Because he thinks we already have the best manager in the world. Just give him time and he will be better than SAF.
The “Ole In” Brigade
- Thread starter Lentwood
- Start date
Because he thinks we already have the best manager in the world. Just give him time and he will be better than SAF.
Absolutely. If they are 'top-class' then they must come with top results. It's what Mourinho would say.
Yesterday’s loss has me over the edge. I don’t think Ole will be able to cut it here.
Till now it still felt like he is moving in the right direction, albeit in a really convoluted way but now it’s clear that we are going around in circles with no end in sight.
If people are hoping to give him a couple transfer windows to improve performances then remember that aren’t an attractive destination any more for top talent. In the recent past we were able to attract and retain players towards the end of their prime by simply paying them above the market. That approach is now gone too.
I am grateful to Solskjær for studying the ship and sucking out the post Mourinho toxicity. It’s fun watching football again because of him but we really need a manager who is used to working under similar circumstances and under the limitations we are currently under.
Till now it still felt like he is moving in the right direction, albeit in a really convoluted way but now it’s clear that we are going around in circles with no end in sight.
If people are hoping to give him a couple transfer windows to improve performances then remember that aren’t an attractive destination any more for top talent. In the recent past we were able to attract and retain players towards the end of their prime by simply paying them above the market. That approach is now gone too.
I am grateful to Solskjær for studying the ship and sucking out the post Mourinho toxicity. It’s fun watching football again because of him but we really need a manager who is used to working under similar circumstances and under the limitations we are currently under.
Nobody is thinking that. What makes you think that any other manager would play better and win every game that you cleary think we should be doing?
I reckon a large proportion of our fanbase has 'daddy issues'. They're not just looking for a manager for their football team, but also a father figure who will be there for them for long time. You just need to give him enough time, and he'll be perfect and nobody else is better. It's dead weird, but I think there's some truth to it.
Who's expecting us to win every game? We have 31 points from 21 games. There a lot room for improvement on that.
No offense but that's some of the dumbest logic I've ever seen on here.
I seriously don't know what you're rambling on about. I literally just gave him credit for Fred and the improvement of those players and agreed with you on it.
Your original "point" was made up bullshit that I've seen on here countless times as an excuse under Ole and I merely pointed out to you that it was wrong. I don't care about anything else.
With the current lot of players, too many shortages or surplus in requirement.
What's the point of keeping up the pretence of being a club that gives the manager time if we keep sacking them after a year or two? Ole will be number 4.
We don't give managers time as a club and as fans and that's the truth.
So then, we embrace the circus, the new identity, and hope it brings as many trophies for us as it does for Real.
But they wouldn’t have done cos we where a far better team in 99 or 2008. It’s really a pointless and irrelevant comparison. I am saying no more on this.
It's a fantasy scenario, but you really think the PL was stronger in 90's than it is now? Our only contender was Arsenal. We finished 1st with 78 points. Finishing with 97 points is clearly better and in a far more competive league. They won the CL as well. There's no trophy for finishing 2nd, but I would say Liverpool were as good as our 2008 team.
We've given all four managers more time than they deserved. Each and every one of them was a sunken ship long before we actually sacked them. Moyes and LvG should've been gone by Christmas in those seasons, Ole should've been gone by September/October and Mourinho should have been gone the moment he started falling out with everyone. We have been incredibly patient, no other big club would've given those managers the time of day we have.
Ole has had more than enough time to imprint some sort of style of play, to improve results, to show what he's capable of, and has, quite frankly, failed on every front.
plus, a top-class manager earns the right to more time based on what they have achieved previously and their record of building great sides when given time to do so. You think if we hired someone as good as Klopp that we should expect him to immediately chase titles and sack him without letting him build a team? Don't be so ridiculous. Everyone compares Ole to SAF but seems to forget the fact that SAF had done wonders at Aberdeen which earned him patience here. Ole has done the square root of sweet feck all in his career so far to earn more time than we've already given him.
I really couldnt care less we’ve enough problems to deal with right now without bringing in fantasy scenarios. Just as an aside though, the league standard has been piss poor for years now with exception of city and Liverpool.
The standards of our bottom and midtable are much higher than they were because increase in wealth. Which means that those teams in general had worse players than now.
Anyway I think points tally is a very good metric for league form.
You wrote: "Besides, if Pogba was playing then Fred wouldn't have even gotten games and wouldn't have improved."
Aaaaand that's me discrediting Ole how exactly?
Ridiculous to think that. Solskjaer is barely in the top 15 managers in the PL let alone the best in the world
He won't ever manage in the PL again once he gets sacked here.
Aaaaand that's me discrediting Ole how exactly?
I praised Ole for the development of Fred and you wrote the above suggesting Fred only improved because Ole was forced to play him. That's nonsense and suggests to me you can't give Ole credit. Can you admit that Ole deserves some credit for Fred, McTominay, Greenwood and Pereira's development? I include Pereira reluctantly as he has only played well twice imo.
I don't agree that we gave Moyes and LVG enough time. You based your opinions simply on results. Moyes had barely a sniff at the job before he got fired. The team had barely been changed in the 7 months he was here and it was the sack purely based on shite results.
LVG is, by far, the only manager post-Fergie to successfully imprint his style on the club. We had 60% possession most games and controlled most of them. He was still once piece short of the puzzle in terms of scoring goals but did we give him time to find the answer? No. Sacked a day after winning the FA Cup because league results were poor.
Mourinho did well results wise and probably would have had more time had he not pressed the self destruct button so spectacularly with everyone at the club. That was stupid of him. Even then we only sacked him when league results were bad.
Ole, if sacked, will have been midway through changing the culture and reducing the average age of the team. Our team can have a good energy and counterattack but we have some glaring weaknesses in consistency. Do we give him the time to find the answer? No, if we sack him.
So no. I fundamentally disagree that we gave 3 out of 4 managers the time they needed to find the answers to the difficult questions. It was all based on league results at the time of their sacking and thus, we prove that we are a club and fanbase that cannot look past league results to judge a manager's work.
I don't see why we should keep this charade going for the next manager.
Actually, if he finishes at 5th this season, he will be in top 5, if he finishes at 7, he will be top 7. In no way is he "top 15". That is how numbers work. Or does throwing around out-of-context "numbers" and stats only work if they talk against Ole?
I already did give him credit. He's done really well with Fred and McT.
The point about Fred not playing if Pogba was fit was merely to counteract your logic that if all these magical factors had fallen into place together then we'd be doing better. Pogba being fit as well as Fred being in this form would likely never have happened if Pogba was fit, so it's an irrelevant point. Just admit you were fecking wrong and stop trying to goad me into different, unrelated arguments so we can move on from this borefest.
Sensing doubt?
Get him out!
Honestly I can see this becoming another Moyes scenario whereby Ed waits until we're eliminated from the Europa League and sacks him off for like the final 6 games of the season with us loitering around 9th.
Get him out!
Honestly I can see this becoming another Moyes scenario whereby Ed waits until we're eliminated from the Europa League and sacks him off for like the final 6 games of the season with us loitering around 9th.
Right well if you seriously think that Moyes and LvG deserved more time then I don't really know what to say. It was clear long before they were sacked that neither of them were going to succeed here. We had completely capitulated under both of them and neither was going to turn things around, that's blindingly obvious to just about anyone and I'm not sure how you can possibly dispute that.
LvG had TWO years to build a fecking team, that's so much time in modern football! He spent £300m poorly, he had an awful "philosophy" that led to dire performances and results. His results were worse in his second season than his first season. He was done for.
if another top class manager comes in they should be expected to get top four in their first season and put in a title challenge the following season, or failing a title challenge, top four again with improvements in results and showing that they are improving the side and imprinting the style of football we'd like to see. if any of our previous three managers had done that, at a minimum, they'd have been here longer. Mourinho actually did do it (sort of, cause he won the Europa) but he decided to do his usual 3rd season balls-up.
Okay, now I understand. I just disagree overall. Ole has never had a full/good squad to work with for any good period except when he was appointed interim. I just would like to see what he could do with a good squad to pick from. Not going to admit I'm wrong and you can go play with your toys before you get bored.
Lot of fans looking at posts in here. As soon as we loose or draw there is tons and tons of criticism. Nobody in Ole-In (I hope) is thinking "wow, we are good" but there is cause to us being where we are. And it is not just Solskjaer, Solskjaer, Solskjaer. That is why I wondered yesterday if it is just a personal thing that he is not cool enough for some. Improvement takes time. And as I also said, sacking Solskjaer without a plan or meaning would mean that cycle will have to start over again. And one year later Ole-out brigade would be AnotherManager-out brigade because we would still not win title.
There is lots of room for improvement. But I think we can see that we are going forward looking back 12 months ago. Pointwise not but we are playing better football and there is better feeling in the club.
The notion that the squad OgS has had shouldn’t/couldn’t perform better is nonsensical.Okay, now I understand. I just disagree overall. Ole has never had a full/good squad to work with for any good period except when he was appointed interim. I just would like to see what he could do with a good squad to pick from. Not going to admit I'm wrong and you can go play with your toys before you get bored.
I wish we had 11 world class players in each position but that was never going to be the case this year & wont be for some time with our 3 player in summer windows. Nobody expected a title tilt either.
He has waxed lyrical about signing Maguire for example; a signing that a number questioned at the time & funds that could have been utilised elsewhere; sanctioning an all out transfer assault for a player in your most overloaded position means he has to shoulder some blame for not having a ‘better’ squad to pick from.
Instead of judging OgS on an ideological non-reality how about judging him on his performances with the squad he has had.
There is no greater proof of the lowering of our club standards that some thinking it is ok for OgS to oversee such inept performances consistently without expecting him to have a an ability to ‘coach up’ a group of players. We play £200mil+ worth of defensive talent most weeks & I see no evidence of this unit being coached well.
Unfortunately we don’t have Ronaldo’s to pick from but OgS should be doing better with what he does have.
Transition is not an excuse for an underwhelming regression.
LvG did imprint his possession based style on our team. We were very comfortable most games but we were drawing too many as we could not find any winners. We didn't give him the last year to sort that out. He may have found the answer, he may not. If he didn't, he would have gone for free anyway as he wasn't going to renew. But if he had found the answer, the manager after him would have had such a solid foundation to build upon. But we'll never know.
We threw that half-built foundation away in the hope Jose might nab us a quick title. Unfortunately for him, big name manager did not equate to big trophies. And there is the fallacy. People think that track record and CV automatically means better results and better 'patterns of attacking play' (whatever the feck that means). It doesn't. What other managers achieve at other clubs does not immediately equate to success at United because fundamentally United are a very differently run club (better or worse, that's another argument) compared to other clubs.
It's 2 steps forward and 5 steps back. That is not improvement at all. I don't think anyone here is expecting us to win every game but if there should be some sort of indication of what the plan is. Can you tell me what the plan is Ole keeps talking about?
I don't think sacking ole mid season is going to do any good to the team. Give him till end of season and sack him then. Honestly from what am i am seeing i dont think ole is the right manager to take us anywhere close to top half let alone 4th!
For me, yes. I know its an unpopular opinion but we allowed him to sack the entire staff to install his own men (a huge mistake imo). But we apparently trusted him enough to let him hire his own people and yet did not allow him and his people the time to settle in the club.
Expectations were high then though, I get it. Falling out of the top 4 in 2013 was unthinkable for us. However, with hindsight, allowing him and his team to just 7 months to adapt, change and be as consistent as Fergie in terms of acheiving top 4 was pretty unreasonable.
I respect your opinion, it is unpopular because it is terribly wrong. I hope one day you will reflect and see how flawed your thinking is.
Moyes was one of the worst candidates for the job, but we dont need to rehash all that again. Lets see how he lights the world up at West Ham
2020: Poch is the one. I just know it. 2021: Rogers is REALLY the one. I'm sure of it. 2022: We finally got Pep. I always knew that he was THE KEY to us getting back on track just like King Eddie says. 2023,............
No I didnt say that my original post was saying if Fergie had of had the results he had in his first year but it was now (instead of Ole) most on here would have been calling for the sack.
He was bad, but was still on his way to do a better job than Ole is here. He had a bigger squad to work with though with big names so him not dropping certain player or managing it better was on him. Our current squad might have been easier for him to manage better since I think Moyes is better when he can keep playing the same 11 and improve them.
Ole has less options now, but he is not improving them nor has he got the players needed this summer.
Neither of them is good enough to manage us into something great.
He finished 11th. Can you imagine the outcry off a lot on here if we finished 11th?
Yes and I was there to see it too. Do you realise that when he took over we were in a relegation fight? I was happy that we finished 11th. We were second from bottom when Fergie took over. Don't try to spin this.
That is revisionist bullshit, quite frankly. LvG, overall, did a terrible job here and he got more than enough time.
If your solution to our problems is to give a worse manager than LvG or Mourinho, or even Moyes, far more time than any other big club in their right minds would do, then god help us.