But he has been a 64 million striker this season, if you look at his performances.
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But he has been a 64 million striker this season, if you look at his performances.
Yeah but we can vary it a bit with them cutting in and him going wide. Ah well. There might be a reason we don't do that.
His continued upward trajectory has been so impressive. He’s aced every challenge put to him since he started playing regularly. From a lad who was sold on the cheap from his home country to banging them in for Utd and being a United supporter. It’s the stuff of dreams. Copenhagen surely wishing they’d developed him a lot further.
He looks a really good all rounder apart from in the air for such a big guy. He’s class and the scouting on him was top notch. He seems to have bags of personality and is a fighter and someone who can grow into a leader. Very good stuff. If we could get a Rasmus level 21 year old in for every position we would be laughing
He looks a really good all rounder apart from in the air for such a big guy. He’s class and the scouting on him was top notch. He seems to have bags of personality and is a fighter and someone who can grow into a leader. Very good stuff. If we could get a Rasmus level 21 year old in for every position we would be laughing
I see those clips as showing he's adapting well to our style in transition, they aren't all really 'hold up play' in my opinion, many are quick exchanges or passes rather than running a channel. taking a long ball and getting it under control, then bringing others into play. Some are, don't get me wrong, and I'm not saying he can't do it but my impressions of him are not of an Ibra type CF.
Oh man I disagree with your first paragraph so much. You think people will be happy if we paid 64m for a young talent to just play a game here and there? Fans are impatient, they want instant gratification. Hojlund will be even under more scrutiny and pressure when questions will be asked constantly of why we signed him for so much just to sit on the bench and how he will grow/develop if he keeps playing second fiddle.
The ideal scenario is if we can sign an older, more experienced striker who can come in and perform when called upon to share the load with Hojlund. Someone like Cavani but less injured.
Realistically though what would you have expected from either one of those players. They would have been £120m+ type transfers and we don't really create that much, we'd probably be sitting with Kane on like 8 goals and complaining about how we should have signed him 5 years ago and Levy is such a genuis.
Nothing more frustrating than arguing with people last summer that just thought Kane instantly adds 30 goals to our team. Although it’s probably the same group that grumbles about Hojlunds goal tally when he might get a single chance a game (maybe).
Most of us understood that it was always going to be a rough start for Rasmus and it was. Will his goal drought the first half of the season prove to be worth the 25+ goals we expect from him for the next 4-5 seasons? I would say so. His progress has been fantastic and all that's left now is for Bruno and Marcus to look for Rasmus more instead of attempting the impossible shot from distance.
Your opinion
Psychology in almost anything competitive, whether with others or even with your own self is wildly downplayed by most fans.
I'm a trader and I've worked, and still do to this day, with Jared Tendler. He's coached world champion Poker players, athletes and traders on the subject of psychology in these fields, and they are so important; so much so that what is often believed to be an issue of technical lack of edge, is usually a result of mediocre to poor psychological and mental habits. Emotion and incorrect mental habits can have drastic influences on whether or not an athlete makes the right decision at the right time; whether their poor form is further exacerbated by accumulating negative mental cycles, or just how they deal with matters of luck in the game and projecting self-criticism on themselves for not doing better.
There's a million and one possible barriers to any player just not clicking right into gear. Even more so at this level.
I'm a trader and I've worked, and still do to this day, with Jared Tendler. He's coached world champion Poker players, athletes and traders on the subject of psychology in these fields, and they are so important; so much so that what is often believed to be an issue of technical lack of edge, is usually a result of mediocre to poor psychological and mental habits. Emotion and incorrect mental habits can have drastic influences on whether or not an athlete makes the right decision at the right time; whether their poor form is further exacerbated by accumulating negative mental cycles, or just how they deal with matters of luck in the game and projecting self-criticism on themselves for not doing better.
There's a million and one possible barriers to any player just not clicking right into gear. Even more so at this level.
So there two things 1) I would argue the majority of those clips are a variation of hold up play because the ball is played to him and a positive outcome comes out of it. Obviously it's pure highlights so it's not a true representation of his overall success rate on that front. I understand your definition but that's only one part of many things to consider as 'hold up play' imo. 2) The original point was that you said he was more of a poacher/hang around centre back type of player striker. Someone, that involved and fairly technical in the middle of the pitch as shown in the video doesn't usually end up as a penalty box forward.
But how would you describe Ruud? He would still do those kind of things, it’s not like a striker doesn’t get involved at all until the ball goes into the box. But there’s a big difference in the hold up play if someone like Rasmus versus RVP or Berba for example
And I was asking for your opinion but seems like you don't want to share it with me
Seems that way. Wonder how many more he'd score if he had someone like De Bruyne feeding him chances.
You didn't ask my opinion (which I already gave) you made a statement which was your own opinion.
Ive already said I didn’t think he was but he may become one
What more do you think he could be doing, with the lack of service he's been having? His link up play and passing has also gone up a level in recent games.
I think he could've been a little more clinical earlier on in the season, but even the best strikers miss chances.
He's going to be worth hell of a lot more than £64m in my opinion, as he and the team progress (if we make the correct decisions in the transfer market)
He’s the second most expensive CF in the league. The most expensive has double his contribution of goals and assists this season and is himself regarded as a questionable signing at the price paid.
We have primarily paid for potential but the idea that Hojlund is one of the best strikers in the league currently is just plain silly. He’s a good finisher but his all-round game is quite a long way off where I would hope it will be in 5 years time. Out of curiosity, for which other teams in the league do you think he’d currently be the starting CF, guaranteed to start every game?
Who is a 64m striker though these days? Would it really buy you anyone that’s already top class and relatively young?
Everyone was quoting 100m + for the likes of Osimhen. Caiceido, Enzo went for ridiculous fees as apparently they were somehow “proven”.
Felix went for over 100m to Atletico.
V Junior went for 45m in 2018.
I’m really not sure what you think 64m gets you?
Richarlison I guess is your closest example at 60m, and in his first year at Spurs he scored a single Premier League goal and just 2 in the CL.
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I don't think you will find anyone saying he is one of the best strikers in the league at the moment. As you say, we have paid for potential and we can't really tell yet, whether the fee will be justified or not. If he continues his recent form for the rest of the season, I would say it's looking positive.
I would also not be overly concerned with the price we have paid. It's in the past. After a tough period Højlund seems to have turned a corner, and he doesn't seem to be bothered by his price tag himself.
And how did that lad do in his first 6 months in a new league/team?
Asking for a friend.
Never write off youth.
I don't know. Unless you're someone like Haaland, I don't think you're guaranteed to start every game at most clubs.
Arsenal are missing a profile like him, as Jesus is a different type of player (albeit an amazing one). I do think Hojlund is better than Nketiah, and Arteta seems to be reluctant to play Havertz up top from what I've seen. They are targeting Osimhen for a reason, and the Nigerian is a very similar profile to our Dane.
He would start for Spurs and Chelsea, without any doubts. He starts for us without a doubt as well.
Significant game time at Arsenal, Liverpool, Newcastle, Villa, Brentford and Brighton.
I would put him somewhere around Evan Ferguson's level right now, with a similar potential ceiling as well. Also very similar type of players.
Considering their ages, the only striker in the Prem I'd have over him is the obvious pick in Haaland. He's already close to the best strikers in the league and I think he'll be an absolute monster within 2 or 3 years.
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I really like Hojlund and think he can become a very good player for us but this is recency bias at its finest.
He has been very good in the last few games but if you look back a few weeks ago in this thread some fans were calling us a bad footballer and terrible signing. Admittedly those people were overreacting too much the other way.
Good player : Yes
High Potential : Absolutely
Close to the best strikers in the league : Not at the moment
I don't think that his price really bothered him at the start as well, you can tell by his CL form, What coincided with his good form is Garnacho moving on the right, and this opened up a lot of space for him, as Rashford got returned to his natural position, and Garnacho is now more inclined to pass, instead of to shot. Plus you can tell that he has become more vocal when he doesn't get the pass. He has always made the runs, even when he wasn't getting the ball.
Is it recency bias if I've been saying this since September? I was 100% sure of his talent after his first 2 or 3 PL games, and his Champions League performances.
Same, was obvious he had serious potential just watching his physical gifts and ball carrying at pace early on. Rare stuff.
Just like it only took a month to see Antony didn’t have much room to “improve” and was always going to be what he was, even when he was scoring goals at the time after he arrived.
Well I don't know about your personal comments about him. My point being it's way too early in my opinion to say he's close to the best in the league. As I say I like him as well but he has a long way to go still.
I think his link up play in the PL has improved a lot recently, however I think he needs to further improve in that area as well as his hold up and ariel play which will hopefully comecome.
I think he also needs to be smarter with his movement, when to hold for the pull back and when to go near post, vs far post not making the same movement as his team mates etc.
I didn't say he won't be worth the money in future I just expect more from a player we spent 64m on this summer at this stage (non of which is his fault)
Richarlison was playing second fiddle to Kane and had already scored 53 PL goals prior to that season.
Whilst you are naming what was quoted for some players you ignored Marcus Thuram was available on a free, Sesko went for less money and I would say is a similar talent
All I was saying was we overpaid, its my opinion, he cost Atalanta 17m euros 1 year prior and he had not made the strides in his game or performances to go for 64m 12 months later.
I was all for his signing though, and like him as a player
EDIT: Its a bit tedious that people feel the need to try and justify the clubs transfer spending, when we all know the club will make SIGNIFICANT changes to the transfer and recruitment team for the very reason that they are underperforming at their jobs. Which does not just mean making poor signings player quality wise, but also overpaying for players too.
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I actually think in this case it has been an advantage that the club have paid a high fee.
Let's say we had paid 10 m. Do you think the manager would have stuck with him for this long without scoring?
When a manager spends a large sum of the available funds on a player he sort of have to stick to him and believe in him.
Had Ole paid 80 million for DVB I bet he would have played 80% of the games.
Quoting free transfers is an odd one to be fair, like slagging off everyone for spending money when Lewa went to Bayern on a free. It aids not the discussion.
Sesko went to Leipzig, Højlund attracted PSG & United so you saying he’s a similar talent is something I’ll take with a pinch of salt.
Richarlison is the one, and my point was that he also took time to adjust to a new club, despite playing in the league previously. Nunez another that went for more and struggled in his first 6 months.
The thing is, Højlund wasn’t available at the say 40m you maybe think he was worth, and PSG were offering 50m.
So I’m not sure we overpaid at all when comparing othet transfers, we paid for potential rather than risk him smashing it this season and costing 50-60 regardless with other big clubs after him.
Not sure how we win there, we needed him now, not next season.
Jackson 35m I could carry on no point comparing to other transfers. Just compare it to his own 12 months prior
So, a young player just needed some time…. Who would have thought
Jackson looks as average as it gets in fairness, would have been a much bigger waste of money.
Will be a backup striker next season I’ll bet.
The main thing was that Højlund wasn’t available at 35m, PSG were prepared to spend 50m on him. I think in a couple of years we’ll laugh at the idea buying Jackson instead would’ve been anything but a daft idea.
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I'm not sure what's with all the player comparisons. The original point and only one I'm trying to tell you otherwise is you said Hojlund would be more of a poacher type hanging around centre backs. I'm saying he's an all rounder and what's he shown so far doesn't suggest he won't score 'more WH type goals'.
Ruud was a predominantly final third striker, who wasn't really as interested in possession and getting touches around the half line or deeper.
RVP had barely started his career as a winger at Hojlund's age.
Berbatov was a playmaker, who probably spent more time outside the box than in it.
One of the things about Hojlund that’s exciting to me is that he’s so clever for a big lad up front. His flicks, back heels, shorts passes, and movement into space with and without the ball are way ahead of his age.
Someone posted a video a few pages back of some of his touches outside the box this campaign and it’s so refreshing - his eye for short, defense splitting passes that create threatening situations is sublime.
Someone posted a video a few pages back of some of his touches outside the box this campaign and it’s so refreshing - his eye for short, defense splitting passes that create threatening situations is sublime.
Jackson is a year older, has similar goalscoring ratio as Hojlund (Jackson 0.36, Hojlund 0.357) this year so far, with less all round play
I would say if Jackson costs 35M, I wouldn't say Hojlund costing 60M being unreasonable.
2 years older than Hojlund (2003 born)
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