Protests following the killing of George Floyd

[villain]

Through education / improved social measures.

Riots aren’t the answer.

What does that even mean?
Elaborate with details, not general statements that sound as though they mean something.

Who is going to educate who, when & how? Who will greenlight the budget for it?
Who will budget for 'social measures', and what exactly are 'social measures'?

 

[Sara125]

Seems like they have a knack for getting people in the eye.

 

[Bobski]

I have an acquaintance who is a cop, who basically brags at parties about being "rough", I reckon he would fit right into a US department. The only thing keeping him in line are his colleagues, who tell him to cut it out. I reckon the job and its perks just attracts a certain type of person.

Why would you want to be a police officer after you have reached some level of maturity and been exposed to human nature? You will have a few who feel a civic duty, a majority who treat it just like any other job and those who are attracted by the power trip.

All of them will have to deal with the worst of humanity on a daily basis, I would imagine the burnout levels are very high.

 

[sammsky1]

Through education / improved social measures.
Riots aren’t the answer.

I’m guessing that once there is genuine evidence of this taking place, over a sustained period, then the protests which can escalate into riots will stop.

You are also conveniently ignoring the 95%+ people who have engaged in purely peaceful protest and advocating policy based on the violence of a tiny minority.

 

[Kentonio]

Of course she won't but that's because the entire context is more violent on both sides and on the subject of the yellow vests it's the latter who started it and the police finished it. I can also provide videos of the "peaceful" protesters, the only thing I'm asking you is to show some balance, you know damn well that you tried to paint a one sided story because I agreed with you on the excessive violence(the firefighters protests being an example) but tell the entire story, don't go around painting the other side as some sort of peaceful protesters because they are not.

And again your girlfriend shouldn't go to these type of "protests" if she is peaceful because the organizers aren't peaceful, they even fight each others.

Which types of protest? You already accepted that with the firefighters protest the police were violent and totally out of line. Why would a different protest result in a different result? That’s my entire point, once the police stop acting properly, then that spills over into everything else.

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

A potent reminder of the depths of depravity and violence the oppressors will go to in order to uphold their white supremacist system and its ideology. Anybody thinking there is a peaceful route to ending this system in the US is sadly deluding themselves. It’s a system underpinned by violence. It will not allow itself to be challenged or dismantled without recourse to even more extreme modes of violence, as we are witnessing right now.

Going back 99 years seems unnecessary. America was still lynching black people in the 80’s. This is who they are.

I’m not suggesting ‘They’ is more than half, or even a huge minority. But it’s there. They have a disgusting history with racial abuse and servitude and clung to it for all it was worth for as long as possible.

 

[Jericholyte2]

Seems like they have a knack for getting people in the eye.

Add about $40,000 medical fees for the privilege.

‘MURICA!!!

 

[MackRobinson]

What has shocked me is how violent the police have been even when they know they are being filmed.

It's systemic. Police in the U.S. a) a trained to use violence to police minority communities b) are largely immune from criminal prosecution b/c of various factors

Police in the US are doing exactly what they set up to do. They have been militarized for a long time now.

 

[caid]

I'm really impressed with how restrained the black population of america has been. They deserve a lot of credit for not letting themselves be goaded into dropping their peaceful protest. Seeing them surround and protect cops is just so far above and beyond what any other group would do

 

[MackRobinson]

Most definitely. It should have been a chance for the police to shine and they have failed on the whole. That said there are some departments that have been praised and have helped facilitate the protests peacefully however they aren't getting much air time which is a shame.

Because highlighting exceptions to the rule does feck all. Police in the US are geared towards violence towards minority communities. The response you are seeing from the police is literally how they were trained to act.

 

[Carolina Red]

 

[Heardy]

What does that even mean?
Elaborate with details, not general statements that sound as though they mean something.

Who is going to educate who, when & how? Who will greenlight the budget for it?
Who will budget for 'social measures', and what exactly are 'social measures'?

going out for a run but will try and provide a proper reply later.

My main point was that rioting and gangs of lads tearing through cities is going to do nothing to correct/improve the underlying issues.

 

[Hammerfell]

I’m not sure everyone knows the rioting 101 protocols.

Humans commit deeply irrational acts when under fight or flight levels of stress.

I agree the man who wielded a sword was very stupid but I’m not sure he was in full control of his mind and close to insanity and madness.

Bizarre.

 

[JPRouve]

Which types of protest? You already accepted that with the firefighters protest the police were violent and totally out of line. Why would a different protest result in a different result? That’s my entire point, once the police stop acting properly, then that spills over into everything else.

Yellow vests and black blocs because if you didn't notice they systematically attack the police and everything else in the area.

 

[TheReligion]

Because highlighting exceptions to the rule does feck all. Police in the US are geared towards violence towards minority communities. The response you are seeing from the police is literally how they were trained to act.

I disagree. It's important for other officers to see their colleagues elsewhere working with their communities and in some instances joining the protests. It's also important for protesters to see that.

A great way to change a broken system is to get the system to change from within.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

They’re such cnuts.

 

[Kentonio]

Yellow vests and black blocs because if you didn't notice they systematically attack the police and everything else in the area.

Funny, because I was at a yellow vest protest in Paris, and while there were certainly a few knobheads looting and causing trouble, the vast majority were just peaceful normal people.

 

[The Firestarter]

That is disgusting, how is this allowed. I honestly think I would rather live in North Korea than the US at this moment in time.

You won't be living for much longer if you attempt to do a street protest over there.

 

[JPRouve]

Funny, because I was at a yellow vest protest in Paris, and while there were certainly a few knobheads looting and causing trouble, the vast majority were just peaceful normal people.

And the vast majority had no issue with the police.

 

[Dumbstar]

Are these scenes from Syria or America? It's becoming harder to tell. Can Europe expect another refugee crisis this time from across the Atlantic?

 

[MackRobinson]

Through education / improved social measures.

Riots aren’t the answer.

Do you mean the constant cuts to public education and social programs that have occurred in US discretionary spending for the last decade or so?

Riots aren't the answer, but they may be the only thing that forces government into implementing a solution.

 

[Kentonio]

And the vast majority had no issue with the police.

Oh I give up, I guess the people who did nothing wrong and now have to spend the rest of their lives half blind should just shut up and get on with it.

 

[neverdie]

It’s almost as if;

- Building War as a cornerstone of your economy
- Building a war machine to run on it
- Feeding that machine with wars against almost exclusively non-white countries
- Having a clear route that sees 1 in 5 Police Officers sourced from Veterans of these wars
- Militarising the police every time the war machine has some quiet years
- Telling the country that they need guns to fight future tyranny
- Allowing a right wing propaganda network to take in 50% of the eyeballs watching news every day

.... well it’s as if that creates a weird society that is ready to disintegrate when the oppressed decide they’ve had enough.

America is a disgusting place. Rotten to the core in all of the areas it should be pure.

The USA is the answer to the age old question what would've happened if Hitler won the war. Not in racial policy but in economic model. Ethnonationalism based on perpetual war. The US needs to change a lot.

 

[MackRobinson]

I disagree. It's important for other officers to see their colleagues elsewhere working with their communities and in some instances joining the protests. It's also important for protesters to see that.

A great way to change a broken system is to get the system to change from within.

Unfortunately this has been tried and failed previously.

Once again, American police are designed to use violence against minority communities (especially black Americans). This is simply undeniable. They are simply carrying out their training, regardless of the few outliers.

 

[RedTiger]

Tough watch (and not just because the lack of social distancing is freaking me out) Your heart really does break for them.

That's some powerful shit.

 

[villain]

going out for a run but will try and provide a proper reply later.

My main point was that rioting and gangs of lads tearing through cities is going to do nothing to correct/improve the underlying issues.

Rioting brings the city to a standstill, and draws attention to the issue at hand by force.

I'm not aware of any large-scale societal change, such as giving citizens rights or gaining equality - which has come about without violence.

 

[MrMarcello]

The USA is the answer to the age old question what would've happened if Hitler won the war. Not in racial policy but in economic model. Ethnonationalism based on perpetual war. The US needs to change a lot.

Pointed out as early as 1935 by a MoH recipient and retired general officer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Is_a_Racket

 

[JPRouve]

Oh I give up, I guess the people who did nothing wrong and now have to spend the rest of their lives half blind should just shut up and get on with it.

That's not what I said. You keep generalizing and pretending that it's one sided when it's not and you know it. I already said multiple time that it happens but it's not systematic and you know that it's true, we can both point to specific moments when it happened and I believe that we condemn it but you tried to generalize it and ignore the context. If I have one advice to give to people, when it comes to french police, if a minority of protesters starts creating havoc, leave quickly because while the police generally doesn't start, they definitely finish the scuffle.

And none of that has anything to do with the post that you originally responded to, which was about guns and their utilisation.

 

[MackRobinson]

It’s almost as if;

- Building War as a cornerstone of your economy
- Building a war machine to run on it
- Feeding that machine with wars against almost exclusively non-white countries
- Having a clear route that sees 1 in 5 Police Officers sourced from Veterans of these wars
- Militarising the police every time the war machine has some quiet years
- Telling the country that they need guns to fight future tyranny
- Allowing a right wing propaganda network to take in 50% of the eyeballs watching news every day

.... well it’s as if that creates a weird society that is ready to disintegrate when the oppressed decide they’ve had enough.

America is a disgusting place. Rotten to the core in all of the areas it should be pure.

Facts.

As Dr. Cornell West said, "America is a failed social experiment". It's completely rotten to the core and Donald Trump is the embodiment of it. There is no more moral high ground to take. We are a complete joke of a nation that deserves to be mocked.

"American exceptionalism"
"The American dream"
"Leader of the free world"
"Land of the free"

Nothing more than catchy marketing slogans.

 

[Ludens the Red]

If coppers were allowed guns as freely as they are in the states it wouldn't be that much different IMO.

That's a good question, in France they have guns and it doesn't happen often. I don't know if the UK are that similar to the US.

But they dont, that's what makes it a different society and mentality

And that’s a key difference.

I always chuckle when I see people throw out that first line. It is actually complete nonsense and is based on absolutely nothing and shows a distinct lack of knowledge on worldwide policing and doesn’t even make any sense.
To start with there’s actually only a handful of countries in the developed world whose police force DONT have guns. Guns are the norm in police forces around the world. One key difference is that these countries don’t give their fecking citizens guns too.

There’s also the other weirdly ignored thing in that there are plenty of black people in European countries with historical and ongoing racism issues and you don’t see black people being killed by police at the rate and in the manor you see it in the states with their police even though they have guns.

Even if we only speak about the U.K. and US. There are still plenty of officers in the U.K. with guns, we have armed officers and they attend plenty of incidents involving firearms, and it’s rare for these incidents to end in people being shot dead.

A Key difference is that these officers undergo intense and extensive training as well as mental and physical checks. They’re also vetted to the smallest detail. In Europe their officers take years to become full time and then get guns.

Meanwhile in America, you walk in on day one and 120 days later, “here’s your gun, knock yourself out”.

So when people say things like “if you get guns as freely in the U.K. like in the US itd be the same”. It’s actually a nonsensical saying Cos it would never happen. And due to the fact it doesn’t, it cuts out the significant recruiting of individuals whom are gun hungry, gun touting, deranged bigots who crave that power.
It’s like me saying I’ll be as good as Lio Messi if I had the same talent and attitude as Lio Messi. One is a consequence of the other.

 

[evil_geko]

Guys violence is wrong ok




Hmm maybe the opinion of that changes on who the victim of the racism is.

Digging through century old posts changes nothing, but points for trying. Congrats for a pointless quote.

 

[Drifter]

Van Jones Calls Out ‘White Hillary Liberals’



Don't usually agree with Van Jones but I'm Glad he came out with this.

 

[BobbyManc]

I'm really impressed with how restrained the black population of america has been. They deserve a lot of credit for not letting themselves be goaded into dropping their peaceful protest. Seeing them surround and protect cops is just so far above and beyond what any other group would do

Yeah my thoughts too. Of course in such an outburst it is impossible for there not be incidents that we can all lament. What is notable is not that they are occurring but how isolated they are, and how the majority are going above and beyond to minimise any serious harm to human life. Remember the incident that triggered this was a cold-blooded execution in full view of the public, because of an allegation of a counterfeit bill. Meanwhile a white guy can threaten protestors with a bow and arrow and all he took was a beating before order was restored. A black civilian with a bow and arrow would have been shot dead no questions asked by the police.

 

[Pink Moon]

Always pisses me off that LeBron is seen as some kind of heroic activist. His comments on the HK/China situation were a disgrace.

 

[Carolina Red]

Weird one. Feels like you’re accidentally amplifying far right messaging now. This term doesn’t need a leg up into the public lexicon.

I know it means something to you, a Liberal American that sees it used in The lanes you’re running in. But if you hadn’t shone a light on it, it would remain in the darkness for a lot longer.

At a time that Police are killing people, I don’t think it’s helpful to make a point of telling people what a small group of people are co-opting a word to mean.

I could be off base. Feels that it’s a movement that stays small without promotion though.

It’s a movement that is growing rapidly online in the United States and is one that people like Minnesota’s Governor are referring to when they’re saying far-right elements are infiltrating the protests.

And I figured it was clear by now - but this is the alt right movement... they’ve been around and everybody that pays attention to the last several years knows about them. They’re just using new vocabulary now... and that vocab needs to be known to detect them and out them.

 

[DavidDeSchmikes]

Van Jones Calls Out ‘White Hillary Liberals’



Don't usually agree with Van Jones but I'm Glad he came out with this.

Some White Hillary Liberals will forget about George Floyd and the broken system the second Trump is ousted out the White House
"Back to normal"

 

[Kentonio]

Some White Hillary Liberals will forget about George Floyd and the broken system the second Trump is ousted out the White House
"Back to normal"

They’re exactly the people MLK was talking about. ‘Friends’ who don’t understand why people’s can’t just patiently put up with oppression they themselves don’t experience while some mythical peaceful solution is found.

 

[RedPed]

I don’t agree - it gives people an excuse to get caught up in riots.

If people riot in London this weekend it’s entirely on the back of whats happened in the US.

People can protest if they feel they’re “not onto a good gig” but that doesn’t give someone the right to set fire to buildings or for people to attack emergency services in the middle of a pandemic!!

the George Floyd video made me feel sick to my stomach, but riots are not the answer!

And that would be a pretty darned good reason. Watching those three precincts burn in Minneapolis was a beautiful sight. When they build the new ones they can literally and figuratively start from scratch and root out the corruption that caused the protest in the first place. I don't know how old you are so I don't how much you would have seen about the Rodney King incident but yet still those feckers have not learned their lesson.

People have tried the 'we shall overcome', arms linked in solidarity approaches yet nothing has changed. The biggest change has been social media and phone tech which have outed those racist pigs. And if not for those two things, black people would still be police and redneck fodder to this very day.

So yeah, in the grand scheme of things, burning a few buildings that can be rebuilt again is not going to hurt anybody and if it makes people take notice then great. I honestly don't understand why people don't get this? We're not talking about whimsical, opportunist destruction here, we're talking about reacting to decades, upon decades of oppression?

 

[JPRouve]

They’re exactly the people MLK was talking about. ‘Friends’ who don’t understand why people’s can’t just patiently put up with oppression they themselves don’t experience while some mythical peaceful solution is found.

Do you think that they can't understand or that they understand perfectly but are using the system for their own benefit?

 

[TheReligion]

And that would be a pretty darned good reason. Watching those three precincts burn in Minneapolis was a beautiful sight. When they build the new ones they can literally and figuratively start from scratch and root out the corruption that caused the protest in the first place. I don't know how old you are so I don't how much you would have seen about the Rodney King incident but yet still those feckers have not learned their lesson.

People have tried the 'we shall overcome', arms linked in solidarity approaches yet nothing has changed. The biggest change has been social media and phone tech which have outed those racist pigs. And if not for those two things, black people would still be police and redneck fodder to this very day.

So yeah, in the grand scheme of things, burning a few buildings that can be rebuilt again is not going to hurt anybody and if it makes people take notice then great. I honestly don't understand why people don't get this? We're not talking about whimsical, opportunist destruction here, we're talking about reacting to decades, upon decades of oppression?

Are you really suggesting there should be world wide riots and not protests?