Yea. Can’t understand why Lukaku isn’t thriving especially as Sánchez has been with us for such a Long time already.
9
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 51
- Goals
- 27
- Assists
- 10
- Yellow cards
- 3
- Status
This is exactly! The technical difference was the point of the argument @prath92
Anyone can dribble with not good enough ball control if they are given a lot of space, we are all know Lukaku is poor against tight defense. Lukaku's goal against Chelsea FA Cup was pure power & strength at the start, followed by poor lazy defending from Mikel and ball watching from Cahill and gave him enough space as well.
RVN's goal was pure dribble ball control, you won't stop that unless if you foul him.
Anyone can see the difference in their both control between those two goals.
There's more to hard work than simply closing players down and running around like a headless chicken. He makes space for others, he works the channels well, he brings other people into play. Which is more than what he done at Everton; he's got decent movement.
Now, he can definitely improve. He's only been here for a couple of months so give the guy some time. His stats are still pretty good, and overall I'm very happy with him. He can be frustrating but he's moving in the right direction. The stick he's getting is a little hyperbolic.
'Fabulous' isnt a word that you can use here - he cost £75m. No one's expecting Messi or Ronaldo levels from him, but his inability to contribute to our general attacking play isnt good enough for the price we paid. You can't just be a poacher anymore to play striker at the top teams - look at what Barca, Real, Bayern, PSG expect from their strikers. Pep even has reservations about Aguero's ability to contribute, and the guy has more goals than Lukaku.
Here's some perspective:
Mo Salah - 26 goals/9 assists
Firmino - 19 goals/10 assists
Sterling - 19 goals/10 assists
Salah and Firmino cost less than Lukaku combined, and none of them are actually strikers. Kane showed on Wednesday how a striker should lead the line. Defender's should be worried by a striker's presence, but Lukaku doesnt instill that because defenders know he takes an age to control the ball, giving them a chance to intercept, he's not particularly good in the air, so they can win headers against him, and he barely uses his physical advantage, so they dont have to worry about trying to get in a tussle with him. Drogba's a good comparator - he was never a prolific goalscorer, but a nightmare for defenders, and one of the reasons Lampard got so many goals (it usually took two defenders to deal with Drogba).
That's probably his biggest weakness - taking ages to control the ball. It's worth noting as well that while Drogba used height to his advantage, his decision making was lightning fast, it would take split of second for him to control a ball (see his goal against united in the cup final whilst squeezed in between Vidic and Ferdinand). I think Lukaku could do with losing a few pounds of muscle too; it does slow you down after all.
Standards have fallen so low that many feel we should be happy that we have a guy on a books who can knock in goals against fodder without offering much else.
Yesterday;s display was a fine example of folks being easily pleased and a goal disguising a poor performance. He was terrible until he scored the goal, which was a very good finish might I add. He certainly knows where the goal is, when you are putting it on a plate for him.
What pissed me off is seeing him standing around fully marked, and demanding a pass to his feet while he's in a bad position, and then stretching his arms and shrugging his shoulders in dismay as if he was going to do something productive had a team mate passed to him when we know very well he'd have played another simple pass or fumbled over due to a first touch taking the ball away from his feet, where he would then need to run on to it.
Even the other players around him on our team are hestitant to pass the ball to him because they know he will be vulnerable once on the receiving end of a pass which will usually lead to losss of possession.
But really, 90 million for a tap in merchant? Is that what we should be grateful for??
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Here is my fundamental problem with him/ our team with him currently.
Bare in mind i want to him to suceed
My problem is he is a striker that feeds off chances, as well his hold up a build-up play is poor most games although he does do some great long passes every now and again.
The problem being with create maybe 1 chance for him per game and sometimes not even that. That is simply piss poor. Now i imagine that is a mixture of or player not creating and him not being in the correct place.
So that leaves us with this, should we be playing a striker who needs chances to contribute when we basically create none for him or maybe we should play Martial up front. He has better hold up build up play etc..
TLDR If we actually created Lukaku chances i would be confident he would score a lot but the simple fact is we dont create for him at all.
Bare in mind i want to him to suceed
My problem is he is a striker that feeds off chances, as well his hold up a build-up play is poor most games although he does do some great long passes every now and again.
The problem being with create maybe 1 chance for him per game and sometimes not even that. That is simply piss poor. Now i imagine that is a mixture of or player not creating and him not being in the correct place.
So that leaves us with this, should we be playing a striker who needs chances to contribute when we basically create none for him or maybe we should play Martial up front. He has better hold up build up play etc..
TLDR If we actually created Lukaku chances i would be confident he would score a lot but the simple fact is we dont create for him at all.
I know this will sound weird in this very macho game of football.... but why not have him do ballet lessons? That would help him get up on those toes of his, and improve his balance, especially when he's in very tight spaces.
I could have sworn I saw a player's training photo from some team where ballet was incorporated into their routine. I'll try and find it.
I've never been a fan of his. But we don't play to his strengths at all. He seems to absolutely thrive on crosses but we don't seem to play with much width or put in a ton of crosses in.
I am sure if we did he would score a lot more goals.
I am sure if we did he would score a lot more goals.
This has been obvious from the moment we signed him. His strength has never been his hold up play. That was the most ridiculed part of his game. Hi thrives on crosses and balls in behind. Why he was signed for a role that Jose always needs in his strikers when he was never good at it is on Jose's head I'm afraid.
It might be worth trying him from the right with the instruction to cut in.
Every time I’ve seen him do this during a match he’s looked quality.
Despite being a big lad, he’s most definately not a target man (wins very few headers, doesn’t hold the ball up and gets bullied by defenders too easily) so maybe we should try something different with him?
Every time I’ve seen him do this during a match he’s looked quality.
Despite being a big lad, he’s most definately not a target man (wins very few headers, doesn’t hold the ball up and gets bullied by defenders too easily) so maybe we should try something different with him?
I actually think he's been alright. Ok, he's had a few crap games but he has looked good when running at defences and in counter attacks and he has played some great passes which surprised me. He has a fair few good assists.
This place has serious bipolar issues. Here are some of our results from last year:
Stoke 1-1 (H)
Burnley 1-1 (H)
Everton 1-1 (A)
West Ham 1-1 (H)
Stoke 1-1 (A)
Hull City 0-0 (H)
Bournemouth 1-1 (H)
WBA 1-1 (H)
Everton 1-1 (H)
Swansea 1-1 (H)
Southampton 0-0 (A)
11 draws against teams who we should be beating 9/10. 11 points from these 11 games.
This season:
Stoke 3-0 (H)
Burnley 2-2 (H)
Everton 0-2 (A)
West Ham 4-0 (H)
Stoke 2-2 (A)
Huddersfield 2-0 (H)
Bournemouth 1-0 (H)
WBA yet to play
Everton 4-0 (H)
Swansea yet to play
Southampton 0-1 (A)
So from 9 of the games (swapped Hull for Huddersfield), we've won 8 and drawn 1 - with two to play. That's 25 points in comparison to 9 points, last season - he's a huge reason why we're significantly better than in every season since SAF. He's scored in 7 of those games.
Last season, and even in these previous three, we've constantly struggled against relegation fodder and it's a huge reason as to why we've missed out on the CL twice in four seasons. In fact struggling against them was just one issue, many of them came to Old Trafford to "play" with the belief that they could beat us. Not this year, though as we've got part of our mojo back and made OT into the fortress it once was. We were crying out for someone to put his chance his way and help win us points in games where we've dropped far more than we should and that's exactly what the big man has done.
All that's bloody needed is for him, and the rest of the club (players and Mourinho included) to step up in the big games and we'll be challenging for the league.
Stoke 1-1 (H)
Burnley 1-1 (H)
Everton 1-1 (A)
West Ham 1-1 (H)
Stoke 1-1 (A)
Hull City 0-0 (H)
Bournemouth 1-1 (H)
WBA 1-1 (H)
Everton 1-1 (H)
Swansea 1-1 (H)
Southampton 0-0 (A)
11 draws against teams who we should be beating 9/10. 11 points from these 11 games.
This season:
Stoke 3-0 (H)
Burnley 2-2 (H)
Everton 0-2 (A)
West Ham 4-0 (H)
Stoke 2-2 (A)
Huddersfield 2-0 (H)
Bournemouth 1-0 (H)
WBA yet to play
Everton 4-0 (H)
Swansea yet to play
Southampton 0-1 (A)
So from 9 of the games (swapped Hull for Huddersfield), we've won 8 and drawn 1 - with two to play. That's 25 points in comparison to 9 points, last season - he's a huge reason why we're significantly better than in every season since SAF. He's scored in 7 of those games.
Last season, and even in these previous three, we've constantly struggled against relegation fodder and it's a huge reason as to why we've missed out on the CL twice in four seasons. In fact struggling against them was just one issue, many of them came to Old Trafford to "play" with the belief that they could beat us. Not this year, though as we've got part of our mojo back and made OT into the fortress it once was. We were crying out for someone to put his chance his way and help win us points in games where we've dropped far more than we should and that's exactly what the big man has done.
All that's bloody needed is for him, and the rest of the club (players and Mourinho included) to step up in the big games and we'll be challenging for the league.
I love the comparisons with the lesser players but if they are the same of better why have they not score as many goals as he has? Sorry this is exactly like the Felliani signing. Most wanted Morata or Griezmann and this is the fallout of not signing them. No ones saying he's Ronaldo but give him service and he'll score. I could funny understand it if that wasn't the case but the service to him as been limited at best.
Feck, reading that, I just had a mental image of Lukaku wearing Natalie Portman's dress from Black Swan and dancing.
Feck, reading that, I just had a mental image of Lukaku wearing Natalie Portman's dress from Black Swan and dancing.
I don't mean for him to wear a dress!Though I do wonder if they could find something to fit that big feet of his
By the way, as a kid, Rio Ferdinand did some ballet - true story!
His link up play is actually ok, it’s his hold up play that needs to be better.
I thought his hold up play was pretty good yesterday.
I think it’s more when we go long that he struggles with hold up. Even when he was at Everton I remember Blind not really struggling much when the ball went long into Lukaku.
Ballet wouldn't make him significantly more nimble and quick-footed at his age.
His flat-footedness is ingrained in him. His gait, bone structure, leg length, foot shape.... etc. all dictate how quickly he can move parts of his body at speed.
Exactly, how many games this year would have been drawn again only for him? More than a few I expect.
That's an admission that he can't do these things, which is nonsense. He feels like he's been around for a decade but he's still learning his trade. I'm not having that he can't use his bulk more effectively than he does at the moment .
Wonder if we should try a front three of Martial - Sanchez - Lukaku, with Alexis having the false 9 role up front. That way we can play 3 in midfield. Might be worth a try in the big games.
Feck, reading that, I just had a mental image of Lukaku wearing Natalie Portman's dress from Black Swan and dancing.
somebody has got to photoshop Lukaku in a tutu!Ballet! I really have heard it all now.
RVP had 18 league goals by this point in 12/13. Having scored against City away, Chelsea away and Liverpool away to add to his goal at home to Arsenal, basically all the big games.
I cant believe you made that comparison to be honest.
Ballet! I really have heard it all now.
You just need to look at the games. The player is not good enough for a top team.
You can tell the posters who think this should all play out like a game of football manager, some of these new posters haven't got a clue, the old moaners are already established so no surprise there....
Glad there are a few posters who know wtf they are talking about (falling on deaf ears tho).
We should be able to downvote posters and send them straight back to the newbies.
Moaner quote response in 3, 2...
Glad there are a few posters who know wtf they are talking about (falling on deaf ears tho).
We should be able to downvote posters and send them straight back to the newbies.
Moaner quote response in 3, 2...
A “top club” should be creating chances left, right and center, like United last year, for example. All they needed was a prolific #9 to put them away. Now Lukaku gets here and we expect him to be a false nine and be heavily involved in the build up? Nah.
Listen, we knew what we were getting with Lukaku so to expect anything different now is delusional. He finishes off chances. That’s his job. Feed him and he’ll score. He’s reaching Jonny Evans territory of scapegoating, and after a win no less.
Listen, we knew what we were getting with Lukaku so to expect anything different now is delusional. He finishes off chances. That’s his job. Feed him and he’ll score. He’s reaching Jonny Evans territory of scapegoating, and after a win no less.
Agreed.
Lukaku is a terrific striker, and if you feed him (as they should) then he'll score non stop.
And also scoring in it.
I posted his conversion rate just above this post...
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Agreed. He needs to take more long shots. He's got a powerful strike.
Don’t tell him about how strikers like Aguero and Salah have missed more ‘big chances’ this season. That might blow their mind.
The stats back up the ‘he gets feck all service’ narrative as much people think it’s bollocks. He’s not Lionel Messi no but he’s a great finisher. It’s our attack that’s the problem.
Do you think an RVP type player would thrive in this United setup alongside players like Martial and Rashford? Let's not forget how drastically RVNs goals reduced after Beckham's departure. He hated playing with Ronaldo and constantly complained about the quality of service. In the end we looked better going forward with Saha and things came to a head at the 2006 league cup final when he was benched. Looks like Lukaku is the new Andy Cole around here.
Ruud averaged 30 goals a year during his entire time at United, which is exactly what we need. RvP imo, was simply not on that level for a long enough period of time. We need an out and out striker who is a deadly finisher. Unfortunately other than Kane, Lewandowski, and maybe one or two others, there simply aren't enough of them around these days.
Ruud averaged 30 indeed but there was a steep drop off after Beckham left. In his first season he scored 36 and he scored 44 (his best) in his second. In his final three seasons he managed 30, 16 and 24. Lukaku has scored 19 so far in his first season and has made 6 assists. He's surely on his way to 30 at least for the season if he stays fit so if you're judging him on his goals contribution don't you think you should maybe wait until the end of the season?
Lukaku rate would probably get him 30 goals or more this season despite much worse service than RVN had. Alexis if he keeps up with the level he showed yesterday game, would be a great boost for Lukaku.
It's another case when people just look at how others is doing and project their expectation and disregarding every thing else.
Can't see Van Nistlerooy linking up with Sanchez and Martial at all . They would be way too unpredictable for him he would throwing strops all round every time they took an extra touch or dribble .
Van Persie I could see working well and a fit Saha that didn't break down would be unstoppable
He only played half a season in year 4 so there would obviously be a drop off, but if you extrapolate his performance over an entire season it would equal more than 30 that year. Also, he continued his 30 goal average into his first year at Madrid.
For me, Lukaku, is basically a poor man's Drogba. He may get a good number of goals but you just never have any confidence that he will score when we can use a goal, which is something the likes of RvN, Ibra, and RvP provided.
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