Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion

Hopefully the Ukrainians make enough progress before the snow becomes a factor, where they would then be well positioned to flush the remaining Russians out of the south given their lack of logistical support.
Frozen grounds are better for movement than mud... as long as it's not too much snow in the way, the winter actually makes movement easier in some regions
 
Frozen grounds are better for movement than mud... as long as it's not too much snow in the way, the winter actually makes movement easier in some regions

Except the Russians don’t have the moral or infrastructure to be successful in winter, especially with Ukrainians getting increasingly sophisticated weapons in the present.
 
Kind of expecting Russia to have retreated from the majority of its gains earlier in the war and effectively resort to attacking urban areas via air in the next few months. They'll throw bodies at defending their frontline whilst they can, but it's hard to see them making gains/improving morale/combat quality anytime soon.
 
Except the Russians don’t have the moral or infrastructure to be successful in winter, especially with Ukrainians getting increasingly sophisticated weapons in the present.
Meanwhile, I hope that Ukrainian forces are well supplied of all the personnel, vehicle, and equipment related supplies to be as effective as possible in winter fighting. That part shouldn't be hard to anticipate (winter happens every year), and shouldn't even be expensive compared to some of the more advanced systems/ammunition they're being supplied with.
 
Jaysus, lads.

Sometimes I think this thread gives an interesting insight into the geopolitical complexities of the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

More often it's a queasy mix of war gaming and military fantasists.

That likely because the thread is a reflection of the narratives coming out of Twitter.
 
Meanwhile, I hope that Ukrainian forces are well supplied of all the personnel, vehicle, and equipment related supplies to be as effective as possible in winter fighting. That part shouldn't be hard to anticipate (winter happens every year), and shouldn't even be expensive compared to some of the more advanced systems/ammunition they're being supplied with.
Ye like Canada which is one of the most prepared nations in terms of winter warfare just gave them 500k winter uniforms on top of everything else.

 
Jaysus, lads.

Sometimes I think this thread gives an interesting insight into the geopolitical complexities of the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

More often it's a queasy mix of war gaming and military fantasists.
Anything in particular in the posts before that comment bother you? Saying you can use fuel bombs on trenches?
 
Jaysus, lads.

Sometimes I think this thread gives an interesting insight into the geopolitical complexities of the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

More often it's a queasy mix of war gaming and military fantasists.

I don’t comment on military matters as I know nothing about that subject but there are two interesting factors about this war (at least from a Western perspective) which provoke such interest and heated comment:

1. It’s probably the first war fought amidst wall to wall social media coverage (with Ukraine particularly adept at using it to their advanatage).

2. It’s the first war for a long, long time which is not enshrouded in moral ambiguity - there is a clear good and bad side.
 
I don’t comment on military matters as I know nothing about that subject but there are two interesting factors about this war (at least from a Western perspective) which provoke such interest and heated comment:

1. It’s probably the first war fought amidst wall to wall social media coverage (with Ukraine particularly adept at using it to their advanatage).

2. It’s the first war for a long, long time which is not enshrouded in moral ambiguity - there is a clear good and bad side.

Ah yeah. I do understand the interest in the war. It’s more the knowledge of - and apparent fascination with - the best way to kill people that I find a bit icky. I feel the same when anyone waxes lyrical about various different guns.
 
Ah yeah. I do understand the interest in the war. It’s more the knowledge of - and apparent fascination with - the best way to kill people that I find a bit icky. I feel the same when anyone waxes lyrical about various different guns.
You mean you didn’t get excited when you saw the video of the conscripted Russian blokes, who clearly couldn’t hold a gun straight, and pictured all the intricate ways they might be slaughtered?
 
If they are just going with big straight line trenches then that is suicidal. That's a tactic that was abandoned early in WW1. Just drop some Fuel Air explosive and watch it roll down the line.
All it would take is the Ukrainians to recruit one dragon and it would be all over as we saw when Daenerys Targaryen attacked the Lannister army on the Roseroad.
 
All it would take is the Ukrainians to recruit one dragon and it would be all over as we saw when Daenerys Targaryen attacked the Lannister army on the Roseroad.
Logistics and training required makes that totally unfeasible. They'd need to learn valyrian too
 
I don’t comment on military matters as I know nothing about that subject but there are two interesting factors about this war (at least from a Western perspective) which provoke such interest and heated comment:

1. It’s probably the first war fought amidst wall to wall social media coverage (with Ukraine particularly adept at using it to their advanatage).

2. It’s the first war for a long, long time which is not enshrouded in moral ambiguity - there is a clear good and bad side.
Moral ambiguity as in it was always olay for the west to bomb muslim countries and kill our civillians as long as it doesn't directly affect you.
 
Moral ambiguity as in it was always olay for the west to bomb muslim countries and kill our civillians as long as it doesn't directly affect you.

Not what I said but yes, wars in Europe (the first extended one since the early 90s and the first involving a major power since 1945) do have a greater impact on Europeans than wars elsewhere. I’m not going to defend Iraq but it wasn’t the west slaughtering civilians in Syria and It’s not the west killing “terrorists” in the Sahel. But I hear Putin and the Wagner Group have a big fan club in places like Syria and Mali.
 
Not what I said but yes, wars in Europe (the first extended one since the early 90s and the first involving a major power since 1945) do have a greater impact on Europeans than wars elsewhere. I’m not going to defend Iraq but it wasn’t the west slaughtering civilians in Syria and It’s not the west killing “terrorists” in the Sahel. But I hear Putin and the Wagner Group have a big fan club in places like Syria and Mali.
Oh yeah we love Putin, he only murdered thousands of us, it's totally not regime propaganda, goes to show how ignorant you are.
 
Oh yeah we love Putin, he only murdered thousands of us, it's totally not regime propaganda, goes to show how ignorant you are.

So what’s your point? You started out castigating the west for bombing muslim countries. You wanted the west to intervene or not? Libya intervention to kill dictator bad, Syria non-intervention around dictator bad? I get confused what we are supposed to do…
 
Moral ambiguity as in it was always olay for the west to bomb muslim countries and kill our civillians as long as it doesn't directly affect you.

Could people please clarify when saying these things? I keep looking and can't find a Republic of the West, and we certainly aren't talking about the East's invasion. Sorry but I'm a real nazi about that:angel:
 
So what’s your point? You started out castigating the west for bombing muslim countries. You wanted the west to intervene or not? Libya intervention to kill dictator bad, Syria non-intervention around dictator bad? I get confused what we are supposed to do…
You are putting words in my mouth, the only thing I'm saying that your words shows the lack of compassion some people have, of course it's only a minority of people who are actually like this and I'm calling you out personally as opposed to the "west", we dealt with the same person killing our people, ie Putin, as Ukraine, and it gets to me how different the tone has been as if our children are of lower quality than yours and they deserved to die, so feck your moral ambiguity, it never existed except in your head to justify your lack of empathy.
 
Could people please clarify when saying these things? I keep looking and can't find a Republic of the West, and we certainly aren't talking about the East's invasion. Sorry but I'm a real nazi about that:angel:
"What have the Euromans ever done for us?"

Whatever the result of this war is, bringing back Russia to something resembling of a West-friendly society is something that will take at least decades.

I hope we get good news from Kherson and/or Kreminna soon.

Oh I don't know, you seem to have a good grasp on the subject.
 
Oh I don't know, you seem to have a good grasp on the subject.

Apparently I don't, that's why I ask people to clarify. West-friendly could mean a lot of things, maybe you think of it as Bombing-friendly. But who is the West? Is Japan, South Korea and Australia the West?
 
Macron's comments didn't go down too well to international audiences, it seems.

 
But he said the same as Borell?
But Borell also clearly said that there would be a strong military response. Problem with Macron is that he always talks about what won't be done, but not what will be done, creating the impression of someone who is constantly showing fear and weakness. This only emboldens Putin to escalate.
 
But he said the same as Borell?
Well, not quite. Missing the vital part that you know, might escalate something, humiliate Putin or in any way, shape or form make him not look like the weakest leader the world has seen in a long long time. Guy just screams of fear, toothlessness and weakness which is not the message we should be sending right now.
 
Because in 2003 Lithuanian public was supporting NATO accession, while in 2008 Ukrainian public was against it. Finding primary sources from that period is a bit of a pain, since most links to press releases are dead, but this RAND testimony quotes a 75% support in Lithuania at the time and Wikipedia has a set of polls gauging the Ukrainian sentiment and it's never positive before 2014.
That’s interesting and a really good illustration of why this conflict has been so traumatic for Ukraine and Ukrainians. People looked equally East and West back then, if not more to the East. It has changed so much in the last decade, particularly in the younger generations.

I just consider the perception of how Russia is viewed through the Ukrainians I know and it is a complete sea change from pre-2014, to post-2014, to now. The Sochi Olympics were seen as exciting and an opportunity for Ukrainians, with the games making an unlikely visit to their part of the world, then Russia occupied Crimea and Donbas to make life never the same again.