If that's what he chose then fair enough. But surely we should try because he is what we need?
Romeo Lavia | Chelsea bound?
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Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) discuss United's fantastic win away against Athletic Club in the semi-final of the Europa League.
They also pick out the positives of United's 4-3 loss away at Brentford, and Nik reviews a day out at Old Trafford watching Manchester United Women qualify for the Champions League.
If that's what he chose then fair enough. But surely we should try because he is what we need?
Sure. Firstly, we don't need to sign a kid to come in and be our long term successor to Casemiro, as it would appear that Kobbie Mainoo is the heir apparent for that role. Secondly, who is to say that Casemiro won't drastically decline this season? Fabinho had a big drop off last season and I assume that was considered unexpected for most people. Therefore, perhaps it is us who needs the experienced head? Especially if the likes of Fred and McTominay depart.
I think, this debate "started" about a question if Lavia would be a smarter buy than Amrabat. I agree with you, we have to be smart about the fees but I think, you make a mistake by calling the idea of Lavia as a "non" priority position. We are one Casemiro redcard or injury away from having absolutely no midfielder who is above average defensively. This is a big risk. And the midfielder we are relying on is already 31 so we should already have a contingency plan.
Mainoo is good and well but he isn't a defensive midfielder in terms that defensive aspects are his strengths, isn't he? He is more of a progressor as well. Plus he is short which, if won't make things easier as the starting lineup gets increasingly"smaller". If we have the money to spend on Amrabat, then we should have the money to spend on Lavia. Liverpool were ready to spend big on an upcoming DM talent in Ugarte. Their next choice seems to be Lavia.That, if nothing else, should at least be an indicator that there seems to some potential that people are already seeing.
Fully agree. Quite baffled, seems like some people think to much in terms of positions than in terms of skill sets. And the ball skillset is extremely rare in our squad. Especially in midfield. Has been for years and we've seen how important it is with Casemiro. We have to have a backup for that. At least (!!) before bringing in another progressor like Amrabat.
There aren't many who are. But if we lose Casemiro for whatever reason, we will still be better up if we have somebody physical, well positioned and good in the tackle playing in midfield. Who is that going to be? I am sure if we talk long enough, people will say this can be DVB...
Don't know much about Amrabat, but we should be signing this one instead. We have no one in the mold of Casemiro and when he is absent we will be up a creek without a paddle, just like last season. Lavia is a much smarter signing, even if more expensive.
I don’t think anybody is against signing young midfielders. People may, however, be against spending the best part of £50 million on a young midfielder who is similar in profile to Mainoo, when more appropriate alternatives might be added instead.
We need cover for Casemiro. I don’t think anybody will dispute that. I won’t be acting like a big Jessie if Liverpool get Lavia, though.
I'm not bothered if they sign him. But Mainoo and Lavia might actually complement each other well in 5 years, so I don't see how signing Lavia is an issue for Mainoo. A bigger issue for Mainoo might be hanging him out to dry by trying to make him Casemiro's backup.
It’s telling that scouts on here want to spend 50m on a relegated teams kid midfielder where we have a world class player already playing then shit themselves over spending 55m pounds on a young striker that we are in desperate need of
it's utterly bizarreBabyish response.
Non priority was probably the wrong term in a sporting aspect, I agree Casemiro has too much on his plate. But unfortunately within the context of our overall window an additional midfield signing is not the current priority. It's clear a striker and then securing sales are the current major plans. Which means we're not really in a position to be competing at the sharp end of 40-50 million for Lavia and we're completely at the mercy of other clubs in the meantime even if we do wish to compete for him.
That's why I believe Amrabat has been sounded out for what could actually be half the price because it's something that can be pursued even if sales are conservatively estimated whereas Lavia might need a bit to go right. I don't think it's as simple as "if we can buy Amrabat we can buy Lavia." It could be the case that Lavia is twice as costly. It shouldn't matter for a club like us, but this summer I'm afraid it probably does.
I don't see what else Mainoo is if not a defensive midfielder prospect. He naturally occupies those positions. That doesn't mean every aspect of his game is ready and naturally for a young player the technical side is probably better than the tactical and positioning side but that's the point of developing talent. I don't necessarily think Lavia would swoop in and do a complete defensive job on his own either without Casemiro. So at which point do we want to develop youth and which do we want ready made experience? Amrabat and Mainoo may make more sense than Lavia and Mainoo from where I'm sitting, it covers bases.
I see your point. To be perfectly honest, Lavia probably isn't really a hill for me to die on. But I think spending money on Amrabat is pointless, even if it is only 25 million. I wrote it earlier, look at his fbref profile - defensively he is wank. And if he can't be a backup to Casemiro (which would be the objective I see as important) then save yourself the money for the winter. Go for a strong attacking RB or whatever.
edit: position wise Mainoo might be a DM. But I don't really see a ball winner there. He has many good attributes and qualities already. Not arguing he isn't a good player. But I don't think he is the answer for the ballwinner role.
I personally don't think he's trying to replicate Casemiro's defensive skillset and I think we have to be a bit careful with defensive numbers because they can jump up and down depending on the style and Fiorentina maintain possession whereas a team like Southampton are putting out fires all game because they're useless.
I think he wants an option because at the moment we have a surplus of players that are box to box players in some sort of variation. There's only Casemiro who really operates from deep positions and Eriksen became increasingly difficult to trust as the season progressed and he deteriorated physically.
I think with Amrabat (and Lavia for that matter) he's probably aiming for someone that can give Casemiro a break in easier fixtures because obviously we're not going to be able to buy someone capable of ousting Casemiro. They wouldn't need to be elite defensively for that, actually the buildup would be way more important than clogging it up with someone average on the ball with limited passing. Imagine having Bruno spamming passes and a unreliable passer at DM, it would be horrendous. Then if they can also partner Casemiro without being too defensive it's also good for options. That could work in difficult games.
Dunno, that's just my guess looking at the skillset of Amrabat and why he might want him because his passing and progression is top notch. Lavia also has pretty good buildup and maybe has more defensive tools to work with but he's also less experienced and polished and costs more so take your pick really. But I don't think the rationale is about tackling and interception numbers alone.
Your argument was weak af mate. By your logic we should have 2 x 27 year olds for every position in case one of them has a surprise decline.
I really like the look of Mainoo, but to call him the heir apparent to Casemiro after a decent year in the u21s and 3 pre-season games (2 of which being against quite poor opposition) is wild. No reason why in the future you couldn’t have a midfield of Lavia and Mainoo - in fact I think it has world class potential as a 2.
For context, I’m not totally against Amrabat, he’s decent enough to be a squad player for us from what I’ve seen. I just think Lavia has far more potential and would be a much better choice given we have the luxury of Casemiro as our 1st choice 6, meaning Lavia can be eased in over a season or two.
The past 10 years we have been shocking at squad building and selling players on - giving us the worst net spend in the country. I can’t think of a single player we’ve bought and sold for a profit. Similar to someone like Fred, Amrabat will end up being here for 3 years, then sold on for half the amount we bought him for in his last year of contract. This needs to stop.
Nail on head. No reason for him to choose us at this stage of his career when we have Casemiro. Next, please.
That's certainly a younger player profile I wouldn't mind joining the midfield (There were musings of Tchouaméni possibly being available as well, for the more proven version) but it is probably not attainable or reasonable spending this window.
I hope they rinse Pool big time. It looks like for us he's out of budget
Exactly. If they replace Fabinho with him as their first choice DM as shite as he was last season I’ll be quite happy. He’s got potential but as you say he’s very raw and nowhere near ready to start every game for a top 6 side.
Personally I get what you are saying But sometimes youngsters can progress Surprisingly Quickly If they are backed and Given Confidence by the Management to be main man if they have the right attributes .
Selling Mctominay for around £40M and bagging this guy would be a masterclass, but he seems Liverpool bound and we're apparently linked with the Fiorentina guy
He would be a great signing for Liverpool. He is young but have a higher ceiling of all the midfielders they are signing this year. Was my pick if we had to replace Partey this year. But Partey is staying so this won't work for us.
United should have been all over this. 10years younger than Casemiro seems perfect for his understudy.
United should have been all over this. 10years younger than Casemiro seems perfect for his understudy.
We have been interested in this kid for like 12 months. We threw a crazy 45M bid in for him on deadline day last summer. Personally I think we need Caicedo plus one other midfielder, so Lavia could be a good player to target but we have Santos, so maybe a different profile of midfielder would be better.
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Great analysis. Backed up a lot of my thoughts on him.
Everyone worries that every player Liverpool are linked with will turn out to be the best player of all time. Been like that since the days of El Hadji Diouf and Smicer
That should get them there or pretty close, considering City have a 20% sell-on clause.
A little bit too late this. He was right there all summer.
Don't blame him, other than money been the main motivation I don't see any upside of going to Chelsea right now.
Lavia worked under shields before one of their head of recruitment. Plus southampton has good relationship with Pochettino and I m sure lavia has only heard of positive feedback of Pochettino player management.
Chelsea is letting down Pochettino so far in player recruitment. Player like lavia could have easily been bought at the beginning of the window. His addition would not effect Caceido deal. They know chelsea needs depth in midfield after all their outgoing, so it is crazy that now they are making attempts to sign players.
I don’t know why but his name really sounds like it should be a part of the female anatomy.
Yeah I know what you mean
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Clitoris? No wonder his Southampton team mates could never find him.