Protests following the killing of George Floyd

I'm a bit curious, has anyone every seen a molotov cocktail made with a plastic bottle?
 
JPRouve said:
I'm a bit curious, has anyone every seen a molotov cocktail made with a plastic bottle?
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No, not to mention Molotov cocktails are ignited before being thrown, and that thing they’re holding clearly wouldn’t fit in the bottle.
 


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Fortitude said:
This is insane.

The social media age is bringing incontrovertible truth home to many who had no idea this kind of thing goes on.
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Yeah this is definitely one of the good things about Twitter. Especially considering how often the police bodycams are conveniently turned off.

nimic said:
Imagine how often these kinds of injustices took place before everyone started walking around with cameras in their pocket 24/7 the past decade or two?
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Not only the frequency, they do all this stuff knowing there are cameras everywhere, imagine what they do in private.
 
Olly Gunnar Solskjær said:
Yeah this is definitely one of the good things about Twitter. Especially considering how often the police bodycams are conveniently turned off.


Not only the frequency, they do all this stuff knowing there are cameras everywhere, imagine what they do in private.
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Right. It's honestly astonishing just how many videos we've seen of obvious police brutality in response to protests about police brutality. It shows just how little those people care about how they are viewed. Hell, there's literally dozens of videos out there of the police agitating towards the media, which surely is the one group you don't try to brutalize if you want to pretend you're the good guys.
 
nimic said:
Imagine how often these kinds of injustices took place before everyone started walking around with cameras in their pocket 24/7 the past decade or two?
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Yes, when it was word of mouth: 'theirs' against 'ours', miscarriages of justice were simply dismissed. They're not being picked up by the mainstream media for the most part even now, with the footage right there, but it's a massive leap forward to have even a fraction of these events captured and displayed independent of any newsroom deciding on, or editing, what they show.

Whoever thought Twitter and Instagram could be saving graces in 2020!?
 
So, another couple of King Leopold II's statues have been vandalized last night in Belgium, following the killing of George Floyd and the global protests against racism. A lot of people have been willing to get rid of them for a long time, some people want to keep them because it's a reminder of the devastating regime in Belgian Congo. I'd be happy if they removed them, and educated the kids at school. In my day, we were hardly educated on the subject. From what I hear, it's much better now.

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Sky1981 said:
Imagine what they got away with before smart phones
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They're still getting away with everything despite smartphones. Chauvin and his gang would have gotten away despite smartphones hadn't it been for a national uprising.
 
nimic said:
Right. It's honestly astonishing just how many videos we've seen of obvious police brutality in response to protests about police brutality. It shows just how little those people care about how they are viewed. Hell, there's literally dozens of videos out there of the police agitating towards the media, which surely is the one group you don't try to brutalize if you want to pretend you're the good guys.
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I cant get my head around this. US police have provided 1000s of examples of over zealous police brutality in past 6 days, for the whole planet to watch. I'm sure someone is vdo sticking them all together as a montage, it will last for hours. They are literally radicalising the whole country against them.

I want know what the strategy is: How do the most senior police chiefs think this plays out over the next weeks and months. I'd guess they have lost of trust of the past majority of the population and far more than just persecuted black people.

The only conclusion I get to is that some of these policemen literally know no other means of policing, that this form of policing is their default nature. And that makes the allegation of police brutality against blacks a genuine complaint.
 
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Im guessing innocent civilians in Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine and Syria are waving to say Hi to Americans right now.

If this is how USA treats its own citizens, I dread to think of the atrocities US Army inflicted in war zones on civilian populations.

I think its good for USA to see just what military conflict looks like. Perhaps Americans won't be so supportive of military interventions in the future and also genuinely hold their army to account for war crimes.
 
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DoomSlayer said:
Ah, right. So you believe this person speaks for all Russians? And you are ready to judge the whole nation and country based on your extensive historical knowledge on the subject?
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Did you read what he posted? Let me tell you this, if you are a black footballer where are you more likely to have a banana thrown at you or subjected to a barrage of monkey chants. If you are homosexual where are you more likely to get the shit beaten out of you. Get the feck away with your stupid comment. You Russian?
 
DoomSlayer said:
Ah, right. So you believe this person speaks for all Russians? And you are ready to judge the whole nation and country based on your extensive historical knowledge on the subject?
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People judge entire nations all the time. Just look at the views about the US in the CE forum. Its a fairly normal thing around here.
 
Leroy The Red said:
Another absolutely garbage post.

First of all who told you people weren’t trying to improve things in their communities? Who told you they’re “ignoring the other side of the equation”. It’s a continuous, rigorous daily cycle, where members of the black community are trying to influence and change the lives of those living in these deprived and crime ridden areas. This is done through education, youth work, community work, stressing the importance of religion and sport amongst other things.
Even if you’re too ignorant to see it on a smaller scale go and look through history, I suppose people like Martin Luther King and Rosa Parks didn’t exist? I suppose they just “made selfies”.
Just because you can’t be bothered to educate yourself to see it doesn’t mean it isn’t happening.
Also, stop acting as if black people are pretending there aren’t problems in black communities. Nobody is saying all black people are innocent and that no black people are criminals. This isn’t about individuals or a select few, or even a small minority it’s about the entire system.

This is a classic tactic used though, attempting to bring things down to a microscopic level to go “I told you so, it’s their fault”. You can see it all on these twitter feeds. Thousands upon thousands of black people protesting peacefully in hyde park yet when seven black people kick off with police, its plastered all over the twitter feeds of the racists and presented as the majority behaviour. This is what black people have had to deal with for years.

I don’t think you understand the gravity of what black America in particular have gone through. Please go and educate yourself, look up mortgage discrimination, look up criminalisation, look up employment discrimination, please I beg you go and educate yourself before you come out with nonsense.

Thirdly, nice try in your attempt to disguise your obvious inner belief that gang culture, poverty, drug dealing and violence is a ‘black thing’.
There’s massive gang cultures, poverty and drug issues all around the world. El Salvador, Argentina, Albania, are places with lots of this, there arent many black people in these countries. These problems are not born out of race. They’re born out of poverty, poor education, and the fact some people regardless of race are just cnuts. If you think tackling generations of crime and poverty in black dominant neighbourhoods can be MAINLY solved by black people telling other black people off for being naughty and by parents raising children together you’re completely delusional.

Imagine me and you wanted to build individual houses. Now imagine you enslaved me to build your house and then once you finished building yours you released me and left me to build mine.
But rather than support me with building mine and allowing me access to things you had access to, instead you purposely and actively sabotage me building it, you stop me from getting the materials needed, you burn it to the ground whilst I’m building it and then you have the audacity to turn around and ask “why haven’t you build your house yet, you should do more”.



It was an abomination of a post, there was nothing meaningful about it.
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I have a lot of respect for the members of the black community who are actively trying to influence and change the lives of those living in these deprived and crime ridden areas, but the problems they're facing cannot be resolved just by their efforts alone. When I said people need to start with themselves, I meant just that. And the idea that families staying together has a huge effect on people growing up isn't delusional, as you put it, I tell it from my personal experience and it doesn't just apply to black people, it's the same thing everywhere, no matter your race, nationality or background. I should be responsible for my own life, for my children, for my family, nobody else. It's great that there are active members of the community who offer help and assistance but unless I teach my kids by my own example and take responsibility for myself and my family, I can't expect any real positive changes. It's quite popular in America to blame schools for failing kids, especially from poor neighbourhoods but for my money, the problem starts at home. There's a reason kids who go to the same school end up in a different situations afterwards, and more often than not, it's their situation at home that either leads them to becoming a valued member of society or makes them stray onto a wrong path. There are exceptions, of course, but they only prove the rule.

Secondly, I never said that gang culture, poverty, drug dealing and violence is a ‘black thing’, like it only exists in black neighborhoods. That's what I hate the most, it's when people misquote others just so they could make their point more emphatically. Nice try, though.

Martin Luther King and Rosa Parks lived in a very different time in a very different country. They could only dream of the opportunities black people have now, despite all the racism, whether systemic or individual, it's incomparable to what it was like 50-60 years ago. It's fine to criticize modern America for everything that's wrong with it, including racial issues, but you can't honestly tell me there wasn't a huge progress made in the last few decades. People may feel it's nowhere near enough, and rightly so but that's a different argument.

My initial post was made to bring attention to the fact that due to the outrage aimed at police for killing another black man people en masse jump on the 'blame the system' wagon and it's easy to follow the well-beaten path either through fear of otherwise being called a racist or due to simply wanting to blend in and look 'liberal and progressive'. All the issues you've mentioned, including criminalization, mortgage and employment discrimination etc, are real and it should be rectified, no one argues that. But I stand by my opinion that the real change starts at home, and that applies to every nation or race.
 
I'm a bit thick, I don't understand how this constant rioting/protesting is going to help anything?

I understand protesting but it appears to be going much further, nobody is actually trying to break it down into talks are they?

Obviously you get the dipshits who just use a protest to be dicks anyway.

But the speeches, the gatherings, the group mentality can't be good? It's turning into group a Vs group b. Alot of the police will be good people, but they're being made to stop looting and riots because of something one asshole and his mates done? (I know there is more but this is the incident that kicked it all off). Also they'll be getting a lot of shit just for being police.

Surely the point has now been made and it's time to take it somewhere in a more peaceful manner? I just don't see the "end game" here for anyone at the moment.

Also, I understand America going all tits up, why is every other country following? Are the police everywhere really as bad as over there? Can anyone point me to an example of UK police brutality against a minority? I don't remember any in the news, but then again that could get glossed over tbh.

So really my question is, where does this go from here?
 
antihenry said:
My initial post was made to bring attention to the fact that due to the outrage aimed at police for killing another black man people en masse jump on the 'blame the system' wagon and it's easy to follow the well-beaten path either through fear of otherwise being called a racist or due to simply wanting to blend in and look 'liberal and progressive'.
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This is such a bullshit argument. You can't possibly imagine why someone would be outraged at this incident and others like it, so in your world there has to be something else to it. It's projection, nothing more, and honestly betrays a lack of empathy.
 
antihenry said:
I have a lot of respect for the members of the black community who are actively trying to influence and change the lives of those living in these deprived and crime ridden areas, but the problems they're facing cannot be resolved just by their efforts alone. When I said people need to start with themselves, I meant just that. And the idea that families staying together has a huge effect on people growing up isn't delusional, as you put it, I tell it from my personal experience and it doesn't just apply to black people, it's the same thing everywhere, no matter your race, nationality or background. I should be responsible for my own life, for my children, for my family, nobody else. It's great that there are active members of the community who offer help and assistance but unless I teach my kids by my own example and take responsibility for myself and my family, I can't expect any real positive changes. It's quite popular in America to blame schools for failing kids, especially from poor neighbourhoods but for my money, the problem starts at home. There's a reason kids who go to the same school end up in a different situations afterwards, and more often than not, it's their situation at home that either leads them to becoming a valued member of society or makes them stray onto a wrong path. There are exceptions, of course, but they only prove the rule.

Secondly, I never said that gang culture, poverty, drug dealing and violence is a ‘black thing’, like it only exists in black neighborhoods. That's what I hate the most, it's when people misquote others just so they could make their point more emphatically. Nice try, though.

Martin Luther King and Rosa Parks lived in a very different time in a very different country. They could only dream of the opportunities black people have now, despite all the racism, whether systemic or individual, it's incomparable to what it was like 50-60 years ago. It's fine to criticize modern America for everything that's wrong with it, including racial issues, but you can't honestly tell me there wasn't a huge progress made in the last few decades. People may feel it's nowhere near enough, and rightly so but that's a different argument.

My initial post was made to bring attention to the fact that due to the outrage aimed at police for killing another black man people en masse jump on the 'blame the system' wagon and it's easy to follow the well-beaten path either through fear of otherwise being called a racist or due to simply wanting to blend in and look 'liberal and progressive'. All the issues you've mentioned, including criminalization, mortgage and employment discrimination etc, are real and it should be rectified, no one argues that. But I stand by my opinion that the real change starts at home, and that applies to every nation or race.
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You should read the twitter thread in post #3993, which gets into the idea that black people should try to get their own house in order before complaining about external forces (tl;dr they already are)
 
antihenry said:
I have a lot of respect for the members of the black community who are actively trying to influence and change the lives of those living in these deprived and crime ridden areas, but the problems they're facing cannot be resolved just by their efforts alone. When I said people need to start with themselves, I meant just that. And the idea that families staying together has a huge effect on people growing up isn't delusional, as you put it, I tell it from my personal experience and it doesn't just apply to black people, it's the same thing everywhere, no matter your race, nationality or background. I should be responsible for my own life, for my children, for my family, nobody else. It's great that there are active members of the community who offer help and assistance but unless I teach my kids by my own example and take responsibility for myself and my family, I can't expect any real positive changes. It's quite popular in America to blame schools for failing kids, especially from poor neighbourhoods but for my money, the problem starts at home. There's a reason kids who go to the same school end up in a different situations afterwards, and more often than not, it's their situation at home that either leads them to becoming a valued member of society or makes them stray onto a wrong path. There are exceptions, of course, but they only prove the rule.

Secondly, I never said that gang culture, poverty, drug dealing and violence is a ‘black thing’, like it only exists in black neighborhoods. That's what I hate the most, it's when people misquote others just so they could make their point more emphatically. Nice try, though.

Martin Luther King and Rosa Parks lived in a very different time in a very different country. They could only dream of the opportunities black people have now, despite all the racism, whether systemic or individual, it's incomparable to what it was like 50-60 years ago. It's fine to criticize modern America for everything that's wrong with it, including racial issues, but you can't honestly tell me there wasn't a huge progress made in the last few decades. People may feel it's nowhere near enough, and rightly so but that's a different argument.

My initial post was made to bring attention to the fact that due to the outrage aimed at police for killing another black man people en masse jump on the 'blame the system' wagon and it's easy to follow the well-beaten path either through fear of otherwise being called a racist or due to simply wanting to blend in and look 'liberal and progressive'. All the issues you've mentioned, including criminalization, mortgage and employment discrimination etc, are real and it should be rectified, no one argues that. But I stand by my opinion that the real change starts at home, and that applies to every nation or race.
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If you’re trying to claim you’re not racist, it may behoove you to not make the basis of your argument the notion that black families don’t stick together. Which if you follow to its logical conclusion is the same as the stereotype that black men don’t make good fathers.

If that’s an American thing and you weren’t aware of that racist stereotype then I’ll give you a pass on that one.
 
Organic Potatoes said:
If you’re trying to claim you’re not racist, it may behoove you to not make the basis of your argument that black families don’t stick together. Which if you follow to its logical conclusion is the same as the stereotype that black men don’t make good fathers.

If that’s an American thing and you weren’t aware of that racist stereotype then I’ll give you a pass on that one.
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Of course he's aware. He's using the same old, tired arguments that have always been used, dog-whistles and all.
 
Organic Potatoes said:
If you’re trying to claim you’re not racist, it may behoove you to not make the basis of your argument that black families don’t stick together. Which if you follow to its logical conclusion is the same as the stereotype that black men don’t make good fathers.

If that’s an American thing and you weren’t aware of that racist stereotype then I’ll give you a pass on that one.
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I'm not trying to do anything except voicing my own opinion. If someone thinks me a racist, I can't control that nor do I give a shit.
 
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