Should we consider selling Pogba?

Withnail said:
And what's wrong with his attitude?
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I just think we could do with someone who strives to dominate every game and gives his all to win for his teammates. Someone who improves year on year who everyone gets behind.

I think Pogba gets a lot of unfair stick but in 4 years here he still makes the same mistakes he did in his first year for us. He never looks like a man possessed, dominating the midfield and pulling us through a game.

I know that may not be the kind of player he is and a new DM may change everything for him but given the money we’d receive for him we could go and buy any other midfielder we wanted in the world who as I say, may have a completely different attitude.
 
He'sRaldo said:
DM is definitely not ideal long term. Not because he's subpar defensively (it's improving and now quite solid) but because he's shackled in attack. He's playing in that position because he's the best we have there.

As for Bruno, how has he proven to be a clearly better attacker?

And the follow up question is, would it be better to get a more defensive midfielder to replace Pogba and then play Bruno as the sole creator (remember we don't have attacking wingbacks or natural wingers), or do we play Pogba and someone else as attacking threats from midfield in a more balanced formation not based on a no. 10?
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The last part of your post is the big question mark for me. There are options on how we can setup midfield, IMO we will shift to more flat midfield 3 with new season and some issues with Pogba will be gone. Nevertheless, what we see is prime time Pogba and I don't think we should expect anything more from him, so it's reasonable to discuss if we are entirely happy with what he provides.
 
JPRouve said:
Herrera has been shit for PSG and barely played, so i'm not sure why you mention him. And Pogba has been a game changer for us, in fact he has been our best outfield player since 2016, the question should be why haven't we been succesful and the answer is clearly about the rest of the team, surely you can see that?
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What games did Pogba change for us recently? Best player since 2016 my arse.
 
JG3001 said:
Yes it should always be the aim, my concern is with the money wasted up till now, it’s sell before we buy. Freeing up some deadwood wages will help cover a couple signings but beyond that I’m not so sure. Need a few more academy lads to come good.
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But that's not about Pogba which is my point. You are essentially wondering if we can have an excellent team despite the money that we wasted and the "deadwood". In that context De Gea, Maguire, Bruno Fernandes and Pogba are all in the same bag, how do we build an excellent without an infinite budget and it has little to do with these players flaws.

Instead of asking a legitimate question about team building you turned it into a question about Pogba when it concerns all players in the team and Pogba is one of the least questionable of them.
 
Everyone treated Pogba like the next GOAT in the football world, but seriously I would take De Bruyne, Silva, Hazard, Modric, so many others over him. Pogba is grossly overrated. Don't know whether it's his form or his peak, but clearly he's not matching expectations of pundits or fans....
 
JPRouve said:
No, he has been a game changer under Mourinho in a double pivot with Matic, Pogba has barely played higher up at United anyway. Why do you think he ended up in PFA team of the year in 2017/20018 when he absolutely didn't play higher up the pitch?
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I won't argue on that, but right now the discussion is how he fits in this team. His performances and impact on the team should be widely discussed just as any player on the team, let alone one of the biggest stars.
 
No. You don’t sell a world class midfielder if you don’t have to. We don’t have to.
 
MZX7 said:
Everyone treated Pogba like the next GOAT in the football world, but seriously I would take De Bruyne, Silva, Hazard, Modric, so many others over him. Pogba is grossly overrated. Don't know whether it's his form or his peak, but clearly he's not matching expectations of pundits or fans....
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That I agree with, he was grossly overrated by people that clearly didn't watch him play, some were claiming that he was the best all round midfielder.
 
Borys said:
I won't argue on that, but right now the discussion is how he fits in this team. His performances and impact on the team should be widely discussed just as any player on the team, let alone one of the biggest stars.
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And he’s consistently created for this team.

We are far better with him than without him.
 
Borys said:
I won't argue on that, but right now the discussion is how he fits in this team. His performances and impact on the team should be widely discussed just as any player on the team, let alone one of the biggest stars.
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Right now he is one of the best performers in the team, so he fits quite well.
 
Yeah let’s sell our only WC player in the team! Sounds like a perfect idea.
 
Borys said:
The last part of your post is the big question mark for me. There are options on how we can setup midfield, IMO we will shift to more flat midfield 3 with new season and some issues with Pogba will be gone. Nevertheless, what we see is prime time Pogba and I don't think we should expect anything more from him, so it's reasonable to discuss if we are entirely happy with what he provides.
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The crux of it is if you can find a better fit, then go ahead and sell. But we shouldn't be daft and sell him first, and then start scrambling when we realized we fecked up.

If I see evidence that we'll achieve more without Pogba than with him (which basically amounts to winning the biggest trophies, as we've won everything else already, as well as 2nd in the PL) then we can of course sell him.

But until that time, of course you keep one of the best performers on your team.
 
sammsky1 said:
What games did Pogba change for us recently? Best player since 2016 my arse.
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Who has been consistently better than him? And how many of those players are there? And once you answer those 2, why would you sell the player that is barely beaten (in your eyes) when there are far more players that can be described as weak links?
 
He'sRaldo said:
The crux of it is if you can find a better fit, then go ahead and sell. But we shouldn't be daft and sell him first, and then start scrambling when we realized we fecked up.
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Well that goes without saying. I do think his market value is quite high. It all depends on many factors, but in my opinion he is not key player in this team and highly overrated by some on this forum. Doesn't mean I don't rate him and want him gone.
 
JPRouve said:
But that's not about Pogba which is my point. You are essentially wondering if we can have an excellent team despite the money that we wasted and the "deadwood". In that context De Gea, Maguire, Bruno Fernandes and Pogba are all in the same bag, how do we build an excellent without an infinite budget and it has little to do with these players flaws.

Instead of asking a legitimate question about team building you turned it into a question about Pogba when it concerns all players in the team and Pogba is one of the least questionable of them.
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Apologies I’ve probably somewhat veered from the original point. I think we can probably agree that at this stage, there are a number of players whose place at the club should be scrutinised before Pogba.
 
Borys said:
Well that goes without saying. I do think his market value is quite high. It all depends on many factors, but in my opinion he is not key player in this team and highly overrated by some on this forum. Doesn't mean I don't rate him and want him gone.
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You are entitled to that opinion of course, but when it comes to tangibles like selling him based on that opinion, you need to bring some really solid proof to go alongside it.

I think that's a fair position to take.
 
JPRouve said:
That a player was injured and changed a game is laughable? You are an easy crowd.
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Erm from My memory, he came on as sub vs Spurs and has a fun cameo. and anyway we drew, so what did he change about the game?

This is the problem with Pogba fanboys. You exaggerate absolutely everything about him, and then act surprised why neutral fans have such high expectations from him.

Maybe that’s it. The problem isn’t him, it’s his fanboys who keep protesting that he is world class, the bestest, someone who should be cherished, when in fact he’s just really just a good decent player. This narrative you have all created around him has destroyed his reputation.
 
sammsky1 said:
Erm from My memory, he came on as sub vs Spurs and has a fun cameo. and anyway we drew, so what did he change about the game?
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With how many points did we get into CL? It was a very close battle, so every point counted in the end.
 
sammsky1 said:
Erm from My memory, he came on as sub vs Spurs and has a fun cameo. and anyway we drew, so what did he change about the game?

This is the problem with Pogba fanboys. You exaggerate absolutely everything about him, and then act surprised why neutral fans have such high expectations from him.

Maybe that’s it. The problem isn’t him, it’s his fanboys who keep protesting that he is world class, the bestest, someone who should be cherished, when in fact he’s just really just a good decent player. This narrative you have all created around him has destroyed his reputation.
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You are not neutral and are talking to someone that didn't want Pogba at United and would ship him out of the club right now for Thiago if it was possible just because I prefer Thiago collectively and individually. So don't go around pretending that you are neutral when it comes to Pogba, you keep talking nonsense.
 
JPRouve said:
You are not neutral and are talking to someone that didn't want Pogba at United and would ship him out of the club right now for Thiago if it was possible just because I prefer Thiago collectively and individually. So don't go around pretending that you are neutral when it comes to Pogba, you keep talking nonsense.
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I have no agenda against pogba aside from the fact that he has never come close to delivering what he was sold as.

If it were only me who thought this, then I would seriously rethink my view. But it isn’t, in fact people who think like me has been an ever increasing group. I was just very early having spotted the issue after only 10 games. I still don’t know what it is that he is meant to do.
 
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He's a fantastic player, incredibly skilled but somehow he isn't quite the right fit for us.

Michael Carrick was an excellent footballer with dips in form. In Pogba's position I think he'd be more effective.

I'm not sure if we signed a passing playmaker next to Pogba like Pirlo at Juve would we see better balance

it doesn't feel like the right fit

He's still a fantastic player - maybe just not the right fit for us perhaps
 
sammsky1 said:
I have no agenda against pogba aside from the fact that he has never come close to delivering what he was sold as.

If it were only me who thought this, then I would seriously rethink my view. But it isn’t, in fact people who think like me has been an ever increasing group of people. I was just very early having spotted the issue after only 10 games. I still don’t know what it is that he is meant to do.
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At least be honest with yourself, you have an agenda and the people agreeing with you aren't more rational. And I told people that it would happen before we even signed him because Pogba was overrated and that he isn't the player that people are dreaming about but it doesn't change the fact that he has been our best outfield player since 2016, that he has also been a game changer and neither of these things mean that he is perfect or the best player ever which is something that I have never suggested, I don't rate him as a top 10 player but again that doesn't make him not one of the best player in the world. People should keep in mind that there are 11 players that start every games so there is way more than 11 players in the group of best players in the world, a conservative figure would be 40 and Pogba is definitely in that bracket.
 
JPRouve said:
At least be honest with yourself, you have an agenda and the people agreeing with you aren't more rational. And I told people that it would happen before we even signed him because Pogba was overrated and that he isn't the player that people are dreaming about but it doesn't change the fact that he has been our best outfield player since 2016, that he has also been a game changer and neither of these things mean that he is perfect or the best player ever which is something that I have never suggested, I don't rate him as a top 10 player but again that doesn't make him not one of the best player in the world. People should keep in mind that there are 11 players that start every games so there is way more than 11 players in the group of best players in the world, a conservative figure would be 40 and Pogba is definitely in that bracket.
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What’s my agenda then? Pray tell.

And he isn’t or hasn’t been our best player, else everyone would agree with you.

Lastly so you think that anyone who disagrees with you isn’t rationale? Wow that’s quite a high level of arrogance!
 
Only if it's a Coutinho-esque transfer fee. If not, then it's not worth it.
 
JPRouve said:
At least be honest with yourself, you have an agenda and the people agreeing with you aren't more rational. And I told people that it would happen before we even signed him because Pogba was overrated and that he isn't the player that people are dreaming about but it doesn't change the fact that he has been our best outfield player since 2016, that he has also been a game changer and neither of these things mean that he is perfect or the best player ever which is something that I have never suggested, I don't rate him as a top 10 player but again that doesn't make him not one of the best player in the world. People should keep in mind that there are 11 players that start every games so there is way more than 11 players in the group of best players in the world, a conservative figure would be 40 and Pogba is definitely in that bracket.
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It happened to Maguire as well. The hype, then the record fee, and then the disappointment based on the hype. It's understandable tbh even if it's ridiculous.

And it worries me about Sancho as well, because people hype him up the same way (most likely having sparingly watched him) and we'll have to pay a huge fee to get him. It seems on the surface like the same recipe as the others.
 
Borys said:
What do you mean by solid proof?
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Proof that he's not a key player, because that's what selling him will based off.

If there's proof we don't feel his absence and are able to replace him while taking a step forward, then we should do it. But since it's a risky move, it shouldn't be off the back of feelings.
 
Alejandro Angel said:
.......I would be happy to sell if we could get the money back that he cost and that they invested the money into the squad.
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I think that boat sailed long ago.
We overpaid when we bought him and for a while the club put an even higher value on him, but he hasn’t exactly set the world on fire for the 4 years since he returned from Juve. That’s half of his senior career!
He’s now 27.5 years old and it’s uncertain if he’ll ever fulfil that earlier promise.
It would be difficult to offload him now, especially so in the current environment, unless it was for a much reduced price; but the likely wages and add-on fees that his agent will demand, will put off most if not all possible buyers.
I’d prefer him to stay and be redeployed in a more creative attacking role, but if he asks to go and is prepared to take a big cut in wages to make that possible, we’d be better off taking whatever we can get for him. We won’t get anything near what we paid for him though.

BenitoSTARR said:
No. You don’t sell a world class midfielder if you don’t have to. We don’t have to.
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Knux said:
Yeah let’s sell our only WC player in the team! Sounds like a perfect idea.
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It‘d be nice to have a world class midfielder to sell in the first place.
 
He'sRaldo said:
Proof that he's not a key player, because that's what selling him will based off.

If there's proof we don't feel his absence and are able to replace him while taking a step forward, then we should do it. But since it's a risky move, it shouldn't be off the back of feelings.
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On the contrary, how to prove he is key player? Not that I disagree with you, but I'm just wondering. It isn't like he's constantly contributing to goals (it's not his main role right now anyway). Generally, I think if we got a decent offer and he wanted to move then we should definitely consider selling him.
 
sammsky1 said:
What’s my agenda then? Pray tell.

And he isn’t or hasn’t been our best player, else everyone would agree with you.

Lastly so you think that anyone who disagrees with you isn’t rationale? Wow that’s quite a high level of arrogance!
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No I think that you are not rational and that people who admit themselves that they judge Pogba differently because of his transfer fee and agent aren't rational when it comes to Pogba's evaluation. I mean we had people claiming that McTominay was better.

There is no reason for me to be right 100% of the time but as it happens Mourinho, Ole, Conte, Allegri and Deschamps considered that Pogba was a great player and had/have him as a starter whenever he is fit. The premier league players put him in the PFA team of the year in 2018/2019. Now maybe all these people are wrong, a large amount of the fanbase is wrong and of course I'm wrong, that's also an option.
 
Borys said:
On the contrary, how to prove he is key player? Not that I disagree with you, but I'm just wondering. It isn't like he's constantly contributing to goals (it's not his main role right now anyway). Generally, I think if we got a decent offer and he wanted to move then we should definitely consider selling him.
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With Bruno playing as a 2nd striker and Matic playing very deep, how do you reckon the ball has been getting to our forwards?

Bruno might make the final pass, but that's his role. Pogba's role is different, but his absence is noticeable when someone like Fred or McTominay is played in his place. With that said, I agree with you that it may not be his most optimal role, but it's pivotal nonetheless.
 
Borys said:
On the contrary, how to prove he is key player? Not that I disagree with you, but I'm just wondering. It isn't like he's constantly contributing to goals (it's not his main role right now anyway). Generally, I think if we got a decent offer and he wanted to move then we should definitely consider selling him.
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Look at our record/stats without Pogba and with Pogba the past 3 seasons.

I think that's proof enough.
 
starman said:
It was all down hill for Newcastle after they got rid of Stephane Guivarc'h...
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Don’t know what you want to say? He was there for 3 months and played 4 games, all comps for Newcastle.
 
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