Well overdue.
The Guardian - Manchester United to sack Erik ten Hag after the FA Cup Final
- Thread starter Tom Van Persie
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Whilst I understand the point you are making it is definitely hugely regrettable for any football reporter in the country to annoy Utd who are by an absolute mile the biggest news source for football journos.
How is he going to go out there today and genuinely enjoy this? He hasn’t been spoken to by the club regarding his future and the rumours. That much is clear. He’s hearing about it in the press. How shit must he feel right now?
let’s reverse the two seasons? This season was last season and last season was this season, would he be getting sacked? He wouldn’t. It’s the fact we’ve declined since the last but you got to take into account the factors around this.
has he been perfect, nope. Could he have made better decisions, of course. Do we know ALL the facts. Nope.
We all know what’s coming. McKenna. we keep a fair few of these players because they worked with him before. He will be very ole like with man management.
rashford stays, sancho stays along with a few more. They get another chance and it totally avoids having to sell and deal with these players right away. Again, player power will prevail.
let’s reverse the two seasons? This season was last season and last season was this season, would he be getting sacked? He wouldn’t. It’s the fact we’ve declined since the last but you got to take into account the factors around this.
has he been perfect, nope. Could he have made better decisions, of course. Do we know ALL the facts. Nope.
We all know what’s coming. McKenna. we keep a fair few of these players because they worked with him before. He will be very ole like with man management.
rashford stays, sancho stays along with a few more. They get another chance and it totally avoids having to sell and deal with these players right away. Again, player power will prevail.
Regrettable? It will change absolutely nothing for the reporter outside of increasing his views this week.
There's a slight difference between The Sun and the Guardian... People with any sense who look at The Sun know not to believe anything that's printed there.
There are actually some media outlets and journalists with integrity.
So getting on the wrong side of the biggest headline grabbing entity in the country would not change anything for someone who's entire job is dependent on getting clicks that he needs contacts to reliably get?
That's a ludicrous take. I'm not saying it's going to end his career and obviously he can mostly focus on Chelsea but it is plainly obvious that it's better to have a good relationship with Man Utd than a bad one.
There is no player power at United not in overtly negative sense nor I have felt United's players have downed tools for any manager on the contrary I have seen them try their best for all the managers even when writing was on the wall for most of those managers, even for the most toxic one .
Yes for two reasons. First his assignement is not United, we are not talking about a United beat writer. Secondly reporters do not need to be on the good side of a Football club to have sources about this club, one of the main source for reporters are agents not people working for the club or briefs, though they can also have personal relationships with someone specific within a club which again isn't something that is affected by being on the wrong side of the club.
Now your point is true for some, some reporters rely on the club and club executives, those will toe the line but it's not true for everyone.
Yes, obviously. But he wouldn’t have even got this season.
You don’t finish 8th in the league & bottom of your CL group at a club like United and get away with it. And rightfully so.
Don't think that matters all that much for a Chelsea journo.
For a select few journos who are pretty much only covering United, sure.
It’s the agents you approach not the manager directly
It’s obviously not possible to ensure the information doesn’t leak when multiple third parties are involved
To be fair agents can be muzzled if the client wished.
It's not in the interest of the clients. The reason reporters have access to information from agents is because agents use reporters to get certain narratives around, a player/coach whether it is about availability, form or image.
They all have pressure to get clicks. Guardian prints its fair share of click bait as well.
As I say ten hag is most likely gone I’m just saying I find it odd.
Would also say I don’t think the guardians sources are that good usually. Right the odd time but more often playing catch up on football stories. Could say the same for the times as well
Agents act in the interest of the clients by way of job prospects but they can still be muzzled if needed.
If Sir Jim for example requested discretion from Poch, I'm sure that would or should have been communicated in good faith.
It becomes disrupt and destory when you do that day before a final. I have no problem them printing it after the final or as some have done during season. But to do this before theFA cup final? I don't buy that it is done just out of nothing. It gets big exposure so close to the game and it affects our team. Whether it is true or false.
That is why I'm saying that we need our club to be little more protective about our club and start to ban those who are only after to make problems. Ban from OldTrafford and not giving them opportunities to ask questions in any shape or form. But we also know that our club haven't even bother to talk about VAR and referees making so many strange decisions against us so I wouldn't put my hope on this either.
If that is true or not you wait until after the game. Why is it important to put it out day before without any sources whatsoever? It doesn't make any sense unless it is done to disrupt and affect us in some way.
Sacked or no sacked. There should be all out concentration on this final from everyone in the club. Talk about manager should be done after it. However it feels that some people genuinely would love us to lose this final just so they can throw some more hate at out manager. Fans, journalists, experts and so on.
he then proceeded to stink the place up for months, if my boss offered to make me a partner in the business and then i proceeded to feck up every kitchen i went to fit i don't think i'd be furious if he changed his mind because of what he said at first
Because you get views for that report days before the game and then get views for articles linked to the actual game or any narrative linked to the game after. What you are suggesting is that they should dilute their viewership for no actual good reason when it comes to their POV.
Pretty classless from The Guardian to be honest especially from a media outlet acknowledged as having more journalistic integrity and ethics than some of their counterparts
Indeed it seems to be the best and the modern way to run a football club looking at the evidence.
I expect Ashworth to take over some of the responsibilities that has fallen to the manager over the past 10 years.
It’s news. They have to report it. Timing not being favourable for United doesn’t change that nor does or should factor in on reporting. What are you talking about? Think for a second - imagine if journalists start holding back pieces because the timing isn’t “nice” for government and the likes. Sometimes journalists hold pieces to allow you to comment/corroborate before they publish - but ultimately, news need to be published, and ideally as soon as possible/they’ve been verified.
Man, I’m not replying to you any more, this whole exercise is dumb.
If he was staying then INEOS would have come out in the last few weeks and said their sticking with him
The people who he would have the relationship you are referring to are the ones who he would have spoken to that would be pissed off?
It is pretty obviously less than ideal. The biggest story of his career is about Utd.
There's a difference between using click baits and actually publishing a lie or a baseless exclusive.
If the Guardian lacks sources then I'd expect it not to publish something. Not to invent it.
I didn’t say they invented it. I said their sources aren’t fantastic. Same as the sun story that I referenced earlier.
I don’t really care. I just made the point that the story could turn out to be nonsense which is within the realm of possibilities. Doubt anyone in the club leaked this because it doesn’t make sense. That leaves an agent as being the source and they are not exactly the most trustworthy sources as they are playing a game.
Manager deserves to go based on performances this season. But I still find this story very odd especially as Ineos are supposed to be a slick operation
Yes, but they have been a gutter paper for more than a decade now IMV.
You are assuming that he has any relationship with people within the club when my point is that it's only one option out of many. It's probable that he has no relationship within the club to lose and that he got that information from an outsider.
I'm saying it's stupid to be seen as untrustworthy by the most read about entity in his industry. Which is a blindingly obvious fact.
I'm sure they are. But things are in a state of flux now with people coming and going, and ultimately, it only takes one person telling something to one person.
Yes.
The only realistic alternative to him not having been sacked already - whether he has been informed of this or not - is that they're actually still on the fence about him.
Outside of never reporting anything negative what exactly would make a reporter trustworthy? And which reporter/paper fit the bill?
That's not the point being discussed. The point being discussed is whether it's a bad career mood to mark yourself out in an unfavourable light to the biggest club in the country.
Which obviously it isn't.
Not convinced being the first journalist from a big outlet to report a major scoop will harm his career to be honest.
Did BBC and ITV discuss it?
You'd think most people in the club - playing staff included - know one way or another what's about to happen to ETH? It's not that they're going to only know now after reading about it in the Guardian so that it casts a shadow over the final.
It's a bit much to expect the press not to write articles speculating about ETHs future when it's been a topic of discussion for some time, much less when the season is ending.
It's a bit much to expect the press not to write articles speculating about ETHs future when it's been a topic of discussion for some time, much less when the season is ending.
Apparently we need more of this kind of thing.
I did say the leak might not have the effect people were expecting. Almost like a new manager bounce except...for the manager leaving.
Nah, just think it was very poor timing but what do I know. It doesn't seem to have affected the performance that much.
Nah, just think it was very poor timing but what do I know. It doesn't seem to have affected the performance that much.
looks like it’s affected it to me
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