Ralf Rangnick | ex-interim manager | does anyone rate him?

[InfiniteBoredom]

I think that's our mantra for the past 10 years incl the tail-end of Fergie's reign.

I wouldn’t judge him by the same criteria if this is February and we are still turning in these Ole ball performances, but everything takes time to implement, even for the simplest routine it takes 21 days to form a habit, so expecting us to consistently press in his 3rd game in charge is fanciful.

For the moment, get the points on board, avoid injuries, manage the player fitness, and hopefully by the time of the CL K.O we are ready to kick on instead of fizzling out like we usually do nowadays.

 

[giggs-beckham]

All in all, two PL wins in a row, in December during a hectic period, whilst trying to implement an entirely unfamiliar system. I guess we should have expected the teething. But at least the teething is 6 points in 6.

I wasn't on about the results. They've been good since Carrick started. I don't see why he would've told them not to press if the main aim is re programming them to be a pressing unit.

 

[SeanyC]

I can’t believe some people on here after 3 games are doubting him already

This is like a movie, it’s going to take time to put all the pieces together. Yesterday wasn’t great and I think he played that same team as he sees these players as the ones he’s going to use the most so needs to see how they do in his new system which granted didn’t work yesterday and Ralf admitted that afterwards

Results are key and we got the 3 points and a clean sheet, we don’t play any of the top 3 until March but looking at the fixtures he will want at least by the villa game on the 10th Jan the players to have a good solid understanding of his philosophy by then and acting on it
I want to go into that City game in top 4 and playing good football (want it earlier of course but you get me)

what I also like is that fact the Transfer windows opens soon and we have a few more games until then so he can dip in if he needs to (imo we do), difficult in Jan but not impossible

 

[Escobar]

Against Brentford, he should bench Rashord, Ronaldo, and Fernandes and play Sancho, Greenwood, and Donny in those positions.

I agree but not sure if he does change up things. Would send the right signsl too

 

[Blackwidow]

I wasn't on about the results. They've been good since Carrick started. I don't see why he would've told them not to press if the main aim is re programming them to be a pressing unit.

Could be the physical state. And basics for a good pressing is the positioning. If that is not good you even open bigger gaps than without pressing!

 

[Khadaad]

The performances of the Fernandes, Rashford, and Ronaldo made it impossible to have the control Rangnick talks about. Sancho was unlucky to be substituted but Rashford can make the difference physically towards the end of games (even if he doesn't give his all during the game).

Fernandes should have been taken off though. His bottom level is just something else. I also hope Rangnick changes the way he defends when player's run at/past him. Gets on the wrong side too much.

I'm looking forward to the changes vs Brentford just to see what he has in mind. It's clear that he sees Fred and McTominay as the base and that's fine, especially with performances like yesterday. Fred was always going to thrive under him but McTominay was good too.

Rangnick was quite direct in his post-match interview. Saying that your players are not physically present should be a big jolt (hopefully).

 

[Nordmore]

Against Brentford, he should bench Rashord, Ronaldo, and Fernandes and play Sancho, Greenwood, and Donny in those positions.

Agreed on Ronaldo and Bruno.

If Cavani is available yeah not Rashford but if not I'd like to see Greenwood and Rashford uptop. Sancho won't be any good as one of the two highest forwards in a 4222 imo. But he was pretty good as a hybrid between RM/AMC at Dortmund if my memory serves me right.

Cavani/Rashford - Greenwood
Donny - Sancho
The rest pick themselves.

 

[matt10000]

This is all pretty laughable. What's so ambitious about hiring a 60+ year old guy who has never worked at a top club? Who has never won a title but a single German Cup with Schalke? How come that's the extent of his career if he's such a messiah of football wisdom? Is Man United's aspiration to run like the well-oiled, unstoppable winning machines that are RasenBallsport Leipzig or TSG Hoffenheim?

Well it is interim at the moment.

If he is supposed to be the ideas man behind Klopp etc. but not the coach to deliver then we have the option of using him in an advisory role but if it turns out he can be a top coach then we have the option of keeping him where he is.

It is win win and makes great sense.

Where it could fall down is the timing and decision of what happens with him next season. Should he be interim or permanent. With Ole we made permanent too soon, hindsight being a wonderful thing. If he does really well this season, I would keep him on permanent with the club and state his position ion is head coach until such time it is right to step back jntk the consultation role. That way if things aren’t working oit on the pitch we can seamlessly saybthis is the right time to handnover the day to day without losing him and all having all the controversy of another sacking etc

 

[Sultan]

Gegenpressing (counter-pressing) narrative is getting too much attention. A good pre-season rather than learning on the job is needed for the system to be implemented. Maybe we don't have the type of players which makes this system a non-starter? There are many ways to be successful on the pitch and you generally play to the strength of the squad.

The system gets more confusing if Rangnick is only an interim coach and the club could move to a different coach with a different set of ideas. Even if Rangnick moves to an advisory role he cannot dictate to a new coach to play this system?

 

[Sultan]

This is all pretty laughable. What's so ambitious about hiring a 60+ year old guy who has never worked at a top club? Who has never won a title but a single German Cup with Schalke? How come that's the extent of his career if he's such a messiah of football wisdom? Is Man United's aspiration to run like the well-oiled, unstoppable winning machines that are RasenBallsport Leipzig or TSG Hoffenheim?

How many top clubs in Germany are presently still playing the Gegenpress and are they successful?

 

[Judas]

Bruno gave the ball away far too quickly. This is probably because of Ralf's quick attacking philosophy. Sancho was a bit better because he looks comfortable carrying the ball. Rashford was probably the wrong selection for this game because he needs space to run in behind and Norwich defended deep.

Anyway, a win is a win no matter how ugly it was and another clean sheet. Players might be a little tired from the new training regime and it might take a few weeks before they are on top of things.

No that's just Bruno being Bruno. It was a typical recent performance by him. I expect the majority of his passes to not reach their target or be over/under hit.

 

[sugar_kane]

Really want it to work for Ralf and of course we’re barely two weeks into his time here, but the combination of our fans desperate for him to be a genius *********** tactician and him talking a great game after us serving up total shite is eerily remiscent of the LVG era.

That of course doesn’t have much bearing on what we’ll look like on the pitch in a couple of months - but the last few years have taught me to be fairly cynical.

 

[Ralph1386]

Agreed on Ronaldo and Bruno.

If Cavani is available yeah not Rashford but if not I'd like to see Greenwood and Rashford uptop. Sancho won't be any good as one of the two highest forwards in a 4222 imo. But he was pretty good as a hybrid between RM/AMC at Dortmund if my memory serves me right.

Cavani/Rashford - Greenwood
Donny - Sancho
The rest pick themselves.

In my opinion, Rashford has looked lost out there lately and should not be an automatic starter. He’s off the pace and often makes bad decisions and bad passes. Don’t see why Bruno gets dropped but not Rashford. I think they should both be dropped.

 

[gajender]

Really want it to work for Ralf and of course we’re barely two weeks into his time here, but the combination of our fans desperate for him to be a genius *********** tactician and him talking a great game after us serving up total shite is eerily remiscent of the LVG era.

That of course doesn’t have much bearing on what we’ll look like on the pitch in a couple of months - but the last few years have taught me to be fairly cynical.

He is manager for 6 months nobody should be expecting much from him and nor you need to be cynical for sake of it . Save it for our next full time appointment .

 

[Ayoba]

A bit of an overreaction I feel.

It wasn't a terrible performance, we were actually on top in the 1st half and we should've scored at least one goal. The 2nd half was even but i'll admit the final 20/15 minutes Norwich were all over us! From what i've seen over the course of two games, we tend to start well but then performances drop in the 2nd half.

Even against Palace, Ayew missed a golden chance to put them 1-0 up. So we've got to find a way to sustain a high level of control in the 2nd half, which ofcourse will take time for Ralf to implement his style and also for the players to get used to it. We also need to be taking our chances in the 1st half when we are on top of our game.

Edit: To add to this, you have to take into account the fixture pileup over December, where performances don't really matter and its all about results. Even yesterday, Liverpool, city and chelsea both needed penalties to win home games!

 

[Nordmore]

In my opinion, Rashford has looked lost out there lately and should not be an automatic starter. He’s off the pace and often makes bad decisions and bad passes. Don’t see why Bruno gets dropped but not Rashford. I think they should both be dropped.

Agreed no one should be an automatic starter. Problem is only him, Ronaldo, Cavani, Martial and Greenwood are suitable for a foward role in a 4222 imo. Martial has been worse and looks like he'll leave soon.

If you read my post again you'd see I said if Cavani is available then no Rashford.

 

[Ralph1386]

Agreed no one should be an automatic starter. Problem is only him, Ronaldo, Cavani, Martial and Greenwood are suitable for a foward role in a 4222 imo. Martial has been worse and looks like he'll leave soon.

If you read my post again you'd see I said if Cavani is available then no Rashford.

Fair enough. We have similar opinions. I just think that Greenwood+Ronaldo would work better if Cavani is not available. Anyway, we’ve got a lot of fixtures so we’re bound to be rotating.

 

[Judge Red]

Not to doubt that he’ll make us better as the season goes on but Carrick’s three games were more enjoyable to watch. Carrick also dropped Ronaldo and Bruno. It’s a lot easier to manage this club when you can tell Ed and the Glazers to go feck themselves.

Either way, we haven’t lost for six games. Let’s go.

 

[Hoof the ball]

I wasn't on about the results. They've been good since Carrick started. I don't see why he would've told them not to press if the main aim is re programming them to be a pressing unit.

It's very unlikely indeed that Ralf would have told them to not press, yes.

 

[Hoof the ball]

Our issue, as a group, is how poor we are at 2nd balls, loose balls. How poor we've been at this for a number of years now. We have to be one of the lowest performing teams for 2nd balls. Liverpool win what seems like almost every loose or 2nd ball; we seem to win none of them.

Intensity, like Ralf said. We're not physically present in the moment. In our minds, we're not anticipating 2nd balls, not reacting quick enough to them. It's a big, big mental issue.

 

[VP89]

I wasn't on about the results. They've been good since Carrick started. I don't see why he would've told them not to press if the main aim is re programming them to be a pressing unit.

I think they were just knackered from the training methods. Its going to be up and down. My only criticism for our manager is I would like to see a bit more rotation. Rashford doesn't need to start evey game for example. Mind you he has only had two league games so maybe the plan is for Greenwood on Tuesday.

I think Lingard can do good work in the system too.

 

[MeddlLoide]

How many top clubs in Germany are presently still playing the Gegenpress and are they successful?

The top clubs don't and can't just play what you probably understand as "Gegenpress" as the purest form of Rangnick's ideology like always finishing the attack after 8 seconds cuz nobody besides Bayern, Dortmund, Leverkusen now Leipzig again and sometimes someone brave like Stuttgart even wants the ball against them. Just look at how Marsch failed in comparison to the Nagelsmann possession system. There's nothing to be pressed when the opponent is happy to just play long before you can press anybody. You need to know what to do with the ball.

After Klopp won the titles everybody scrambled for counter measures and the "Gegenpress" managers always failed in the same manner. Klopp himself was kinda figured out and needed until years into his Liverpool job to understand the need of possession elements. Then you have someone like Mirko Slomka who was Rangnick's assistant and a student of him finishing 4th and 7th with an Europa QF with a Hannover team that was odds on to be relegated, never was able to do something against people giving them the ball and sitting back and got sacked 1 1/2 years later. Roger Schmidt on Leverkusen had one good season in 14/15, then really struggled and had to adjust in 15/16, came back to do the same nonsense as before and got sacked in 16/17. Leipzig themself were figured out the same way in the 2nd season with Hasenhuttl even though he even tried to give them more solutions with the ball. If Rangnick stays that dogmatic like he seems to be right now and doesn't get back to his 18/19 pragmatism I think United can be very happy to get Ten Hag in the summer because this won't get better with time when teams know exactly what they need to do against him.

 

[Woziak]

Very much early days, somethings are encouraging and some like our inability to win the second ball or consistent sloppy passing are disturbing, it’s clear Ralph wants the job full time as he probably thinks the only reason he’s never won anything significant is because of budget and club size he’s managed previously. My point he seems all a bit too similar to LVG and Jose, Ego and self centred driven! I believe he’s a great ideas man, a great football man but a great coach not only imposes their iron will but can adapt to their squad and their opponents, in other words if he continues every game with a narrow 4-2-2-2 in the premier league he’ll get found out, this is right for some games but others we should play a 4-2-3-1 or 3-4-1-2 or 4-1-2-3 or even a 4-3-3, my point contrary to popular belief , Sir Alex didn’t always play 4-4-2 and Pep doesn’t play a conventional 4-3-3 they tweak the formation while they watch the game, they prepare to succeed not only concentrate on one rigid formation. I hope he stabilised the club, gets top 4 and we go get Ten Hag, a modern coach who understands flexible formations and variants on the Dutch 4-3-3 system. Many people forget Peps 4-3-3 Barcelona system sometimes became 1-2-3-4 system at Bayern with inverted FB’s playing as old fashioned half back playmakers. Can Ralph be better than Klopp, Pep or Tuchel?
I don’t think so can Poch maybe with a big club , can Ten Hag? He’s without doubt the best option to take these guys on next season.

 

[Garethw]

I’m not massively worried. The guy hasn’t even been in the job a fortnight yet ffs. My biggest concern is seeing McKenna in his ear every five minutes. Yesterday was a typical Ole performance, tactics and substitution show. What’s the common denominator between both regimes? Kieran fecking McKenna!

 

[horsechoker]

I’m not massively worried. The guy hasn’t even been in the job a fortnight yet ffs. My biggest concern is seeing McKenna in his ear every five minutes. Yesterday was a typical Ole performance, tactics and substitution show. What’s the common denominator between both regimes? Kieran fecking McKenna!

I noticed he was wearing earphones, perhaps on the phone with ole?

 

[Tarrou]

I’m not massively worried. The guy hasn’t even been in the job a fortnight yet ffs. My biggest concern is seeing McKenna in his ear every five minutes. Yesterday was a typical Ole performance, tactics and substitution show. What’s the common denominator between both regimes? Kieran fecking McKenna!

well and all the players and a bunch of other coaches

 

[Ralph1386]

My biggest concern is seeing McKenna in his ear every five minutes. Yesterday was a typical Ole performance, tactics and substitution show. What’s the common denominator between both regimes? Kieran fecking McKenna!

It’s not only Mckenna, there are still also other backroom staff at training that Ole had brought with him from Cardiff and Molde who are still at the club. It’s impossible to replace all of them in one go, especially for an interim manager. But it’s definitely not helping speed up the transition.

 

[roonster09]

I’m not massively worried. The guy hasn’t even been in the job a fortnight yet ffs. My biggest concern is seeing McKenna in his ear every five minutes. Yesterday was a typical Ole performance, tactics and substitution show. What’s the common denominator between both regimes? Kieran fecking McKenna!

fecking hell, they are professionals, not high school kids where you blame other kid for spoiling your kid with shit ideas.

Also coaches discuss the game, they have to come up with plan to change things and talk about lot of things that goes on the pitch. People look for scapegoat all the time.

 

[Mickeza]

Honestly the fecking scapegoating of McKenna on this place is tedious.

 

[Ixion]

I'm sure the performance of most of the players surprised him yesterday, a decent performance against Palace followed by that dross against the bottom side in the league. He's barely been here 2 minutes yet though so it isn't down to the manager. Performances like yesterday will help him realise where we're lacking and who he can trust. He has kept the same XI because it won the previous 2 but I imagine we'll see a couple of changes on Tuesday and we sure as shit better see more intensity.

 

[TheReligion]

Assume people forget Liverpool when Klopp took over...

 

[VivaJesperBlomqvist]

E

I agree with this. I can't understand what the feck is McKenna is doing? He should have packed his bags with Carrick and Ole. We have heard stories of how players don't rate his coaching style. He should have been gone.

Every time I see a manager talking to McKenna, things seem to be going tits up.

 

[thebelfastboy]

The performances of the Fernandes, Rashford, and Ronaldo made it impossible to have the control Rangnick talks about. Sancho was unlucky to be substituted but Rashford can make the difference physically towards the end of games (even if he doesn't give his all during the game).

Fernandes should have been taken off though. His bottom level is just something else. I also hope Rangnick changes the way he defends when player's run at/past him. Gets on the wrong side too much.

I'm looking forward to the changes vs Brentford just to see what he has in mind. It's clear that he sees Fred and McTominay as the base and that's fine, especially with performances like yesterday. Fred was always going to thrive under him but McTominay was good too.

Rangnick was quite direct in his post-match interview. Saying that your players are not physically present should be a big jolt (hopefully).

I thought Sancho was keeping the ball well, making smart passes and intelligent runs. I was surprised to see him go off.
Rashford on the other hand was all over the place, I'm not convinced he's properly recovered from injury/surgery. In this kind of form he's not a starter for me but better coming off the bench for the last 20.

 

[Water Melon]

What I like about RR is his honesty. He openly admitted that Norwich were more intense than us yesterday. He praised DDG and both of our no 6s, however, Ralf also mentioned that when our technical atttackers do not have time and space to show their skills, they are not as physical as they should be. It seems to me that Lingard, Mata, Martial, Pogba, Cavani and probably Matic along with Phil Jones will leave the club come summer. We will free up of plenty of money for wages and are likely to sign young, promising talents instead of established or past it superstars. When it comes to Donny, I think he might stay for one more year.

 

[Ballache]

People need to calm down (wishful thinking).
The best thing about appointing RR is the 2 years consultancy role. As interim manager, he has one aim and that's finishing top 4. If you're expecting a 180 degrees shift in terms of style now, you're being deluded.
We will finally have someone making good football decisions at the club and hopefully we hire a modern coach that gets a full pre-season to implement his styles and ideas.
It's extremely difficult to implement a new style mid-season, let alone over the busy Christmas schedule.

 

[VP89]

Honestly the fecking scapegoating of McKenna on this place is tedious.

Very true my friend

 

[Sultan]

The top clubs don't and can't just play what you probably understand as "Gegenpress" as the purest form of Rangnick's ideology like always finishing the attack after 8 seconds cuz nobody besides Bayern, Dortmund, Leverkusen now Leipzig again and sometimes someone brave like Stuttgart even wants the ball against them. Just look at how Marsch failed in comparison to the Nagelsmann possession system. There's nothing to be pressed when the opponent is happy to just play long before you can press anybody. You need to know what to do with the ball.

After Klopp won the titles everybody scrambled for counter measures and the "Gegenpress" managers always failed in the same manner. Klopp himself was kinda figured out and needed until years into his Liverpool job to understand the need of possession elements. Then you have someone like Mirko Slomka who was Rangnick's assistant and a student of him finishing 4th and 7th with an Europa QF with a Hannover team that was odds on to be relegated, never was able to do something against people giving them the ball and sitting back and got sacked 1 1/2 years later. Roger Schmidt on Leverkusen had one good season in 14/15, then really struggled and had to adjust in 15/16, came back to do the same nonsense as before and got sacked in 16/17. Leipzig themself were figured out the same way in the 2nd season with Hasenhuttl even though he even tried to give them more solutions with the ball. If Rangnick stays that dogmatic like he seems to be right now and doesn't get back to his 18/19 pragmatism I think United can be very happy to get Ten Hag in the summer because this won't get better with time when teams know exactly what they need to do against him.

These two word sums up my feelings.

 

[Robertd0803]

Assume people forget Liverpool when Klopp took over...

Yeah they were awful. Yet Im willing to bet if you offered any Liverpool fan the initial period would be rubbish but they would win the CL/PL they would quite rightly have jumped at the chance.

Yesterday wasnt great at all but we got 3 points and move on to the next game.

 

[Shark]

Yeah they were awful. Yet Im willing to bet if you offered any Liverpool fan the initial period would be rubbish but they would win the CL/PL they would quite rightly have jumped at the chance.

Yesterday wasnt great at all but we got 3 points and move on to the next game.

They also had a much worse squad than us currently though. I'm not expecting a big transformation over the coming months but I'm at least expecting the passing to improve within the next few weeks. Yesterday was as bad as it's ever been.

 

[Robertd0803]

They also had a much worse squad than us currently though. I'm not expecting a nig transformation over the coming months but I'm at least expecting the passing to improve within the next few weeks. Yesterday was as bad as it's ever been.

Yeah it was a pretty familar performance to ones under Ole. Id be hoping the same that the basics improve.