Replacing Rooney

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VoetbalWizard said:
whilst I do not agree with evangelicals, maybe this part isn't so bad right now all things considering.

Regarding Kaka's age, any expensive players will be 26 or younger. Even if you swap say kaka + 10 million for rooney, you are effectively pricing kaka at 30-40 million quid. That opportunity cost is very real and the club wont spend it on a 29 year old player that has essentially zero value after his contract is up here.

It is a shit policy IMO, but that's the situation we are in right now.

There are also questions still about his fitness even when he comes back healthy. I am biased towards Kaka, but the club might feel that if they aren't going to get the Kaka of 2007, then it isn't worth it at all.
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Good point(s) there kiddo, we have to assume that after only a season and a half, which whilst not the standard he was with Milan still hasn't been poor thus far for Real, that the club and the player wouldn't want to switch after such a short period.
Benzema is another matter, he looks out of sorts at Madrid and it would only be pride halting a move away, surely.
The transfer speculation surrounding Rooney claims that Real, or any other club like City or Chelsea, would have to pay more than the eighty million quid they paid for Ronaldo. Certainly three months ago, this may have been the case due to his outstanding season last year, but with his current form that might have diminished, but in saying that, you'd still be confident United could get £50 million PLUS Benzema.
Real wouldn't take a massive hit on the fifty-odd million or whatever it was they paid for Kaka....if Fergie really wanted Kaka, I'd assume we'd get somewhere in the region of £25 million plus Kaka if they really want Rooney, that's my take on it and I think that'd be a fair deal for both parties.
 
Scoreboard Red said:
Good point(s) there kiddo, we have to assume that after only a season and a half, which whilst not the standard he was with Milan still hasn't been poor thus far for Real, that the club and the player wouldn't want to switch after such a short period.
Benzema is another matter, he looks out of sorts at Madrid and it would only be pride halting a move away, surely.
The transfer speculation surrounding Rooney claims that Real, or any other club like City or Chelsea, would have to pay more than the eighty million quid they paid for Ronaldo. Certainly three months ago, this may have been the case due to his outstanding season last year, but with his current form that might have diminished, but in saying that, you'd still be confident United could get £50 million PLUS Benzema.
Real wouldn't take a massive hit on the fifty-odd million or whatever it was they paid for Kaka....if Fergie really wanted Kaka, I'd assume we'd get somewhere in the region of £25 million plus Kaka if they really want Rooney, that's my take on it and I think that'd be a fair deal for both parties.
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I'd take a 23yr old Kaka for 50m, but a 27yr old one with niggling injuries ongoing for a season... Sounds like OH Mark II so I'd stay away from Kaka' for now.

Even the risk for Pastore and his stupid price tag makes up for another injury prone imo.

Not that Kaka' isn't a good player mind u, I just dont' want us to risk an injury prone player atm, we have too many of them...

Would love to have Kaka' at his prime with us.
 
TonyMontana said:
he's just 19.
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What's your point...are you saying he is a match for Rooney, or potentially will be?

We need a striker who can replace Rooney NOW! We all panicked with Valencia 'replacing' Ronaldo, but Rooney filled the goal-scoring void whilst Valencia offered his differing but equally effective version of right-wing play.

Can Macheda score twenty-odd goals a year for us? I seriously doubt it.

Macheda is seemingly put on the same pedestal as some of the other great strikers of modern times by people on here, yes he is nineteen but by the same age players like Fowler, Owen, Rooney, Pato etc were all first team regulars by the age of eighteen and performing. Macheda isn't getting games and when he does, only offers glimpses of potential.

There is a flip-side in that other good strikers like Ruud van Nistelrooy, Teddy Sheringham, Didier Drogba etc weren't known about until their mid-twenties at least and they went on to shine later in their career...but these examples were with lesser clubs. If Macheda cannot show that he is a top-quality striker with a top-quality club like United with the support and skill around him, how else can you claim he is top-notch?
 
RedThaiDevils#7 said:
I'd take a 23yr old Kaka for 50m, but a 27yr old one with niggling injuries ongoing for a season... Sounds like OH Mark II so I'd stay away from Kaka' for now.

Even the risk for Pastore and his stupid price tag makes up for another injury prone imo.

Not that Kaka' isn't a good player mind u, I just dont' want us to risk an injury prone player atm, we have too many of them...

Would love to have Kaka' at his prime with us.
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Has Kaka's career been littered with injuries? Not that I recall, this is the first one I know about, he was almost ever-present for Milan in the Champions League between 2005-2009...
 
Scoreboard Red said:
Has Kaka's career been littered with injuries? Not that I recall, this is the first one I know about, he was almost ever-present for Milan in the Champions League between 2005-2009...
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Try getting more info. on his current injury and you'd know why it is caused a huge risk. If he was sent to the surgeons a bit more late due to overdoing himself, we would have seen Kaka retiring already.
 
Scoreboard Red said:
What's your point...are you saying he is a match for Rooney, or potentially will be?

We need a striker who can replace Rooney NOW! We all panicked with Valencia 'replacing' Ronaldo, but Rooney filled the goal-scoring void whilst Valencia offered his differing but equally effective version of right-wing play.

Can Macheda score twenty-odd goals a year for us? I seriously doubt it.

Macheda is seemingly put on the same pedestal as some of the other great strikers of modern times by people on here, yes he is nineteen but by the same age players like Fowler, Owen, Rooney, Pato etc were all first team regulars by the age of eighteen and performing. Macheda isn't getting games and when he does, only offers glimpses of potential.

There is a flip-side in that other good strikers like Ruud van Nistelrooy, Teddy Sheringham, Didier Drogba etc weren't known about until their mid-twenties at least and they went on to shine later in their career...but these examples were with lesser clubs. If Macheda cannot show that he is a top-quality striker with a top-quality club like United with the support and skill around him, how else can you claim he is top-notch?
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I don't think Tony's trying to claim that he's top notch... I know the urge for a top notch CF... But for Macheda's case, the potential was there to be seen... Not that he is already a world beater, we're talking about potential and SAF has identified that Macheda is a good potential which is the soul reason why we're not letting other clubs get a sniff at him.

Now in the case that you'd like a new worldclass striker, if Rooney were to leave then all Man Utd fans would be silly not to want a new striker.

But we would be also called silly if we were to rule out a 19 year old just because of a few glimpses that we've seen from him.

Let's give him a bit more time, its not like he is on 90k a week.
 
RedThaiDevils#7 said:
I don't think Tony's trying to claim that he's top notch... I know the urge for a top notch CF... But for Macheda's case, the potential was there to be seen... Not that he is already a world beater, we're talking about potential and SAF has identified that Macheda is a good potential which is the soul reason why we're not letting other clubs get a sniff at him.

Now in the case that you'd like a new worldclass striker, if Rooney were to leave then all Man Utd fans would be silly not to want a new striker.

But we would be also called silly if we were to rule out a 19 year old just because of a few glimpses that we've seen from him.

Let's give him a bit more time, its not like he is on 90k a week.
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Yeah, I agree, let's give him a bit more time...in the squad, this is my point! You lot are seemingly saying we're fine Rooney is leaving as we have Hernandez and Macheda. Hernandez is doing very well and scoring and I see him as an Ole-type to get the odd game here and there and come off the bench, but Macheda is less than impressive. I'm not saying get rid of him, he will be a good addition to the squad but he is simply not up to standard at this present time.

I'm saying we need a high-quality established replacement for Rooney once he leaves and as soon as he leaves...
 
Scoreboard Red said:
Yeah, I agree, let's give him a bit more time...in the squad, this is my point! You lot are seemingly saying we're fine Rooney is leaving as we have Hernandez and Macheda. Hernandez is doing very well and scoring and I see him as an Ole-type to get the odd game here and there and come off the bench, but Macheda is less than impressive. I'm not saying get rid of him, he will be a good addition to the squad but he is simply not up to standard at this present time.

I'm saying we need a high-quality established replacement for Rooney once he leaves and as soon as he leaves...
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Try reading my posts again, I'm more the type that is happy with the potential we have as I identify Macheda/Hernandez/Diouf as good potential, I don't mind if you disagree with me on this as the latter aren't even 23 yet...

If we were to go for an established player, I've already posted my analysis on who I want which is Suarez.

The thing which is always going to be a debate point is the value for the player and wanting a new signing...

I'm trying more to picture out the clubs benefit, not own muppetry which I name tens of players in which i'd want...
 
Suarez would be brilliant wouldn't cost the bank and would be massive the lad can even play on the wing if needed which we wouldn't but could come in handy if we have Chica and Berba up Front, plus he is willing to take on players which rooney has seem to have lost in the last few years. plus he can shoot OUTSIDE the box which rooney has seem to lost as well.
 
CR#7 said:
Suarez would be brilliant wouldn't cost the bank and would be massive the lad can even play on the wing if needed which we wouldn't but could come in handy if we have Chica and Berba up Front, plus he is willing to take on players which rooney has seem to have lost in the last few years. plus he can shoot OUTSIDE the box which rooney has seem to lost as well.
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I concur, totally...
Seventy goals in two seasons in any league is outstanding, plus he is not a Ruud-esque type of goal-merchant, he makes his own goals, takes on players, free-kicks, long-range, tap-ins etc...
 
Scoreboard Red said:
Yeah, I agree, let's give him a bit more time...in the squad, this is my point! You lot are seemingly saying we're fine Rooney is leaving as we have Hernandez and Macheda. Hernandez is doing very well and scoring and I see him as an Ole-type to get the odd game here and there and come off the bench, but Macheda is less than impressive. I'm not saying get rid of him, he will be a good addition to the squad but he is simply not up to standard at this present time.

I'm saying we need a high-quality established replacement for Rooney once he leaves and as soon as he leaves...
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Not really.. i think we will cope very well even in Rooney's absence. I mean, the cnut has done feck all in 6 months, ie just 1 goal. With the funds, we have to strengthen our midfield, especially a creative centre midfielder and a left winger, both of which must possess the ability to beat players and bags of pace. With the midfield sorted out, even Macheda will be hitting 15-20goals a season. The problem isn't with Macheda, but the lack of service from an extremely pedestrian and unimaginative, slow midfield.
 
If Rooney leaves we need a top class replacement. Kaka and Benzema for Rooney? And we need an Essien clone n'all.
 
That said we have some brilliant prospects developing but if he goes in Jan ....
 
Can someone point me how a 40m Kaka' aged 27 is anywhere near the word value in money ?

Adding the fact that the guy is injured ( just recovered from a very serious injury )

Hasn't played good football for almost a year now... as of course he was carrying an injury with him the whole time...

Not in our policies as he is older than 26...

I mean you can go on about his past heroics which I think he was an awesome player... But his price tag just makes him to big of a risk... + injuries.

Kaka is a good name, but so is Bebe', also Mame would love a say.
 
Sky Sports | Manchester United News | Football | Premier League | Roy - United may want Torres

Roy Hodgson has admitted that Wayne Rooney's desire to leave Manchester United is likely to prompt interest in Fernando Torres from their arch-rivals.

Rooney declared on Wednesday that he was heading for the exit door at Old Trafford after six years at the club, prompting immediate speculation about who his replacement will be in United's attacking line.

Chelsea and Manchester City were both linked with a move for Torres during the summer, and with Liverpool's awful form this season so far and the Spanish international cutting a forlorn, frustrated figure at Anfield, speculation over his future is likely to continue.

Hodgson however stated that Torres, who was linked with a move to United before joining the Reds in 2007, would not be the only name on Sir Alex Ferguson's wanted list.

"I think I'd have to say we'd cross that bridge when we come to it," the Reds boss said when asked about the threat of United possibly trying to sign Torres.

Target
"I am pretty sure when a great player like Wayne Rooney is looking to leave his club, Manchester United will be in a position to target an awful lot of players around the world.

"I don't think Fernando Torres would be the only player they will be targeting or [we would be] the only club worried their star striker is going to be a target.

"They will have the opportunity to replace him with many star strikers around the world, so all I can say is I am not naive to the situation.

"I am not naive enough to think there is no danger we will ever lose a player like Fernando Torres.

"I can only hope we won't and I will make certain I do everything in my power to keep him happy at the club, help him improve his current form and to get him playing for Liverpool as he has in the past."
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Would be interesting if we actually went in for Torres. I know I'd want him here despite his injury problems. However, a nice exchange for Benzema + Kaka would be great as well.
 
RedThaiDevils#7 said:
Can someone point me how a 40m Kaka' aged 27 is anywhere near the word value in money ?

Adding the fact that the guy is injured ( just recovered from a very serious injury )

Hasn't played good football for almost a year now... as of course he was carrying an injury with him the whole time...

Not in our policies as he is older than 26...

I mean you can go on about his past heroics which I think he was an awesome player... But his price tag just makes him to big of a risk... + injuries.

Kaka is a good name, but so is Bebe', also Mame would love a say.
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Alot of people said the same of Giggs when he was going through a rough patch a few years back. And look what happened. Class is never lost, and if there's anyone who could revitalise Kaka, it could be SAF.
 
Freak said:
Alot of people said the same of Giggs when he was going through a rough patch a few years back. And look what happened. Class is never lost, and if there's anyone who could revitalise Kaka, it could be SAF.
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Giggsy didn't have a hefty price tag on his neck didn't he ?

We're talking about risk and a 40m player who has been struggling with injury ( a very serious one mind you ) is a big risk...

Not saying Kaka won't be the same person again, if he does get back to his peak, good for him... Will SAF be the one to do it ? I won't call it impossible but given the facts I'm sure he is eyeing younger prospects which are no where near 40m...
 
RedThaiDevils#7 said:
Giggsy didn't have a hefty price tag on his neck didn't he ?

We're talking about risk and a 40m player who has been struggling with injury ( a very serious one mind you ) is a big risk...

Not saying Kaka won't be the same person again, if he does get back to his peak, good for him... Will SAF be the one to do it ? I won't call it impossible but given the facts I'm sure he is eyeing younger prospects which are no where near 40m...
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If we do sell Rooney to Real Madrid, we should at least make an effort to get Kaka in return. He is a top class player who would be worth the risk. Anyways, I don't think Kaka would even come to Man Utd.
 
puNANI said:
If we do sell Rooney to Real Madrid, we should at least make an effort to get Kaka in return. He is a top class player who would be worth the risk. Anyways, I don't think Kaka would even come to Man Utd.
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Kaka is still a good player, but I do think he's past his best. If we are going to invest huge sums, we should buy players who are still at their prime.
 
I hope we don't even think about going for someone who might turn out to be good. Of course when it works - like it did with Ronaldo and many others - it's brilliant, but it's something that should be tried only as a supplement to a strong position. When Rooney leaves, our front line will be weak. There is no two ways about it. Aside from Berbatov, we'd be relying on an ageing crock and a couple of young nobodies to come good. We need a striker who will be very likely to perform and make a big impact. Unfortunately that'll cost, but even with the way the club's finances are, I'm sure the owners will be able to see that the potential in lost income over the long term if we fail to replace Rooney will be massive compared to the sort of transfer fee we would need to pay for one of the best strikers in the world.
 
We need to buy the best up and coming striker in the world, to replace Rooney, as that is what we did when we bought him. The question is - who fits THAT bill?
 
I wouldn't want Torres. Don't get me wrong; great player and all but I have my doubts on his fitness in the long run. Could turn out to be Owen II
 
Crustanoid said:
We need to buy the best up and coming striker in the world, to replace Rooney, as that is what we did when we bought him. The question is - who fits THAT bill?
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Aguero/Suarez would do fine imo. Thats if we're not talking about Value of the money stuff..

Dzeko won't be bad...

Neymar looks awesome imo. Chelsea bound though...

Torres just to piss off the scousers :lol:
 
Hitchcocker said:
I wouldn't want Torres. Don't get me wrong; great player and all but I have my doubts on his fitness in the long run. Could turn out to be Owen II
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Same here...

Moreover i m a bit suspicious about the timing of Hodgson's statement re: united's interest in Torres.
It looked as if he was inviting united to bid for him
 
RedThaiDevils#7 said:
Giggsy didn't have a hefty price tag on his neck didn't he ?

We're talking about risk and a 40m player who has been struggling with injury ( a very serious one mind you ) is a big risk...

Not saying Kaka won't be the same person again, if he does get back to his peak, good for him... Will SAF be the one to do it ? I won't call it impossible but given the facts I'm sure he is eyeing younger prospects which are no where near 40m...
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The price tag won't be an issue because if we do get him, it's going to be part of some swap deal with rooney. We would not be forking out money for him as simple as that.
 
Do people really think enough of the proceeds of a Rooney sale will be made available to reinvest??

There'll be no replacement.

Hernandez and Macheda will move up the pecking order and that'll be that.
 
Dans said:
Do people really think enough of the proceeds of a Rooney sale will be made available to reinvest??

There'll be no replacement.

Hernandez and Macheda will move up the pecking order and that'll be that.
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same here....if there will be any funds available, they will go towards a goalkeeper and central midfielder. But it wont be easy introducing new players when the team is in transition
 
RedThaiDevils#7 said:
Aguero/Suarez would do fine imo. Thats if we're not talking about Value of the money stuff..

Dzeko won't be bad...

Neymar looks awesome imo. Chelsea bound though...

Torres just to piss off the scousers :lol:
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Aguero is definitely the type of player we would want ability wise but there have always been doubts about his fitness. We don't have a great track record with Argentinian players either.

Suarez doesn't look good enough to me.

If we're talking about quality youngish players then personally I would love to see us try to sign Thomas Muller. Then if we cannot get Torres (he is quality and PL proven) then Pato.
 
RedThaiDevils#7 said:
Aguero/Suarez would do fine imo. Thats if we're not talking about Value of the money stuff..

Dzeko won't be bad...

Neymar looks awesome imo. Chelsea bound though...

Torres just to piss off the scousers :lol:
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in the history of united and liverpool there have been transfers between the two clubs with a monetary total of £34,000 and the last transfer was in 1964,this will never happen!!

but, yes!! it would be nice just to piss off the scousers!!
 
RedThaiDevils#7 said:
Aguero/Suarez would do fine imo. Thats if we're not talking about Value of the money stuff..

Dzeko won't be bad...

Neymar looks awesome imo. Chelsea bound though...

Torres just to piss off the scousers :lol:
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Aguero, like Neymar, has also said he wants to go to Chelsea.

Our more realistic targets would be Suarez, Dzeko or Benzema (if they were taking Rooney).

But I'd like to see us try for Pato or Thomas Muller.

Torres is a crock - feck knows why we'd even consider him. We've got our fair share of sick notes already. At this rate we'll be buidling an extension to the medical room before the south stand extension.
 
Dans said:
Do people really think enough of the proceeds of a Rooney sale will be made available to reinvest??

There'll be no replacement.

Hernandez and Macheda will move up the pecking order and that'll be that.
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Actually, yes. The ' star player ' factor which brings in an awful lot of income to the club will go down quite a lot with Rooney's departure. Not that it matters much to us lot but it can heavily swing the accounts in a direction the club cant afford to go in.
 
This is more of an issue for me than losing Rooney- just who will we go for?? anybody who is coming in to replace him will have to be decent.... and anybody of that calibre will surely have the clubs with money to burn having a look as well. Wouldn't surprise me if SAF declares "theres no value in the market" then promptly goes out and invests in youth.
 
Who will replace Rooney... club captain Vidic votes for ..... Torres ! hehehe.. seriously, if Torres can stay fit, he'll be the perfect replacement.
 
Scoreboard Red said:
I concur, totally...
Seventy goals in two seasons in any league is outstanding, plus he is not a Ruud-esque type of goal-merchant, he makes his own goals, takes on players, free-kicks, long-range, tap-ins etc...
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I rate him aswell. Hes a far better player in an all round sense than I gave him credit for. Reminds of Tevez at times. I think he'd fit into the premiership easy enough aswell. Hes an arse like dalglish had
 
Names like Benzema, Pastore, Sanchez, Rodwell are exciting and all but I do think we'll be needing to add some experience to the squad in the near future. I don't necessarily mean in it in a "we need an established leading star" way, but rather we need an experienced personality, cool head, leadership on and off the field. The squad is very young as it is.
 
RedThaiDevils#7 said:
Can someone point me how a 40m Kaka' aged 27 is anywhere near the word value in money ?

Adding the fact that the guy is injured ( just recovered from a very serious injury )

Hasn't played good football for almost a year now... as of course he was carrying an injury with him the whole time...

Not in our policies as he is older than 26...

I mean you can go on about his past heroics which I think he was an awesome player... But his price tag just makes him to big of a risk... + injuries.

Kaka is a good name, but so is Bebe', also Mame would love a say.
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SAF has no problem buying experience if he needs too. Berbatov was 27 when we signed him, and that was at a time when our frontline was very young. With the inevitable departure of Giggs and Scholes we'll be left with a pretty young midfield, I see no reason why SAF won't invest in a top class 27/28 year old if needed, and if the 'value' is there obviously.

However, I'd nearly prefer Diarra over Kaka, as crazy as it seems!
 
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