I'm actually in awe that Venus made a Wimbledon final in 2017. Been watching her since the 90s.
Tennis 2017
- Thread starter The Man Himself
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McEnroe making excuses for Venus as soon as the match had finished was pretty lame.
Truly. I did think it would be highly unexpected for both her and federer to win in 2017, but for them to get to the final is still something.
Imagine how it feels to be a Cilic fan in the Wimbledon stand tomorrow?
Before the game, a lot of them were making it out it would be a shoe in for Venus.
I believe Venus turned pro the year Muguruza was born.
I like how they try to show each other respect.
Muguruza: That was my toughest match ever......!!!!
lolz
Muguruza: That was my toughest match ever......!!!!
lolz
Good to see the younger female players stepping up to win it unlike the males.
Sue Barker is awful.
I doubt they actually follow the game at all. Sports hack tend to just waffle the usual dross and get away with it.
Muguruza is just more comfortable than Venus, even with a few nervy moment at the beginning. Game was always on her racquet.
It was a remarkable achievement, regardless of the result. They said she won her first one 17 years ago and her last one nine years ago! Hell of a player over the years and unbelievable longevity.
Sad for Venus, I'm backing the fellow oldies, but very well played by Miguruza though.
The number of bad calls in that match
Retirement for Venus?
...because she lost one match?
Same here.
And recently she has no form of reaching Grand Slam Finals. I think this is the first final in many years, making this a great performance from Venus.
It was way more than a few nervy moments. Venus was 5-4 and 40-15 up on Muguruza's serve.
Had Venus got one of those 2 points, she'd have won this.
She made the Australian Open final this year
...because she lost one match?
... and is age 37 suffering from a constant illness?
Blimey they need to wrap this programme up. They're struggling to talk about it, Tracy Austin just said Williams is 37, next year she'll be 38... You don't say!
If she's making slam finals I doubt retirement is in the cards. One of the announcers mentioned today she wants to stick around til the next Olympics.
Yeah, can't imagine she will. That was just my reaction to how utterly abject she was in that second set.
One of my dreams has been to see Federer win one more Wimbledon.
I never gave up hope of him doing it and was believing he could win one more GS but so far his 2017 has been nothing but a fairy tale how he defied the odds and got into some of the best form of his career at the age of 36.
I wonder if Djokovic will have a renaissance in his 30's like Federer?
Federer went through some bad years in his 30's when Nadal, Djokovic and Murray were in their prime and now aging Federer seems to be the younger of the bunch it's quite crazy how things can change so fast.
I never gave up hope of him doing it and was believing he could win one more GS but so far his 2017 has been nothing but a fairy tale how he defied the odds and got into some of the best form of his career at the age of 36.
I wonder if Djokovic will have a renaissance in his 30's like Federer?
Federer went through some bad years in his 30's when Nadal, Djokovic and Murray were in their prime and now aging Federer seems to be the younger of the bunch it's quite crazy how things can change so fast.
I doubt Djokovic will do the same. Once players drop off the top its incredibly difficult to go back up. Fed is a one off in that sense.
I don't think Djokovic's style of play lends itself to a particularly long career. Djokovic's game is centred on great returning and defensive prowess above all else, skills which are very much speed-dependent. As he ages, he will naturally lose his pace, making it very hard for him to be as good a returner as he has previously been. Unless he somewhat re-tools his skill-set and becomes more reliant on great tecnhical skills. it's hard to see him lasting as long as Federer.
Is Djokovic more reliant on the physical side of his game?
Roger seems to be the most talented of the trio
He will probably learn a lot from watching Federer re-establish himself so late in his career that maybe he will adapt his game as well to suit his age.
The weird thing with Federer is he looks like he's the youngest player no matter who he's playing against.
It just looks so natural for Federer and like he's playing against amateurs at times.
He's playing better than he was 5 years ago it's absolutely crazy
Not sure I agree, the game and ageing in sport has changed a lot. Experience is very much rewarded if you are willing to keep yourself in shape nowadays, it's not about pure youthful mobility now. And I don't any of the young guys being similar worldy levels of the Big Four, so once recovered, Murray-Djokovic should continue more than fine for some time year. Nadal proved that once you get over them injuries and don't let the 30 number hold you down.....yeah, you can still hang. Federer obviously proving it to a higher number, but hasn't had as many injuries. But then again, Federer is more built on finesse and technique as opposed to extreme fitness levels that the other 3.
Still, once over their niggles, I still wouldn't bet against Murray-Djokovic for a couple years yet. Their talent is enough to beat anyone before it gets to 4 hours....
2003 year end rankings - Roddick(21), Federer(22), Ferrero(23), Agassi(33), Coria(21), Schuttler(27), Moya(27), Nalbandian(21), Phillipoussis(27), Grosjean(25)
Current - Murray(30), Nadal(31), Djokovic(30), Wawarinka(32), Federer(35), Cilic(28), Thiem(23), Nishikori(27), Raonic(26), Zverev/Dimitron(20/26)
Still, once over their niggles, I still wouldn't bet against Murray-Djokovic for a couple years yet. Their talent is enough to beat anyone before it gets to 4 hours....
2003 year end rankings - Roddick(21), Federer(22), Ferrero(23), Agassi(33), Coria(21), Schuttler(27), Moya(27), Nalbandian(21), Phillipoussis(27), Grosjean(25)
Current - Murray(30), Nadal(31), Djokovic(30), Wawarinka(32), Federer(35), Cilic(28), Thiem(23), Nishikori(27), Raonic(26), Zverev/Dimitron(20/26)
Djokovic is similar to Federer in terms of the mental side of his game. I just don't get the impression he will have the mojo to get back up to that level.
Vis-à-vis Federer, Djokovic is definitely more reliant on the physical side of his game.
For as well as Roger is playing right now, he was probably a better player five years ago. Federer's absolute peak IMO was around '05/'06 and ever since then he has declined slowly and gradually. Because of Federer's great technical abilities however, he can still give exhibitions when out on the court, something which makes people think that he's playing better than ever. Federer can still give exhibitions but in all likelihood, he was a better player five years ago and he was better again eleven and twelve years ago.
Just remember, Djokovic is probably playing the worst levels of his career, and yet has incredibly casually still got to back to back quarters......this wouldn't even be headline news if it was Agassi at any point in his career or anyone from that era. Make that anyone, from any era, other than Federer. Such is the level of relentless all-court consistency these two played at.
Oldest Slam winners...31 seems to be a drop-off point for many...
01 Ken Rosewall (AUstralian Open 1972) 37 years, 2 months and 1 day
02 Roger Federer (Wimbledon 2017) 35 years, 11 months and 2 days
03 Roger Federer (Australian Open 2017) 35 years, 4 months and 15 days
04 Andres Gimeno (Roland Garros 1972) 34 years, 10 months and 1 day
05 Andre Agassi (Australian Open 2003) 32 years, 8 months and 28 days
06 Arthu Ashe (Wimbledon 1975) 31 years, 11 months and 25 days
07 Stan Wawrinka (US Open 2016) 31 years, 5 months and 8 days
08 Rod Laver (US Open 1969) 31 years, 1 month
09 Pete Sampras (US Open 2002) 31 years and 27 days
10 Jimmy Connors (US Open 1983) 31 years and 9 days
11 Rafael Nadal (Roland Garros 2017) 31 years and 2 days
01 Ken Rosewall (AUstralian Open 1972) 37 years, 2 months and 1 day
02 Roger Federer (Wimbledon 2017) 35 years, 11 months and 2 days
03 Roger Federer (Australian Open 2017) 35 years, 4 months and 15 days
04 Andres Gimeno (Roland Garros 1972) 34 years, 10 months and 1 day
05 Andre Agassi (Australian Open 2003) 32 years, 8 months and 28 days
06 Arthu Ashe (Wimbledon 1975) 31 years, 11 months and 25 days
07 Stan Wawrinka (US Open 2016) 31 years, 5 months and 8 days
08 Rod Laver (US Open 1969) 31 years, 1 month
09 Pete Sampras (US Open 2002) 31 years and 27 days
10 Jimmy Connors (US Open 1983) 31 years and 9 days
11 Rafael Nadal (Roland Garros 2017) 31 years and 2 days
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Roger hasn't won Wimbledon at the age of 35 .... yet.
I'd take this Federer over the 2012-13 Federer regardless of the 2012 win......2013 is the point where he clearly noticed he had to tweak his game far more to adapt to his own ageing, Edberg coming in is what helped him get back up to this level.
Just so you know....I still think this Federer wins 3 slams a year in 2004-07 too but possibly not 11 slams out of 16 altogether in that span, incredibly something he's gotta favoured to do this year anyway! He just doesn't play 100 games.
Djoker is renowned for his great mental strength, isn't he? I always believe that his decline is more mental than physical but him getting bagelled by Thiem in the last set in the French Open and retiring in Wimbledon means there could be deeper underlying issues that has attributed to his decline. It seems he lost motivation after winning the French Open last year + personal issues have affected him. Perhaps what John McEnroe said is right about him similar to Tiger Woods. Once you lose that level, it's very very hard to get back that mojo.
As other posters have pointed out, the reason why Federer is still winning slams at 35 because he is so supremely talented. What about Nadal though? He's always been reliant on his physical side and everyone wrote him off after his back injury and he came back stronger twice. He managed to get to the AO Final, dominated the French Open and lost in Wimbledon because that's his weakest surface.
I still have hopes that Nole can reach his 2011/2015 and early 2016 level again, that dominance was the highest level in tennis history and every match, you can bet your house on him and go to sleep.
This gives me hope that he can still get back his mojo and start winning slams again. It makes me sad because he finally got back his fighting spirit again and his injury is back, I think Nole has been burnt out and he need to take time off.
Big difference between 2012 Federer and 2013 Federer. 2013 was definitely Federer's worst season ever since he won his first GS at Wimbledon in '03. 2012 may not have been all-conquering but it was definitely a better season than 2013.
Don't like how some are assuming federer has this in the bag. Cilic is a good player who can beat federer.
Nadal is 31 though; he's pretty much right on the edge of the age when the performance of tennis players falls off a cliff, with the very notable exception of Federer. I think when we say that neither Djokovic or Nadal will last as long Federer, we mean that they won't be regularly competing for Grand Slams at the age of 35. Big, big difference between competing at Grand Slams when you're 31 and when you're 35.
I'd go one step further - apart from Nadal I think Cilic is the worst match up for Federer on grass.
It's same style, the cracks and chinks were there in 2012 that started to show he needed to change. 2013 was just the end of that cycle of his career, but he's played better in his recent three final runs than he arguably did in 2012. He's literally only dropped two sets outside his Djokovic losses, Djokovic at all his all-time levels.....in 2012 he dropped 5.
He's looked relentlessly at ease outside of Djokovic, and well last year, but I'd say it's fair to say he was playing a bit niggled thus the long break afterwards, hopefully something that will help Murray and Djokovic if they do similar.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2...lassy-trainer-tribute-injured-novak-djokovic/
sorry if it was posted already.
sorry if it was posted already.
That's some shoddy journalism even by the Telegraph's standards, he's been wearing a variation of them since Miami at least.
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