Post Match United v Blackburn

I think what was most annoying about this game was that the team put out was good enough to win. The injuries obviously caused lots of problems but both halves we dominated but our use of the ball in the final third was pretty poor and that was where some of the more established players let us down. At the back we made mistakes, De Gea really didn't handle the high balls well, he was coming out with no real determination to win the ball as well as trying to punch balls he should be catching.

We caused ourselves problems as well with the set up as well. If Anderson was ok to play 45 mins then I'm sure he would have been fine to play around an hour, probably more given how in control we were, which could have made a big difference in the first half. I'm not sure what the situation is with Giggs, Gibson and Rooney but unless they were all injured, I don't think we should have left out any of them from the squad, not when we have that many players out of position on the field.

Ultimately it's a bad loss but the injuries have caught up with us. We're still in a great position in the league but I think this could hurt us long term, we really can't afford to be dropping points at home.
 
Unam333 said:
Today's result really ruined the occasion. Not the 1st time this happened (Memorial Munich Disaster sticks to mind).

The worst part is, we had fit players available who weren't on the bench, but should be on the bench, like Giggs, Rooney, Gibson, feck it, maybe even Morrison.

Man, we were finally on a good run and then this result. What a kick in the teeth this all is.

Anyway, Happy New Year Cafs!
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I find it hard to believe those players were around.
 
Randall Flagg said:
Rafael has been on the bench over the last couple of weeks. Clearly ahead of Anderson in terms of fitness
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doesn't change the fact he played a rb just back from injury (on the bench yes but not on the field) at ctr midf.
 
Twigginater said:
Because we had a gap in CM, and had no-one to fill it. Play Valencia there and you have a midfield of:

Welbeck - Park - Valencia - Nani

and a defence of

Evra - Carrick - Jones - Rafael

I don't think that's much better than what happened today.
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That gap could've been filled by Valencia or even Pogba, or even JOS :drool:
 
Twigginater said:
Does it really make that game hard to judge?

How about the referee seeing Berbatov being fouled today and not giving a penalty. Does that mean this game was hard to judge?
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It was 11 vs 11 today though.

Wigan were never going to be competitive at OT after going a man down when already a goal down.
 
Twigginater said:
Does it really make that game hard to judge?

How about the referee seeing Berbatov being fouled today and not giving a penalty. Does that mean this game was hard to judge?
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So what did you make of Valencia's and Rafael's starting positions? You seem to be skating over that issue...
 
Twigg, we all get it, you are a good fan and all that but people are entitled to be pissed off.

Fergie needs to give a bit of an explanation IMO as to where the club stands at the moment with injuries and players being unavailable.

If players have been rested today for no reason then I think he has got it very wrong. You have to win your home games no matter what. One eye on beating Newcastle away is no good if you have dropped 3 points at home to bottom of the league Blackburn.
 
TheReligion said:
Twigg, we all get it, you are a good fan and all that but people are entitled to be pissed off.

Fergie needs to give a bit of an explanation IMO as to where the club stands at the moment with injuries and players being unavailable.

If players have been rested today for no reason then I think he has got it very wrong. You have to win your home games no matter what. One eye on beating Newcastle away is no good if you have dropped 3 points at home to bottom of the league Blackburn.
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The thing is over the course of the season you HAVE to make gambles like this. We had enough out there today to win, but unfortunately we didn't. We had a good number of chances, snatched at a lot, and they scored three decent goals.

I mean we had about 14 corners surely. They have a few and score from one.

It's ok being pissed off but in the big picture it's clear to see why Fergie did what he did today. With so many players out, it's clear that we had to make some kind of sacrifice.
 
Feed Me said:
So what did you make of Valencia's and Rafael's starting positions? You seem to be skating over that issue...
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Fine. Rafael can't play there, but I can understand the thinking as he's extremely mobile and good in the tackle, and also pairing him with Jones would have meant a lack of experience at the back.
 
Twigginater said:
Fine. Rafael can't play there, but I can understand the thinking as he's extremely mobile and good in the tackle, and also pairing him with Jones would have meant a lack of experience at the back.
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But Rafael is a more experienced right back than Valencia and Valencia is a more experienced midfield player than Rafael.

It's no coincidence that we looked more dangerous once Valencia was restored to his natural habitat. Granted, we were also helped by having an actual central midfielder on the pitch.
 
prateik said:
So if we sign a central defender, what do we do when Vidic returns in 6 months time?
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there is no guarantee if and when Vida will return from that injury, never mind what kind of form he will be in. You dont not plan in these circumstances. IF he gets another CB in (i dont believe he will btw), then the man in form takes the shirt. Simple
 
Twigginater said:
It's ok being pissed off but in the big picture it's clear to see why Fergie did what he did today. With so many players out, it's clear that we had to make some kind of sacrifice.
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The problem was not the players per se, the problems was playing most of them out of position. I don't know what's so hard to see about that... there was absolutely no need to do so with four actual defenders available.
 
Twigginater said:
The thing is over the course of the season you HAVE to make gambles like this. We had enough out there today to win, but unfortunately we didn't. We had a good number of chances, snatched at a lot, and they scored three decent goals.

I mean we had about 14 corners surely. They have a few and score from one.

It's ok being pissed off but in the big picture it's clear to see why Fergie did what he did today. With so many players out, it's clear that we had to make some kind of sacrifice.
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why did he play raffa in midf - see to me that is not clear. so the sacrifice was 3 points. risk/reward. risk dropping points at home for a win at newc away. maybe - time will tell.
 
Feed Me said:
But Rafael is a more experienced right back than Valencia and Valencia is a more experienced midfield player than Rafael.

It's no coincidence that we looked more dangerous once Valencia was restored to his natural habitat. Granted, we were also helped by having an actual central midfielder on the pitch.
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Yeah for me the change was that Anderson come on. I think Rafael looked good at RB.

It's a shame really, but I can see why Fergie

a) Rested Anderson
b) Played Valencia at the back
c) Played Rafael.
 
mu77 said:
why did he play raffa in midf - see to me that is not clear. so the sacrifice was 3 points. risk/reward. risk dropping points at home for a win at newc away. maybe - time will tell.
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Because Rafael is good in the tackle, can run all game and lacks defensively occasionally.

It's the whole risk/reward thing. Normally it pays off.
 
Twigginater said:
Fine. Rafael can't play there, but I can understand the thinking as he's extremely mobile and good in the tackle, and also pairing him with Jones would have meant a lack of experience at the back.
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A big club tends tp play players in their natural roles, something we're struggling to do due to injuries. Its time for United to tackle that issue since switching players around will only harm their careers and making them lose form.
 
golden_blunder said:
there is no guarantee if and when Vida will return from that injury, never mind what kind of form he will be in. You dont not plan in these circumstances. IF he gets another CB in (i dont believe he will btw), then the man in form takes the shirt. Simple
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exactly - rio/vida anothyer yr older - evans is injury prone , feck me the twins - help at the back can't hurt. but like you i think nothing will happen.
 
devilish said:
A big club tends tp play players in their natural roles, something we're struggling to do due to injuries. Its time for United to tackle that issue since switching players around will only harm their careers and making them lose form.
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How can United tackle that issue? Please explain.
 
Feed Me said:
But Rafael is a more experienced right back than Valencia and Valencia is a more experienced midfield player than Rafael.

It's no coincidence that we looked more dangerous once Valencia was restored to his natural habitat. Granted, we were also helped by having an actual central midfielder on the pitch.
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I think Valencia's and Rafaels starting positions were right in the line up we went for. I initially figured Valencia would play centrally but I think what we did made sense. If you put Valencia in the middle he can't use his biggest asset which is his pace and cross. He's not comfortable enough on his left to dribble through the middle. Rafael on the other hand is a lot more comfortable on either foot and so can come through the middle much more easily and you can utilise Valencia from wide. It made sense to play them there. However I think you're right that we looked better with Valencia further forward. Ando should have started instead of Hernandez, I reckon we would have looked a lot better.
 
Twigginater said:
Because Rafael is good in the tackle, can run all game and lacks defensively occasionally.

It's the whole risk/reward thing. Normally it pays off.
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You're listing defensive qualities that were not really needed today. We were listless in our attacking play in the first half because Park and Rafael aren't constructive players. They're both runners. It always looked like a midfield selection lacking in composure and on the ball ability to me.

We moved the ball painfully slowly in the first half.
 
Twigginater said:
How can United tackle that issue? Please explain.
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I honestly don't know. It could be a physio or coaching thing or the mere fact that some players are injury prone. However this situation is ridiculous and unacceptable and its repeating itself nearly year after year.
 
Feed Me said:
You're listing defensive qualities that were not really needed today. We were listless in our attacking play in the first half because Park and Rafael aren't constructive players. They're both runners. It always looked like a midfield selection lacking in composure and on the ball ability to me.

We moved the ball painfully slowly in the first half.
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If our defensive qualities weren't needed how the feck did we conceed 3.

I can't think of any attributes that Valencia possesses which would look good in CM. He can run very fast, he can get a great cross in and he can track back (which would come in handy) I think his one footedness makes him a poor choice for CM tbh.
 
devilish said:
I honestly don't know. It could be a physio or coaching thing or the mere fact that some players are injury prone. However this situation is ridiculous and unacceptable and its repeating itself nearly year after year.
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Y'know what else is repeated year after year.

Trophies.

Perhaps we leave things alone?
 
golden_blunder said:
there is no guarantee if and when Vida will return from that injury, never mind what kind of form he will be in. You dont not plan in these circumstances. IF he gets another CB in (i dont believe he will btw), then the man in form takes the shirt. Simple
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I wouldve agreed if we didnt have any young defenders at the club and not much after Vida and Rio.
We have Smalling,Evans and Jones.
Its a decent spread with Rio being the oldest, Vidic being 4 years younger and then a few younger defenders.

As it is, there are enough to cover for him till he returns and we can decide after than whether or no we need to get someone else in.

The temporary problem tho is that injuries elsewhere have meant the others have played a lot (in different positions RB, midfield) and have picked up knocks too.

Its a weird one with all these injuries. Cant account for them and cant have a bigger squad either.
 
Twigginater said:
Y'know what else is repeated year after year.

Trophies.

Perhaps we leave things alone?
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We should look at things that need to improve rather then simply gloat on what we've achieved. Barca won the treble last year and yet that hasn't stopped them to find new ways how to get better. We should do the same.

Now if for you having 11 players injured is acceptable then be my guest. For me its not and these waves of injuries is not only hindering our performance but could risk in forcing United to spend unneccessary money.
 
devilish said:
We should look at things that need to improve rather then simply gloat on what we've achieved. Barca won the treble last year and yet that hasn't stopped them to find new ways how to get better. We should do the same.

Now if for you having 11 players injured is acceptable then be my guest. For me its not and these waves of injuries is not only hindering our performance but could risk in forcing United to spend unneccessary money.
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What can you do? Fletcher/Vidic's/Cleverly/Evans injuries all happened in a match where they couldn't do anything else. What.. what can we change?

They're not injury prone, none of them are injuries they've had before. Just a nightmre scenario.
 
The worst thing about the result is that it will inspire City.
 
Twigginater said:
If our defensive qualities weren't needed how the feck did we conceed 3.

I can't think of any attributes that Valencia possesses which would look good in CM. He can run very fast, he can get a great cross in and he can track back (which would come in handy) I think his one footedness makes him a poor choice for CM tbh.
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The first was Berbatov's marking of Samba from a set piece.
The second was poor defending from Carrick, then Jones, then De Gea.
The third was dire keeping from De Gea.

We made sloppy, individual errors. Generally, Blackburn were a non entity as an attacking unit. Had we dome more with the ball ourselves, we wouldn't have had a problem.

Whatever you say about Valencia's skill set, he has more experience there than Rafael in midfield. And Rafael is more natural at right back.
 
Twigginater said:
What can you do? Fletcher/Vidic's/Cleverly/Evans injuries all happened in a match where they couldn't do anything else. What.. what can we change?

They're not injury prone, none of them are injuries they've had before. Just a nightmre scenario.
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Its not a 1 year thing though isn't it? Time and time again we're ending up in this situation, which, is hindering us badly both in terms of performance and in the future on financial terms. I mean think how much money could have been spared if Ando/Clev could have actually sorted our CM problem
 
Feed Me said:
The first was Berbatov's marking of Samba from a set piece.
The second was poor defending from Carrick, then Jones, then De Gea.
The third was dire keeping from De Gea.

We made sloppy, individual errors. Generally, Blackburn were a non entity as an attacking unit. Had we dome more with the ball ourselves, we wouldn't have had a problem.

Whatever you say about Valencia's skill set, he has more experience there than Rafael in midfield. And Rafael is more natural at right back.
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Yeah saying "midfield" masks the fact that he's never played any games for United in CM. Whereas he's played a few at RB.

Either way it could have gone wrong. We had to play players out of position no matter what.
 
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