I don't really get that, Martial has been contested and bench several times and he has always fought back and won his place again. He never gave up but his mental strength is doubted.
Romelu Lukaku | Napoli watch
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I don't really get that, Martial has been contested and bench several times and he has always fought back and won his place again. He never gave up but his mental strength is doubted.
I think this is the first season to judge him as a mature player. He will improve on his past numbers no doubt, but people have to be tolerant of bumps in the road as well. Judge him over a season .
His sulking is the reason he didnt nailed left wing position. Who's his competition skill wise?
Let's see how he does this year.
Exactly. He wasn't first choice player under Jose, he fought for his place, won it and then was dropped for no reason, again won his place back.
On the other hand, the player for whom this thread is dedicated to, is usually called as mentally strong player when he runs away the moment his place is under threat.
When exactly has he sulked? This type of nonsense is tiring.
Same with Firmino. He is so important for them but if you look at stats only and not the games you wouldn't think he was the lead striker for one of the most scoring teams in europe.
Myth. Jose didn't favour his style and dropped him regularly. The sulking thing was just an assumption people used to rationalise Jose's preference. That Martial would come back and go on an 8 game scoring streak to suspend Jose's sacking should have put this myth to bed
Look. It's clear we're not gonna see eye to eye. Why bother?
Let's just see how he ended up ok
If he's the next henry then great. I'm a manchester united fans, just because i have some reservations on how i think he'll develop as a player doesnt mean i hate him and want him to fail.
If you can't even accept that premise then let's just agree to disagree.
It's getting tiring seriously regurgitating the same old lines.
Ok. Let's see now that jose is gone.
Well it's tiring because half of the time you talk nonsense for no good reason. A player doesn't have to be Henry to not have his mental strength doubted. Also it's ironic to use Henry as a reference when he is known to have terrible temper and a propensity for sulking which is one of the reason why he isn't particularly liked.
Look. I'm done with you.
I made a simple statement about martial, it's quite flattering for me. I simply say the jury is out. Wish him well and let's see how it goes.
But somehow you seems to drag all this i hate him bullshit, idiotic post, etc. You're getting personal.
If you really cant converse without having that prejudice that it's about jose or some posters have sinister agenda towards our own player then just put me on ignore. Seriously. There are people in this thread i love to converse, you dont have to think everything is for you.
I didn't say that you hated him, I didn't even assume that you hated him. I asked you a question about why you would question his mental strength and failed to give an answer.
Edit: But I may have been a bit too aggressive on the previous post, sorry about that.
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If you think Martial has poor mental strength then god knows what you think about Lukaku's time here. Doing silly 'non-celebrations' because the fans dared to criticise him, whilst simultaneously telling his colleagues to grow up and act like a man.
Let's just see how they both goes
Fair enough. Will be difficult to make a direct comparison given the circumstances but okay
I'm easy. I'm not fuzzy about stats and anything. See where we are in the next 2-3 years as a team is good enough
When did this happen ?
I remember this. It was weird. After a barren spell, he finally scored against Bournemouth at home in December 2017 and just stood there not celebrating like he was sulking.
Scoring the opener in the 25th min and you just stand there, head down? The following week he done the same away to West Brom. Again, scored opener 25th min and just stood there, head down. Look at his celebration at West Brom for Everton, doing acrobatics! So it wasn't out of respect.
Apparently, he was sulking because of fan's questioning his ability. It was definitely a thing at the time.
1.24 min for Lukaku celebration:
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There are so many things that aren't covered by stats and that's where someone like Drogba is probably underappreciated but even when you look at the stats, there's simply no comparison with Rooney/Lukaku (even more so when you think Lukkau is the out and out striker). For United Rooney averaged a goal/assist every 0.7 games, Lukaku with Everton/United is 0.43
He wasn't sulking. He made 2 crucial mistakes that lost us the Manchester Derby by gifting City 2 goals from set pieces and literally ended our chances in a title fight. It was logical that will be his reaction scoring immediately in the next 2 games. It'll be a surprise if after losing us a big game and basically the title race he goes on celebrating like crazy the next game. I for myself liked that reaction from him. It showed he knew he fecked up really hard.
Didn’t he do a few weird tweets around this time too? Definitely came across as a bit sulky to me.
There is a huge space between what he did and ‘celebrating like crazy’
He did carry on with those non-celebrations on one or two more goals in the matches after that. He was sulking imo. After throwing away the league he was still oblivious as to why fans were pissed with him
It’s not semantic, and you can’t have watched much prime Shearer if you think he was a level below Van Nistelrooy. Before his injuries he had a serious claim to being the best number 9 in the world.
For me it's a pretty normal reaction and it's normal it will extend for a few games too. We shouldn't underestimate the psychological impact of what happened in that City game. Doesn't seem to have anything with the fans at all. He was getting slaughtered far more in his second season and didn't do this.
Never said he was. Read again.
Funny how you chose to omit Jamie Vardy from your mentions. Romelu Lukaku has a better goals per minute ratio in the PL than Vardy. Are you now saying that Vardy isn't a very good PL goalscorer?
I've literally never heard anyone say that about Vardy. He has proved, as a goalscoerer at that level, to be very good.
And now Rooney and Drogbas goal records "aren't particularly good"? Not even good? 2nd highest amount of goals scored in the PL ever (confortably), and Wayne Rooney wasn't even a good goalscorer?
Also, seeing that the original poster is obsessed with his minutes per goal metric, and uses this standard to decide who the best PL goalscorers were, do you know who comes top 10 in the PL era? Hernan Crespo and Javier Hernandez. Do you honestly think that Hernandez is the 5th best PL golascorer in history, even better than Harry Kane?
The lengths some will go to to discredit Lukaku are simply crazy.
Pretty ridiculous really.
It’s fair to say lukaku has regressed though in the last 2 years. He was better when leaner and fitter in his early career.
Well I believe that Vardy's overall contribution is excellent, he is a constant nuisance for the opposition backline chasing every balls and harassing them all game long. As for Javier Hernandez I actually mentioned him in this thread and said that if Lukaku was considered the same way we consider Chicharito I would be happy, Chicharito was an excellent goalscorer for United but a limited player outside of that which is why he has never really been considered like a week in week out starter by SAF, I would have been happy to have Lukaku in a similar role but I understand why he wouldn't be happy with it.
Is this still going on? 
Hernandez was a huge nuisance though, opponents had to constantly watch what he was doing. They can pretty much leave Lukaku alone until the ball gets to his feet, and even then there's a second or two until it's under control.
I felt finished with this discussion, but;
- Hasselbaink played four or five years in the PL in his thirties. For teams like Boro and Charlton. In his twenties he had a goal approx every 150 min for Chelsea and Leeds. His «overall record» suffered from playing several years after his peak. But its still similar to Lukaku at Man Utd. His peak years is far better.
- The same was the case for Rooney. Even if he declined earlier. Furthermore, Rooney did not only play centre forward. He was left winger, second striker and even midfielder at one point. And he was so much more than just a goalscorer. But I would assume his peak years as centre forward and main man is alot better than Lukaku (without checking).
- Vardy played several years for a very poor Leicester-side.
- To me, Drogba is the biggest surprise. Of course he, like Hasselbaink, suffered from playing in the PL well past his peak. But I’m still surprised his numbers are not better. Looking at his numbers he was more inconsistent than I remember. And of course he too was so much more than a goalscorer.
If Lukaku had continued his carrier in the PL his PL-average would suffer too eventually. Like any other striker in history.
The guy barely watches any football except Wiki pages going by the posts, won’t be surprised if he thinks Vardy barely contributes when he doesn’t score.
Same. Now you know.
I never knew he was capable of such feats!Stop being so dense and follow the conversation. Nowhere have I said that Lukaku is a complete striker or forward, he isn't and has glaring weaknesses in his game. The argument being made by some anti Lukakus on here is that, despite that, he is not even a very good goalscorer, of which I said he was. The original poster said that he can't be a very good PL goalscorer simply because he only averages a goal every 165 minutes. Then I pointed to other top class PL strikers of the past and present (all with better games) who had worse ratios, including Vardy. Did said poster also consider Vardy to not be a "very good PL goalscorer"? Of course not, the goalpost moved. Apparently Vardy played for a poor Leicester side, so had an excuse. Can you at least apply the same logic with Lukaku? He played 5 of his full 7 PL seasons at West Brom and Everton (2 of those Everton seasons they finished outside the top 10).
You're comparing a guy who played most of his PL career for Everton and West Brom to guys that played mostly for the top 6 clubs?
No where I said you said that. So stop being so dense and just stop posting. You are looking clueless with every post. If you actually read @JPRouve 's posts without just reading wiki and posting them, he didnt say Lukaku's record is bad, he said it's not good enough for the player who don't offer much except goals, which is the point me and others made. That's anyways too much to process for the guys who just can't look past total goals scored in wiki page.
You're quoting a guy who said that Rooney and Drogba weren't particularly good goalscorers in the PL. Really, on a United forum, in fact on any forum?
Can you really think that and be taken seriously? Rooney has the second highest amount of goals in the PL, ever, and that doesn't even make him a good goalscorer. All this thinking just to berate Lukaku?
Yes, Drogba and Rooney weren't very good goal scorers but they were great players so their goal scoring record was good enough as they offered lot more to the team than just goals. They are capable of producing man of the match performance without even scoring a goal, that's how good their contribution was.
You are just proving my wiki point with every post. And no, all this is not to berate Lukaku, it's because that's how people see it. There are players who are great players but not great goal scorers.
Drogba scored more than 20 league goals just twice and after that his best goal scoring season was 12 goals. In 9 seasons, he scored more than 10 goals only 5 times.
Lukaku's contribution is nowhere good enough to carry his goal scoring record while Rooney and Drogba's contribution is miles better, so that their goal scoring record wasn't a problem. Apart form all this, Rooney was not even a lead striker for the club. He played as 'lead the line' striker once in his career, 2009-10, when he scored 27 league goals in 34 games.
If you just go by career totals, then Giggs is better goal scorer than RVN, which I'm sure none of the posters here would agree with.
Good try trying to worm your way out of that, but you failed. The poster said, in his words, "weren't particularly good" when describing Roo and Drogs as PL goalscorers. Please explain to the forum how Rooney, the second highest scorer in PL history (comfortably too) wasn't even a particularly good scorer. Name me a top league in Europe where the guy in 2nd place in the scoring stats in the last 30 years is not even considered a "particularly good scorer". I'll await.