I would blame the midfielders for lack of service to Lukaku. Also Conte for picking the midfielders.
Romelu Lukaku | Napoli watch
- Thread starter Samid
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I would blame the midfielders for lack of service to Lukaku. Also Conte for picking the midfielders.
We’ll see. He worked very hard at first when he came to us.
I am going a bit over the top of course. He has done well so far under Conte though.
Most of those players would command 200-300 million over two transfers. (Can’t even imagine Mbappes fee)
Could I see them all scoring from that chance every single time? Nope. I’ve seen great players make bigger bloopers out of much easier chances. Are a lot of those players much different players than Lukaku with different strengths- yes. I could see Aguero being the most likely to slink that goal in.
I don’t see how you put Lukaku in those players league in terms of transfer fee at all.
Once again- Lukaku put it on target. He didn’t make a mess of it. Is Lukaku elite and world class- nope. Does he have a lot he can improve on- yes. He doesn’t offer a very fluid style of play but he can be and he can be very lethal. He would have done wonders in Mourinhos Inter team
there's something enjoyable about seeing clips of his shitness knowing it's not happening with a United shirt on now. Specially considering he's a bit of a dick.But you can pick any player and do a compilation of their shitty moments, it's not that hard at all. And that includes Salah, Messi, and Ronaldo. What baffles me is selling Lukaku and keeping Martial, that makes no sense whatsoever. Or maybe Martial had no takers, which is understandable.
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Martial is better than Lukaku. Hope that helps.
I know from watching him with us that I'd bet on him fecking up over him doing something good. There's not many players like that. Martial is far better with and without a football when he's playing well, which is hopefully now going to be a more regular thing.
I agree he needs to, and I believe him expressing his frustration with those behind him midweek was a sign of a goal hungry mentality he is developing. His all-around play is so much better than Lukaku though. You can see how much more threatening Rashford looks alongside Lukaku. If he can have that type of effect on others his own individual production won't tell the whole story.
Obviously the other key is that we need the service into him and our attackers to consistently be there as it was against Partizan and Brighton.
I hear crickets after the post above. Wheres the "he's not even a very good PL goalscorer because he only averaged a goal every 165 mins" brigade?
United look much slicker going forward without him I must say. Martial holds the ball up better.
That's the key. Martial has shown he can move the ball forward and create dangerous opportunities for the forward line if he gets the ball with some space, or even without as he can beat a man with his first touch and dribbling. When Martial has one of his stinkers, it's usually followed by a poor performance from the midfield and a lack of incisiveness in the forward passing. Barring the odd game here and there, Martial just isn't someone who is capable (yet or ever) of dragging the side to a win on his own, so this team needs more creativity from the midfield, because if Martial gets decent service, he has shown he can extend the benefit to Rashford or James. The problem is against the better sides, this team's midfield gets swallowed up and then you can only depend on some fluky counter or a penalty to get anything done.
feck Lukaku the fat bastard
No it doesn't help at all, because it's a blatant lie and you know it. All statistical analyses of the two players have shown Lukaku has clearly outperformed Martial every season. They are both strikers so they are very easy to compare. Already this season Lukaku is ahead of Martial. I give you just a short Opta Stats summary on Lukaku (published on 31 July 2019), I hope this helps:
"113 - A tally of 113 Premier League goals puts Lukaku above Wayne Rooney (89), Eden Hazard (85), Jamie Vardy (80) and Sadio Mane (66) in the list of the competition's top scorers since his debut on August 27, 2011.
42 - Lukaku is by far and away the most potent goal threat in United's squad, having scored 42 times in all competitions since his arrival two years ago - 16 more than their next most-prolific player Marcus Rashford.
27 - The 2017-18 season was the 26-year-old's best in English football as he netted 27 goals in all competitions for the Red Devils, who he joined from Everton in July 2017.
25 - The most fruitful Premier League campaign of Lukaku's career came in 2016-17, when he scored 25 for Everton - the most in a single season by a Toffees player since Gary Lineker hit 30 in 1985-86.
10 - In the last seven top-flight seasons, Lukaku and Sergio Aguero are the only players to have succeeded in scoring at least 10 goals per campaign.
4 - Ruud van Nistelrooy (36), Robin van Persie (30), Dwight Yorke (29) and Zlatan Ibrahimovic (28) are the only United players to have scored more in all competitions in their debut seasons than the Belgian's 27.
3 - Aguero (162) and Harry Kane (125) are the only other players to have scored more than 100 Premier League goals since Lukaku made his first appearance in the competition."
Martial does not even get a mention, but of course you are welcome to post any Martial stats (from ANY source) that outshine Lukaku's. I didn't bother to add international performance stats because it would just become too overwhelmingly landslided. Martial cannot dream of having stats like that, even using a same-age comparison. Out of interest, how much do you think United could sell Martial for at the moment? Don't tell me £74m because you know he is worth nowhere near that.
As we have seen tonight. We already know that if Lukaku doesn't score, he's not worth having on your team. If Martial doesn't score, he's still hugely influential and an assett to have.
Speaks volumes. Lukaku was dead weight who offerred very little to the future of our club and team. Its indicative that no other big club was in for him give his "goal scoring pedigree".
People comparing him to Shearer et al... if any of them had put themselves on the market in their prime, you bet your arse every big club in the world with the finances would be over them.
Speaks volumes. Lukaku was dead weight who offerred very little to the future of our club and team. Its indicative that no other big club was in for him give his "goal scoring pedigree".
People comparing him to Shearer et al... if any of them had put themselves on the market in their prime, you bet your arse every big club in the world with the finances would be over them.
Martial joined us as a 19 year old and apart from 1 season, has largely been played out of position. Youre arguments are shit. I'd probably give up.
They left out the Lukaku chances from the official highlights show
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Martial didn't play as striker, he is playing as striker this season and in first half of Van Gaal's season.
Of course Lukaku scored more goals than Martial for ManUtd as he played as CF and in every game. Martial barely played 50% of total mins, it would need insane effort to outscore Lukaku when Martial played less than 50% mins and as LW covering the FBs.
In Lukaku's 2 seasons' at ManUtd
2017-18:
Lukaku - 4071 mins - 36 G+A - 113 mins per G+A
Martial - 2337 mins - 20 G+A - 111 mins per G+A
2018-19
Lukaku - 3001 mins - 19 G+A - 158 mins per G+A
Martial - 2327 mins - 15 G+A - 155 mins per G+A
In league alone:
2017-18:
Lukaku - 2869 mins - 23 G+A - 124 mins per G+A
Martial - 1582 mins - 14 G+A - 113 mins per G+A
2018-19:
Lukaku - 2130 mins - 13 G+A - 163 mins per G+A
Martial - 1623 mins - 13 G+A - 124 mins per G+A
Martial had better record in 2017-18 and 2018-19 season and this is playing as winger, role which was described by Zabaleta as
It's just amazing how people just compare numbers without considering the positions, mins, roles they played.
What Lukaku achieved historically isn't of much use as we are talking about his performance for ManUtd.
Most of the stats just lack context like only Lukaku and Aguero scored more than 10 league goals in last 7 seasons, obviously as players who are much better than him didn't play 7 seasons or played long enough to score 100 league goals.
Bloody hell Inter had 38 shots last night
Some people tying themselves in knots to try and discredit Lukaku. It didn't work out at United and looks like Martial is doing well leading the line. But he needs to add more goals. Lukaku has proved he can score goals, and lots of them at PL level, even for dross like Everton and West Brom. Martial needs to start doing the same.
Some people just can't looks past "He scored 100 PL goals, mighty Lukaku" nonsense. Good CF playing 7-8 seasons will obviously score 100 goals, that's around 15 goals a season.
He's not played CF much until this season though, where he's been injured for most of it. I'll be the first to say he's not been good enough most of the time but he's finally looking like he's improving and hopefully becoming more consistent. I'll take Martial's control, movement and dribbling over whatever Lukaku supposedly does good (not even particularly great at finishing despite he goal tallies).
It's a weird thing because when you follow other sports and the analytics around them, these type of stats are logically pushed aside or have important caveats. A player like Lukaku is a high usage player with average efficiency, the reason his cumulative stats are that high is because he has had a long career mainly due to the fact that he was built like a grown man at 15 years old. It doesn't make him rubbish but it means that when you use more sophisticated tools, you realize that his outputs is above average but not very good. If you consider him as you would consider Chicharito then you have a valuable player in your hand, if you think that you have the likes of Aguero, Vardy or even a less prolific Firmino then you have a problem because Lukaku's contribution isn't really close to them.
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Martial surely is overrated and inconsistent but how anyone with just a bit knowledge of football cannot see that he is some classes above Lukaku is strange.
Backpass to the keeper. Good man Lukaku.
Exactly. People forget that he started playing professionally at the age of 16 and was a consistent starter at 19 in PL. His record was compared to Rooney, one of the funny comparison. Rooney can be man of the match without even scoring a goal, he was that good and his contribution was so impressive. That's the problem with Lukaku, no one said he is bad player or his goal scoring record is bad. It's just that, for a limited player who doesn't offer much his goal scoring record isn't good enough.
Just compare Martial's performance yesterday, he was playing like a playmaker, creating chances with ease and his touch was so consistent, same with his hold up and link up play. He didn't score but had 2 assists but apart from that he was very good in general play. This is the player who had big quiet first half and still managed to influence the game without scoring.
He's a class above at times. Lukaku is jack of spades most of the times.
Until martial can deliver what he's capable of at his best days weeks in week out than people like me will always question him. I prefer players who's doing the basics right and you can rely on a 7 performance every week rather than a player that can do a 10 and a 4 the next week.
I could use a french example to illustrate it, Henry has a worse goal ratio for France than Trezeguet but Henry has without a doubt been the better player for France. Trezeguet was a great player, one of the best french player ever but his goalscoring record wasn't good enough in the context of France and he was always in a competition with players that were able to provide more like Wiltord and Anelka. Trezeguet still played a lot but he was never uncontested.
Yeah, there are so many examples where goal record is not everything. Obviously goals is the ultimate goal but you need players who helps in reaching that goal.
The way I see it, when Lukaku doesn't score, he doesn't offer much.
Thankfully he's only 23 and has ample time to iron out his inconsistencies.
I'd liken him to Firmino, a player who joined the PL at 24.
Lukaku has proven himself to be better than Ronaldo this season as a league player.
Your point went left when you mentioned Vardy. He's not known as a great contributor outside goals, a la Firmino.
You said that Lukakus output is just above and not very good, due to the amount of games he's played. Actually, when compared to some of the legends of tge past, his output is indeed very good. Do you know that in the PL only, he averages more goals per minute than Vardy, Fowler, Rooney, Drogba and Hasselbaink. Are you now saying that their output in numbers in the PL wasnt very good?
Lukakus output, even after playing many games is very good. How many strikers out there can score 25 for Everton, and 17 in 20 starts for a dire West Brom team?
And what do all these players have in common? They scored against top teams ona regular basis.
Lukaku's stats against top 6 in England
58 matches played 15 goals scored
edit: these stats are from Oct 2017
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https://www.givemesport.com/1496684...elu-lukakus-man-utd-scoring-record-vs-top-six
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Yesterday may have been Brighton but it does give a glimpse into why we sold Rom and stuck with Rashers and Martial.
Yup..but he's been here for a good 3 - 4 years. He'll be properly judged now
I think Rashford and Martial will have breakouts this year if both can stay fit.
Drogba and Rooney weren't particularly good goalscorers, it's their overall contributions that made them special and Fowler and Hasselbaink mainly played in a different era.
I have my doubts. These last 4 years im not sold on martial mental strenght. Ability wise i think there's no problem.
Let's see if he can continue his steady rise when there's bump. By 24 most past veterans have ironed out their inconsistency.