As others have said, he's right but I suspect he's doing as he's asked a we would be completely toothless if he wasn't trying things. Even now we get a fraction of output from him compared to what he's capable of, but him being moved all over the pitch probably doesn't help.
Roy Keane
- Thread starter MyOnlySolskjaer
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I would be interested to see how Bruno plays when he has others around him that can play possession based football.
Watch Portugal. He's more reserved with the ball.
Typical rent-a-quote Roy. Goes after whoever his target his without any balance. Did it to Hojlund at before the game on the weekend then had dial it back at halftime.
I mean, have you ever watched a Portugal game? He's exactly the same, maybe worse. Playing alongside the likes of Dias, Neves, Jota, Ronaldo, Silva, Joa Felix, cancelo etc. All incredibly technical players.
He doesn't suddenly become world class when surrounded by better players.
Yes I’ve watched loads of Portugal the last few years and Bruno is easily one of their best players. He’s been better than players like Bernardo Silva for example for Portugal. Massively underrated by Utd fans but I get it because we are horrific and no players can really shine in this cluster feck of a team.
I don't know what you guys are talking about.
Keano is my hero of Greek myth level.
Keano is my hero of Greek myth level.
I said it before we signed him having watched him at Sporting. He was an okay stop gap to get away from Lingard and Pereira as our 10s, but his carelessness in possession alongside being easy to press would always prevent us from being a team that could play top level dominating football.
Problem is, we turned him into the face of the club.
Problem is, we turned him into the face of the club.
There, finally Keane speaking the unspoken about Bruno (in public manner).
Bruno is our best player, but he's absolutely the main problem and we somehow made him captain.
Thing is, Bruno is able to do the basics well especially when asked to. I recall the game Carrick dropped him as caretaker in the CL and he came on when were behind (against Atalanta?) in the last 20mins and tore it up playing simple and effective football.
He's just prone to playing like a nutter when the pressure's really high (against big clubs or when paired with the likes of McT).
He's just prone to playing like a nutter when the pressure's really high (against big clubs or when paired with the likes of McT).
I do think we should consider moving Bruno on, providing we get a good offer, but ETH does obviously take some of the blame in how he utilises him and how he's given him carte blanche to do anything.
Anyway, ETH won't be here next year.
Anyway, ETH won't be here next year.
I kind of feel like Bruno is a 'luxury' player and you can't really afford them in modern football at the top.
Roy Keane
Tbh, I don't think a luxury player would make it at a major top club ( competing for the big trophies ) during any period.
Coutinho, Veron, Stefano Fiore instantly spring to mind.
Tbf to both of us Coutinho, Mata and Rodriguez all won trophies for their respective clubs (Madrid, Barca, Chelsea etc. at the time) but I think PL football and the turn of the decade has stepped up to a level of intensity where you need that '10' to do a bit more unless you're playing Ange-ball with a squad full of runners/elite athletes at prime fitness levels.
On the ball I would agree. But him running around all over the place off the ball? I can't imagine that is really what he is asked to do. It rarely really helps and sometimes even makes things worse by giving away stupid free kicks (prime example Galatasaray, who scored twice after Bruno committing a foul in an area where I would not expect an AM to be in).
I don't think he is underrated. He doesn't seem to half the right state of mind under pressure when asked to lead a team. That's a skill and talent in itself (and it fits that we have this point in a Keane thread who was excellent in this regard). For Portugal he can mostly focus on playing a clear role and contributing what he can do. Though I agree that this is also caused by United's dysfunctional team, he would look better (and would be rated higher) if he wasn't made the main man of the team.
It's absurd to talk about Bruno leaving the midfield wide open without mentioning McTominay who is the main cause of our woes in this area.
With two other fully functioning midfielders, Bruno is able to play a freer role (which is where he thrives and where the team gets the most out of him) the problem is we either don't have those players available or our manager thinks it's a class idea to play two midfielders with no positional discipline whatsoever.
To blame just Bruno for this seems daft, and I think Keano knows this deep down, but for whatever reason Bruno is the player everyone loves to hate.
He's absolutely spot on about the discipline aspect though, and keeping a cool head. This is a big problem for the team when our captain behaves like this. Yes show fighting spirit, chase the ball down, go in hard on a tackle or whatever to rally the team and the fans but not at the expense of leaving us wide open and vulnerable constantly. Oh also, he needs to learn to fecking calm the game down or grind out a win (or even a draw) once in a while rather than constantly going gung ho.
The Pogba comparison is apt, very different players and personalities but immense talents that we should have gotten more out of by building the team around them instead of accentuating their weaknesses.
With two other fully functioning midfielders, Bruno is able to play a freer role (which is where he thrives and where the team gets the most out of him) the problem is we either don't have those players available or our manager thinks it's a class idea to play two midfielders with no positional discipline whatsoever.
To blame just Bruno for this seems daft, and I think Keano knows this deep down, but for whatever reason Bruno is the player everyone loves to hate.
He's absolutely spot on about the discipline aspect though, and keeping a cool head. This is a big problem for the team when our captain behaves like this. Yes show fighting spirit, chase the ball down, go in hard on a tackle or whatever to rally the team and the fans but not at the expense of leaving us wide open and vulnerable constantly. Oh also, he needs to learn to fecking calm the game down or grind out a win (or even a draw) once in a while rather than constantly going gung ho.
The Pogba comparison is apt, very different players and personalities but immense talents that we should have gotten more out of by building the team around them instead of accentuating their weaknesses.
Keane is right about Bruno, but I don't know how they had that discussion without also mentioning Rashford.
He is not a luxury player, he is a hard working player fit for a team on the fringes. He'd be excellent for a 6th to 8th placed team as he can create chances but he doesn't have finesse on the ball that you require from a number 10 at a team looking to win big trophies. He is not press-resistant, can't dribble and constantly plays low percentage balls. There is nothing luxury about that.
I think that was exactly our assessment for him too when we looked at him the window before we singed him. Then for some reason we went back in again in January and got him for a fee higher than he was available for in the summer in typical Manchester United fashion.
He's the elephant in the room.
He's spot on. But Ten Hag is emphasising it with the ridiculous system that we play.
You could get away with Bruno hero ball if we had a solid midfield base in a 4-2-3-1 instead of this crazy 4-1-5 formation.
You could get away with Bruno hero ball if we had a solid midfield base in a 4-2-3-1 instead of this crazy 4-1-5 formation.
I think his 'hard work' is a detriment though which is weird to say as it's not entirely his fault but more a fault of the squad you have assembled. You want a player like Bruno just floating in that final third and playing those high risk strategy plays with the security and energy behind and around him to ensure that you can cover for it and take advantage of it but you don't so it's more often than not either a detriment to have him there or he will pop up with a moment of brilliance which overshadows sub-par performances. It weirdly becomes a viscous cycle of player carrying club and vice versa.
Agreed. If we had a solid and structured base in midfield it would be less of a worry. There's many issues in midfield, Bruno being a bit of a lunatic is just one of them.
Right or wrong, it's down to the manager. If he's allowing him to be chaotic, that's on him. If he's not allowing him to be chaotic and he's still doing it, that's on him. He made him captain and picks him for every match.
He's still, by a mile, our best player and the fact he's running into the spaces Scott McTominay is playing in, and that Kobbie Mainoo is left to shield the defence by himself are bigger problems.
He's still, by a mile, our best player and the fact he's running into the spaces Scott McTominay is playing in, and that Kobbie Mainoo is left to shield the defence by himself are bigger problems.
Agreed, I've been a critic of Bruno's performances for a good cpuple of years at this point, but EtH is actively setting him up to harm the team
Is he though? I am never sure what is being asked of Bruno, except to run around, often chasing lost causes e.g. pressing on his own! I'd love to know what pre-match instructions ETH gives Bruno, is there a general or standing brief such as to "do what you can, when you can, look up field for the movement in front and react; looking back, try to see/anticipate where the gaps are and get yourself back there. Specific briefs such as "take all the free kicks in the final third, unless occurring between the posts then let Rashford have a go, all the corners, unless Shaw is on the field. Approach the refs in the Ashley Young way, i.e. drop little messages in their ear, don't front them up, or scream at them."
How much faith does ETH have in Bruno to 'pick the right moment' or to whisper in the ear of players who are not performing. I suppose we will never know... don't even think ETH or Bruno know either!
I'm pretty confident if Bruno was reigned in by a manager/given specific instructions he would follow them pretty well. His current approach to the game is dictated by our oveall (non) style of football.
Ex-United player saying something stupid shocker 
Bruno is for sure a hard worker and the fact that he's practically never been injured in his career shows that he's a top professional off the pitch as well. It's not just luck and genetics. Criticising Bruno for poor discipline is about as silly as criticising him for poor chance creation.
Bruno is for sure a hard worker and the fact that he's practically never been injured in his career shows that he's a top professional off the pitch as well. It's not just luck and genetics. Criticising Bruno for poor discipline is about as silly as criticising him for poor chance creation.I've watched loads - and he is a lot more disciplined
Nobody called Bruno lazy, the point is he is working hard but stupid. Either he is not following orders or he is just given bad ones. Probably a bit of both.Ex-United player saying something stupid shocker
Bruno actually is a huge problem, Keane is right. ETH's formation and role for Bruno, a shitty combination. He is also spot on about his mentality. There is no way Bruno should be captain
My issue with the article today from the gang is why has it taken them so many years to say it about Bruno. Look at the endless Bruno debate on here, the issue around his positioning is so bloody evident it’s fuelled an insane amount of discussion but they’ve just noticed it? It’s THE single key theme from how United choose to play (to accommodate Bruno) and his stats aren’t good enough to even consider doing what we do. Every few pages you see someone saying hopefully a manager can control him or give him more of a set role and bollock him for the multiple times he breaks the pressing structure down with his silly runs or gives the ball away (I have said this many times foolishly) but it ain’t happening. This is who he is and this is who we are when he plays, whether coaches by Allardyce or Sacchi.
bingo, 100%, exactly the point Keane was making.
Bruno's defensive work is excellent for an attacking midfielder though. So is his pressing. I'm sure that he occasionally misses a run into the box, but so does everyone else in our squad, include our defenders (who should be specialists on dealing with that).
I have a list of things that I would criticise Bruno for. Lack of discipline or stupid movement is definitely not on that list.
Keane spot on as usual
I am aware of his good stats, but I think he sometimes gets them by running into areas he shouldn't (have to) cover, and sometimes what he does just doesn't seem to matter.
I didn't check if it's still the case but earlier this season United had the most high turnovers in the PL (I think that was the stat) and Bruno's defending/pressing was quite crucial to get those. And still United failed to score goals from these. For me this can be explained to a certain degree by Bruno's pretty wild positioning, his movement just isn't connected to that of most of the team.
Or in other words, if he wins a ball high up, has to try a Hollywood pass to another player who is just to far away from him to play it simple, and misplaces that, than it was a lot of effort and a good defensive action.
Yet the benefit for the team is the same as when he had just stayed in formation and didn't run to win the ball.
This is why he should be part of the CMs, his shooting conversion rates are really bad when you look at him compared to other AMs, get him playing to his strengths - work rate, tackling, graft, pressing, interceptions, passing (when he's not searching for the highlight reel ball every time) etc.
The high turnovers are purely because we pump the ball long so much. It sounds like a good stat until you look into it.
Bruno is part of this but all our players do it.
We’ve see Case become a first time lump it passer in this system.
The problem with this anecdote is that this pressing of his also leads to plenty of chances and even some goals. This is very valuable for the team. The average good team play 500-600 passes per game but they typically only get 5-6 good solid chances after all. So there are what, 50-100 successful passes for every one chance? And more than twice that for every goal?
Look no further than Van Gaal's United. We were generally in perfect control of the game and dominated possession too. And it was all pointless.
Thinking the same. He is probably the greatest captain in premier league history and was box office on Sky to begin with but he does talk like United are still the club of his era. I love his honesty also but tbh , He was overboard when dug Hojlund out few weeks back.
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