Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach

[hellhunter]

People are not willing to have a rational discussion though, people just want to complain because they aren't seeing the team have instant improvement.

Or any at all, for that matter

 

[Swedish_Plumber]

Why should we be patient? Seemingly every other new manager seems to be getting a tune out of their players in relatively shorter time than us without spending nearly as much money as we do. Its always Manchester United managers that need £200m per summer and a full squad of their own handpicked players to look half decent. I'm sick of it.

Not asking him to have us contending for top 4 immediately but don't make us look like relegation battlers and do the basic things right. These players, as limited as they are, are for sure better than a relegation threatened team.

You say you’re sick of it. Are you wanting another manager yet again in the hope that doing the same thing again might just do it this time? If so, who?

Things take time. Especially when we’ve blown a criminal amount of money on utter shite. Anybody claiming another manager could come in and make a difference instantly and make that last hasn’t been paying attention the last 12 years.

We can do things differently this time and not sack the manager, especially after 4 bloody months and no pre season. Hopefully with new men upstairs it can turn out differently.

 

[Doracle]

The team has won 6 of the last 8 games, sometimes you can't have everything all at once in regards to wins and good performances unfortunately.

Our last 11 league matches consist of 3 wins, 1 draw and 7 losses, 10 points at an average of less than a point a game - or borderline relegation form over a season. Let’s not pretend we are in good form just because we’ve managed to pick up a few wins against weak European teams.

And, yes, good performances do tend to lead to better results over time.

 

[roseguy64]

I do hope we take some of our most promising youth players on tour and if they do well show some faith in them. Might be the answer to some of our issues is right under our noses.

Promising youth players are always taken on tour

 

[DJ_21]

Promising youth players are always taken on tour

Don’t get why obi hasn’t been given a chance yet in the first team. Can’t be any worse than our current ST

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Promising youth players are always taken on tour

They do, I know that, more bothered that we actually manage to develop a few more of them. If they are thinking of using them as a source of transfer funds in the future.

 

[Ayoba]

People are not willing to have a rational discussion though, people just want to complain because they aren't seeing the team have instant improvement.

People are rightly complaining because there has been minimal improvement, you could argue we're going backwards. We've lost so many home games, we struggled against relegation sides like soton and Leicester. People are right to complain and ask questions.

 

[Fahad Jawaid]

I am underwhelmed by Amorim tbh, i figured that we would have a tough time initially and will lose a few matches, due to new change in system and adoptability. However, i was hoping this season will be all about seeing major improvements in play (in terms of chances creation, exciting play) and the cohesiveness will be there, plus our pressing to be improved etc.

I remember when Klopp joined pool, they were losing matches in between but they become very good to watch, plus their pressing levels improved overnight and it was an obvious improvement to anybody who had watched them earlier.

Similarly with Pep at City, i think in the first season he got only 4th place, but the passing patters and playing out from the back everything was there, but due to lack of players suitability from playing at the back alongside goal keeper they had some horror shows, but you could see what he was trying.

With us except our form in top away games, their seems to be no major improvement from Ten Hag era, people may say our possession stats have improved but that's because 80% of the ball in circulated between CBs and Wingbacks, his system reminds me of the worst days of LVG (death by possession).

In fact i would say in Ten Hag time we had:

1) Better Home Form
2) Better to watch in terms of creating chances, less boring etc.
3) Better league position

I am also getting this feeling that with time, our performances are further deteriorating in the last few weeks the performances vs Southampton, Fulham, Palace and Leicester were all shocking (i know we won 3 of them). I know a lot of people will blame the players etc, but from the squad Ten Hag had last season we have only strengthened it with 6 additions (5 summer and 1 winter). I am skeptical whether he is the right choice and whether we should allow him to spend another 150M in the summer choosing his players (which may become redundant for other manager) and this cycle continues.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

People are not willing to have a rational discussion though, people just want to complain because they aren't seeing the team have instant improvement.

It’s rational to ask why the manager can’t seem to get any tune out whatsoever out of his players, a group that are much better than the form in the last 14 PL games.

I don’t know why you wouldn’t question it? The run of results with this squad is completely unacceptable.

 

[roseguy64]

You have to give him a pre season at least. He's averaged a game every 4 days so far. You can't do any training with that kind of schedule.

This is the precise reason why he shouldn't have come mid season, some of our fans won't provide him the luxury of getting to the Summer before they decide he's not good enough. It was a stupid recruitment choice, should have just gone with an Interim.

We don't have to give him a preseason. Emery and Ole didn't get one and they got results quickly. Potter didn't get one and he didn't deserve to last long enough to get one at Chelsea. You have to show you deserve to be backed.

 

[The holy trinity 68]

Or any at all, for that matter

If you can't see improvement then you should stop watching football. The team are shipping far less goals than before Amorim and conceding a lot less goals.

 

[Brightonian]

Don’t get why obi hasn’t been given a chance yet in the first team. Can’t be any worse than our current ST

Then you’re not watching him. He’s a long way from being ready. He looked out of his depth at U21 level recently. And if you think our forwards are wasteful, some of the chances he is missing would have him crucified by this forum at senior level.

None of this is a criticism of him at the level he’s actually at. He bangs in goals and his skills are steadily improving to catch up with his early physical advantages. But everyone seems to underestimate the huge gulf between U18 and senior level because of their understandable frustration with our senior performances.

 

[The holy trinity 68]

Do you think Amorim is currently doing a good job?

Yes I do.

He got rid of Rashford, Antony and Malacia.

We beat Man City and Arsenal and drew Liverpool.

We finished 3rd in the EL table, while being the only unbeaten team in the tournament.

We beat 2 PL teams in the FA Cup, while City, Newcastle, Liverpool etc have only played lower league teams.

The team is conceding less chances and less goals than the previous manager and we have won 6 of the last 8 games.

This is all while moving to an unfamiliar formation and trying to implement his own tactics, while having to play 2 games a week. A big percentage of the team are inexperienced and under 21, then the team has lazy or old players such as Rashford, Casemiro, Eriksen and Evans were/are basically useless.

I genuinely think he is doing a good job and people are just being impatient and petulant.

 

[The holy trinity 68]

People are rightly complaining because there has been minimal improvement, you could argue we're going backwards. We've lost so many home games, we struggled against relegation sides like soton and Leicester. People are right to complain and ask questions.

It’s rational to ask why the manager can’t seem to get any tune out whatsoever out of his players, a group that are much better than the form in the last 14 PL games.

I don’t know why you wouldn’t question it? The run of results with this squad is completely unacceptable.

Why are you so fixated on the PL results only? The team were never going to qualify for the European places anyway so the league position doesn't even matter much, and are conceding less chances in the league, its just unfortunate that results haven't gone our way.

The main improvement is the team are less wide open and the opponents are creating less opportunites, is that not an improvement? Just because other areas have not improved, doesn't mean that is not an improvement?

Pointless ignoring the EL and FA Cup results and only focusing on the PL, especially when this season the EL and FA Cup results are more important.

 

[roseguy64]

Don’t get why obi hasn’t been given a chance yet in the first team. Can’t be any worse than our current ST

Playing against boys is different than fully grown men. Sometimes a player simply isn't ready yet. We promoted about 10 youth players for LVG and only Rashford made it. Some of those players might have been better served not playing PL football at the time and could have been better players if they'd been loaned out.

 

[roseguy64]

Why are you so fixated on the PL results only? The team were never going to qualify for the European places anyway so the league position doesn't even matter much, and are conceding less chances in the league, its just unfortunate that results haven't gone our way.

The main improvement is the team are less wide open and the opponents are creating less opportunites, is that not an improvement? Just because other areas have not improved, doesn't mean that is not an improvement?

Pointless ignoring the EL and FA Cup results and only focusing on the PL, especially when this season the EL and FA Cup results are more important.

It's not about the results in the league really. We don't look good unless we're forced to counterattack or playing opposition below PL level.

 

[RedSky]

We don't have to give him a preseason. Emery and Ole didn't get one and they got results quickly. Potter didn't get one and he didn't deserve to last long enough to get one at Chelsea. You have to show you deserve to be backed.

The situations are different though. Ole took over from Jose, the squad was a bit rubbish but the first eleven was genuinely pretty good. We had plenty of goals in that team. We have very few goals in this team.

Chelsea also spent a fortune in the January window during Potters time there. We've actually made the squad weaker this January (although personally I think the decisions were correct).

I don't think people really understand how terrible we really are and how far we have regressed as a club. What we're trying to do with Amorim is something different, we're actually going through short term pain to attempt to establish a new identity and transform the club. If we get cold feet on that and sack him then we deserve everything we get.

 

[Cathy Ferguson]

The situations are different though. Ole took over from Jose, the squad was a bit rubbish but the first eleven was genuinely pretty good. We had plenty of goals in that team. We have very few goals in this team.

Chelsea also spent a fortune in the January window during Potters time there. We've actually made the squad weaker this January (although personally I think the decisions were correct).

I don't think people really understand how terrible we really are and how far we have regressed as a club. What we're trying to do with Amorim is something different, we're actually going through short term pain to attempt to establish a new identity and transform the club. If we get cold feet on that and sack him then we deserve everything we get.

Why do we have to change system to establish a new identity? Few top clubs play 343 and Amorim has no trophies outside Portugal which has a minor league.

 

[Joseunited]

Yes I do.

He got rid of Rashford, Antony and Malacia.

We beat Man City and Arsenal and drew Liverpool.

We finished 3rd in the EL table, while being the only unbeaten team in the tournament.

We beat 2 PL teams in the FA Cup, while City, Newcastle, Liverpool etc have only played lower league teams.

The team is conceding less chances and less goals than the previous manager and we have won 6 of the last 8 games.

This is all while moving to an unfamiliar formation and trying to implement his own tactics, while having to play 2 games a week. A big percentage of the team are inexperienced and under 21, then the team has lazy or old players such as Rashford, Casemiro, Eriksen and Evans were/are basically useless.

I genuinely think he is doing a good job and people are just being impatient and petulant.

I'm more than happy with Amorim, it's going to be a painful process but he'll get it right.
He has a specific system and at the moment not very many players that can implement it.
Nobody has any patience, it's either win or get the sack.

 

[baskinginthesun]

Yeah you might be right - my memory of it is mostly just him more or less saying, 'ok boys, get out there, smile, and play with freedom'. I suppose that was an implementation of ideas in a sense, but it hardly seemed like a system implementation, particularly when the the following years with Ole rarely included such a free-flowing, buccaneering style (to be fair, he did manage to make us hard to beat for a while.)

I think the difference was Ole came in and provided simple instructions to get them out of a bad run of results. I think most mangers who come in mid season keep it simple to get to the summer.

It maybe a case that Amorim has come in and is going in full board with his ideas and it's not making a difference. The players are looking at the fixture list as much as him and going "how the hell are we supposed to that right now." System change is fine. But, what we do within it should be the simple stuff.

At least at home, we should be fun to watch. But, it's a chore and it's hard to find positives when we're not winning and looking like getting best every weekend.

 

[jem]

I think the difference was Ole came in and provided simple instructions to get them out of a bad run of results. I think most mangers who come in mid season keep it simple to get to the summer.

It maybe a case that Amorim has come in and is going in full board with his ideas and it's not making a difference. The players are looking at the fixture list as much as him and going "how the hell are we supposed to that right now." System change is fine. But, what we do within it should be the simple stuff.

At least at home, we should be fun to watch. But, it's a chore and it's hard to find positives when we're not winning and looking like getting best every weekend.

The problem was that it was a bandaid solution that did nothing to solve the underlying and simmering problems (Pogba's smirk on the day Jose was fired says it all.) I still remember feeling pretty annoyed seeing Rashford and Lingard releasing moronic social media content mere days after we wrapped up that season in the most inept and woeful manner possible. I give Amorim huge credit for at least trying to dismantle some of the systemic issues that have plagued us for years (player power being the main one.)

 

[VP89]

The problem was that it was a bandaid solution that did nothing to solve the underlying and simmering problems (Pogba's smirk on the day Jose was fired says it all.) I still remember feeling pretty annoyed seeing Rashford and Lingard releasing moronic social media content mere days after we wrapped up that season in the most inept and woeful manner possible. I give Amorim huge credit for at least trying to dismantle some of the systemic issues that have plagued us for years (player power being the main one.)

Yeah the culture shift is important irrespective of style of play and results. He's at least doing an assertive job in this sense and when speaking about his players I dont think hes put a foot wrong.

 

[Stig]

I was at the game tonight, and I was looking at our formation, and it is all wrong. Out of possession, he insists that everybody gets back, so at various points in the game, we had a flat back 5, and there was only 1 Leicester player in our half. So our midfield and forwards are completely overrun, because it is 9 against 5. So they were just playing it around us, and we couldn't get the ball back. And when we did get the ball, we had no options, because everyone was double marked.

I'm not a coach, or a specialist tactician, but if half of your team is the wrong side of the half way line, you aint gonna cause the opposition any problems. You'll probably be lucky to get a shot on goal, if you can even get the ball back.

We've got too many players in our own half. Which is why our build up play is so slow, there are no options to play it forward. Everyone is dropping back to receive the ball, but when they take it on the half turn, there are no options to play it forward.

We make rubbish teams look good, because we are making it so easy for them.

In the game I think I was at least 3 occasions when I think we literally waited for one of the back three who was ahead of the ball to get back into position, and the line to straighten up before we then passed the ball sideways or backwards. It really looked as if they had been told no forward passes untill or back 3 or 5 are all in their correct positions.

Did anyone else see this or am I making it up ?

 

[Stig]

Or any at all, for that matter

There can't be anyone on this forum who doesn't want Amorim to succeed, but what I find massively frustrating is that he seems to be making contrarian decisions for the sake of it to either prove that he's the boss, or a genius or I don't know what. He's making some decisions as to how to play or who plays where that 90+ % of the posts on here don't agree with, as the experts on the telly and radio don't seem to agree with either - which makes me and others question his decision making / ego / rationality even.

 

[Tarrou]

I think he deserves a good summer and backing into next season

if we don't back a guy like this and give him a bit of time we're making a mistake

 

[RedRocket9908]

People are not willing to have a rational discussion though, people just want to complain because they aren't seeing the team have instant improvement.

We havent really seen any improvement, we have gone backwards from a team that before he came in was beating Leicester at home easilly (5-2 and 3-0) to a team that is now getting outplayed for a lot of the game at home to Leicester and needing a late offside goal to beat them.

People seem to think he is going to lead this full squad rebuild in the summer but the truth is the club cant afford a full squad rebuild and will likely struggle to just sign the players needed to at least get his tactics to work so he needs to start showing he can work with what he has got or next season will probably be starting the same way this one is ending.

 

[VP89]

The situations are different though. Ole took over from Jose, the squad was a bit rubbish but the first eleven was genuinely pretty good. We had plenty of goals in that team. We have very few goals in this team.

Chelsea also spent a fortune in the January window during Potters time there. We've actually made the squad weaker this January (although personally I think the decisions were correct).

I don't think people really understand how terrible we really are and how far we have regressed as a club. What we're trying to do with Amorim is something different, we're actually going through short term pain to attempt to establish a new identity and transform the club. If we get cold feet on that and sack him then we deserve everything we get.

At the same time though, we have more quality in our team that plays week in week out to not scrape against dross sides and average a point a game.

 

[baskinginthesun]

The problem was that it was a bandaid solution that did nothing to solve the underlying and simmering problems (Pogba's smirk on the day Jose was fired says it all.) I still remember feeling pretty annoyed seeing Rashford and Lingard releasing moronic social media content mere days after we wrapped up that season in the most inept and woeful manner possible. I give Amorim huge credit for at least trying to dismantle some of the systemic issues that have plagued us for years (player power being the main one.)

Fair point. I honestly don't remember the social media stuff. If he's trying to dismantle player power then I'm all for it. But, surely he can get the rest of the squad playing better than this at the same time?

 

[Iker Quesadillas]

If you can't see improvement then you should stop watching football. The team are shipping far less goals than before Amorim and conceding a lot less goals.

United have conceded 22 goals in 13 league matches under Amorim. That's 1.69 GA/90. Under Ten Hag they had conceded 11 in 9 league matches, which is 1.22 GA/90, and last season they conceded 58 goals in 38 matches which is 1.52 GA/90.

 

[JPRouve]

United have conceded 22 goals in 13 league matches under Amorim. That's 1.69 GA/90. Under Ten Hag they had conceded 11 in 9 league matches, which is 1.22 GA/90, and last season they conceded 58 goals in 38 matches which is 1.52 GA/90.

Stop being irrational.

 

[hellhunter]

United have conceded 22 goals in 13 league matches under Amorim. That's 1.69 GA/90. Under Ten Hag they had conceded 11 in 9 league matches, which is 1.22 GA/90, and last season they conceded 58 goals in 38 matches which is 1.52 GA/90.

Thank you. We looked a bit more solid early into Amorim's reign, but not so much recently

 

[Woziak]

I think the most worrying part is, we got 14 games to go, and only 3 look winnable. I think we've done enough points to be safe but we might be looking at finishing between 13-16. That's a new low and I know Amorim is not responsible for the mess that got us here but that finish will be on his record.

Well if we do finish 15th-16th, he would have managed 27 PL games so yes that would be on him!

I’m going to try and be balanced;

1. Has Amorim damaged the market value of any of our players?
2. Did he say that this is the worst Man United team in History?
3. Did he say that ETH and RVN could get more out of these players?
4. Did he damage the football confidence of young players like Garnaucho, K Mainoo, Zirkzee and Hojlund.
5. Does Ruben Amorim continue to show nepotism and pick Dalot and Bruno in their wrong positions just to get them in his side.
6. Does Amorim really think that inverted 10’s and inverted wingbacks doesn’t narrow the pitch and allow the opposition easy ways to attack down the wide areas even though United’s wing backs are so deep we are playing 5 at the back at old Trafford.
7. What young players from our youth teams has he promoted bar “Goodwill”, apparently he was the only one he thought was up to standard even though the under 21’s are 3rd in PL2 and the under 18’s have lost only two games this season and have an excellent chance of retaining the U18 PL.
8. What formation does our youth teams play, I’ll answer 4231 or 433 still and he’s been here 3 months. Imagine what the youth players think when they read on social media that the Man United Coach thinks they are all not up to standard!
9. Ruben is perhaps the most honest coach in modern football however sometimes you can be too honest and he needs to reign it in a little, he can’t get rid of 25 players in the summer as much he might want to, at best he’ll lose 15 of this current squad, providing he finishes his contract in summer 2028!
10. I love Amorim charming personality but less is more and we thought we were getting his swashbuckling 3421 system which allows players to freely interchange in positions, instead we are getting a 5221 system with inverted wing backs and inverted number 10’s who keep playing awful at home.
Ruben say less produce more football please, these players are nowhere near as bad as you’ve told them or made them!
Only 9 months ago they won an FA CUP which in true football currency is worth more than a Portuguese league when you beat City and Liverpool along the way.

 

[Guv77]

United have conceded 22 goals in 13 league matches under Amorim. That's 1.69 GA/90. Under Ten Hag they had conceded 11 in 9 league matches, which is 1.22 GA/90, and last season they conceded 58 goals in 38 matches which is 1.52 GA/90.

Ouch!

 

[Gavinb33]

Why are you so fixated on the PL results only? The team were never going to qualify for the European places anyway so the league position doesn't even matter much, and are conceding less chances in the league, its just unfortunate that results haven't gone our way.

The main improvement is the team are less wide open and the opponents are creating less opportunites, is that not an improvement? Just because other areas have not improved, doesn't mean that is not an improvement?

Pointless ignoring the EL and FA Cup results and only focusing on the PL, especially when this season the EL and FA Cup results are more important.

We've conceded 2 to palace and 3 to Brighton in the last 2 home PL matches I mean we are conceding less chances but we are conceding lost of goals, not to mention the games prior 3 to forest and Bournemouth, 2 to Wolves and Newcastle we are not wide open but we are also not secure at all either

 

[JediSith]

What happened to “judge a manager after 3 transfer windows” absolutely appalled by pundits ex United players. If they were at least consistent I wouldn’t mind. But considering how much they backed their mate Ole. I can’t take them seriously.

 

[JPRouve]

What happened to “judge a manager after 3 transfer windows” absolutely appalled by pundits ex United players. If they were at least consistent I wouldn’t mind. But considering how much they backed their mate Ole. I can’t take them seriously.

It's never really been a thing and shouldn't.

 

[StuCol]

I'm more than happy with Amorim, it's going to be a painful process but he'll get it right.
He has a specific system and at the moment not very many players that can implement it.
Nobody has any patience, it's either win or get the sack.

We talk about Hoijlund not being good enough. But he’s not getting chances. That’s because of an insistence on playing ‘inverted’ wing backs and wingers.

Basic human physiology dictates that it’s a thousand times more difficult for a left footed player, playing on the right, to whip a cross in. He has to turn back, which takes time, slows play and increases the chances of getting the ball taken off them.

The team has been screaming out for an attacking left back / wing back since Shaws injury. So, we buy one. And the manager, nobody else, chooses to play him on the right.

Dalot is decent on the right. He is absolutely terrible on the left. Terrible.

The decision is 1. Utterly incomprehensible and 2. 100% on the manager.

I want him to be a success. I really do. Decisions like that make it incredibly difficult to trust him though.

 

[Bright_Eyes]

People are not willing to have a rational discussion though, people just want to complain because they aren't seeing the team have instant improvement.

You don't like it when people complain? Tell me more

 

[nickm]

Why do we have to change system to establish a new identity? Few top clubs play 343 and Amorim has no trophies outside Portugal which has a minor league.

We hired him knowing this was the deal. So we have an obligation. Judging him before we give him the tools would be wrong - and our finances are so bad we can't even do that yet. So let's just get this season out of the way before we go burning another manager.

 

[Pscholes18]

Why do we have to change system to establish a new identity? Few top clubs play 343 and Amorim has no trophies outside Portugal which has a minor league.

Yes because, Jose's, Ole's and ETH's system worked so well. Trophies galore.