Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion

Erdogan also belong in that group, though he is taking a more pro-Ukraine stance, also, Turkey is really important to NATO, for a number or reasons.

What does Orban and Hungary even offer to NATO and/or EU? Not only do they not lack any of the numerous benefits that Turkey has, they just outright support Russia these days.

Kick them out of both NATO and EU, i'd say, they clearly identify more with Russia than with Europe anyway.
A lot of the sex trafficking may be going thru Hungary given the presence of a lot of the pornography industry there. Just saying.
 
The UN Security Council adopted a US resolution on Ukraine Monday that was supported by Russia and contained no criticism of Moscow's aggression on the third anniversary of its invasion.
There were 10 votes in favor and none against, but five abstentions including France and Britain which could have vetoed the resolution that merely "implores a swift end to the conflict" without blaming Russia.
https://www.barrons.com/news/us-ukr...ssian-support-at-un-security-council-d7b47dec
 
Trump is more shamelessly open about it but it’s not much different than the UK plan -


Britain’s main economic aid project in Ukraine runs from 2022-25 and is called the Good Governance Fund. One of its aims is to ensure that “Ukraine adopts and implements economic reforms that create a more inclusive economy, enhancing trade opportunities with the UK”.

A recent project update from the Foreign Office is explicit about the goals. It states these should see “the invasion not only as a crisis, but also as an opportunity”.

It notes: “Ironically, despite the horrific circumstances in which interventions are being delivered, the operating context has provided a unique opportunity to really demonstrate to the GoU [government of Ukraine] and the Ukrainian population the importance and effectiveness of targeted technical assistance interventions designed to deliver reforms that generate tangible benefits”.

These reforms are also variously described in the UK project documents as “better integration with Euro-Atlantic markets” and “aligning it [Ukraine] more closely with Western markets”

https://www.declassifieduk.org/uk-sees-privatisation-opportunities-in-ukraine-war/

Thanks folks, that's interesting. And a little disheartening, but I can see I was being very naive.

I don't think you're being naive in this instance, what Trump has been pushing for is extremely grotesque and not comparable to the UK deal the above poster is citing there at all. That's a ridiculous claim.

The 'Good Governance Fund Ukraine' is an aid deal established pre-brexit in 2015 to help with Ukraine's (and other applicants) accession to the EU, which is literally written in Ukraine's constitution. It provides technical assistance to remove the barriers to its EU application such as tackling its remaining corruption problems, improving accountability and public confidence, expanding the public sector to allow foreign investment (crucial to its post-war economy and rebuilding efforts). The whole project was revised and expanded when the all-out war began so when it talks about 'opportunities' its not talking about for the UK, its talking about opportunities to highlight how already implemented reforms are aiding them now and further implement economic/judicial reforms to eliminate corruption and help Ukraine towards its own committed goals of "aligning more closely with Western markets".

Of course the UK economically benefits long term when Ukraine is stable and mutually beneficial trade agreements can be reached, and that is one of the listed goals. That is light-years away from what Trump is proposing though. Unfortunately when it comes to geo-politics, you can't take anything at face value until you find a trusted source, you have to dig into the details yourself. Which I just can't help myself doing sometimes unfortunately when I see some shitty claim on t'internet!
https://devtracker.fcdo.gov.uk/programme/GB-GOV-1-301455/documents

Describe where the programme is on/off track to contribute to the expected outcomes and impact. What action is planned in the year ahead?

As noted above, following the ToC review process in the summer of 2022, GGF now has the following impact statement:
An open and resilient and democratic Ukraine with stronger rule of law, more effective, transparent, and accountable institutions, and an economy that is competitive and inclusive.

This objective is supported by three outcomes:
  • Judicial reform embeds rule of law; selected state institutions are more effective, transparent, and accountable, reducing corruption and increasing ability to deliver reconstruction and services effectively.
  • Ukraine adopts and implements economic reforms that create a more inclusive economy, enhancing trade opportunities with the UK.
  • Citizens and civil society, including those currently disadvantaged, are better able to engage in politics, hold government to account, and access economic opportunities, including reconstruction.

Also, we can't trust any reporting on a US/Ukraine deal until if/when it is done. Zelensky has made it very clear he is not signing anything detrimental to Ukraine and Bloomberg is trusting the white house as a source, which is akin to trusting the Kremlin right now.
 


From a purely political scientific and military strategic perspective it's hard to argue with everything he is laying out there. Even as someone who considers himself left of center and has no love lost for McConnell - it aligns very closely with the way I perceive this situation.

The f*ckwad and every other Republican still voted against continuing support for Ukraine the other day though. McConnell and a few other Republican senators have been saying all the right things in public and doing the exact opposite when it matters. They've seen how unpopular dropping support for Ukraine is with their own voters so are playing the game. They know most of them won't even know a vote took place in the senate last week. Not a damn thing these feckers say can be trusted.

https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1191/vote_119_1_00076.htm
 
The f*ckwad and every other Republican still voted against continuing support for Ukraine the other day though. McConnell and a few other Republican senators have been saying all the right things in public and doing the exact opposite when it matters. They've seen how unpopular dropping support for Ukraine is with their own voters so are playing the game. They know most of them won't even know a vote took place in the senate last week. Not a damn thing these feckers say can be trusted.

https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1191/vote_119_1_00076.htm

Huh? I get the rest of your post, but in terms of Ukraine? The voters don't give a shit, this is Mitch just being cold-war, old-style politician.

Yes, i'm sure polling says even majority of republicans kinda doesn't like Russia, but in terms of priorities, it doesn't break top 10 of their issues, may not break top 20.

US electorate barely cares about domestic issues, they for sure won't about foreign conflicts, unless it costs a significant of american lives, last time that happened was Vietnam.
 
Huh? I get the rest of your post, but in terms of Ukraine? The voters don't give a shit, this is Mitch just being cold-war, old-style politician.

Yes, i'm sure polling says even majority of republicans kinda doesn't like Russia, but in terms of priorities, it doesn't break top 10 of their issues, may not break top 20.

US electorate barely cares about domestic issues, they for sure won't about foreign conflicts, unless it costs a significant of american lives, last time that happened was Vietnam.

You're probably right, I just saw one gop guy get screamed at when defending Trump's Ukraine policies at one of their 'townhalls', have also seen it cited as a reason in some of the social media posts that get spread around of Trump voters now turning on him, from a certain demographic maybe.
 
This account has been posting a lot of footage from day 1 of the war today.

One of the more surreal ones... "it only emerged during conversation they were all Russians" :lol:

 
"The pilot from this recording, Viacheslav Radionov, unfortunately died a few minutes after the film was made. He was the first Ukrainian pilot to take off to defend Ukraine, thanks to the fact that he engaged in combat with Russian aircraft, he allowed other pilots, from the 40th brigade, to take off safely".