Radja Nainggolan

Since when wasnt peak age too old. As the word suggests anyone of 29 or over is likely to get worse not better, so spending big money doesnt make sense. Our squad doesnt need (more) experience it needs quality, energy and creativity

We are going off topic here, but age is an interesting discussion to have, so lets do it.

If a club buys a player who is 29, assuming that the player looks after himself, at this age, he should be at his absolute peak. This means that he will perform at the top of his abilities. This is a good thing, not a bad thing.
And it is reasonable to assume that the player will stay with us for the next 3 years at least. So, during the years of 29-32, we effectively get a player who is performing at his absolute best.
Buying a player when he is at his absolute peak, depending on the transfer fee, should be seen as a good thing. Remember when Madrid started buying Galacticos? They were buying players at their peak. When they bought Figo and Luis Ronaldo, neither were youngsters. I believe CR7 was one of the youngest Galacticos.

So, now, lets talk about buying a young player, say age 21. He is nowhere near his peak and has a lot of learning to do. So you buy the 21 year old player, probably pay a big transfer fee (eg. Martial) and the player at that young age is not to be relied upon, despite paying big money. In 5 or so years, that player could deliver and be relied upon, but wait: what if that young prospect never becomes a great player? All that money. All those wages...for little return?

All of a sudden, that 29 year old player who was at his absolute peak, ready to make instant impact, an almost "sure thing", seems like a good buy. Right?

Many MUFC fans will use the example of Rooney and Ronaldo. These fans needs to realise that a young combination like that (both doing well, at the same club) come along once in a generation...if you are VERY lucky.
Most of the time, the most winningest clubs in the World tend to stick with a balance of players in their absolute prime and a few youngsters who can learn from the big names and may (or may not) become the next big names of the team, after the current crop of older players are moved on.

Fans need to ask themselves: are you willing to take that risk, hoping that a 20 year old becomes the next big thing. Or would you rather spend the money on a player who is at his peak and is doing the business at his current club, so almost guarantees that he will hit the ground running when he joins our club?

Personally: I am desperate for us to win the league and as such, I can't wait 5 years for youngsters to develop. The longer we go without winning the title, I think the more difficult it will be for us to win the title again (much like LFC or AFC). Winning the league essentially becomes a habit. With this in mind, I want to see us win the title this season, which means we need to buy experienced players in their prime...something which Jose is actually pretty good at.
 
Neither Herrera or Nainggolan can reliably be DM, and both would only be using half their game if played there. We need someone truly defensive who can start there regardless of the opponent.

I agree with this in theory (not having to change the "best 11" depending on the opposition) but I don't think a defensive midfield player is the answer.

Against weaker sides, the current United squad doesn't have the quality to break them down while carrying a purely defensive midfield player. United put in some excellent defensive displays last season with Herrera as the deepest midfielder.

Unless the club signs at least 2 top class forwards (in addition to Perisic) then the key requirement in midfield is an offensive player rather thsn a defensive one.
 
Against weaker sides, the current United squad doesn't have the quality to break them down while carrying a purely defensive midfield player. United put in some excellent defensive displays last season with Herrera as the deepest midfielder.

Unless the club signs at least 2 top class forwards (in addition to Perisic) then the key requirement in midfield is an offensive player rather thsn a defensive one.

Not sure I agree with that. Our problem breaking down defensive sides last season was not creative - we created a lot of chances, consistently. The problem was putting those chances away. So the onus on transfers shouldn't be on creative midfielders, who very much did their job, it should be on strikers. Then, and only then, we should move on to a DM who can, as you say, start in a best XI against any opponent, and free up Herrera to do the box-to-box job he is made for, and thus Pogba to be more focussed on going forward.
 
We are desperate for a defensive midfielder imo, Pogba and Herrera are fantastic players but we need a third first 11 midfielder to compliment them. I like the fact we have pereria as a first team player now but obviously he's more an attacking player.

Once we've sorted out a striker our other priority just be central midfield.
 
Not sure I agree with that. Our problem breaking down defensive sides last season was not creative - we created a lot of chances, consistently. The problem was putting those chances away. So the onus on transfers shouldn't be on creative midfielders, who very much did their job, it should be on strikers. Then, and only then, we should move on to a DM who can, as you say, start in a best XI against any opponent, and free up Herrera to do the box-to-box job he is made for, and thus Pogba to be more focussed on going forward.

You are massively over simplifying things. Strikers can be creative and midfielders can be great finishers. Just look at Lampard who was a midfield player but was nothing special in anything other than finishing.

Or Fergie's first great side who scored lots of goals with Mark Hughes as the main striker. It's all about getting the balance right and adding a holding midfielder and pushing Pogba further forward greatly reduces the team's offensive threat.

If you go with a midfield 3 of a pure holding midfielder, Herrera and Pogba, the front 3 would all need to be "goal scorers". You would need a MSN/BBC type front 3. Unfortunately Martial, Mkhitaryan and Mata show no signs of being that level of goal threat under Jose and I think Rashford is a few years away too.

Nainggolan is another offensive threat, both creative and finishing himself. If you don't have a few players who will score a lot of goals you need a lot of players who will score a few goals.
 
Not sure I agree with that. Our problem breaking down defensive sides last season was not creative - we created a lot of chances, consistently. The problem was putting those chances away. So the onus on transfers shouldn't be on creative midfielders, who very much did their job, it should be on strikers. Then, and only then, we should move on to a DM who can, as you say, start in a best XI against any opponent, and free up Herrera to do the box-to-box job he is made for, and thus Pogba to be more focussed on going forward.

Thing with Nainggolan then is that he's more of a goalscorer than a creator, and like Scholes he can both score from outside of the box but he'll also sneak forward and act as a 'fox in the box'. Herrera mostly brings decent possession and very good pressing which often creates good chances for the team when he's allowed to harry high up the field. But he's not really a consistently creative player, not even under Van Gaal or at Bilbao where he deployed higher up the field, and his passing range leaves much to be desired. I really think that he needs competition because many times when watching him I think that he's just a jack-of-all trades kind of midfielder who really doesn't excell enough in any department to really be a top, top player. But my main peeve with him right now is that he just doesn't bring enough to our attacking play, and Nainggolan could easily contribute more than Herrera there both in scoring and creating. At the same time a player like Fabinho could easily make him redundant as a defensive midfielder if we were interested.
 
Neither Herrera or Nainggolan can reliably be DM, and both would only be using half their game if played there. We need someone truly defensive who can start there regardless of the opponent.

I agree. However, having 2 hardworking midfielders sharing the work load can work especially if more hardworking players are added to the first team when needed (Perisic? Lingard?). SAF used it to perfection with Carrick, Fletcher, Scholes, Park and Valencia and co.
 
Not sure I agree with that. Our problem breaking down defensive sides last season was not creative - we created a lot of chances, consistently. The problem was putting those chances away. So the onus on transfers shouldn't be on creative midfielders, who very much did their job, it should be on strikers. Then, and only then, we should move on to a DM who can, as you say, start in a best XI against any opponent, and free up Herrera to do the box-to-box job he is made for, and thus Pogba to be more focussed on going forward.
We should free up Herrera so he can shoot on goal, he does it so well…
 
We've added Lukaku to our Belgian contingent, expand it now. Woodward and Mourinho definitely read these forums now and then, just keep posting in this thread until we get him. :wenger:

Get it done!
 
We've added Lukaku to our Belgian contingent, expand it now. Woodward and Mourinho definitely read these forums now and then, just keep posting in this thread until we get him. :wenger:

Get it done!
Yeah Roma have said today he's going nowhere.
 
It would be great to have him here, he's the sort of player than can do everything Mata & Mhiki can do, outshine Lingard & Fellaini by a mile, add some passion, and maybe, just maybe the player that United sign from time to time and makes them self a legend.
 
It would be great to have him here, he's the sort of player than can do everything Mata & Mhiki can do, outshine Lingard & Fellaini by a mile, add some passion, and maybe, just maybe the player that United sign from time to time and makes them self a legend.

Any idea why all the Belgian coaches of the last years chose Fellaini and Witsel in stead of Radja most of the time?
 
Any idea why all the Belgian coaches of the last years chose Fellaini and Witsel in stead of Radja most of the time?
They're clueless that's why. Belgium have one of the best attacks in the world but they don't use it correctly because of their inept managers.
 
They're clueless that's why. Belgium have one of the best attacks in the world but they don't use it correctly because of their inept managers.

But they play two defensive midfielders so what does their attack have to do with Nainggolan and most importantly him not starting. Even though I'm pretty sure he was a starter in the Euro's.
 
Would be an ideal signing for us. Fits the bill exactly in midfield, in the prime of his career when we've just lost two very experienced heads and won't be around so long as to prevent the likes of TFM developing and sticking with us. A trio of Nainggolan-Herrera-Pogba is, realistically, hard to improve on.
 
But they play two defensive midfielders so what does their attack have to do with Nainggolan and most importantly him not starting. Even though I'm pretty sure he was a starter in the Euro's.
I'm saying that if their coaches can't even get an attack with players like Hazard, De Bruyne, Mertens, Carrasco and Lukaku to attack well. If they can't do that it shows how poor their coaches are and how they will also mishandle other areas of the pitch like the midfield.
 
Sounds more as a move for a better contract if anything. Would be awesome to have next to Pogba though, with Herrera shielding them
 
I haven't really given this one a second thought as I didn't think he wanted to leave Roma. But it's starting to get interesting...
I wouldn't get your hopes up, Monchi only came out the other day and said there won't be any more departures. He's angling for a new contract according to the media in Italy, probably just putting pressure on the board. He loves Roma, not sure he'll ever leave.
 
I haven't really given this one a second thought as I didn't think he wanted to leave Roma. But it's starting to get interesting...

It's definitely him angling for a new deal. We have a certain way of carrying out our transfers that clearly involves asking the target to keep their head down and their mouth shut.
 
Any idea why all the Belgian coaches of the last years chose Fellaini and Witsel in stead of Radja most of the time?

Perhaps because Nainggolan smokes. It's true, he does. Don't know how much or how frequently, but he did smoke during either 2016 Euro or 2014 World Cup. Can't remember which one. Could be a reason, but I have no idea.
 
Against the best teams playing 3 in midfield seems necessary these days. Fabinho would be ideal as a DM but wont score many goals from open play which was a big problem for us last season. Nainggolan helps address the goalscoring issue while giving us energy, tenacity and creativity. He'll make late runs into the box, and track back to protect the back four.

I was unsure about him for a while but I think he's perfect. Realistically:

Pogba - Nainggolan
Herrera
is probably the best midfield in the league, and one of the better midfields in Europe too imo.

I also think Mourinho sees Herrera as DM because of the links to Bakayoko, Nainggolan and Rodriguez, all of whom would cause Herrera to be a defensive midfielder to provide balance. Which might be correct simply because Herrera offers very little offensively as we saw this season from his poor goal scoring record. He made a few good key passes like the one to Rashford vs Chelsea but playing as a holding midfielder still lets him do exactly that; he's just perhaps a little more mobile than the average DM. Kind of like Henderson at Liverpool maybe, sitting at the base of Wijnaldum and Lallana but able to move out of position and press, like a dynamic DM. His passing range is good enough for it too.
 
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Against the best teams playing 3 in midfield seems necessary these days. Fabinho would be ideal as a DM but wont score many goals from open play which was a big problem for us last season. Nainggolan helps address the goalscoring issue while giving us energy, tenacity and creativity. He'll make late runs into the box, and track back to protect the back four.

I was unsure about him for a while but I think he's perfect. Realistically:

Pogba - Nainggolan
Herrera
is probably the best midfield in the league, and one of the better midfields in Europe too imo.

I also think Mourinho sees Herrera as DM because of the links to Bakayoko, Nainggolan and Rodriguez, all of whom would cause Herrera to be a defensive midfielder to provide balance. Which might be correct simply because Herrera offers very little offensively as we saw this season from his poor goal scoring record. He made a few good key passes like the one to Rashford vs Chelsea but playing as a holding midfielder still lets him do exactly that; he's just perhaps a little more mobile than the average DM. Kind of like Henderson at Liverpool maybe, sitting at the base of Wijnaldum and Lallana but able to move out of position and press, like a dynamic DM. His passing range is good enough for it too.
You don't have to play 3 in midfield, you can have 4, like Monaco or us against Chelsea, for instance.:p

Against tall opposition, I doubt Mourinho sees Herrera as #6, he played Fellaini there instead of Herrera, #8, against Burnley, for instance. Also, Herrera's truly great at high recoveries, and has an impressive assists' numbers, to my surprise. I can't see him as our #6, unless, as you put it, we bring someone of the calibre of Nainggolan. But I also don't see us choosing 4-3-3 as our most of the games template, so…
 
Nainggolan is overrated. Didn't shine in the CL/EL, hasn't done anything of note with Belgium and hasn't even won anything with Roma.
 
Really can't see Roma selling anyone else this summer, least of all one of their most influential players such as Nainggolan.
 
We have to sign him at any price. He'd be a magnificent performer for us and would honour the shirt.
 
Nainggolan is overrated. Didn't shine in the CL/EL, hasn't done anything of note with Belgium and hasn't even won anything with Roma.
Roma as a club notoriously bottle everything in Europe, he is/was sporadically picked for the NT (former-Wilmots pet Witsel and follow-every-order-down-to-a-tee Fellaini are always given priority) and virtually every Belgian player of this generation hasn't done anything of note internationally. Not winning things is a bizarre criticism. Many of our targets haven't won trophies; it's a team sport after all. Harsh criticisms, in all.
 
End of that article is interesting if true:
Anderlecht’s Leander Dendoncker, 22, is also being monitored after impressing both home and away when the Belgian team faced United in the Champions League.
 
Would be funny if he's seen as Dier's back up as he's a much better player (though also different). Anyway, having Herrera holding behind Nain and Pogba would be pretty brilliant.
 
Roma as a club notoriously bottle everything in Europe, he is/was sporadically picked for the NT (former-Wilmots pet Witsel and follow-every-order-down-to-a-tee Fellaini are always given priority) and virtually every Belgian player of this generation hasn't done anything of note internationally. Not winning things is a bizarre criticism. Many of our targets haven't won trophies; it's a team sport after all. Harsh criticisms, in all.
He is 29 though. Having achieved so little at 29 makes me think he simply doesn't have what it takes to be a serial winner.