"...They definitely bring in more money, and if it continues they might as well just keep bringing in popular choices/wwe fighters/ex-boxers/winner of big brother. Until eventually UFC is just back to being a freak show.
 
There is a lot of fighters that don't deserve to be in the UFC (quality wise). CM Punk is only one of them. They need tin cans too in the roster. With or without CM Punk, some guys will be left out, some deserving, some not.

Conor on the other side, doing whatever he wants, is much more disruptive and disrespecting. He is directly fecking over the most deserving (no two ways about it) of all the fighters, the top dogs of the lightweight division.

I would prefer none of this bullshit were in the UFC, but personally, there is nothing more annoying and disrespectful than Conor handpicking his fights and refusing to defend his belt.
 
George Owen said:
There is a lot of fighters that don't deserve to be in the UFC (quality wise). CM Punk is only one of them. They need tin cans too in the roster. With or without CM Punk, some guys will be left out, some deserving, some not.

Conor on the other side, doing whatever he wants, is much more disruptive and disrespecting. He is directly fecking over the most deserving (no two ways about it) of all the fighters, the top dogs of the lightweight division.

I would prefer none of this bullshit were in the UFC, but personally, there is nothing more annoying and disrespectful than Conor handpicking his fights and refusing to defend his belt.
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Course there's lesser fighters in the UFC there always will be, not everyone can be the top top level. The difference being them fighters aren't paid 500k a fight and special treatment. They're paid a lot less and fight a lot more and in much tougher circumstances.

CM Punk came in as a freak show entertainment to basically not let Bellator sign him, they matched him up with another inexperienced fighter who humiliated him. Fair enough as a one off, but then to fight again and probably on the same money it's just a bit stupid really.

Conor, whilst I can appreciate people may think he takes the piss, is a million times more worthwhile than CM Punk and deserves a whole lot more from the UFC than CM Punk does. I don't quite get this narrative of Conor picking fights (he arguably did it with Diaz 2.)

He fought Holloway as a replacement fight (was meant to fight Andy Ogle)
He fought Brandao as a replacement fight (he was meant to fight Cole Miller)
He then fought Poirer and Siver
He fought Mendes after Aldo pulled out 2 weeks before a fight
He then finally fought Aldo and knocked him out in 13 seconds
He then fought (and lost to) Diaz after Dos Anjos withdrew from the fight 2 weeks before. In this time "any time any place" Aldo was offered the fight and turned it down
Then he got a rematch against Diaz which was obviously a fight he wanted and won
He then fought Alvarez for the LW title which was meant to happen before RDA pulled out and got the title.

In the mean time he's been stripped of 1 of his titles and is meant to be defending the other one and has said he would against Khabib, Ferguson or Lee.

CM Punk in the meantime has an accumulation of a UFC career of swinging for a punch (badly), missing it, getting taken down and then losing a fight. I don't get how him getting 500k per fight when he is awful is any way comparable to a man who has stepped up whenever he has meant to fight and legitimately made the company a fortune.

The card Punk was on was pretty stacked and did 450k buys, Stipe's next fight did 300k so it's not like he brought in a huge amount solely on his own, market one of their own fighters better and they wouldn't need freakshows like CM Punk. I only imagine his next card does worse as the "what will happen" factor has gone. IF he fights a decent fighter he loses, if he fights someone brought in just to fight him it's kind of pointless anyway.

I don't blame him for trying it fair play it's always been a dream but he's not good enough for the level and that money could be spent on better or more deserving fighters who have done more for the company that's just a fact.
 
JP77 said:
Is it really a disgrace though? I just don't get the complaints.

CM Punk having another fight isn't effecting 'career MMA' guys what so ever. Nothing changes whether Punk fights again or not in those terms.
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Nobody cares about Punk. If he was a legitimate fighter who could actually not get obliterated by 22 year old upstarts then there may be a trace of interest and legitimacy in bringing him back, but he's a 38 year old choreographed wrestler who isn't good at MMA, so its understandable that he will be perceived as a joke.
 
I think real MMA fans don't give a shit about punk but casuals surely do.

Some dude is more likely to get interested in seeing CM Punk fight over Eric Spicely.
 
Dirty Schwein said:
I think real MMA fans don't give a shit about punk but casuals surely do.

Some dude is more likely to get interested in seeing CM Punk fight over Eric Spicely.
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Very true.

Personally I don't want these fans who are interested in CM Punks fights to be involved, because then where does it end? Roman Reigns vs CM Punk in the octagon at MSG? feck that.
 
Dirty Schwein said:
I think real MMA fans don't give a shit about punk but casuals surely do.

Some dude is more likely to get interested in seeing CM Punk fight over Eric Spicely.
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Yeah true, personally i've never been a fan of wrestling, so the whole CM Punk thing didn't have a lot of meaning. But there's always going to be crossover between disciplines, which doesn't have to be a bad thing, but it will always come with the associated hysteria.

Like obviously i'm a fan of McGregor, but realistically he was never going to outbox one of the best boxers of all time. Of course that made utterly no difference to it being played up so much. Don't get me wrong though, i was right there watching it too, so i guess i'm part of the problem haha
 
Finally a PPV card this weekend! My picks :)

Kajan Johnson vs Adriano Martins
Luis Henrique vs Arjan Bhullar
Mitch Clarke vs Alex White

Gavin Tucker vs Rick Glenn
Sarah Moras vs Ashlee Evans-Smith
Henry Cejudo vs Wilson Reis
Sara McMann vs Ketlen Vieira

Jeremy Stephens vs Gilbert Melendez
Ilir Latifi vs Tyson Pedro
Neil Magny vs Rafael Dos Anjos
Amanda Nunes vs Valentina Shevchenko
Demetrious Johnson vs Ray Borg
 
Kajan Johnson vs Adriano Martins
Luis Henrique vs Arjan Bhullar
Mitch Clarke vs Alex White

Gavin Tucker vs Rick Glenn
Sarah Moras vs Ashlee Evans-Smith
Henry Cejudo vs Wilson Reis
Sara McMann vs Ketlen Vieira

Jeremy Stephens vs Gilbert Melendez
Ilir Latifi vs Tyson Pedro
Neil Magny vs Rafael Dos Anjos
Amanda Nunes vs Valentina Shevchenko
Demetrious Johnson vs Ray Borg
 
Kajan Johnson vs Adriano Martins
Luis Henrique vs Arjan Bhullar
Mitch Clarke vs Alex White

Gavin Tucker vs Rick Glenn
Sarah Moras vs Ashlee Evans-Smith
Henry Cejudo vs Wilson Reis
Sara McMann vs Ketlen Vieira

Jeremy Stephens vs Gilbert Melendez
Ilir Latifi vs Tyson Pedro
Neil Magny vs Rafael Dos Anjos
Amanda Nunes vs Valentina Shevchenko
Demetrious Johnson vs Ray Borg
 
Dirty Schwein said:
The company just cares about money and ratings, punk will bring in both. Hardcore fans will watch because they'll put it on a card with other good fights and they'll also get all the wwe and the more casual fans for punk, it's the smart play for them. Not saying I agree, I think it's a disgrace but the UFC is a business at the end of the day.

@Mark_GrumpyLion someone commented into co-main as santi cazorla, my footballer names are catching on :lol:

I went in this week as troopz bludfam, was hilarious how they pronounced it :lol:
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I thought you sent in two! hahahahaa
 
Tom Van Persie said:
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Something definitely doesn't add up about the Jones case. He was blood and urine tested a few weeks out and passed, then apparently failed a urine test the day of....which makes no senses since he would've had to be on whatever the PED for a lengthy period of time to gain any sort of benefit from it.
 
Raoul said:
Something definitely doesn't add up about the Jones case. He was blood and urine tested a few weeks out and passed, then apparently failed a urine test the day of....which makes no senses since he would've had to be on whatever the PED for a lengthy period of time to gain any sort of benefit from it.
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If he's been set up, will be a case of boy who cried wolf.
 
Raoul said:
Something definitely doesn't add up about the Jones case. He was blood and urine tested a few weeks out and passed, then apparently failed a urine test the day of....which makes no senses since he would've had to be on whatever the PED for a lengthy period of time to gain any sort of benefit from it.
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I don't know about that. I remember in my rugby days in school, when we played the national tournament against other schools, we would take a cocktail of stuff (Bronchodilators and ephedrine) early the same day to improve airflow and cardio.

So, whatever he took, if it was beneficial to his cardio (which is one of the most important aspects of fighting), then he obviously had benefited from it.

(maybe, because turinabol doesn't make sense to be taken the same day, he took it to mask something else?)

we'll see, but whatever that guy in the video says, should be taken with a pinch of salt, he works for Jon Jones defence team.
 
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George Owen said:
I don't know about that. I remember in my rugby days in school, when we played the national tournament against other schools, we would take a cocktail of stuff (Bronchodilators and ephedrine) early the same day to improve airflow and cardio.

So, whatever he took, if it was beneficial to his cardio (which is one of the most important aspects of fighting), then he obviously had benefited from it.

(maybe, because turinabol doesn't make sense to be taken the same day, he took it to mask something else?)

we'll see, but whatever that guy in the video says, should be taken with a pinch of salt, he works for Jon Jones defence team.
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Except that Turanabol is synonymous with strength and mass and generally requires a 3-6 week cycle to show its benefits, which are typically built a top other recently completed steroid cycles (Deca etc). Jones' tests several weeks out showed nothing, so clearly something is a bit wrong here. The guy in the video a few posts up also made a great point that the world of doping testing is incredibly competitive and a vendor isn't likely to admit it made a mistake as it would almost certainly obliterate their credibility on future tests and contracts with the likes of the UFC etc.
 
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Raoul said:
Except that Turanabol is synonymous with strength and mass and generally requires a 3-6 week cycle to show its benefits. Jones' tests several weeks out showed nothing, so clearly something is a bit wrong here. The guy in the video a few posts up also made a great point that the world of doping testing is incredibly competitive and a vendor isn't likely to admit it made a mistake as it would almost certainly obliterate their credibility on future tests and contracts with the likes of the UFC etc.
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yeah it makes sense, but it can be also the other way around. If they get caught manipulating samples to fit their story and cover up some mistake, it could bring much more serious consequences upon them. Admitting to a mistake would have just ended up with improved guidelines for the whole drug testing process from now on.

Right now. If i had to pick between Jones or USADA doing some stupid shit, i would go with Jones, but whatever it is, hopefully we get to the bottom of it.
 
It's like God wants DJ v TJ.
Interestingly Cody told rogan that his original plan was to defend v TJ pre injury and face MM on the MSG card so odds are we will see a super fight very soon.
 
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