[Schmeichels pinky]

I care for Man Utd and what players bring to this club. If they can't deliver then they can just feck off

That’s what it’s all about, isn’t it? We all want players who make us a better team.

I think your assessment of Hojlunds performances and skills are way off, but even if it weren’t things are not black and white, are they? What does “deliver” mean? What room does that term leave for interpretation regarding the circumstances under which a player has or hasn’t performed well? How should we judge a young player with a huge potential, who doesn’t “deliver” from his first game?

 

[Schmeichels pinky]

Højlund is backup striker at best next season or we go nowhere again.

Yeah, he’s obviously the reason we didn’t win the league.

 

[L1nk]

Joint top scorer despite everything and people still think he's the problem? This forum never ceases to amaze me

 

[RuudTom83]

Task for the summer is to find him a mentor, United have a potential gem in Hojlund, but he needs a bit of help up front and some guidance in training, but I think he had a great season all things considered.

 

[JeffFromHK]

he is a great player - he just need to work on his aerial ability and ability to find space himself in the box (zigzag runnings which players like Aguero, RVP and Chicharito were great at)

 

[lex talionis]

Joint top scorer despite everything and people still think he's the problem? This forum never ceases to amaze me

Who has written here that Hojlund is the one and only problem with United this season?

 

[D. Grayson]

I believe he had a successful first season in terms of goals; however, I believe his involvement disrupts the team's cohesiveness and detracts from our other attacking players.

 

[Mike Smalling]

Joint top scorer despite everything and people still think he's the problem? This forum never ceases to amaze me

Not only that, but discounting penalties he would be way out on his own as top scorer. I wonder what the narrative around him would be if he had taken penalties this season. Bruno has scored 6/7, so Højlund would likely have been on +20 goals if he had been taking them. People are creaming all over themselves over Cole Palmer for getting 22 league goals, but 9 of them have been penalties. It's often overlooked when talking about goal tallies.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

Not only that, but discounting penalties he would be way out on his own as top scorer. I wonder what the narrative around him would be if he had taken penalties this season. Bruno has scored 6/7, so Højlund would likely have been on +20 goals if he had been taking them. People are creaming all over themselves over Cole Palmer for getting 22 league goals, but 9 of them have been penalties. It's often overlooked when talking about goal tallies.

It's always overlooked and it drives me mad.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

I believe he had a successful first season in terms of goals; however, I believe his involvement disrupts the team's cohesiveness and detracts from our other attacking players.

This would make sense if our attack was "cohesive" without him, but it's not.

 

[D. Grayson]

This would make sense if our attack was "cohesive" without him, but it's not.

Last season, the team scored 108 goals and had an overall positive goal difference of 45. This season, they only scored 86 goals with a plus-2 goal difference. Additionally, the team created more chances last season, ranking 3rd in the league, while this season they ranked 16th. It's important to have a striker who can get involved in the game to bring out the best in our forward play. I don't think Rasmus has the skill set to do that.

 

[The holy trinity 68]

Last season, the team scored 108 goals and had an overall positive goal difference of 45. This season, they only scored 86 goals with a plus-2 goal difference. Additionally, the team created more chances last season, ranking 3rd in the league, while this season they ranked 16th. It's important to have a striker who can get involved in the game to bring out the best in our forward play. I don't think Rasmus has the skill set to do that.

Neither did Andy Cole but he learned it. Rasmus will be just fine. He is 21 and seems to have the work ethic to learn.

 

[ROFLUTION]

Last season, the team scored 108 goals and had an overall positive goal difference of 45. This season, they only scored 86 goals with a plus-2 goal difference. Additionally, the team created more chances last season, ranking 3rd in the league, while this season they ranked 16th. It's important to have a striker who can get involved in the game to bring out the best in our forward play. I don't think Rasmus has the skill set to do that.

So you’re faulting Højlund for Rashford not scoring a shitton of goals and half of our squad being injured leading to incoherent play/setup?

 

[ROFLUTION]

Joint top scorer despite everything and people still think he's the problem? This forum never ceases to amaze me

RedCafe in a nutshell:
Guy who scores most is the problem (Højlund)
Guy who creates the most is the problem (Bruno)

 

[diarm]

He has the second best conversion rate in the league and plays inside the greediest set of wide players in the league.

Set a team up to provide for him properly and he’ll score all the goals you want.

 

[LDUred]

He kind of scored a goal against Brighton as well in the home fixture. If that had been awarded it might have helped him along because it would have been his first league goal.

If you are using the top down World Cup tech I am pretty sure you would see a slight dent in the line calling it in, but the weird camera angle on one of the replays was just very sketchy and left it open to doubt. But yeah, a goal in that game could have made a significant difference in the grand scheme of things.

I think when assessing his season out of 10 it's 7 minimum and 8 tops. He's been good.

 

[Lyng]

Last season, the team scored 108 goals and had an overall positive goal difference of 45. This season, they only scored 86 goals with a plus-2 goal difference. Additionally, the team created more chances last season, ranking 3rd in the league, while this season they ranked 16th. It's important to have a striker who can get involved in the game to bring out the best in our forward play. I don't think Rasmus has the skill set to do that.

To blame that on the striker is incredible levels of madness.
Its about as daft as claiming we are receiving more shots on goal per game because of Onana.

 

[D. Grayson]

Neither did Andy Cole but he learned it. Rasmus will be just fine. He is 21 and seems to have the work ethic to learn.

Andy played alongside a strike partner and wide midfielders who delivered crosses. While Cole's overall game improved, let's not pretend he transformed into van Basten. His skill set was well-suited to the team, and he didn't have to completely change his game. Poachers don't become different players due to time and desire, as seen with Lukaku at Chelsea or Jović at Madrid. I'm concerned that Rasmus may not have the technical ability to be the lone striker for this team, and I don't think the team can play with two up top.

So you’re faulting Højlund for Rashford not scoring a shitton of goals and half of our squad being injured leading to incoherent play/setup?

Nope, I am saying our attacking output appeared to be blunted because Højlund is not capable of providing the type of interplay that players like Cavani, Martial, and Weghorst provided, which allowed Rashford to score a shitload of goals.

 

[sebsheep]

So you’re faulting Højlund for Rashford not scoring a shitton of goals and half of our squad being injured leading to incoherent play/setup?

He's also made us concede more

 

[D. Grayson]

To blame that on the striker is incredible levels of madness.
Its about as daft as claiming we are receiving more shots on goal per game because of Onana.

He's also made us concede more

We faced more shots on goal due to our snakebite defense. We generated fewer chances because our striker was unsuitable for the required role. it is not rocket science.

 

[LDUred]

To blame that on the striker is incredible levels of madness.
Its about as daft as claiming we are receiving more shots on goal per game because of Onana.

The levels of criticism and scrutiny are massively exaggerated for Hojlund.

Wout scored 2 goals in 31 appearances last season and was a complete atrocity in terms of forward play, constantly misplacing passes, running into other player's space, giving away pointless fouls, being hopeless in the air, etc.

Hojlund has added that physical element to our attack and also contributed in the final third.

 

[sebsheep]

We faced more shots on goal due to our snakebite defense. We generated fewer chances because our striker was unsuitable for the required role. it is not rocket science.

Starting to feel like it.
You can accept the defence has been part of the issue for goals conceded but want to put the blame for our lack of creativity on the striker.
Something we were poor at in the latter half of last season and before he came into the team this season.

 

[D. Grayson]

Starting to feel like it.
You can accept the defence has been part of the issue for goals conceded but want to put the blame for our lack of creativity on the striker.
Something we were poor at in the latter half of last season and before he came into the team this season.

The presence of a number 9 who gets involved in build-up play is crucial for the team's performance. A striker like Martial enables Rashford to make runs and receive quick passes, while also creating opportunities for Bruno to play balls behind the defense when they focus on marking the striker closer to the center circle.

 

[ROFLUTION]

Andy played alongside a strike partner and wide midfielders who delivered crosses. While Cole's overall game improved, let's not pretend he transformed into van Basten. His skill set was well-suited to the team, and he didn't have to completely change his game. Poachers don't become different players due to time and desire, as seen with Lukaku at Chelsea or Jović at Madrid. I'm concerned that Rasmus may not have the technical ability to be the lone striker for this team, and I don't think the team can play with two up top.



Nope, I am saying our attacking output appeared to be blunted because Højlund is not capable of providing the type of interplay that players like Cavani, Martial, and Weghorst provided, which allowed Rashford to score a shitload of goals.

I think you’re overrating them to be honest. Only one of them played regularly, so it’s not like you can say there’s a constant in there. Also Rashford wasn’t great when Cavani was here.

 

[ROFLUTION]

He's also made us concede more

In fact Scholes, Pep and Ten Hag has gotten more ever since he signed. Many clear patterns if you just look for them.

 

[D. Grayson]

I think you’re overrating them to be honest. Only one of them played regularly, so it’s not like you can say there’s a constant in there. Also Rashford wasn’t great when Cavani was here.

In the seasons Cavani played regularly, Rashford was involved in 20 league goals.

 

[sebsheep]

The presence of a number 9 who gets involved in build-up play is crucial for the team's performance. A striker like Martial enables Rashford to make runs and receive quick passes, while also creating opportunities for Bruno to play balls behind the defense when they focus on marking the striker closer to the center circle.

Here's his goals from last season. The striker getting involved in build up (which Hojlund is actually capable of when we pass to him) wasn't anywhere near as important as you're claiming.

 

[Lyng]

The presence of a number 9 who gets involved in build-up play is crucial for the team's performance. A striker like Martial enables Rashford to make runs and receive quick passes, while also creating opportunities for Bruno to play balls behind the defense when they focus on marking the striker closer to the center circle.

it seems you fail to understand how to use Højlund. Much like Ten Hag until the last two games.
Højlund is at his best and excellent in the build up play when allowed to run channels. Using him as a target man is limiting his use and ability to help the team.
His lay off work and passing play mixed with blistering pace is levels above Weghorst who was really only good as a target man to stand there and lay it off.
Much like with our defences increased work load and our midfield failing it all falls back to a terrible setup by our current manager.

 

[ROFLUTION]

In the seasons Cavani played regularly, Rashford was involved in 20 league goals.

regularly is a bit of a stretch though, no? Was injured on and off and in and out of the starting 11 if my memory serves me correct. Hard to attribute any of Rashford’s succes to him imo.

edit: just checked and memory serves me correct. 26 games in total with many being subbed on or off. A bit surprised to see that Cavani rarely scored against big clubs in that season.

 

[Red00012]

I think he’ll start on the bench Saturday

 

[El Zoido]

I think he’ll start on the bench Saturday

I agree. He’s been a good impact sub recently but the game will likely be out of sight by the time it comes to that.

 

[Schmeichels pinky]

Last season, the team scored 108 goals and had an overall positive goal difference of 45. This season, they only scored 86 goals with a plus-2 goal difference. Additionally, the team created more chances last season, ranking 3rd in the league, while this season they ranked 16th. It's important to have a striker who can get involved in the game to bring out the best in our forward play. I don't think Rasmus has the skill set to do that.

This is the worst take I’ve seen in here. Do you know the difference between correlation and causation?

 

[D. Grayson]

it seems you fail to understand how to use Højlund. Much like Ten Hag until the last two games.
Højlund is at his best and excellent in the build up play when allowed to run channels. Using him as a target man is limiting his use and ability to help the team.
His lay off work and passing play mixed with blistering pace is levels above Weghorst who was really only good as a target man to stand there and lay it off.
Much like with our defences increased work load and our midfield failing it all falls back to a terrible setup by our current manager.

The team was at its best when our wide player ran the channels and the center-forward held up play. Højlund seems to be a square peg in a round hole. In my opinion, his inability to play the required role is limiting the use and ability of our other attackers. Højlund is a better individual player than Weghorst, but Weghorst was better for the team.

regularly is a bit of a stretch though, no? Was injured on and off and in and out of the starting 11 if my memory serves me correct. Hard to attribute any of Rashford’s succes to him imo.

edit: just checked and memory serves me correct. 26 games in total with many being subbed on or off. A bit surprised to see that Cavani rarely scored against big clubs in that season.

During that season, the other forward in the rotation was Martial, who had the skillset required to play the role. The undeniable truth is that when we have a forward who can drop deep and play in the half-space the team performs better.

Here's his goals from last season. The striker getting involved in build up (which Hojlund is actually capable of when we pass to him) wasn't anywhere near as important as you're claiming

The forwards dropping into the half-spaces create space out wide, and the quick one-twos on the edge of the box have been crucial in scoring those goals, but they have been largely absent this season. All the data suggests that Højlund is not getting involved in the build-up to the required level; he is at his best when running the channels. His passing numbers from Atalanta are similar to what he has achieved this season.

 

[Lyng]

The team was at its best when our wide player ran the channels and the center-forward held up play. Højlund seems to be a square peg in a round hole. In my opinion, his inability to play the required role is limiting the use and ability of our other attackers. Højlund is a better individual player than Weghorst, but Weghorst was better for the team.

Given that he has a much higher conversation rate than our wingers thats a weird statement.
Look at his play under a much better manager in Atalanta.

 

[sebsheep]

The team was at its best when our wide player ran the channels and the center-forward held up play. Højlund seems to be a square peg in a round hole. In my opinion, his inability to play the required role is limiting the use and ability of our other attackers. Højlund is a better individual player than Weghorst, but Weghorst was better for the team.



During that season, the other forward in the rotation was Martial, who had the skillset required to play the role. The undeniable truth is that when we have a forward who can drop deep and play in the half-space the team performs better.



The forwards dropping into the half-spaces create space out wide, and the quick one-twos on the edge of the box have been crucial in scoring those goals, but they have been largely absent this season. All the data suggests that Højlund is not getting involved in the build-up to the required level; he is at his best when running the channels. His passing numbers from Atalanta are similar to what he has achieved this season.

You're talking about Rashford's goals but you don't seem to have looked at Rashford's goals.

 

[roonster09]

The team was at its best when our wide player ran the channels and the center-forward held up play. Højlund seems to be a square peg in a round hole. In my opinion, his inability to play the required role is limiting the use and ability of our other attackers. Højlund is a better individual player than Weghorst, but Weghorst was better for the team.



During that season, the other forward in the rotation was Martial, who had the skillset required to play the role. The undeniable truth is that when we have a forward who can drop deep and play in the half-space the team performs better.



The forwards dropping into the half-spaces create space out wide, and the quick one-twos on the edge of the box have been crucial in scoring those goals, but they have been largely absent this season. All the data suggests that Højlund is not getting involved in the build-up to the required level; he is at his best when running the channels. His passing numbers from Atalanta are similar to what he has achieved this season.

Martial at his best was all that, but not WW. He had some good games but overall didn't offer much. Rashford form has nothing to do with WW or Hojlund.

 

[Schmeichels pinky]

Højlund seems to be a square peg in a round hole.

Well, he’s on his way to becoming a world class square peg so a good manager would make the hole square

 

[D. Grayson]

Given that he has a much higher conversation rate than our wingers thats a weird statement.
Look at his play under a much better manager in Atalanta.

His conversation rate indicates he is a good striker, his other metrics indicate his an average ball player. He had Boga as a provisional strike partner and wing back providing diagonal balls he could run onto similarly, Lukaku at inter had a team set up to play to his strengths in 20-21 but struggled at Chelsea when he was required to play a different role.

The better manager who perpetually finishes fifth in a weaker league didn't turn him into Bergkamp he just had a team that played into his strengths.

 

[Oranges038]

You're talking about Rashford's goals but you don't seem to have looked at Rashford's goals.

I just watched his 30 goals from last season.

Vast majority came from exposing a high line with balls in behind, there a few absolute belters from range (Arsenal, Betis) most of the rest came from Bruno, Eriksen or Shaw playing balls into the box.

 

[D. Grayson]

You're talking about Rashford's goals but you don't seem to have looked at Rashford's goals.

Martial at his best was all that, but not WW. He had some good games but overall didn't offer much. Rashford form has nothing to do with WW or Hojlund.

The team and by extension Rashford play better when we have a striker who drops deep and gets involved in build-up play. Rashford's uptake in form when Lukaku and Ronaldo respectively left is not an anomaly.