Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion

hellhunter said:
I'm really not an expert, but I'm under the asumption that turning off a nuclear power plant on short notice isn't quite so easy, is it?
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Power will be shut when you decide but you can't just leave. You still need to keep cooling systems running for months otherwise it will go very poorly.
 
Was watching some pro-Putin arguments on reddit last few days. Their main talking points:


1. Ukraine was continuously shelling the separatist regions for years, not accepting previous agreements, and attacks had gone up recently.
Not sure how true it is - surely Russia could have posted more footage if it was widespread?
Regardless, doesn't justify Russia bombing anything, let alone residential buildings, hundreds of miles away.

2. Ukraine militia and police/armed people are killing people indiscriminately.
This seemed to be the most credible of their 3 points, saw a few videos of cars being stopped, harrassed, some people shot. Given the official policy about men 18-60, it makes sense too.
It's funny for a pro-Soviet pro-Putin idiot (the guy I was arguing with) to say this though, since it's exactly what the NKVD did during WW2 in Moscow to "stop panic" and "deter looting".

3. Ukraine is refusing to open humanitarian corridors offered by Russia.
There was a link to a Ukraine-language website about this, which itself linked to a Ukrainian ministry statement about fighting and calling "green corridors" a Russian plot, so it seemed credible.
But then, today, apparently both sides have negotiated exactly this. So not exactly a talking point that will last long.
 
Before I say this, and inevitably get flamed - I want to first make it clear that I think Putin is a cnut, his pretext for war is bullshit and I hope he fails in every possible way. feck him and feck the invasion. I'm on Ukraine's side.

But I don't like narratives and how some people are unable to be objective. I saw a post on reddit about how somebody feels sorry for some of the Russian kids on the front lines and won't celebrate their deaths, some of them are just young lads in their teens who have been told by everybody around them that they're doing the right thing. The replies were predictable: "You're a traitor" "feck the invaders I hope they all die" "You're a nazi sympathiser". Sorry but feeling sorry for these kids doesn't mean I don't feel sorry for the people in Ukraine being killed and displaced.

Also, while practically everything that comes out of Russian news agencies is highly slanted propaganda, not everything that comes out of 'our side' is going to be completely truthful either. People post old images and videos of war on social media, showing awful destruction, and implying it's from 2022. If you dare point out that it's fake/old, you'll be flamed for being a Putin bot. This isn't right either. Pointing out fakes does not take away from the fact that Ukrainians really are suffering, but we don't need to make shit up - if anything being deceitful about these matters is insulting to the Ukrainians who are actually suffering.
 
Droid_Repairs said:
Before I say this, and inevitably get flamed - I want to first make it clear that I think Putin is a cnut, his pretext for war is bullshit and I hope he fails in every possible way. feck him and feck the invasion. I'm on Ukraine's side.

But I don't like narratives and how some people are unable to be objective. I saw a post on reddit about how somebody feels sorry for some of the Russian kids on the front lines and won't celebrate their deaths, some of them are just young lads in their teens who have been told by everybody around them that they're doing the right thing. The replies were predictable: "You're a traitor" "feck the invaders I hope they all die" "You're a nazi sympathiser". Sorry but feeling sorry for these kids doesn't mean I don't feel sorry for the people in Ukraine being killed and displaced.

Also, while practically everything that comes out of Russian news agencies is highly slanted propaganda, not everything that comes out of 'our side' is going to be completely truthful either. People post old images and videos of war on social media, showing awful destruction, and implying it's from 2022. If you dare point out that it's fake/old, you'll be flamed for being a Putin bot. This isn't right either. Pointing out fakes does not take away from the fact that Ukrainians really are suffering, but we don't need to make shit up - if anything being deceitful about these matters is insulting to the Ukrainians who are actually suffering.
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I cant imagine you will be flamed for pitying the children Putin sends to fight his war of conquest. War has always been about cnuts in ivory towers moving poor kids around to go and kill eachother. Such a fecking ridiculous concept. War.
 
Droid_Repairs said:
Before I say this, and inevitably get flamed - I want to first make it clear that I think Putin is a cnut, his pretext for war is bullshit and I hope he fails in every possible way. feck him and feck the invasion. I'm on Ukraine's side.

But I don't like narratives and how some people are unable to be objective. I saw a post on reddit about how somebody feels sorry for some of the Russian kids on the front lines and won't celebrate their deaths, some of them are just young lads in their teens who have been told by everybody around them that they're doing the right thing. The replies were predictable: "You're a traitor" "feck the invaders I hope they all die" "You're a nazi sympathiser". Sorry but feeling sorry for these kids doesn't mean I don't feel sorry for the people in Ukraine being killed and displaced.

Also, while practically everything that comes out of Russian news agencies is highly slanted propaganda, not everything that comes out of 'our side' is going to be completely truthful either. People post old images and videos of war on social media, showing awful destruction, and implying it's from 2022. If you dare point out that it's fake/old, you'll be flamed for being a Putin bot. This isn't right either. Pointing out fakes does not take away from the fact that Ukrainians really are suffering, but we don't need to make shit up - if anything being deceitful about these matters is insulting to the Ukrainians who are actually suffering.
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There's people in here who think the same way. Yesterday one lovely individual was talking about rounding up Russians in foreign countries and putting them in camps.

Fascism has been rising again in Europe and can't help but feel this war is only going to make things worse.
 
Droid_Repairs said:
Before I say this, and inevitably get flamed - I want to first make it clear that I think Putin is a cnut, his pretext for war is bullshit and I hope he fails in every possible way. feck him and feck the invasion. I'm on Ukraine's side.

But I don't like narratives and how some people are unable to be objective. I saw a post on reddit about how somebody feels sorry for some of the Russian kids on the front lines and won't celebrate their deaths, some of them are just young lads in their teens who have been told by everybody around them that they're doing the right thing. The replies were predictable: "You're a traitor" "feck the invaders I hope they all die" "You're a nazi sympathiser". Sorry but feeling sorry for these kids doesn't mean I don't feel sorry for the people in Ukraine being killed and displaced.

Also, while practically everything that comes out of Russian news agencies is highly slanted propaganda, not everything that comes out of 'our side' is going to be completely truthful either. People post old images and videos of war on social media, showing awful destruction, and implying it's from 2022. If you dare point out that it's fake/old, you'll be flamed for being a Putin bot. This isn't right either. Pointing out fakes does not take away from the fact that Ukrainians really are suffering, but we don't need to make shit up - if anything being deceitful about these matters is insulting to the Ukrainians who are actually suffering.
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Very good post, mate. I think a lot of people, me included, are struggling with the terror and injustice of it all and overreact occasionally
 
Beans said:
Let's give them Ukranian citizenship, I'm sure the EU would be happy to help speed that up if there are any bureaucratic issues.

Putin's entire argument is based on BS, a propaganda narrative he's been pushing for years and years. What right to face Ukraine with no allies can he claim, especially when he's bringing in soldiers from other countries?

Russia hasn't been able to stop the flow of supplies into Ukraine, all they have are threats to use. If he could actually do anything, he'd be doing it to stop that. Even Turkey is thumbing their nose at him.

If the world doesn't help Ukraine, you're telling China and Russia they can take over and non-nuclear country in the world that's not in NATO. All off the back of a bluff. We did the cold war, no body wants to end the world by launching. If he's "crazy" enough to launch then it doesn't really matter what we do, but I think he's made a horrible mistake and threats of nukes are all he has left. To let him turn that into a win would be tragic.

How do you tell North Korea they don't need nukes to protect themselves from Russia, now?
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The same way you tell Iran that they don't need nukes to protect themselves from US
 
Droid_Repairs said:
Before I say this, and inevitably get flamed - I want to first make it clear that I think Putin is a cnut, his pretext for war is bullshit and I hope he fails in every possible way. feck him and feck the invasion. I'm on Ukraine's side.

But I don't like narratives and how some people are unable to be objective. I saw a post on reddit about how somebody feels sorry for some of the Russian kids on the front lines and won't celebrate their deaths, some of them are just young lads in their teens who have been told by everybody around them that they're doing the right thing. The replies were predictable: "You're a traitor" "feck the invaders I hope they all die" "You're a nazi sympathiser". Sorry but feeling sorry for these kids doesn't mean I don't feel sorry for the people in Ukraine being killed and displaced.

Also, while practically everything that comes out of Russian news agencies is highly slanted propaganda, not everything that comes out of 'our side' is going to be completely truthful either. People post old images and videos of war on social media, showing awful destruction, and implying it's from 2022. If you dare point out that it's fake/old, you'll be flamed for being a Putin bot. This isn't right either. Pointing out fakes does not take away from the fact that Ukrainians really are suffering, but we don't need to make shit up - if anything being deceitful about these matters is insulting to the Ukrainians who are actually suffering.
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I feel sorry for the Russian kids who are little more than involuntary pawns in Putin's murderous agenda. Many have been given food, tea, and smartphones by Ukrainians in towns they attempted to invade, so I doubt anyone will call these Ukrainians nazi sympathizers because they feel fed Russian teenagers.
 
BlueHaze said:
Why on earth are they fighting near nuclear power plants? Does Putin and Russia not realize any damage to that will have devastating effects on Russia as well?
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I was working in a nuclear power station in North Wales in 1986 when Chernobyl went into meltdown and it caused monitoring equipment to alarm in stations all over the UK. There was restrictions on farmland in the Welsh mountains for 26 years .
 
GDaly95 said:
This cannot be true.

It just can't be.
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It's been happening for a while anyway, as a form of punishment. Whether they take you, or they take a family member to punish you. And it's not necessarily to a war, it could be off to Siberia for you. Military service is mandatory, though not always enforced.

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2021/05/01/russias-pandemic-excess-death-toll-passes-460k-a73804

"In December 2019, police officers came to Ruslan Shaveddinov's Moscow apartment, sawed through the door and placed him in handcuffs before whisking him away for forced military service in the Arctic."
 
I just saw the remains of a bombing in Chernigov. The result is devastating. Apparently it is essential for access to Kiev and they are going to crush it
Pintu said:
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even if they are using him or teasing him in the negotiations, at least he is trying and showing iniciative.I wonder what Merkel would do
 
Mogget said:
There's people in here who think the same way. Yesterday one lovely individual was talking about rounding up Russians in foreign countries and putting them in camps.
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If you mean me, then that's not what I said at all.

Don't twist words to fit your agenda.
 
Red Dreams said:
The US and the West should never have enticed Ukraine about joining NATO.
It was directly threatening to Russia.

Non military benefits should not have been conditional on Ukraine joining NATO.
No one can justify Putin invading Ukraine.
But lets not pretend the West did not have a huge role in what is happening now.
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Ukraine did not join NATO though, and the West decided not to let it in. So what's your victim blaming excuse going to be now?
 
Droid_Repairs said:
Before I say this, and inevitably get flamed - I want to first make it clear that I think Putin is a cnut, his pretext for war is bullshit and I hope he fails in every possible way. feck him and feck the invasion. I'm on Ukraine's side.

But I don't like narratives and how some people are unable to be objective. I saw a post on reddit about how somebody feels sorry for some of the Russian kids on the front lines and won't celebrate their deaths, some of them are just young lads in their teens who have been told by everybody around them that they're doing the right thing. The replies were predictable: "You're a traitor" "feck the invaders I hope they all die" "You're a nazi sympathiser". Sorry but feeling sorry for these kids doesn't mean I don't feel sorry for the people in Ukraine being killed and displaced.

Also, while practically everything that comes out of Russian news agencies is highly slanted propaganda, not everything that comes out of 'our side' is going to be completely truthful either. People post old images and videos of war on social media, showing awful destruction, and implying it's from 2022. If you dare point out that it's fake/old, you'll be flamed for being a Putin bot. This isn't right either. Pointing out fakes does not take away from the fact that Ukrainians really are suffering, but we don't need to make shit up - if anything being deceitful about these matters is insulting to the Ukrainians who are actually suffering.
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I don't think this is controversial. Putin is sending in boys to fight and die for him. Kids who should be at school or university enjoying their lives.

And yes, Ukraine is using propaganda. Because I support them I don't mind it so much. Especially if it demoralises Russian troops into giving up and shortening the conflict. It is important to treat it cautiously like you said though.

carvajal said:
I just saw the remains of a bombing in Chernigov. The result is devastating. Apparently it is essential for access to Kiev and they are going to crush it

even if they are using him or teasing him in the negotiations, at least he is trying and showing iniciative.I wonder what Merkel would do
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Macron's standing has gone up in the polls since the war started. And the first round of the French Presidential elections is in five or so weeks. There could be a very cynical reason behind these moves.
 
An investigation has been launched into the death of a Ukrainian-born oligarch in Surrey earlier this week.

Officers were called to a property in Portnall Drive, Wentworth, at about midday on 28 February.

Mikhail Watford, aged in his 60s, was pronounced dead at the scene.

An investigation into the death is under way but Surrey Police said there were not believed to be any suspicious circumstances "at this time".

His next of kin have been told and are being supported by specially-trained officers.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-60608132
 
Frosty said:
I don't think this is controversial. Putin is sending in boys to fight and die for him. Kids who should be at school or university enjoying their lives.

And yes, Ukraine is using propaganda. Because I support them I don't mind it so much. Especially if it demoralises Russian troops into giving up and shortening the conflict. It is important to treat it cautiously like you said though.



Macron's standing has gone up in the polls since the war started. And the first round of the French Presidential elections is in five or so weeks. There could be a very cynical reason behind these moves.
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I'd like to give Macron the benefit of the doubt. When a major crisis happens, the president of that moment can't just do nothing and sit back.
 
Frosty said:
Macron's standing has gone up in the polls since the war started. And the first round of the French Presidential elections is in five or so weeks. There could be a very cynical reason behind these moves.
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It's only because he's facing a bunch of nobodies or politically inept candidates. If he was facing a popular former high-ranked cabinet member from either the Sarkozy or the Hollande administrations, Macron would be in serious trouble right now.
 
TheGame said:
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Given the sizable task of maintaing control of such a large place and so many people they are either going to have to win the hearts and minds or rule through fear and I think there really is only option left for them sadly

These humanitarian routes are as much about letting anti russians leave the east so that more of the remaining population are open to living under russian occupation
 
Frosty said:
Macron's standing has gone up in the polls since the war started. And the first round of the French Presidential elections is in five or so weeks. There could be a very cynical reason behind these moves.
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He has consistently been 7-8 points of percentage above the second candidate even before the war. He has to be the least worried about elections out of all current world leaders, especially since the Le Pen keeps losing lieutenants who are jumping to the Zemmour shop who is somehow nonetheless sinking.
 
Droid_Repairs said:
Before I say this, and inevitably get flamed - I want to first make it clear that I think Putin is a cnut, his pretext for war is bullshit and I hope he fails in every possible way. feck him and feck the invasion. I'm on Ukraine's side.

But I don't like narratives and how some people are unable to be objective. I saw a post on reddit about how somebody feels sorry for some of the Russian kids on the front lines and won't celebrate their deaths, some of them are just young lads in their teens who have been told by everybody around them that they're doing the right thing. The replies were predictable: "You're a traitor" "feck the invaders I hope they all die" "You're a nazi sympathiser". Sorry but feeling sorry for these kids doesn't mean I don't feel sorry for the people in Ukraine being killed and displaced.

Also, while practically everything that comes out of Russian news agencies is highly slanted propaganda, not everything that comes out of 'our side' is going to be completely truthful either. People post old images and videos of war on social media, showing awful destruction, and implying it's from 2022. If you dare point out that it's fake/old, you'll be flamed for being a Putin bot. This isn't right either. Pointing out fakes does not take away from the fact that Ukrainians really are suffering, but we don't need to make shit up - if anything being deceitful about these matters is insulting to the Ukrainians who are actually suffering.
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The Ukrainian Ambassador that read out the text of the Russian soldier to his mother really sunk me. These are young men sent to die for no cause and they didn't even know it. They have to die because it's either them or the ones they are sent to kill . This is all the fault of one man .


I myself have conflicting views on let's say bombing the convoy because in one instance these convoys are being sent to kill people defending their home. In the other instance these are largely made up of 20 year olds that never wanted to be in the army in the first place , in the middle of nowhere probably not even knowing they are being sent to destroy a city. It's complicated and it sucks.
 
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