Ralf Rangnick | ex-interim manager | does anyone rate him?

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glazed said:
It means that we will take a long time to master this playing style and several of our current squad will not be part of that. It's a messy process but it has to play out.
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Yeah but what role is Rangnick playing? I don't see any decent performance on the pitch, at least when it comes to work rate, pressing, off the ball movement. He himself said he isn't part of any managerial hiring. ETH himself said he has big say on transfers and we have recruitment team.

So I'm missing this transition that Rangnick started or brought into start. If nothing else, I expected at least to see some good workrate from players, which lasted 60 mins in first game.

Till this point, it's all nice talk from him.

Also don't think Rangnick and ETH have similar playing style. Rangnick thinks GK is the least technical player so should have least touches in the football, and no backpasses. For ETH's game, GK is also part of build up play. So I don't think we will benefit anything from Rangnick's time as manager. At best we will have to assume he plays some role in transfers as apparently he has great scouting network.
 
roonster09 said:
Yeah but what role is Rangnick playing? I don't see any decent performance on the pitch, at least when it comes to work rate, pressing, off the ball movement. He himself said he isn't part of any managerial hiring. ETH himself said he has big say on transfers and we have recruitment team.
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I agree the players have just refused to do what he wants and he has no other options so nobody can call him a success on the field. Where he has succeeded for me is showing who can and can't play the way they need to.
 
roonster09 said:
Yeah but what role is Rangnick playing? I don't see any decent performance on the pitch, at least when it comes to work rate, pressing, off the ball movement. He himself said he isn't part of any managerial hiring. ETH himself said he has big say on transfers and we have recruitment team.

So I'm missing this transition that Rangnick started or brought into start. If nothing else, I expected at least to see some good workrate from players, which lasted 60 mins in first game.

Till this point, it's all nice talk from him.

Also don't think Rangnick and ETH have similar playing style. Rangnick thinks GK is the least technical player so should have least touches in the football, and no backpasses. For ETH's game, GK is also part of build up play. So I don't think we will benefit anything from Rangnick's time as manager. At best we will have to assume he plays some role in transfers as apparently he has great scouting network.
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He is the link between our currently shit club and every good footballing person out there. He knows a guy, but also knows a guy who knows a guy.
 
glazed said:
I agree the players have just refused to do what he wants and he has no other options so nobody can call him a success on the field. Where he has succeeded for me is showing who can and can't play the way they need to.
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IMO the guy talks good but when it comes to actions it's opposite of what he says. Talks about young players and then brings on Jones as a sub to play in midfield. Talks about young talent, players who are hungry and then brings on players who have no future at the club.
 
roonster09 said:
IMO the guy talks good but when it comes to actions it's opposite of what he says. Talks about young players and then brings on Jones as a sub to play in midfield. Talks about young talent, players who are hungry and then brings on players who have no future at the club.
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Yeah they offered him a big bonus if he could nick fourth place so it wasn't like they weren't bothered.
 
tjb said:
One thing that has irked me with his appointment is the need to exaggerate how bad we were under Ole to minimize his failure. Make no mistake about it, we never looked as bad as we do now under Ole.

Under Ole, our counter attacks worked. Basic play was never an issue with Ole, except in big games. Our issue with ordinary games was that we straggled in breaking teams down. Specific to this season and the beginning of last season, we also had defensive leaks due to poor defensive preparation - a key sign that Ole was not good enough to be a United manager. However, we could move the ball and pass like any normal team.

Under Rangnick we look legitimately terrible. Our moves break down easily and in truth never truly connect. There is hardly any real movement on the ball. It almost feels like the team's entire aim is to win the ball back occasionally with a press and then keep the middle tight to prevent counters. There is no connectivity on the flanks, no real link up through the middle, no space for Bruno to get on the ball and no support for Ronaldo. Our team with Rangnick is completely disjointed in a way it never was with Ole, even against Watford. Our defensive issues from earlier on in the season ( which were our true problem at the start) were never fixed, unfortunately any semblance of attacking impetus seemed to have gone with Ole as well. None of our players look good under Rangnick outside the all time brilliance of Ronaldo. That speaks volumes.

This could be for a multitude of reasons of course, but fans should not lie and act like this is what Ole served up for 3 years, that would simply be a lie. Its actually worse football than 2016 LVG, and that's saying something
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Ole's is the worst manager in the history of Manchester United, he was never qualified to get the job in the first place.
He is a failed field manager, he has no structure, no pattern how he sets up his team.
He could be given this City squad and make them look just as bad, that's how inept he is.
He is also very much responsible for this chaos we are witnessing around the club.
Rangnick had an impossible job to fix the mess on the pitch, but I'm positive he will be incredibly useful to ETH thanks to this interim experience.
I believe he was brought to modernize this football club and hopefully his (remote) consultancy role will be taken seriously.
 
glazed said:
I think the restructure is more important to them. The Glazers will be aware that top four is very much more difficult to achieve when there are four top other clubs playing high press well, because they will churn out results. In that scenario we are virtually guaranteed to finish lower than City, Liverpool, Chelsea, and soon, Arsenal. So the Glazer long term business model is screwed. And that's more important than one season.
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I admire your optimism mate.
 
interesting comments today by Rangnick talking about the need to additional "modern" strikers in the squad and referencing Pool and City having 5-6 in their squad....Ronaldo doesn't want to be a 9 or play like a 9 and that United need more versatile attacking players
 
bosskeano said:
interesting comments today by Rangnick talking about the need to additional "modern" strikers in the squad and referencing Pool and City having 5-6 in their squad....Ronaldo doesn't want to be a 9 or play like a 9 and that United need more versatile attacking players
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He is right in that regard. We desperately need attacking players who can operate between the lines. Players who will feel confident to receive the ball in those areas and force the defence into action, instead of just standing still or constantly waiting for a ball in-behind even when it's clear that such a ball is not an available option. It's both beautiful and sad watching Ronaldo in this United team. A 37-year-old constantly moving in the attacking third, trying to create numerical advantages, helping his teammates, showing the rest that, if you want the ball in-behind, it's you who has to work and make it happen more than anyone else. A testimony to the hunger and the football intelligence of a great. On the other hand, you see the paucity of choices we have. Players who moan because they want to do only one thing on the pitch. Players who need an eternity on the ball, who always need to be facing the goal, who always need space in front of them. A proper team can usually make the adjustments to carry one such player if his numbers are worth it. We tried to build a whole attack on them and we expect Bruno to have an assist per game and we have made McFred a mainstay in the midfield because let's face it... if not them, who's going to do the running whenever we lose the ball high up the pitch? The men in front of them most certainly won't.
 
stevoc said:
I admire your optimism mate.
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Realism. If we aren't champions league regulars then the club loses billions in value and melts off huge chunks of the international fan base. Glazers can't have that. They tried European Super League as a way of qualifying without investing but that didn't pan out. In a sense, ESL was the ultimate expression of Woodward's strategy. When it failed, so did the Glazer business model.
 
TheRedDevil'sAdvocate said:
He is right in that regard. We desperately need attacking players who can operate between the lines. Players who will feel confident to receive the ball in those areas and force the defence into action, instead of just standing still or constantly waiting for a ball in-behind even when it's clear that such a ball is not an available option. It's both beautiful and sad watching Ronaldo in this United team. A 37-year-old constantly moving in the attacking third, trying to create numerical advantages, helping his teammates, showing the rest that, if you want the ball in-behind, it's you who has to work and make it happen more than anyone else. A testimony to the hunger and the football intelligence of a great. On the other hand, you see the paucity of choices we have. Players who moan because they want to do only one thing on the pitch. Players who need an eternity on the ball, who always need to be facing the goal, who always need space in front of them. A proper team can usually make the adjustments to carry one such player if his numbers are worth it. We tried to build a whole attack on them and we expect Bruno to have an assist per game and we have made McFred a mainstay in the midfield because let's face it... if not them, who's going to do the running whenever we lose the ball high up the pitch? The men in front of them most certainly won't.
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we used to have that with Rashford, Martial and Greenwood then 2 of the 3 lost their way and forgot about playing football and one of them turned into an abuser

modern game doesn't need a hold up striker or a big target #9.....the mobile forward across the front 3 is the way to go as it is so much more difficult for defenders to deal with when you can constantly overload areas of the pitch but still an ability to run in behind with pace
 
glazed said:
Realism. If we aren't champions league regulars then the club loses billions in value and melts off huge chunks of the international fan base. Glazers can't have that. They tried European Super League as a way of qualifying without investing but that didn't pan out. In a sense, ESL was the ultimate expression of Woodward's strategy. When it failed, so did the Glazer business model.
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Realism?

Most of your recent posts in here mate are you commenting on what you think is happening at the club based on your own theories.

That's the opposit of reality. Now your theory could be correct but there hasn't been much in the way of quotes to confirm it.
 
stevoc said:
Realism?

Most of your recent posts in here mate are you commenting on what you think is happening at the club based on your own theories.

That's the opposit of reality. Now your theory could be correct but there hasn't been much in the way of quotes to confirm it.
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Well if you think quotes from the club are a better guide to reality than thinking and watching what they actually do then yes you would be correct.
 
Banat said:
Ole's is the worst manager in the history of Manchester United, he was never qualified to get the job in the first place.
He is a failed field manager, he has no structure, no pattern how he sets up his team.
He could be given this City squad and make them look just as bad, that's how inept he is.
He is also very much responsible for this chaos we are witnessing around the club.
Rangnick had an impossible job to fix the mess on the pitch, but I'm positive he will be incredibly useful to ETH thanks to this interim experience.
I believe he was brought to modernize this football club and hopefully his (remote) consultancy role will be taken seriously.
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That is such a dumb statement when you look at how Wreck-It has made the team even worse and has even poorer results than Solskjaer. There was a reason why Solskjaer got the job permanently and yet Wreck-It couldn't even muster a new manager bounce. Do you remember the 'Ole's at the Wheel" songs? United's worst manager would not have created that vibe amongst the fans before eventually going sour. Wreck-It did not have an impossible job. We were still in cup competitions and vying for top 4 and he had just one job but he's failed miserably. He's been shite practically the whole time he's been here.
 
RedPed said:
That is such a dumb statement when you look at how Wreck-It has made the team even worse and has even poorer results than Solskjaer. There was a reason why Solskjaer got the job permanently and yet Wreck-It couldn't even muster a new manager bounce. Do you remember the 'Ole's at the Wheel" songs? United's worst manager would not have created that vibe amongst the fans before eventually going sour. Wreck-It did not have an impossible job. We were still in cup competitions and vying for top 4 and he had just one job but he's failed miserably. He's been shite practically the whole time he's been here.
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What's dumb is the imbecile logic comparing an interim inheriting a broken squad with no transfer backing or pre season to a useless failure who had hundreds of millions and almost 3years with feck all to show for it.
 
bosskeano said:
we used to have that with Rashford, Martial and Greenwood then 2 of the 3 lost their way and forgot about playing football and one of them turned into an abuser

modern game doesn't need a hold up striker or a big target #9.....the mobile forward across the front 3 is the way to go as it is so much more difficult for defenders to deal with when you can constantly overload areas of the pitch but still an ability to run in behind with pace
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Nah, 73 goals, which is the pinnacle of these three, is nothing to write home about. Especially when you take into consideration that nine of those goals were scored in a single game and that we also failed to score in 8 league games that season. Feel free to argue otherwise, but, personally, i never shared the enthusiasm of the Caf regarding the future prospects of the side Solskjaer was trying to build at OT. All three of them lacked so many things to justify the amount of faith the club, the manager and the fans put into them.

I wasn't talking about a hold-up striker. What both Liverpool and City have, and we don't, are players who can find pockets of space between the lines, either in the half-spaces or wider, and make things happen. Whenever a long-ball is played down the channels toward Salah/Mane/Jota or a long-diagonal reaches Mahrez/Sterling/Foden, you know that they are going to assess their options with their heads up, read the plays and use their close-dribbling and their ability for one-touch football to create the best shot available. This is what makes these balls dangerous and keeps defences on their toes. Compare it to our "I'll cut inside and shoot" or "give me the ball to run at defenders" attitude, and you'll see that our ceiling was never the same as theirs.

Our last title-winning side had two players who had mastered the art of finding pockets of space between the lines: Carrick and Rooney. They would both always make themselves available and not only would they show up for the ball, but they also already knew to whom they were going to pass it next. It's a sad state of affairs that we rely on a soon-to-be 38 yo Ronaldo to do the job upfront while we enjoy the "privilege" of watching McT hiding behind the opposition players or Fred coming up with his next blooper. You need these players in order to stretch the pitch and allow players from the second lines to get involved in the final third. This is what i believe RR is talking about.
 
roonster09 said:
IMO the guy talks good but when it comes to actions it's opposite of what he says. Talks about young players and then brings on Jones as a sub to play in midfield. Talks about young talent, players who are hungry and then brings on players who have no future at the club.
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Jones, Mata, Cavani, Matic all played the last game because it would be their last in front of OT, I thought that was pretty obvious.
 
3KDré said:
Jones, Mata, Cavani, Matic all played the last game because it would be their last in front of OT, I thought that was pretty obvious.
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They didn't play only last game, I thought that was pretty obvious.
 
RedPed said:
That is such a dumb statement when you look at how Wreck-It has made the team even worse and has even poorer results than Solskjaer. There was a reason why Solskjaer got the job permanently and yet Wreck-It couldn't even muster a new manager bounce. Do you remember the 'Ole's at the Wheel" songs? United's worst manager would not have created that vibe amongst the fans before eventually going sour. Wreck-It did not have an impossible job. We were still in cup competitions and vying for top 4 and he had just one job but he's failed miserably. He's been shite practically the whole time he's been here.
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He doesn't have worse results compared to the end of Ole's time, with a season that had already been trashed, a squad which isn't his and has been so badly mismanaged that half of them are going out the door in the summer. And I don't even rate Ralf that highly.

That's what happens when you allow fan sentiment e.g. "Ole's at the Wheel" to decide business decisions in the face of common sense.
 
glazed said:
Well if you think quotes from the club are a better guide to reality than thinking and watching what they actually do then yes you would be correct.
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Not necessarily but in this case maybe.

My opinion is based on what the Glazers have done for years, as in actually done over almost 2 decades. Not what I think they might have done in the last 6 months and suddenly changed their approach and mindset to running United in doing so.
 
IWat said:
He doesn't have worse results compared to the end of Ole's time, with a season that had already been trashed, a squad which isn't his and has been so badly mismanaged that half of them are going out the door in the summer. And I don't even rate Ralf that highly.

That's what happens when you allow fan sentiment e.g. "Ole's at the Wheel" to decide business decisions in the face of common sense.
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So at the end of November we couldn't have made top 4 or won one of the 2 cups we were still in?
 
stevoc said:
So at the end of November we couldn't have made top 4 or won one of the 2 cups we were still in?
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I wouldn't expect a good manager coming in as a caretaker in November, that gets no money in January, to achieve particularly much anywhere else. Particularly when a substantial chunk of the squad would obviously be leaving in the summer. And I don't think Ralf is a particularly good manager, it's clearly not his strength.
 
roonster09 said:
They didn't play only last game, I thought that was pretty obvious.
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Rangnick also said it's not a great idea to bring in youngsters right now to play in probably the most toxic environment we've had in decades, which is pretty fair enough, no?
 
VP89 said:
What's dumb is the imbecile logic comparing an interim inheriting a broken squad with no transfer backing or pre season to a useless failure who had hundreds of millions and almost 3years with feck all to show for it.
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I know rational thought is lacking in the Rangnite thought processes but the squad wasn't broken when Ole left, they were just on a poor run of form. I'm pretty certain you and most fans were excited at the beginning of the season. We should have seen at least some improvement under Wteck-It.
 
IWat said:
He doesn't have worse results compared to the end of Ole's time, with a season that had already been trashed, a squad which isn't his and has been so badly mismanaged that half of them are going out the door in the summer. And I don't even rate Ralf that highly.

That's what happens when you allow fan sentiment e.g. "Ole's at the Wheel" to decide business decisions in the face of common sense.
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Come on now, give yourself some credit and stop peddling that myth. We actually started playing well under Carrick. If the season was trashed as you put it, why not just give him the rest of the season? Especially as some of the Rangnites are saying, the results were irrelevant?
 
stevoc said:
Not necessarily but in this case maybe.

My opinion is based on what the Glazers have done for years, as in actually done over almost 2 decades. Not what I think they might have done in the last 6 months and suddenly changed their approach and mindset to running United in doing so.
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Hmm well you have a good point there. They may yet sabotage the whole thing once they've done enough to get top four again. I wouldn't trust them further than I can spit a rat.
 
RedPed said:
I know rational thought is lacking in the Rangnite thought processes but the squad wasn't broken when Ole left, they were just on a poor run of form. I'm pretty certain you and most fans were excited at the beginning of the season. We should have seen at least some improvement under Wteck-It.
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Your childish play on words somehow made your posts even worse. Congratulations.
 
RedPed said:
We actually started playing well under Carrick. If the season was trashed as you put it, why not just give him the rest of the season? Especially as some of the Rangnites are saying, the results were irrelevant?
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Because Ten Hag would never have come if we hadn't signalled that we were serious abut ending business as usual. Poch would have, mind you. But then it really would have been business as usual.
 
RedPed said:
I know rational thought is lacking in the Rangnite thought processes but the squad wasn't broken when Ole left, they were just on a poor run of form. I'm pretty certain you and most fans were excited at the beginning of the season. We should have seen at least some improvement under Wteck-It.
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Genuinely braindead post.
 
IWat said:
I wouldn't expect a good manager coming in as a caretaker in November, that gets no money in January, to achieve particularly much anywhere else. Particularly when a substantial chunk of the squad would obviously be leaving in the summer. And I don't think Ralf is a particularly good manager, it's clearly not his strength.
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Maybe Ralf just isn't a good manager and has had a negative effect on the squad and how the season played out. But the season wasn't completely lost or trashed when Solskjaer was sacked.
 
I don't think we can seriously state that Ralf didn't have a great chance at top four and ultimately doing better than he did. It was a tough job but very achievable too.

Yes he had an awkward situation with a below par squad and poor morale, and he didn't get any funds in January. But what side that just had their manager sacked is in a good situation? That's the job of a midseason manager, improve results in less than ideal conditions.

He came in ahead of that appealing Christmas run and through that he really ought to have strung enough results together to ride out some of the inevitable patchy performances and tougher games. But we made a complete hash of it.
 
stevoc said:
Maybe Ralf just isn't a good manager and has had a negative effect on the squad and how the season played out. But the season wasn't completely lost or trashed when Solskjaer was sacked.
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So you’re saying there was another reason he was sacked?
 
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Submarine Chief said:
So you’re saying there was another reason he was sacked?
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The season was in freefall when he was sacked. After the CP game we all can see that the players didn't want to put in an effort and all the leaks started to happen.
He was in a losing wicket from that moment.
If Ole was kept everything would be swept under the carpet and we won't know how bad these players are and we will be trying to do everything piecemeal and lose in the long run.
 
Foxbatt said:
The season was in freefall when he was sacked. After the CP game we all can see that the players didn't want to put in an effort and all the leaks started to happen.
He was in a losing wicket from that moment.
If Ole was kept everything would be swept under the carpet and we won't know how bad these players are and we will be trying to do everything piecemeal and lose in the long run.
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I would add that the comments throughout the rest of the season by the interim manager confirms much of this. If anything, the situation didn’t get worse but it was exposed to sunlight. And call it a coincidence if you want, but the front office suddenly started going through big changes with the people responsible.

The owners do what billionaires do and put people in place to identify the problems and start a program to fix them. They fire the manager and then the guys responsible for bringing in the underperforming players and then the guys who gave them such outrageous contracts. It seems maybe the owners weren’t really happy about fielding a bloated payroll and a team that didn’t perform despite the extreme amount of money spent.

At some point reality hits us all.
It is going to be interesting to see how it works out for the rest of the players.
 
Submarine Chief said:
I would add that the comments throughout the rest of the season by the interim manager confirms much of this. If anything, the situation didn’t get worse but it was exposed to sunlight. And call it a coincidence if you want, but the front office suddenly started going through big changes with the people responsible.

The owners do what billionaires do and put people in place to identify the problems and start a program to fix them. They fire the manager and then the guys responsible for bringing in the underperforming players and then the guys who gave them such outrageous contracts. It seems maybe the owners weren’t really happy about fielding a bloated payroll and a team that didn’t perform despite the extreme amount of money spent.

At some point reality hits us all.
It is going to be interesting to see how it works out for the rest of the players.
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Agree with you and with Woodward gone Arnold has no reasons to cover for Woodward.
Ralf is not stupid and we need to know why we never played the same way as against CP in the first half?
Also as you said he highlighted the problems we have and there has been a lot of changes at the club. Without Ralf calling out this would not have happened.
Now let's see if he gets Austria playing the way he wants to play?
I also feel that Ralf treat them like professional adults while some of them have been treated with kidgloves by Ole. And when Ole tried to get Rashford to concentrate on his football, Ole got criticized.
Ralf doesn't accept any nonsense from the players.
 
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