I think it's because they probably have deemed the referee has already saw the incident and dealt with it. It's the same reason why we could not appeal Fletcher's red card in the Champions League a few seasons back, if I remember correctly.
Smashley Young
- Thread starter Red Defence
- Start date
I think it's because they probably have deemed the referee has already saw the incident and dealt with it. It's the same reason why we could not appeal Fletcher's red card in the Champions League a few seasons back, if I remember correctly.
Pathetic but, understandable.
They can't take the blown non-offside call into account. Play continued.
The stopping a clear goal scoring opportunity, from the ref perspective there was contact (which can't be denied even in hindsight) that prevented a goal scoring opportunity.
On the whole it was a terrible call but, they can't reverse it only because it was the wrong call taking various things into consideration.
They can't take the blown non-offside call into account. Play continued.
The stopping a clear goal scoring opportunity, from the ref perspective there was contact (which can't be denied even in hindsight) that prevented a goal scoring opportunity.
On the whole it was a terrible call but, they can't reverse it only because it was the wrong call taking various things into consideration.
This. It was always going to be a touch and go appeal, given the way things are set-up.
Much better chance of getting a violent conduct type red overturned, very rare for a clear goalscoring opportunity one to be changed on the basis there was no foul.
If you say so - can't pretend to have followed every turn of his career, but it's not something that sticks in my mind from Watford and Villa. Certainly haven't seen a lot of it from him this season.
He's defo got the odd tumble in his game.
He was the biggest diver in the league at Villa ('most fouled player' on Opta).
A small tricky forward? Hard to picture after the 'I want your pics' thread, Moses. Small tricky forwards look like Pat Nevin. You look more like Brian Kilcline.
Nah, I'm a Paul Scholes build, with a bigger non ginger cock of course.
The cock reference is gratuitous. I expect more of you.
So did his missus
I get hammered on here with my opinions on diving. Someone give out to Moses please.
haven't seen it since watching the match but thought he caught him - sounds like I may be mistaken?
Not really I expected them to not repeal it below. It's as others have said Derry made some contact with Young. That's why it's incredibily difficult to prove if someone makes a dive or not in an official capacity when there is even a fraction of contact. This was shown when UEFA had to repeal Eduardo's ban for diving few years back.
I was thinking about this today. Ref in the Villa-Pool game booked 2 players for diving - both times he was wrong.
Suarez got one for Pool when Ireland clipped him (but thats ok since he's a git) and the Villa player should have got a penalty for the foul by the Pool player. I don't think refs are equipped to deal properly with diving, should go to a review panel to be fair, but one with enough balls to implement it.
But then a dive can only be classified as a player going to ground when there is no contact. Every time I have heard the Young incident discussed people have said there was "minimal" contact...so there was contact.
Also, there have been instances where a player has had to avoid what would be a foul to protect themselves and goes to ground. Is it a dive, because they didn't stay in place and take the foul?
I would love cheating and diving to be eliminated from the sport...but there needs to be a clear process in place as to how this will happen and what will be the criteria. In the absence of this, there will be inconsistency...and that is the biggest frustration.
Yup. The rest of Europe apparently has no interest in getting rid of it so there is no point in trying to go it alone in England. That and all the previous listed difficulties.
Easy....a panel of maybe all the manager's and/or all the captains of the other football teams in the division, plus some refereeing officials.
They all convene every Monday morning, and review replays of all alleged dives reported over the weekend's fixtures. Where the majority votes that an incident was a dive/violent conduct, etc, then punishment is handed out.
So let the other participants in the league all decide together what is and isn't a dive by vote. Not too hard to implement, is it?
So for me the challenge is that if there's illicit contact of any kind (other than the "fair" shoulder to shoulder "charge") with the player and not the ball, then a free kick (or penalty if inside the box) is legitimately supposed to be given. That is of course, unless the player shrugs off the foul stay's on his feet and makes an attempt on goal. And if he misses ... then what?
And what constitutes a dive? Is it embellishing a genuine foul by flying through the air and or rolling around in feigned agony to ensure the referee gives the decision? Or is it when a player truly falls without contact of any sort to elicit a call that should never be?
A referee who categorically decides a player has "dived" without the benefit of a "second view" is indeed a brave person. Things happen so quickly can a ref be so sure that no contact was made?
I agree that diving calls should be made after the fact in all but the most blatant of cases for a panel of experts to adjudge.
In Young's example I must say it reminded me of some of Ronaldo's penalty awards; At pace and when only just in balance, the slightest nudge or trip will cause even the most honest player fall. And also in Young's case I believe the decision came from the brush of contact against the calf of his standing leg and not the hand on his back. (A hand on a players back is not a foul if it's not a push) My concern from Ashley is his "flight" through the air was defo "over the top" ... IMHO Ref has to give the penalty; review the "dive" after the fact and punish the "diver" from there.
And what constitutes a dive? Is it embellishing a genuine foul by flying through the air and or rolling around in feigned agony to ensure the referee gives the decision? Or is it when a player truly falls without contact of any sort to elicit a call that should never be?
A referee who categorically decides a player has "dived" without the benefit of a "second view" is indeed a brave person. Things happen so quickly can a ref be so sure that no contact was made?
I agree that diving calls should be made after the fact in all but the most blatant of cases for a panel of experts to adjudge.
In Young's example I must say it reminded me of some of Ronaldo's penalty awards; At pace and when only just in balance, the slightest nudge or trip will cause even the most honest player fall. And also in Young's case I believe the decision came from the brush of contact against the calf of his standing leg and not the hand on his back. (A hand on a players back is not a foul if it's not a push) My concern from Ashley is his "flight" through the air was defo "over the top" ... IMHO Ref has to give the penalty; review the "dive" after the fact and punish the "diver" from there.
Its not about double standards, its about being realistic. Diving is part of the game as much as agents and billionaires with no idea of football and who own clubs are. Am I happy about it? No Can we change that? No.
Considering that the UEFA/FIFA refuse to implement technology for obvious reasons then there will be room of abuse and such thing will be exploited. Im sure that if Livepool, Barca or any other club were in a position to hurt us by diving then they'll do it. At the end of the day its what you win that count and not how you do it.
It's embarrassing and he should cut it out. The way he exaggerates the slightest bit of contact is cringeworthy.
practicing for his move to La Liga
Are we fans making more out of it than we should? I would think that if there is such a big uproar towards young then if he was genuinely tripped at the calf then he should come out and say so.
But clearly he's not found a reason to explain himself, which says that 1. its not such a big deal to the football fraternity than we are making it out to be, and/or 2. He did dive!
Contact but so theatrical. Really embarrassing franky. If he went over without looking like such a dickhead then fair enough.
another dive again.... stop it please.
Can we bench him for this shit please? Seriously, if we're going to win it let's do it properly. Pathetic.
It's disgraceful really. It was probably a foul but the way he went down was ridiculous.
there was contact, but the way he went down was disgraceful.
feck off Ashley. I think it's a penalty, but still, feck off. We can win comfortably without that shit.
same train of thought as that myself.
It wasn't a dive. His eyes are clearly on the ball.
There's no way he would even attempt a dive after the slaughtering he got in the media last week.
There's no way he would even attempt a dive after the slaughtering he got in the media last week.
Cheating your way to the title
Can we?
Pathetic. And against his old club that made him? I hope he cops it every time he steps on the pitch now, he's made a name for himself.
As for what you said there pete, it's not as if they wouldn't have won this game anyway...
As for what you said there pete, it's not as if they wouldn't have won this game anyway...
Dive. Why is his leg going to the defender's foot?
I'm interested to know how Young is going to avoid that foot. He's going to the defender and then changes directions 90°. Reminds me of the pen Dzeko got the other day. How is Young going to avoid contact there without stopping himself or moving to his left?
You're having a laugh. No wait, I am.
Mate, you can't defend that - he moved in entirely the other direction from the ball for crying out loud.
You're having a laugh. No wait, I am.
Mate, you can't defend that.
It isn't a dive as such, he exaggerated the fall. It was a stone wall penalty.
Clear dive. As soon as he falls to the ground his eyes go to the ref, thinking 'did it work?' Yes it did, Ashley, you pulled it off again. Apparently this is modern football. Not that I'm gonna stop watching it but feck that football.