No of course it doesnt, but we need some proper competition, someone who can stay fit, someone who will play if Rafael isnt doing the business. This is why Evra turned out so bad, because no matter how lackluster he performed he had nobody to come and take his place. Low standards were good enough.
Seamus Coleman
- Thread starter Ramshock
- Start date
No of course it doesnt, but we need some proper competition, someone who can stay fit, someone who will play if Rafael isnt doing the business. This is why Evra turned out so bad, because no matter how lackluster he performed he had nobody to come and take his place. Low standards were good enough.
I think we could use a backup until Rafael figures out his injury problems but I absolutely think Rafael is our best bet for the future. I genuinely wouldn't trade him for anyone in the world in his position, and I certainly wouldn't be paying 25mil for someone to replace him. It's baffling that we let Fabio go when he would be the perfect, free, backup to Rafael rather than forcing Smalling, Jones, and Valencia there.
Ideally we'd get a player who can play left and right back, then we can go and get a first choice left back too and let Buttner go.
And honestly with tactics like we had against Fulham (Mata in from the right) it doesnt suit Rafael. It suits someone like Coleman who has the attacking ability to play in a wide midfield role.
Yeah but in a perfect world we'd have signed a midfielder who isnt Fellaini. Thats unfortunately not how we do business. We'll be lucky to get one solid fullback for next season
Moyes is going to gut this squad, I'm convinced of it.
Maybe but we'd still be lucky to have one solid fullback for next season even if he signed 3 of them.
Well he signed Coleman for 50k so I think you're being a bit harsh. He also signed Baines, who despite me not wanting him here due to price, age and style, is a very good left back.
somebody is... im not convinced it will be moyes
I would take Coleman over a Rafael in a heartbeat now.
True, he did buy good fullbacks. I'm just expecting the worst after signing Fellaini and giving Buttner a run in the team. I was thinking we'll end up with someone as tall as Fellaini and as useless as Buttner. Wheres Jelle Van Damme these days? But yeah hopefully he'll find another Baines or Coleman, thats a great record.
Coleman has been far better than Rafael this season, anyone who says otherwise is deluded.
Do not want. Good player yes, but 25m? Get out.
Not to mention we have Rafael. Does he need better cover than Smalling/Jones? Probably. But he's our starting RB, we need a backup, not competition.
Not to mention we have Rafael. Does he need better cover than Smalling/Jones? Probably. But he's our starting RB, we need a backup, not competition.
Has anybody said otherwise?
That winger thing is a myth. He played there sometimes for Sligo but was already a right back when he moved to Everton. He was a right back on loan at Blackpool and then the majority of the 10/11 season for Everton. It was during the 11/12 season that Moyes tried out the Coleman as a winger experiment and it didn't work and Coleman looked poor that season. The next season he was absolutely brilliant playing back in his best position and he has moved it up to the next level this season.
Not sure. Have you?
Agreed, I didnt like him on the wing as a winger but it obviously helped develop his attacking game and he's using that from right back now.
Aye, in the long run it has probably served Coleman well. However, at the time I remember thinking that Moyes was ruining a brilliant prospect and Coleman looked completely shot of confidence that season.
You can tell the people who haven't really seen Coleman play as they're the ones who think that he's only been good this season. He was very close to Rafaels standard last year after a season where he was our most improved player and you could see already at that stage that he would turn out to be a monster of a player. He's showed this year how big his potential actually is.
Spot on. It's frustrating when people think he emerged from nowhere this season or the ones that think he played as a winger for any significant period of time.
I think most rate Coleman, I certainly do, they just don't think he's better than Rafael, you just said yourself Rafa was better than him last season. Yes, this season due to injuries and form he's been below par, like many in our squad, but Rafael is three years younger than Coleman, Moyes should be working with him and improving him rather than spending £25m on replacing him.
I hate how people have become so critical of our players, almost in a way to take blame away from Moyes.
It's particularly funny in this instance when you consider the changing variable in both players' considerable differing performances between this season and last.
Coleman is obviously a very good player, but there's priority that must be taken into account among the positions in our team. We have a left back who has struggled considerably the last two years, our well documented problems in midfield, 3 hit and miss wingers and CBs who've performed very inconsistently all year and we're going to spend 25M on a position that seemed one of our most promising last season. Not just that, but you very rarely need to spend a fee like that to acquire a strong player at fullback. Should we ship out De Gea next?
It's particularly funny in this instance when you consider the changing variable in both players' considerable differing performances between this season and last.
Coleman is obviously a very good player, but there's priority that must be taken into account among the positions in our team. We have a left back who has struggled considerably the last two years, our well documented problems in midfield, 3 hit and miss wingers and CBs who've performed very inconsistently all year and we're going to spend 25M on a position that seemed one of our most promising last season. Not just that, but you very rarely need to spend a fee like that to acquire a strong player at fullback. Should we ship out De Gea next?
Well Moyes certainly hasnt told Rafael to stop tracking back and dive in like his first season.
Coleman 2012/2013 + Coleman 2013/2014 > Rafael 2013/2014
Coleman 2012/2013 < Rafael 2012/2013
Coleman 2013/2014 >= Rafael 2012/2013
It sickens me. You're right, it's a product of the incessant justification of Moyes. All in the name of morality and nothing more.
It took me a while to work it out, but yes, I agree
However, like I said, we know what Rafael is capable of and it is the manager's job to get him to perform to that level, just because he's had injuries and been below par for six months doesn't mean you ship him off and replace him with a new £25m player, this isn't Manchester City, we don't have the resources to do that, and I don't want us to anyway, he's a young player who has been here for a good few years and Moyes needs to show faith in him. Coleman is class though, I agree with your general point.
Arsenal replacement of Sagna.
Will be good for them with him and Gibbs on each side.
Will be good for them with him and Gibbs on each side.
It took me a while to work it out, but yes, I agree
However, like I said, we know what Rafael is capable of and it is the manager's job to get him to perform to that level, just because he's had injuries and been below par for six months doesn't mean you ship him off and replace him with a new £25m player, this isn't Manchester City, we don't have the resources to do that, and I don't want us to anyway, he's a young player who has been here for a good few years and Moyes needs to show faith in him. Coleman is class though, I agree with your general point.
I agree, i think that it would be a waste for both United and Coleman to sign him unless you sold Rafael which would be silly. Rafael does have the quality to be a very good player (I think he'd be World Class without injuries but i'm not sure anymore as they seem to keep stunting his development at key times/you play Smalling which stunts his development aswell which is irritating for a neutral who wants to see the best young players excel). Every game Rafael is available for he should be playing as he'd be United first team quality for 5-10 years, plus it would save that 25m for LB/CM which are the positions which you MUST improve in.
Aye, i've always felt like he'd fit in at Arsenal considering how we both like to play, and how much he has excelled under the style. He'd also be able to provide them goals though which i don't think Sagna has ever really managed.
plus he gets cl football next season probably which must be tempting for him - cant see wenger paying the crazy amounts pf money spoken about though - £25m on a full back? - possibly if you could get him for a bit less though (or if you could construct a player plus money deal though they hardly ever happen)
Another £25m for an Everton player??
If we sign Leighton Baines as well, we could have spent £75m on bringing three Everton players to the club, and Moyes could probably go down as the stupidest cnut in history.
If we sign Leighton Baines as well, we could have spent £75m on bringing three Everton players to the club, and Moyes could probably go down as the stupidest cnut in history.Coleman is just as good as Rafael, and less injury prone. But a right-back should not be a priority this summer, especially not for £20 odd million. Would be a baffling move.
Think Moyes should stay away from Everton players. It will just bring negativity for him.
You guys are taking the piss, right?
Absolutely not.
I must have missed the incessant justification of Moyes thread. Good God.
Well, call it coincidental, but the same guys that tear into the majority of our players, as well as question their mentality, work rate and commitment to the club, tend to be the same guys that blindly do this in the same post they defend the manager for just about everything.
I happen to completely disagree with that argument. At times, it really does seem like an incessant justification, even though all evidence points towards it being the fault of the management and their tactics, and not our title-winning champions + Mata, Fellaini and Januzaj.
Aye, as much as I would like to see Coleman here, the move would make little sense.
Rafael has been out of form this season but he is a damn good player.
The vast majority of debate agrees with you. I'm just aghast at the implication that the Caf or the world in general has given Moyes an easy ride. They/ we haven't.
Got you. I think Moyes is getting a tough time in pubs, offices and forums, but the match-goers, board and media all seem to be very much behind him. Even today, the likes of Hansen and Lawrenson are wasting valuable column inches that could be filled with hard news with character assassinations of our players.
I don't particularly want anybody to get an easy or hard time, I just take issue with the people that abuse and undermine our champions, claim the squad needs ripped to shreds, usually in support of Moyes. I haven't liked it all season and it's getting to the point whereby I've had enough.
Most reasonable posters on here will accept that the current pain being endured is a result of poor decisions on the management side and some substandard stuff from our players on the field of play. To totally absolve the players is nonsensical.