Rooney vs. Van Gaal

Will Van Gaal's arrival:

  • Force Rooney to grow up and act as a connsumate professional?

    Votes: 118 38.6%

  • Hasten an exit from the club?

    Votes: 56 18.3%

  • Lead to an upset player who sits on his contract and becomes a disruptive force?

    Votes: 14 4.6%

  • Be an absolute managerial masterstroke that helps Rooney to realise his full potential?

    Votes: 118 38.6%
  • Total voters
    306
  • Poll closed .
Fortitude said:
Rooney was given carte blanch to find his form (for whatever reason from injury to just bad periods of play) over loads of games an immeasurable amount of times during Fergie's rein until things went south during the last half of Fergie's final season.

He's always had special privileges because of his obvious talent when he's playing well. I doubt it'll be the same under LvG.

I simply forgot to add it as an option.

I don't see why insults such as the above are thrown out so assuredly.


It's not about LvG intending to pick a fight - I don't think he's ever been one to do that - rather it's about how he deals with an issue when it comes his way and the stance he'll take when or if his authority is challenged.

I also don't think Rooney's the type who goes storming into offices kicking up a fuss looking for a head-to-head all guns blazing row.

But if things are going sour, Rooney always makes sure he's heard and seen to be unhappy.
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At the end of the day, if things are going well, which hopefully they will be, Rooney is likely to be happy.

There is a lot being made of the RVP and Van Gaal relationship, but I see no reason why that's a negative. RVP was always likely to get the nod upfront given Rooney's versatility anyway.
 
Interesting article from Sports Illustrated on Rooney's place under LvG:

Where does Wayne Rooney belong on the field? That will be one of the first issues that new Manchester United coach Louis van Gaal will have to deal with when he gets to Old Trafford after guiding Holland at the World Cup.

Cynics have suggested that van Gaal was keen to get a Premier League job early in case of a possible first-round exit, given the Dutch's tough group alongside defending champion Spain and dark horse Chile. Regardless, he has his appointment in hand, and his first task is fitting Robin van Persie, January signing Juan Mata and Rooney, the team's star player, into the same side -- something that proved beyond his predecessor, David Moyes.

Given that van Gaal had painted himself as a dogmatic "systems" coach, wedded to a 4-3-3, it's understandable that the focus of his appointment has been just on where Rooney will fit in to the United team - though his planned experiment to play a 5-3-2 at the World Cup to compensate for the loss of midfielder Kevin Strootman is an interesting decision and provides food for thought.

Could Rooney join van Persie in a two-man strike-force with Mata just behind? Will Rooney make up part of a midfield three? Or has van Gaal got something else entirely planned for Rooney?

Van Gaal is no stranger to switching players' positions to get the best out of them. At Bayern Munich, it was van Gaal who converted Bastian Schweinsteiger from a flaky winger into the best German midfielder of his generation.

"One of the hallmarks of van Gaal's career is that he is very good at persuading players to adapt to a role they might not have thought of playing," David Winner, author of Brilliant Orange: The Neurotic Genius of Dutch Football, told SI.com. "He is not quite as rigid with his 4-3-3 as everyone thinks he is. He likes his system, but he knows formations are fluid anyway and what also counts is attitude, energy and state of mind."

Winner interviewed Rooney in 2012 and was struck by the English forward's intelligence. Behind the lurid headlines and salary disputes, he found a thinker about the game, and someone whose appreciation of space and movement came from studying former Ajax (and Liverpool) forward Jari Litmanen. Rooney described himself as like a snooker player always thinking three or four shot (or passes) in advance. This will strike a chord with his new coach.

"What van Gaal likes best about players is their intelligence: Rooney and van Gaal are both highly intelligent, and so I don't think it will be too much of a problem," Winner said. "His teams are all about movement and space, and though they are very precise, at the same time there is an unpredictability and energy to it which tends to win matches."

Van Gaal already has a good rapport with van Persie: he made the United striker the Netherlands' captain and claimed to have never seen a player get to 30 "and still improve as a footballer, like Robin is doing." They have been seen watching games together, and talk about the game a lot.

"I always choose the captains of my team," van Gaal told FIFA TV. "I have to live with them and I give them more responsibility so I have to admire him also because of his personality and identity. My captains are very professional but also very ambitious and also have an honest personality."

Will there be problems between Rooney and van Persie if the Dutchman gets the armband at United? Almost certainly not, given Rooney has the better contract (in terms of status, these things matter), and as for whether they can play alongside each other, they did a pretty good job of that in 2012-13, when the two scored a combined 38 league goals (Rooney 12, van Persie 26) in winning the Premier League title.

Van Gaal could restore Mata to his preferred No. 10 position and persuade Rooney that dropping into a deeper midfield role would be best for the team. Rooney is good enough to play there; and in that respect, perhaps he is England's answer to Philipp Lahm, someone who could excel in every position. Van Gaal will have to be a convincing communicator and salesman.

"He's very clever," said Winner. "He might only stay two or three years, but he'll do something that we might not expect. And the joy is that he's a vivid character, and when he's around exciting things happen."

United fans will not have to wait too long to discover that for themselves.
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http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/so...manchester-united-wayne-rooney/#ixzz32BNty38s

And before anyone starts guffawing at the idea of an 'intelligent' Rooney, Carlo Ancelotti is also on record as describing him as 'one of the most intelligent strikers in the world'.
 
Rooney has made more sacrafices positionally than most other players. I'm not sure where this petulant thing comes from, he's always given his best whatever position. Sure he doesn't want to be played there, and he has a right to voice that opinion but he's always given his all on the pitch. That isn't petulance, that's being a man about it and doing the dirty job you don't want to do.
 
Rooney arguably could have been the most prolific and frankly, best English striker in history if we hadn't had shunted him around to accommodate others. Harsh to call him entitled for wanting to play in his preferred position.
 
r0x0rwolfo said:
Rooney has made more sacrafices positionally than most other players. I'm not sure where this petulant thing comes from, he's always given his best whatever position. Sure he doesn't want to be played there, and he has a right to voice that opinion but he's always given his all on the pitch. That isn't petulance, that's being a man about it and doing the dirty job you don't want to do.
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In Fergies last season, where Fergie said he wasn't happy being played at CM.
 
I think there is a very good chance Rooney will get on great with LVG. Rooney is the kind of hard nosed give it all on the pitch type of character LVG likes. His off season stuff and contractual stuff, who knows. I don't think a manager should ever hold a player to account for what they want contractually. They only get one go around and should always be leveraging for the best possible deal they can get. It's the game they both have to play. The Manager has to protect the interests of the club, the player needs to protect their own interests. Once business is settled, get on with it.
 
Lu Tze said:
Rooney arguably could have been the most prolific and frankly, best English striker in history if we hadn't had shunted him around to accommodate others. Harsh to call him entitled for wanting to play in his preferred position.
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That is true. In the early years he very rarely played up top, and his record is decent.
 
Bojan11 said:
In Fergies last season, where Fergie said he wasn't happy being played at CM.
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If he wasn't, he wasn't. He probably wouldn't be too happy about playing in net either, but does that make him petulant? He's done the business in positions he wasn't happy being played in, that's not the mark of petulance.
 
What we will hopefully see the back of, are those matches where Rooney remains on the pitch for the entire game when quite undeserving of the privilege. And should he enter on one of those spells where his touch is worthy of a player wearing an oversized pair wellies, it's time for you to sit out a few weeks Wayne.

For the team's sake i believe that wide left is where he could be put to best use, although whether Rooney can find it in himself to buy into the role is another matter entirely.

In short though, people are trusting that the overly indulgent policies of the past twelve months are at an end.
 
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I do get where some of the comments are coming from regarding possible friction between van Gaal and Rooney. van Gaal will never accept Rooney drinking lager or taking unhealthy food or any of his antics regarding his contract situation these past 3 years. If van Gaal was in charge last summer, I'm almost certain Rooney would have been sold. There's no way van Gaal would cave in to the selfish demands of a single player.

van Gaal expects that every player acts as a model professional and that means getting to bed early, drinking and eating healthy food, doing 100% in every training session and not letting anything outside of football have any effect on your performances on the field.
 
Nick 0208 Ldn said:
What we will hopefully see the back of, are those matches where Rooney remains on the pitch for the entire game when quite undeserving of the privilege. And should he enters on one of those spells where his touch is worthy of a player wearing an oversized pair wellies, it's time for you to sit out a few weeks Wayne. .
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There have been several other players who fit in this category, much more so than Wayne. Why is Rooney getting all the vitriol?
 
Van Gaal will handle the Rooney situation perfectly imo. He knows how much power Wayne has at United but he also knows how much power the manager is given at United. I think Rooney will relish the chance to work with such an experienced manager.
 
Rooney applied himself brilliantly for the last manager. Certainly better than others in the squad.

Any problems will be caused by the possibility of Van Gaal only fielding one striker and his preference to RVP, rather than any attitude problem from Rooney. If that does happen then obviously Rooney will be unhappy, no different to Mata at Chelsea.
 
adexkola said:
There have been several other players who fit in this category, much more so than Wayne. Why is Rooney getting all the vitriol?
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There are few who carry with them a similar level of expectation however, as well as competition for their place in the XI.

I wouldn't describe it as vitriol, rather many people understood Fergie's point of view and feel that such a stance would be more appropriate than we witnessed last season.
 
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LVG will tell Rooney how he can be a better player. If he doesn't heed the advice, I think he will be out the door pretty quick.

Love to see Rooney finish his career on a high, be interesting to see how he plays after world cup.
 
This Rooney v Van Gaal makes me laugh. All because SAF and Rooney's relationship broke down in the end. I'd rather have this conversation, if necessary, later on when the season begins. Right now it's just positivity from me. We'll just have to wait and see.
 
Rooney will be fine with abouthere will be absolutely no tension/drama between the two at all. Why the hell would there be?! LVG has been known to love hard working players that defend and attack. He'll relish working with Rooney and vice versa , Rooney will learn a new philosophy of football from the very top of the European game. He's probably more excited than us.
 
I just don't see how RVP, Rooney and Mata can co-exist in a starting eleven. Let alone Kagawa. To me RVP is the better number 9 and Mata is the better number 10. Where does this leave Rooney? I maintain that Rooney at 10 is to the detriment of the team. How Van Gaal manages this situation is what I'm looking forward to the most.
 
For some reason I could forsee a scenario where LvG would want to play Rooney in another position, which Rooney wouldn't really fancy and eventually become disgruntled, the "2nd transfer request" seemed to stem most from Sir Alex wanting Rooney to play in midfield for a few games, while Rooney only wished to play as one of the 2 up top, so.. we'll see how it all unfolds.
 
None of the options fit my opinion so I'm not voting.

Rooney hasn't done anything wrong on or off the pitch all season, in fact quite the opposite. He's been our most consistent performer of our outfield players. Why anyone would think LvG and Rooney are due a huge bust up straight away is beyond me.

LvG will come in and Rooney will try his hardest, just like he did with David Moyes.
 
The White Pele said:
Rooney applied himself brilliantly for the last manager. Certainly better than others in the squad.

Any problems will be caused by the possibility of Van Gaal only fielding one striker and his preference to RVP, rather than any attitude problem from Rooney. If that does happen then obviously Rooney will be unhappy, no different to Mata at Chelsea.
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Well said, sums up my thoughts on the matter perfectly.

I do believe LvG will find a way for Rooney to flourish however, though I'm certainly not prepared to make any guesses about how and where on the pitch that will be. As many have pointed out, Rooney is a hardworking, intelligent, and all around quality footballer, and as it happens LvG tends to like hardworking, intelligent, quality footballers.

I really do believe that LvG's arrival will mark the third stage of Rooney's career. He's been the brilliant youngster waiting to take center stage, and from there he went on to become the slightly underwhelming striker who's (more or less) been focal point of our team. Next season will be different with LvG here. Just how different remains to be seen, but I think it will be a turn for the better for both Wayne Rooney and Manchester United.
 
I think Rooney will be fine. An on form Rooney is generally the embodiment of what total football stands for. He's a hard worker and straight from the streets. With that said, the only role I see for him is as a left sided forward in a 433. Van Persie will be our solo man, and Mata must play through the centre. Rooney could and would score goals for fun provided he made the correct runs.
 
Really hard to say what will happen, how are we to know how two people will work together? The only potential issue is that Rooney seems to lose out if Van Gaal plays his expected formation as Van Persie will surely be his preferred choice.
 
I don't know where this myth about LVG and Rooney not coming good has come from. Rooney on his day is a special player and someone who can win you a game on his own. We're certainly better with him in the team than not so I'm hoping LVG and Rooney will work well.
 
Given his wages I dont see Rooney going anywhere
nor do I see a reason why he should... He can play a number of positions has great technique and works as hard as anybody - why wouldnt lvg want him?
 
Kill 'em all said:
I do get where some of the comments are coming from regarding possible friction between van Gaal and Rooney. van Gaal will never accept Rooney drinking lager or taking unhealthy food or any of his antics regarding his contract situation these past 3 years. If van Gaal was in charge last summer, I'm almost certain Rooney would have been sold. There's no way van Gaal would cave in to the selfish demands of a single player.

van Gaal expects that every player acts as a model professional and that means getting to bed early, drinking and eating healthy food, doing 100% in every training session and not letting anything outside of football have any effect on your performances on the field.
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I think comments like this do a disservice to Fergie. He didn't win as many trophies as he did by letting players take the piss, in training or during the off-season. In his entire United career to date there's been one incident of Rooney letting off-field antics affect him at training and Fergie didn't hesitate to take him out of the team (the infamous Blackburn game in 2011/12)

This image of Rooney as a lager-swilling, lazy good for nothing doesn't fit with someone Fergie rated so highly and picked so often. People are reading far too much into some photos in the tabloids. I mean, when did you ever see Rooney let himself down in terms of work-rate or effort during a match?

No aimed at you but it's slightly ironic that so many people on here slag Rooney off as a lazy fat bastard and say someone like Kagawa should have his place in the team. When did he ever put in the type of 90 minute shift you see from Rooney? You're far more likely to see him hit the wall after an hour or so of football than our "lazy" scouser.
 
I am seeing a lot of praise showered on Rooney. Intelligent, great technique, hard worker etc.
Well intelligence is hard to quantify in a footballer although decision making on the field of play can give us an idea. I don't think he is that great a decision maker.
His technique is not that special. He has a suspect if not mercurial first touch and his Left foot is rarely used. A central midfielder should have a great first touch.
A left winger should have a decent Left foot and have the ability to cross a ball with it. Never seen Rooney cross a ball with his Left foot, at least no instances come to mind. If not he will constantly be cutting inside reducing our options.
Maybe LVG will make good use of Rooney but in no way is this a given. As someone stated we have a better No9 and No10. Probably in Nani we have a better No11.
He is a hard worker that is without doubt so if LVG plays a fluent game with players constantly interchanging positions up front Rooney could be integral.
Otherwise his playing time will most likely be reduced.
 
I see a lot of people shooting down the whole Rooney vs LvG thing but I'm not so sure. It's being mentioned because clearly there are ingredients there that could cause some sort of issue. Rooney potentially being benched/played out of position to accommodate RvP. Rooney not being named new captain when it was highly likely that he would be. Also being forced to adapt to new ideas when Ferguson has stated that he often would go back to instinct and what he knows. I think it could go either way to be honest. They might get on brilliantly or there will be constant tension that disrupts things. It will be interesting.
 
I believe the any manager will be silly not to manage their best players properly. During Fergie era, we can see how Rooney compliment Ronaldo and Tevez. To say Rooney will become a second fiddle to RVP is pure speculation as none of us are aware the system LVG is going to play. Plus new signings around the corner, nobody is certain how we will play come August, even LVG. After returning from the World Cup, he will then assess the squad including the new signings and then invent a system which he thinks which particular players will suit the position in the formation.
 
If Van Gaal plays his preferred formation of 4-3-3 and RvP is fit, then it's a given that Rooney will be played out of position. How Rooney deals with that will be totally up to him. Van Gaal might want to play him as a left sided front player, or the most forward midfield player. Rooney has made sacrifices before, but his new found love of wanting to be the "top dog" might become an issue, especially with RvP getting all the attention. Rooney either has to accept his position or start learning French very quickly.
 
ghagua said:
If Van Gaal plays his preferred formation of 4-3-3 and RvP is fit, then it's a given that Rooney will be played out of position. How Rooney deals with that will be totally up to him. Van Gaal might want to play him as a left sided front player, or the most forward midfield player. Rooney has made sacrifices before, but his new found love of wanting to be the "top dog" might become an issue, especially with RvP getting all the attention. Rooney either has to accept his position or start learning French very quickly.
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Or he plays Rooney in the litmanen / berkampt role which is probably his best position?
 
sun_tzu said:
Or he plays Rooney in the litmanen / berkampt role which is probably his best position?
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Bergkamp was a no.9 when he played for Ajax and the Netherlands, he only played as a no.10 for Arsenal. Litmanen played as the attacking midfielder, the role that i suggested that Rooney might be asked to play.
 
ZDwyr said:
I see a lot of people shooting down the whole Rooney vs LvG thing but I'm not so sure. It's being mentioned because clearly there are ingredients there that could cause some sort of issue. Rooney potentially being benched/played out of position to accommodate RvP. Rooney not being named new captain when it was highly likely that he would be. Also being forced to adapt to new ideas when Ferguson has stated that he often would go back to instinct and what he knows. I think it could go either way to be honest. They might get on brilliantly or there will be constant tension that disrupts things. It will be interesting.
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Nothing in your points prove that they could get on brilliantly. The way you pointed out Rooney's "shortcomings", it will be a recipe for disaster so what makes you think it could go either way!!
Anyway, I doubt there is any cause for concern. Rooney wanted to be top dog here after Ronaldo left and he has a new multi-million pound deal and a long term contract. I doubt not being made captain will be all that big a problem for him. If he has a problem with that, good luck to him for finding a club which will listen to his demands for the wages he is on/wants.
 
Either Rooney adapts or he goes. He has no positional discipline or perseverance, first touch of a rapist on a bad day and loses his cool far too often when things don't go his way to go along with his many positive qualities.

Our football needs to shift to modern style. That means continuously improvement of its playing staffs and coaches. No room for slackers and players who rest on past glories.
 
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