Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion

Buster15 said:
Ok. So what is his reason for doing it then, given he has told the world that Putin has lied to him?
I am genuinely interested.
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It's in the article. Both Macron and Bennett keep a line of communication between Putin and the West, if for some reason there is a chance of de-escalation he will have leaders to talk to. And they both reports their talks to the rest.

Keep in mind that Macron his generally abrasive, he doesn't care about being liked or doing the popular thing. He just does what he wants or what he thinks is right based on his own opinion.
 
JPRouve said:
It's in the article. Both Macron and Bennett keep a line of communication between Putin and the West, if for some reason there is a chance of de-escalation he will have leaders to talk to. And they both reports their talks to the rest.

Keep in mind that Macron his generally abrasive, he doesn't care about being liked or doing the popular thing. He just does what he wants or what he thinks is right based on his own opinion.
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I think it’s a good idea to have someone who can talk to him.

Not sure why he’s getting stick over it. So long as France don’t sit on the fence.
 
TheReligion said:
Am i the good or the bad? I always forget this :wenger:
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I don’t think I’ve ever accused you of being anything other than good? I’m critical of the police as an institution, perhaps you have mistakenly taken this personally?
 
JPRouve said:
It's in the article. Both Macron and Bennett keep a line of communication between Putin and the West, if for some reason there is a chance of de-escalation he will have leaders to talk to. And they both reports their talks to the rest.

Keep in mind that Macron his generally abrasive, he doesn't care about being liked or doing the popular thing. He just does what he wants or what he thinks is right based on his own opinion.
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Appreciate that and I will accept that my perception of politicians has been adversely affected by the actions of Boris Johnson.
What I am slightly confused with is that the West has a policy of isolating Putin.
And added to that, the appalling actions happening in Ukraine.
So to have a senior leader talk to Putin for hours on the phone just seemed to me to be more than just keeping an open line of communication, should Putin suddenly have a change of heart. But what do I know.
 
Pexbo said:
I don’t think I’ve ever accused you of being anything other than good? I’m critical of the police as an institution, perhaps you have mistakenly taken this personally?
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I was playing around. You’re entitled to be critical as the police should be transparent and open to scrutiny from the public.

I used to take things more personally, when I was first on the Caf, but these day I’ll just try and offer my view/thoughts and move on.
 
::sonny:: said:
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Yeah, that’s fecking terrifying. Those telegrams can be understood differently as it’s mostly about cyber security, but I’m not going to get on it. It’s also kind of absurd that we don’t even know whenever to expect the outside world to cut us off or for Putin to do the same, while the result of any of those scenarios (just like canceling Mastercard & Visa) would only strengthen Putin’s regime by denying those who oppose him in Russia access to information and funding.
 
hellhunter said:
Not sure where I read it, to be honest. Think the explanation was a counter to DDOS attacks
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Oh, that. Those are not mutually exclusive explanations. Anyway, I’m this particular scenario they’re getting ready for the outside world to cut Russia off, not the other way. Not that it makes much difference.
 
Leaving aside the implications, is it even possible for companies to move their entire IT infrastructure to Russian servers in such a short timespan?
 
hellhunter said:
Not sure where I read it, to be honest. Think the explanation was a counter to DDOS attacks
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Yeah, I read the telegram talks about protecting from attacks on DNS, not cutting off the internet to the outside world. That and Cogent pulling out of Russia has possibly led to a few false assumptions.
 
harms said:
Oh, that. Those are not mutually exclusive explanations. Anyway, I’m this particular scenario they’re getting ready for the outside world to cut Russia off, not the other way. Not that it makes much difference.
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I don't really think the outside world can realistically cut Russia off the global internet. Pretty much everyone would have to agree not to route from Russian IPs - seems unfeasible to me.
 
MadMike said:
I don't know why he gets so much shit from some for keeping a line of communication. It's not like he believes all he's told or that he's holding back on sanctions or anything as a result of it. Is it preferable for all lines to be severed?
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Already covered earlier in the thread. Looks like he is believing everything and is happy to repeat whatever Putin is telling him. Other governments have their direct lines too but they're not publicising it. Putin wants a useful idiot to play like the fiddle and Macron is obliging.
 
11101 said:
Already covered earlier in the thread. Looks like he is believing everything and is happy to repeat whatever Putin is telling him. Other governments have their direct lines too but they're not publicising it. Putin wants a useful idiot to play like the fiddle and Macron is obliging.
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What makes you say that?
 
Siorac said:
I don't really think the outside world can realistically cut Russia off the global internet. Pretty much everyone would have to agree not to route from Russian IPs - seems unfeasible to me.
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I’m not technically savvy enough to understand the whole process but I believe the idea is to stop it at physical points of entry. But it’s near impossible as there are so many — unlike, say, in Belarus’, where most of the traffic in and out of the country comes through the same bottleneck. I may be talking nonsense.
 
Buster15 said:
Appreciate that and I will accept that my perception of politicians has been adversely affected by the actions of Boris Johnson.
What I am slightly confused with is that the West has a policy of isolating Putin.
And added to that, the appalling actions happening in Ukraine.
So to have a senior leader talk to Putin for hours on the phone just seemed to me to be more than just keeping an open line of communication, should Putin suddenly have a change of heart. But what do I know.
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Russia aren't isolated though. You need to make a difference between the appearance that many leaders have chosen and what they actually do, the US still have an embassy in Moscow and the argument from Blinken was actually that there is a need to maintain diplomatic contacts.

From a diplomatic standpoint you will need two levels of communication, one between leaders(or at least some of them) and an other between foreign offices with envoys having direct contact with Lavrov's office.
 
Schmiznurf said:
Yeah, it doesn't look like he believes it at all, he's just repeating what is being said so the world can see what shit Putin is spouting.
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Le Drian, the foreign minister, said that Putin and Lavrov say everything and its opposite. They definitely don't believe them at all.
 
harms said:
I’m not technically savvy enough to understand the whole process but I believe the idea is to stop it at physical points of entry. But it’s near impossible as there are so many — unlike, say, in Belarus’, where most of the traffic in and out of the country comes through the same bottleneck. I may be talking nonsense.
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I'm not an expert either. Stopping physical points of entry can be done but I don't think it's feasible for a country with an area of 17 million square kilometres. And then there's satellite access, too.

I mean, Europe still didn't stop buying Russian oil and gas so undertaking the massive operation of trying to cut Russia off the internet entirely seems pretty fecking unlikely.
 
They won't get everyone in Russia off the net, but they could piss off a good chunk of the population. Enough to start a revolution, which you'd assume is the goal here.

Netflix and Tik-Tok have stopped working in Russia, that alone will mobilize thousands.
 
Smores said:
Well like i said I'm going off several Chinese friends in China including the son of a very senior regional official. I get a very open view from them, good and bad, on what normal people think so I'll trust that over distant musings unless you're in China yourself.

The issue is relying on their heavily bias media to guess the views of others. Can you imagine what people would think if they just took Daily Mail and Fox News as sources. Even then you'll find peace and respecting sovereignty pushed, that's as much of a slam to Russia as you'll get. They're not calling it a military operation or any of that bollocks.

They've been censoring pro russia comments for some time on Weibo. The most support you'll get is they source RT too much so stories like Zelenskyy fleeing Ukraine will make their media.
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I am not doubting your source, but I think one reason to explain could be, your friends there `would try to sound more "open-minded" when speaking from their own opinion to a friend from the West - as they all know how strong the West are against the war and Russian.

But if you could read Chinese, you would see from Weibo, majority of comments from average Chinese aligns with what I've said from above. But there are some voice against this and aligns more to the West of course, but they are far from majority.
 
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