If Solskjær walked out that would be a huge PR blow to Ed Woodward and the Glazers
Solskjaer target 5 signings; 6 players could leave [BBC, Telegraph, Guardian]
- Thread starter roonster09
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The modern football transfer window - fans pretending they don't care or have given up on this summer by mid-June, because they hoover up every rumour and opinion and supposed ITK and then work themselves into a frenzy when things don't happen quickly
Its really hard to buy football players these days. If we believe the prices that we are rumoured to be being quoted, then I can understand our hesitance and the need for negotiation. Clubs don't want to sell, and crucially, English clubs don't need to sell, so why would they give these players away? Things will heat up with 2-3 weeks to go when clubs start to realise that they can't keep a player that's had his head turned and then they will want to get rid in good time to bring in a replacement. You don't get value in the market in the middle of June.
To summarise - calm down and wait for the window to close before we give a verdict on this summer.
Its really hard to buy football players these days. If we believe the prices that we are rumoured to be being quoted, then I can understand our hesitance and the need for negotiation. Clubs don't want to sell, and crucially, English clubs don't need to sell, so why would they give these players away? Things will heat up with 2-3 weeks to go when clubs start to realise that they can't keep a player that's had his head turned and then they will want to get rid in good time to bring in a replacement. You don't get value in the market in the middle of June.
To summarise - calm down and wait for the window to close before we give a verdict on this summer.
It's pretty spot on right now. We can offer obscene money, and shine it up that you will be part of the "rebuild" which is different to the rebuild 5 years and also different the rebuild 2 years ago.
It's not spot on at all. It's one thing to say that we can only offer more cash when it comes to a Real or a Barca but they are not the only clubs competing for players we would want.
Are you saying Ole is naive or stupid to want all business done prior to preseason?
Feel like us being a public company is really holding back our expenditures. Also being the shitest run club in Europe
But surely finishing safely in the top 4 each season will fast-track that.
Becoming a public joke and dropping down the league will have a massive knock-on effect long-term to reducing debt.
It would also raise his legendary status at United.
We don't *need* to buy English players - if we had a decent scouting network and DoF, there are bargains to be had and deals to be done. How many have RM already signed?
I think there's a serious lag effect when it comes to revenue decreasing as a result of less or no success.
Woodward has told investors before that league position can falter while revenue remains the same and cited Liverpool as a club who struggled but maintained a high level of revenue for years. They can let us struggle on the pitch and maintain decent revenue for a fair few years - and perhaps they think that by the time the lack of success hits the bottom line of the books, they'll have sold us by then anyway.
The most worrying factor is that, in their eyes, they can afford to have us struggle, and we know that they'd be more than happy to do that.
Not sure that that's a fair comparison. Because of their stature and recent success Real Madrid can count on getting their top targets more often than not, whereas we are presumably in the more difficult position of trying to work out how long to hold out for our top target, second choice, third etc. before moving down the list.
I'd love to believe that, but all the more reason to make a statement and just pay up for quality. It pains me that we are no longer at the top table and are seemingly haggling over what amounts to 'peanuts' in football terms (Eg. just pay the 45m up front for AWB), while giving new contracts to our deadwood. It's at best a lack of planning, and worst total incompetence.
I hold out little hope for the rest of the window, and as a consequence next season. We could end up free fall.
It's not that simple though. Players actually have to want to come to your club. It's all very well being willing to pay "whatever it takes" to bring De Ligt to the club, but if he's got other attractive options then you just have to wait on his decisions.
Even with players who you deem to be in low demand from other big teams (maybe Wan-Bissaka) if you do just offer "whatever it takes" then you're asking to be ripped off in all your future transfers.
I totally know what you mean, and I am not advocating a 'do whatever it takes' approach, but we don't need to shop from the *very* top table to improve our side. de Ligt is a special case as he seems to be the 'creme de la creme', but we don't really need that - we need better than Young, Jones, Rojo, Rashford and Fred. This is not a high bar.
There are many players out there that are deemed 'tier 2' or 'emerging talents' that could do the job for us. We may have to pay a small premium now (no CL etc), but we'd arguably get hungry players out to prove themselves on the big stage, set up a good attractive style, and give us a spring board back up to the highest level.
As for AWB, based on his last seasons performances and the current market, 50m would not be being ripped off. The longer we don't invest while those around us do, the further behind we fall and the more we'll have to eventually spend to catch up.
Ok I didn't intend it to be a WUM post and sorry if it came across that way. That being said - in comparison with other big clubs you are not a particularly attractive option right now - unproven manager, best player wanting out, massive restructuring of squad required, lagging behing rivals. Yes you can offer massive wages and of course that will sway a lot of things in your favor but right now there are other clubs that players would probably consider before thinking about Utd. Things can change of course - Utd is a massive club, one of the great clubs in the world and you would expect things to turn around soon - but at this particular moment it's not great.
Before people start saying stuff about Spurs not being great either - the discussion isn't about Spurs, it's about Utd.
I'm not at all - at least I hope I'm not - Utd is a club with a serious problem right now, we can all see it and so can any potential players thinking about joining the club - the one big positive you can offer that most clubs can't is vast amounts of wages - I'm not sure what else you have to give you an edge against other comparible sized clubs. Against your standard level clubs then of course Utd is still a massive draw and many players would love to play for Utd - but in the market you would want to be dealing in, I think you have problems at the moment.
Honestly not trying to wind anybody up, it's just how I see it.
This was supposed to be a big big summer for Ole and United to try and reduce the gap between City and Liverpool. The way we are going, we are going to do enough to maintain parity with Spurs, Chelsea, and Arsenal. This is just terrible. Ole will probably get fired or we will live in denial that things will get better and persist till we are down and under fighting for 6th spot again. Several big names have been on the move this season and it was important to get them and sell them the dream of OT being the Theatre of Dreams again. Not only we're struggling to attract newer players but we are losing our best ones in the bargain as well. I think it'll take about 7 years for us to comeback. It's going to be difficult considering the rate at which City are improving their team and I'm assuming that Liverpool will strengthen as well. This whole theory to try a replicate what Fergie did is not only naive but irresponsible for a business point of view.
If we've been tracking and scouting Bruno and Wan Bassaka during the season, we should have had these deals tied up.
Well there's an easy solution there isn't there? The Glazers should stop taking dividends if it's affecting the team. This simply cannot go on any longer. I think there's been one summer out of the last ten in which United have actually spent an acceptable amount of money on the team. The 2016 window was good and I was pleased we brought in Pogba, Bailly, Mkhi and Ibra. Then the 2017 window was fine but i disagreed strongly with spending that much on Lukaku. Meanwhile, our rivals as well as Wolves and Leicester, have summer after summer of spending 100m+ on players.
Personally I think we are okay to sell Pogba if 1) we sign two good CMs before letting on that we are selling Pogba (I think right now it looks like nobody) and 2) we change system to a true double pivot with a #10 so that we can get some classic CMs with no more fuss over whether Pogba can play in a 2 and whether we need 8 different players to unlock him, which allows us to play a 10 which suits our current squad much better.
I think if we are in a strong position we can get 150m for Pogba or get some decent players from Juve in return
I think if we are in a strong position we can get 150m for Pogba or get some decent players from Juve in return
United's downward spiral hasn't yet stopped. With Glazers, Woodward and Ole at helm, it is not going to stop unless atleast 2 of them are changed.
It's all about investment vs return with our owners. My personal belief is that after Mourinho managed to get us 2nd the Glazers tightened the purse because they felt confident the squad was good enough to make top 4 and please the sponsors, hence the 30M net spend last summer. I don't believe that Woodward "lost faith" in Mourinho and decided not to back him with transfers, why keep him on if he did?
Don't get me wrong, I'm thrilled he left the club, didn't want him here in the first place but keeping on a employee you don't have faith in, don't back to do his job, I simply don't believe those stories.
The Glazers want top 4 at a reasonable cost and that's where their ambition stops. If they believe that making top 4 would cost 500M pounds and the reward is less, would they invest? I personally am not so sure about that.
We have been linked with pretty much every player available this summer so at the moment I have given up watching all the rumours and just waiting for things to actually happen.
Not overly confident as we have not given new contracts to Jones Young Smalling and apparently 3 years to Mata, show just how much Ed knows what he is doing.
We all had lists of top players we would love to see come in, right now we have no idea if Lukaku/Sanchez/Pogba/De Gea will be staying or going.
We will need replacements on top of what we need to improve so my guess at the moment is we will end up paying over the odds for the likes of Maguire, AWB, maybe Fernandes if Pogba goes but I can't see us getting more than 2/3 in as time is running out with the window shutting early this season.
Looks to me like a few of the kids will be given their chance next year, Chong, Greenwood, Gomes, Garner, Pereira, Tuanzebe might be given a lot of game time next year as I just can't see us getting the amount of players in that we need.
Here's hoping but not feeling overly positive at the moment.
Not overly confident as we have not given new contracts to Jones Young Smalling and apparently 3 years to Mata, show just how much Ed knows what he is doing.
We all had lists of top players we would love to see come in, right now we have no idea if Lukaku/Sanchez/Pogba/De Gea will be staying or going.
We will need replacements on top of what we need to improve so my guess at the moment is we will end up paying over the odds for the likes of Maguire, AWB, maybe Fernandes if Pogba goes but I can't see us getting more than 2/3 in as time is running out with the window shutting early this season.
Looks to me like a few of the kids will be given their chance next year, Chong, Greenwood, Gomes, Garner, Pereira, Tuanzebe might be given a lot of game time next year as I just can't see us getting the amount of players in that we need.
Here's hoping but not feeling overly positive at the moment.
The title of this thread 
.
.I can not wait to hear Woodward side of this story. A book based on his time as CEO of United will surely do numbers just based on the disgruntled United fans around the world. From failed managers, failed transfers (Cesc, Ramos, De Gea etc) to bringing back Pogba and making United somehow more profitable than it was when it was successful.
Woodward has done nothing outstanding when it comes to our brand value. Our growth over the years is at the same level as of other big clubs in the prem. In fact Ed is still using the inertia from SAFs days. However, it is clear that we are steadily being left behind the likes of City, Pool and even Spurs. We are so-so lucky to have had SAF for a quarter of a century. It is due to the Boss' outstanding knowledge and performance we are still being considered as one of big clubs. In fact, as soon as Ed has become our CEO, our decline has well and truly set in.
Wrong . Its the people doing the negotiating such as Woodward and the people pulling the string such as the Glaziers that have us so far behind the curve .
We are Manchester UTD and we should approach a club / player / agent with a reasonable offer + an attractive agent and player package and give them 36 hours to say yes or no .
If its no move on to next target
It wont be NO very often.
If Ole is smart he should resign if he doesn't get adequate backing or he could go the way of Gary Neville. The ending of last season put major questions mark on his ability to coach at the highest level. If he has a disastrous start regardless of whether he's being backed or not, he'll be the first one to take the fall. It would be hard pressed to see another big team in the future to take a chance on him if he fails here.
I know this is his dream job, but he has to be willing to walk away if he's not backed properly otherwise he'll pay the price for it.
I know this is his dream job, but he has to be willing to walk away if he's not backed properly otherwise he'll pay the price for it.
I remember seeing a similar thread last summer. Mourinho was targetting X signings and very few happened.
No disagreements on Woody being incompetent and the Glazers being leeches, but the bolded part is United Exceptionalism and is sadly out of tune with the times. In the last 15 years, we have never had more pull than a club like Madrid even at our peak, and the times where we'd storm in and players would be jumping to join us are in our rear view (for now). It's ridiculous to assume - especially after the dumpster fire of the last few years - that we can walk into the negotiating room and throw our balls on the table and expect the other team to acquiesce to our demands because their player so badly wants to join us. Whether people will admit it or not, we are challenging for the top 4 next year, not the title, and it will probably be 3 years before we can put together a legitimate title run. We can still lean on our rich history, but the footballing landscape has changed and we are no longer one of the biggest fish around.
I'm not sure how serious you are but it would be fascinating. Even just watching the Sunderland documentary on Netflix gave a bit of insight to what goes on and that was a completely different level.
I doubt we would be prepared to but a documentary series behind the scenes would be incredible. From a PR perspective for people like Ed as well, it may actually turn some people's opinions around as well. I'd love to see even just a hot of what's going on, why, what the thought process is etc. Seeing some of the trnasger window meetings with the scouts etc was just really interesting. It may also be a fairly lucrative thing to do in terms of generating money from an Amazon or Netflix. I'm sure it would have a huge amount of interest from fans of all different clubs.
This. Also very few clubs provide the platform for global exposure that United does. No amount of RedCafe meltdowns or wums will change that.
Redeemed. You just sorta listed things other than money that United offers to potential players.
And as a fan, I'm completely happy if we don't go down the Galactico root like Madrid and Barca. We haven't had great fortune with that. Let's play in other markets. Those markets have worked well for Liverpool and City and Spurs.
I am super serious. There are so many questions about how the club is run.
I think Real is quite an interesting comparison actually. What's really impressed me is that they knew back in January that they had problems with their team, and they immediately set about putting that right. They have identified their targets and began negotiation months ago, so that when the window opens they are signing players left right and centre. Organised, efficient, professional.
A million miles from our greedy kid in a sweet shop approach...
Make or break summer. Surely if we make no major signings to improve the team and have a similar or worse season the Old Trafford crowd will awake from the slumber and start making their discontent felt. We cant go on ignoring and in some cases clapping this shite indefinetly.
I dunno. Back in 1972-73, when Tommy Doc was frantically buying players to replace the aging team, my old PE teacher said to us 'you lot would go and support eleven monkeys play if they were wearing United shirts.' He wasn't wrong.
So will we get 3/4 more players in before 1st July? That's when players are due back aren't they?
I share the exact same thoughts as you do.
This club is just a fecking mess from top to bottom.
Worst thing is, the Glazers don’t see anything wrong with it. As long as Ed is making them money, that is all that matters to them. Money 1st, football success 2nd.
It really is quite incredible the patience of OT fans, especially when you compare with ten years ago with the green and gold campaign where the discontent was palpable and yet we were actually competing for the league and champions league at that time.
We've said it about Ed many times over six years but this time it really must be make or break. We're in a position where are two biggest rivals are winning/competing for every trophy and we're closer to Wolves and Everton than we are to them. There has to be genuine signs of progress otherwise it surely must get ugly. Spending big money is a must but the worrying contract extensions for the likes of Rojo, Jones, Smalling, Young are sending red flags flying.
I was thinking along these lines a few days ago too.
I asked myself:
If I was in Ole’s position and I wasn’t happy with the ambition the club was showing and has how Woodward was dealing with my transfer requests, would I walk?
Would I give up the chance of a lifetime for the (perceived) greater good of the club?
The answer for me was no, as I would believe that I could still turn it around.
But I think you’re right - if he left before the new season started, the protests from the fans would far surpass the green and gold campaign a few years ago. Whether or not that would put enough pressure on the Glazers to sell or get rid of Woodward though, is another matter.