Strootman or Fellaini?

[ByronSteve]

Well I was thinking Strootman but in this video supplied by a fellow RedCafe buddy jmaggio, Fellaini does not appear that bad and could well do a job at United.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZFuxC1bdUk

Maybe jmaggio is Fellaini's agent (lol) but have a look anyway.

 

[Suedesi]

So Fellaini or Strootman?

 

[Twigg]

It's funny to look at the comments on the first page of this thread, now look at how opinions have changed.

 

[Y2A]

So I was right. Strootman was never rated much here before he went to Roma.

 

[shaggy]

Based on the fact that I've never seen Strootman play, Strootman.

EDIT: feck off gza.

Basically, Fellaini is not a good footballer. He's played his best football this season, and he was off the striker for that. Kagawa, Rooney, even Welbeck and RVP can all play there.

He's little besides a giant, who's got excellent chest control (something to do with him being bigger than everyone else?). I find his technical skills to be limited, something which you will need at United (assuming (praying) we don't play long ball crap under Moyes). I also find him an incredibly dirty player, and someone I could not support as a United player.

So yeah, Strootman.

This.

 

[friendlytramp]

We're all clueless /forum

 

[Nickosaur]

So I was right. Strootman was never rated much here before he went to Roma.

A lot on here blame Moyes for passing on Strootman. I challenged one poster by saying a lot of the Caf didn't rate Strootman either, which he rejected. This thread shows differently.

For what it's worth, I was one of those who wasn't convinced by Strootman either.

 

[JP77]

Strootman by an absolute country mile and it's not even close to be perfectly honest. Am finding it quite comical that some on here are trying to claim Fellaini is a better player though.

Some just didn't listen.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

So Fellaini or Strootman?

Neither.

 

[Robbie Boy]

It's depressing to think that we could have got Strootman & McCarthy for basically what we paid for Fellaini.

We are linked with both again, except now, they would cost an absolute fortune.

 

[Enigma_87]

A lot on here blame Moyes for passing on Strootman. I challenged one poster by saying a lot of the Caf didn't rate Strootman either, which he rejected. This thread shows differently.

For what it's worth, I was one of those who wasn't convinced by Strootman either.

Hindsight is a beautiful thing. Of course very few will know about Strootman as he wasn't in the spotlight while playing in Holland.

Neither was the right answer and still is.

 

[B20]

I got this one I think!

Is it vidal?

 

[Enigma_87]

I got this one I think!

Is it vidal?

Vidal, Busquets, Martinez.

Since the latter two are not available, I'd say yes.

 

[JP77]

Hindsight is a beautiful thing. Of course very few will know about Strootman as he wasn't in the spotlight while playing in Holland.

Neither was the right answer and still is.

Completely wrong.

Strootman was the right answer and always will be. He was performing at a really good level at the time and anybody who watched him on a regular basis could see he was likely only going to get better and better. He was exactly what we wanted in the midfield and incredibly we passed him up at fecking 12-13 million, it's absolute madness.

 

[Nemesis9]

Ronaldo.

 

[Sandikan]

Fellaini as he's premier league proven. Oh hindsight you bastad!

 

[Enigma_87]

Completely wrong.

Strootman was the right answer and always will be. He was performing at a really good level at the time and anybody who watched him on a regular basis could see he was likely only going to get better and better. He was exactly what we wanted in the midfield and incredibly we passed him up at fecking 12-13 million, it's absolute madness.

I disagree.

We got Herrera now(as we should have last Summer), with Mata and Kagawa in advanced position. We need Vidal or Busquets, Martinez type of player.

Besides it's not like Strootman has set the world alight at Roma. He's level below the ones I mentioned.

 

[JP77]

I disagree.

We got Herrera now(as we should have last Summer), with Mata and Kagawa in advanced position. We need Vidal or Busquets, Martinez type of player.

Strootman can play that role and allow Herrera the freedom to burst back and fourth. Don't get me wrong, I'd love Vidal over any midfielder, but Strootman would fit this team perfectly IMO and I've felt that way for quite a while now. If we don't sign a top midfielder in this market then there's a strong chance we might actually find out how well Strootman could fit us in the future.

 

[Anderson18]

JP77, one of those guys that knows much more about a player than supporters of his former club. Strootman wasn't even that highly rated by PSV fans after his 2012-13 season, Eriksen made him his bitch in the games against Ajax and in the u21 tournament he wasn't anything special either. But yeah, all the top scouts in Europe haven't got a clue and that's why only Roma went for him.

Strootman just made a huge step on the next level, it happens but not that often. Mostly they tend to dominate on a lower level and then make their mark on a bigger stage. After a good 11-12, his 12-13 was bang average.

 

[jason93]

I'd rather keep Fellaini than sell him for a cut price. This season would be too soon to ship him off as he's got so much more to offer.

Strootman for £75 million is a joke. Good player but no thanks. Would rather keep Fellaini and try to get him back to his Everton form in 12/13 than see us give that for a player who's not worth it.

 

[MUFCpiffgawd]

Based on the fact that I've never seen Strootman play, Strootman.

EDIT: feck off gza.

Basically, Fellaini is not a good footballer. He's played his best football this season, and he was off the striker for that. Kagawa, Rooney, even Welbeck and RVP can all play there.

He's little besides a giant, who's got excellent chest control (something to do with him being bigger than everyone else?). I find his technical skills to be limited, something which you will need at United (assuming (praying) we don't play long ball crap under Moyes). I also find him an incredibly dirty player, and someone I could not support as a United player.

So yeah, Strootman.

 

[Enigma_87]

Strootman can play that role and allow Herrera the freedom to burst back and fourth. Don't get me wrong, I'd love Vidal over any midfielder, but Strootman would fit this team perfectly IMO and I've felt that way for quite a while now. If we don't sign a top midfielder in this market then there's a strong chance we might actually find out how well Strootman could fit us in the future.

What I had in mind is that with Moyes philosophy Strootman I think wouldn't have been more efficient than Herrera for example. I'm not comparing him with Fellaini as in the topic but rather than with Herrera who seemed our first choice. It would've meant sense to get them both sure, but I think Herrera/Vidal/Mata or Herrera/Martinez/Mata will be a much better fit for us at the moment than Strootman. Yes he will bode very well in LvG team but at the moment his price is way over the top and is currently long term injured, you never know how fast he will be back in top form.

 

[JP77]

JP77, one of those guys that knows much more about a player than supporters of his former club. Strootman wasn't even that highly rated by PSV fans after his 2012-13 season, Eriksen made him his bitch in the games against Ajax and in the u21 tournament he wasn't anything special either. But yeah, all the top scouts in Europe haven't got a clue and that's why only Roma went for him.

Strootman just made a huge step on the next level, it happens but not that often. Mostly they tend to dominate on a lower level and then make their mark on a bigger stage. After a good 11-12, his 12-13 was bang average.

Where did I say all of the sop scouts haven't got a clue? You're just making shit up for the sake of it. I'm not some know it all, my opinion back then was that Strootman was performing at a good level and would only get better when he took the step up to a bigger club. That happened. I'm not bragging, I couldn't give a shit about being right. To me though it was clear he would of fitted us and it wasn't even a big gamble when you consider he went for 12-13 million while we were panicking all over the shop and throwing 27 at Fellaini on deadline day.

 

[Pyroblazer]

His Everton 12/13 form would be pretty useless for us, because we don't play a "hoof the ball" system. It was always obvious that Fellaini is the player who will look out of place in van Gaals system. It's better we sell him now, when someone like Napoli wants to buy than wait for another season, where he won't play much and will look like shit and will lose the rest of his value, We kept Anderson way too long and maybe Nani too and look how that turned out.

I wanted to buy Strootman last year, with that fee we couldn't do much wrong with a young player, who will only get better. Now it's difficult and I don't think a transfer is possible before next summer.

 

[Enigma_87]

His Everton 12/13 form would be pretty useless for us, because we don't play a "hoof the ball" system. It was always obvious that Fellaini is the player who will look out of place in van Gaals system. It's better we sell him now, when someone like Napoli wants to buy than wait for another season, where he won't play much and will look like shit and will lose the rest of his value, We kept Anderson way too long and maybe Nani too and look how that turned out.

It is debatable if we take into consideration last season.

 

[bosnian_red]

Funny to see how many people on here saw so little of Fellaini and just went on his reputation, saying stuff like he's a defensive midfielder and he'd improve us. Anyone who has seen him properly could tell you he only played well behind the striker or in a long ball system and would never suit us.

On Strootman, there's still quite a few players I'd take over him, but he'd definitely improve us and Van Gaal is a fan. If we don't get Vidal then I'd be happy with him, he's a good all around player, but he's not world class or anything like that.

 

[Crashoutcassius]

Goes to show that our ideas on fellaini have probably been distorted by last season, when every player was terrible. I wish so badly he could have got pre season in with LVG, he's a very capable premiership centre mid. Perhaps he'll be off to napoli where he'll probably do a good job

 

[Dirty Schwein]

at the first page of this thread.

Of course there's hindsight being 20-20 and all that but it's still funny to read.

 

[Red Phoenix Rising]

Funny to see how many people on here saw so little of Fellaini and just went on his reputation, saying stuff like he's a defensive midfielder and he'd improve us.

He hasn't played for United as an out and out defensive midfielder, we haven't seen that yet, so the jury is still out on whether he could improve us there. With Carrick out he may get a chance if he stays on after pre-season. He also did have the highest ground duel success for United over the course of last season despite not playing a purely defensive role for the majority. He played most of his career at Everton as a defensive midfielder as well so 'saying things like he's a defensive midfielder' is true, I am not sure why this would be called into question.

Anyone who has seen him properly could tell you he only played well behind the striker or in a long ball system and would never suit us.

I am not sure why this keeps being said. He won a lot of praise prior to his last season for Everton playing as the deeper and more defensive of a two for Everton in arguably a purely defensive midfield role. He only had one season up the park for Everton and suddenly 'this is his best and only role.. He must play this role for United and we don't need that'. If you ask me he is probably better used in central midfield than up the park, it seems a more logical place to use him if we are surplus in the no10 department. Deeper midfield is an area that needs numbers with the age and injury of Carrick and I think it would be silly to bank on Fletcher making 38+ appearances this season.

edit: Central midfield role providing Van Gaal tells him to stop playing like Wilmots and Moyes had him playing (ie. Dish off and run 40 yards into the box waiting for a cross).

 

[100]

Strootman's reputation has skyrocketed in the last year - it's not surprising that a lot of people chose an established premier league player over a relatively unknown player in the Dutch league. You can also consider the fact that Fellaini was a success for our then manager, in his previous role.

And nobody was saying Fellaini with the knowledge that we'd pay 28m

 

[Henrik Larsson]

When this thread started Strootman was already 3th captain for Holland, and together with Robben and Van Persie they were the only three who got promised a guaranteed selection for Brazil and a place in the starting line-up according to LvG back then (so he 'rated' Strootman more than De Jong or Sneijder, Van der Vaart, Affelay). So the people who really followed him and worked with him rated him for sure.

Reading back threads like this is always funny, and I'd take Strootman over Fellaini almost every day. But it's not like Strootman is 50% better than Fellaini or something. I'd say potentially he is 20-30% better and he would suit our system and midfield (and a lot of other different systems) a bit better than Fellani.

 

[caid]

He hasn't played for United as an out and out defensive midfielder, we haven't seen that yet, so the jury is still out on whether he could improve us there. With Carrick out he may get a chance if he stays on after pre-season. He also did have the highest ground duel success for United over the course of last season despite not playing a purely defensive role for the majority. He played most of his career at Everton as a defensive midfielder as well so 'saying things like he's a defensive midfielder' is true, I am not sure why this would be called into question.

I am not sure why this keeps being said. He won a lot of praise prior to his last season for Everton playing as the deeper and more defensive of a two for Everton in arguably a purely defensive midfield role. He only had one season up the park for Everton and suddenly 'this is his best and only role.. He must play this role for United and we don't need that'. If you ask me he is probably better used in central midfield than up the park, it seems a more logical place to use him if we are surplus in the no10 department. Deeper midfield is an area that needs numbers with the age and injury of Carrick and I think it would be silly to bank on Fletcher making 38+ appearances this season.

He did play as an out and out defensive midfielder for us. Moyes was using 2 dm every week last season. There was the odd game he played as a cm.
Moyes told his mdfielders to stay behind the ball at all times and you could see it in more or less every game we played with acres of space between the strikers and ... basically everything else.

He didn't play as dm for everton, he hasn't played there with any regularity whatsoever for years and years. Dont know why people keep saying he did.
Incidentally he was dire when he did (in his first season at the club).

He played as am for everton last season. Again i have no idea why people claim otherwise.
Rodwell, P. Neville and Gibson played the dm positions. Osman and Barkley occasionally played as a cm (he usually played 2 dm).
Fellaini always played AM, as he has for years for them.

He cant tackle, he's clumsy, has lousy positioning, is a yellow / red card waiting to happen and
doesn't track runners as can be seen on a dozen occasions last season when mugs like charlie adam waltzed past our midfield.

Other than that,
this thread is amusing,
Fair play to whoever bumped it.

 

[Joga Bonito]

For me the entire problem is that we play Carrick who like Alonso and Gerrard is incredibly hard to find a partner to who will make the midfield dominate Europe. Bayern did the right thing when they went for 2 hard-working box-to-box players instead of a deep lying play maker and a box-to-box.

As long as we play Carrick it will not matter who we buy as we will still not reach the level we want. Carrick/Gerrard/Alonso do not have the legs to be part of a 4-2-3-1 which Madrid has shown the difficulty of. Mourinho got the budget to choose any player in the world to partner Alonso and still the level they reached wasn't very high in terms of central midfields. Bayern did much better who went for two more similar players, stronger defensively but lacking that huge range of passing which Alonso/Carrick/Gerrard has.

I think we should look to create a midfield trio based around Kagawa and what he needs to prosper rather than Carrick. I think Cleverley is the perfect partner which has been seen when they play together. But we do need another midfielder who also loves 1 touch football or we will always only have 2/3 who want to play the same style.

Think about how well Kagawa and Cleverley fair together, very accurate passing, very hard to get the ball from. Imagine if there was another one with the legs to make it work in there. I think mimicing Barcelona will do us better than trying to mimic Madrid as we already have 2 very fine midfielders in the possession style but only one, old player, in the "direct" style.

I think a central midfield trio like that would benefit us more as a team even defensively from the possession we would have and it would have its obvious strengths offensively.

A midfield trio with Kagawa and Cleverley?

 

[Invictus]

In my eyes, the solution, is it simple. We bring in Messi.

How, I hear the common caftard ask, does one accomplish this? Easy, we ride to the sunset, we float, we dither, we defy the logic of all mankind. Will Nani leave? Mayhaps, however, I do pray tell thee that in Young, Cleverley, Anderson, we do have all we need.

The objection to this, one supposes (one being not me, or you, yet something, somewhere), would be what happens in the middle of the park, Park, Ji Sung Park, let's bring him back, shall we? yes, forsooth, I've figured this out.

In short, at the end, Strootman or Faillaini? Nay. Messi. Ruud10, life. What the fukk did I just post?

 

[Red Phoenix Rising]

He did play as an out and out defensive midfielder for us. Moyes was using 2 dm every week last season. There was the odd game he played as a cm.
Moyes told his mdfielders to stay behind the ball at all times and you could see it in more or less every game we played with acres of space between the strikers and ... basically everything else.

He played as a box to box midfielder. Nearly identical to in Wilmots system, he played as the 'dish off and break up field' player. There was less emphasis on discipline and more on goal threat. Changing this role back to a limited ground duel midfielder would be a role he has not played for United.

He didn't play as dm for everton, he hasn't played there with any regularity whatsoever for years and years. Dont know why people keep saying he did.
Incidentally he was dire when he did (in his first season at the club).

Because he did. That is probably why people keep saying it. His entire five year stint at Everton wasn't just behind the main striker. He started off as the deeper limited defensive midfielder and then progressed to a more all-round role in a two. Then when Moyes ran out of options up front he played as a second striker in the style that we see today. Dish off and get forward into the box and try and score. I mean he probably has more credibility as a defensive midfielder for Everton but everybody chooses to remember the one season he played up forward for them and nothing beyond it.

He played as am for everton last season. Again i have no idea why people claim otherwise.

He played for United last season. I am comfortable if you want to shell users for claiming he didn't play for United last season.

Rodwell, P. Neville and Gibson played the dm positions. Osman and Barkley occasionally played as a cm (he usually played 2 dm).
Fellaini always played AM, as he has for years for them.

Assuming you mean his final season at Everton under Moyes? Nobody is disputing that.

He cant tackle, he's clumsy, has lousy positioning, is a yellow / red card waiting to happen and
doesn't track runners as can be seen on a dozen occasions last season when mugs like charlie adam waltzed past our midfield.

You're shooting your own credibility in the foot here. Clumsy I can handle, lousy positioning I can argue came from the role he was asked to play for Moyes at United (then mirrored by Wilmots for Belgium). Nobody is really immune from criticism by having players waltz by them last season. It happened far to often in midfield and defense. If you tar Fellaini with that brush you tar the entire defensive unit as a whole.

'Can't tackle'? That is just a lazy excuse to have a go at him. He pretty clearly can tackle as the number suggest.

 

[Joga Bonito]

I've never seen Strootman play, but as far as I can see he isn't a big, dirty, useless, pointy elbowed, curly-haired feck, so him.

Top post

 

[caid]

'Can't tackle'? That is just a lazy excuse to have a go at him. He pretty clearly can tackle as the number suggest.

Come on, watch the argentina belgium match again. Its an extreme example because he was particularly crap that day but its pretty standard fare.
His 'tackling' was embarrasing. I've never put much store in stats. I've haven't seen a clean, well won tackle from him in 20 (?) games last season.
He won the ball, im not saying he didn't but his tackling is just ... its not a strength.

I'm not tarring the entire defensive unit with letting runners go.
I will tar rooney, mata and fellaini with it because all were pretty terrible in that regard.
Rooney and Mata for trying to pass them off to more defensive players at terrible times (when they were on the edge of our box).
Fellanii just ball watched and people strolled past him.
Fletcher was a bit crap at times too.

I remember him playing as a dm for everton. He was lousy at it. He was next to arteta with cahill ahead if i remember rightly?
He was dirty, extremely dirty and he had the same weaknesses as he showed last season for us.

Also i thought wilmots use of him was a laughably rubbish idea that i dont particularly feel like going into.
It might have been moyes plan long term but he rarely used him that way.

Happy to continue conversation in fellaini's thread if you want but honestly ...
I'd rather just agree to disagree.
Its the same argument thats taken place a thousand times in there and both of us would just be throwing out the same
points that a thousand other posters have made.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

We should have bought both then and imo after January we should have both here...

 

[Bwuk]

We should have bought both then and imo after January we should have both here...

I agree. We needed both even just for numbers, and let's be honest, what's £17m to us really?

Typical under Moyes, dithering around and unsure what to do whilst everyone/everything passes us by.

 

[Dans]

Fellaini simply because he's a better football player.