who cares right now. 2 1/2 seasons under Maureen would be better than the last 18 months under LVG
Call me old fashioned but I quite like having a long term plan, something Maureen has never been at any point of his managerial career. This idea that suddenly he's going to want to stay here for more than 2 and a half seasons (or more to the point not completely feck up everything his ego touches in that time) is based on blind faith.
Ronaldo...
What is the 'long term plan'? LVG is gone at the end of next season anyway.
Presumably a revamp of the club at academy, reserve and first team levels - the first and last of those especially. But how about we start with appointing a manager who would actually stick around long enough to see the benefits of any of that?
Great, so, which manager do we appoint as a long term option? I always enjoy this particular debate.
Giggs.
Surely this is pretty big news? he's very reliable regarding us. Herrera and Di Maria come to mind in recent memory as saga's he was spot on with. Surprised there isn't a separate thread with a title..
Youre old fashioned!
Seriously, I can see your point but from where we are now it is hard to see what the long term plan should be. Pochettino? If the club went that way I would support it but it does seem possibly a bit early for him, he could do with staying at Spurs to see if he can actually deliver on the promise he is showing. If Mourinho comes and gives us 2 or 3 seasons or whatever it buys us time, which, if Woodward was prudent, he would use to think carefully about what our next step should be, and start preparing the groundwork. I dont think people are saying Mourinho will turn out to be the long term solution and will be with us for decades - it would be nice if he did, but that isnt the point. It is that there are no strong candidates available who will clearly stay at the club for that kind of timeframe - in fact, there may never be.
I did used to think like you - I think a lot of us did to some extent because it was how SAF thought and it rubbed off on all of us. But I think we need to start flipping it around and think of longevity as the product of success, not success the product of longevity. Meaning, you cant appoint someone and assume that if you give them 10+ years that everything will work out, you need to appoint someone who will deliver the goods, and if they do that, with a bit of luck, we may keep them for a long time because there arent too many jobs around that would entice a good manager who was successful away.
I thought Mourinho would settle at Chelsea for the long term as it happens, I said so on here quite a few times and I was proved wrong, circumstances didnt allow it and the same may well happen if he came here. But I dont think he actually wants to play the field anymore, where else would he want to go? He has done Spain and Italy, he said he prefers England. He has tarvelled and experienced new things, he may want to settle down, I think he would have at Chelsea if he could have. Obviously he may end up falling out with the players or Woodward or the medical staff or whatever, if he does we deal with it, and like I said, Woodward would need to plan for that eventuality.
As a few others have said above the essence of the issue is that there is no candidate around who has the requisite experience who we can guarantee will stick around for a long time. We have to take a risk one way or the other, either by appointing someone with less than the ideal amount of experience, or appointing someone with a history of falling out with people he works with. There is no one candidate I am supporting in this at the exclusion of all others, Pochettino and Mourinho both look good candidates to be fair, but Mourinho looks more qualified to get us back to where we need to be in the short term so I am gravitating towards going that way and hoping we are in a stronger position by the time he leaves, in which case hopefully another good candidate will be available at that time (again, Woodward's biggest job is to facilitate that transition.)
It seem people are still scared to create new threads as someone will always have a go at them. I hate mega threads and you miss new info all the time because of that shite.
I have got a feeling that Maureen wants to create a legacy. He hero worships Ferguson and he's also extremely competitive. He will want to emulate Sir Alex above everything else.
I think he sees United's history as special and I think he will respect that.
For me long-term plans/visions are a lot of the time pointless and usually at best just a starting point which get revised as times goes on.
Not appointing Mourinho because he won't perhaps stay beyond three seasons is just daft. Who will definitely stay beyond the point? Pep? Not likely. Guess we're back with the likes of Giggs? Great - all for the sake of 'long-term' thinking. No thank you.
Club needs to get this done and dusted. Top manager who wants to manage us - let's actually make a good decision for once.
Not appointing Mourinho because he won't perhaps stay beyond three seasons is just daft. Who will definitely stay beyond the point? Pep? Not likely. Guess we're back with the likes of Giggs? Great - all for the sake of 'long-term' thinking. No thank you.
Club needs to get this done and dusted. Top manager who wants to manage us - let's actually make a good decision for once.
true, but i think the original long term plan of 3 years of Louie (building the squad / system etc) followed by Sir Giggs taking over hasn't gone to plan. Hence plans need to be revised. Just pulling one out of thin air, but maybe the new long term plan could be to get Giggs some management experience and when Maureen does desert us after 2 1/2 years then we'll know whether Giggs is management material or not. Don't think we can risk it now.
Regarding his short-term approach to the job, I think it has come down to the fact he's a control freak that has never been given full control. It was always Roman's club rather than his and the same with Moratti at Inter and Perez at Real Madrid.
He knows that if he took the reins at United he'll have full control over every single detail and I think it's incredibly important to want a manager that wants control over the whole club like that. Whereas Pep seems to just want to take control of the first team coaching and have a say in transfers, I think Mourinho has always envied what Ferguson had at United and is desperate it.
There would be no more squabbles over who he is allowed to sign, no more dressing room tantrums. His club, his rules and I think he'd be happier for it.
How would Ferguson have coped under Abramovic? Being told who is going to be joining his squad and being told he's not allowed a certain player or that a certain player is allowed to leave the club and go to a rival?
How would Ferguson have coped at Real when a certain section of the dressing room is undermining his authority and having stories printed that he does not like? How would he have reacted when he goes to the President for support and the best he gets back is a shrug of his shoulders?
Where has his incentive ever been to develop youth? He's been at clubs that demand instant success, at clubs give no credit to the development of a youngster, at clubs that he knows he'll probably out of in a few years time when the owner or President has refused to let him do something his way.
We're a match made in heaven for him. Fergie was a control freak with a huge, huge ego and that is the perfect cocktail for success in this club. Mourinho is cut from the same cloth and will thrive under those conditions.
He knows that if he took the reins at United he'll have full control over every single detail and I think it's incredibly important to want a manager that wants control over the whole club like that. Whereas Pep seems to just want to take control of the first team coaching and have a say in transfers, I think Mourinho has always envied what Ferguson had at United and is desperate it.
There would be no more squabbles over who he is allowed to sign, no more dressing room tantrums. His club, his rules and I think he'd be happier for it.
How would Ferguson have coped under Abramovic? Being told who is going to be joining his squad and being told he's not allowed a certain player or that a certain player is allowed to leave the club and go to a rival?
How would Ferguson have coped at Real when a certain section of the dressing room is undermining his authority and having stories printed that he does not like? How would he have reacted when he goes to the President for support and the best he gets back is a shrug of his shoulders?
Where has his incentive ever been to develop youth? He's been at clubs that demand instant success, at clubs give no credit to the development of a youngster, at clubs that he knows he'll probably out of in a few years time when the owner or President has refused to let him do something his way.
We're a match made in heaven for him. Fergie was a control freak with a huge, huge ego and that is the perfect cocktail for success in this club. Mourinho is cut from the same cloth and will thrive under those conditions.
Its happening, this will be the best piece of business done by Ed and the club since SAF retired, I will be one happy man. Jose Mourinho Jose Mourinho Jose Mourinho
If Ed is still in charge next season, his position must also come under review I would imagine.
Haven't you heard Giggs is the new Guardiola.
That's Gary Neville
Giggs is the new Gary Neville
He wouldn't be my first choice, but I'd much rather him than LVG.
Ed woodward lays golden eggs and the Glazers love him, in terms of footballing side of United on any normal circumstances then yes he would but because he is making people very wealthy he will go nowhere
Agree with pretty much all of this. Mourinho is the 'safe' option to at least drag us up by our bootstraps over the next couple of years. And who knows, it may be a marriage made in heaven. I've always felt that he wants to usurp SAF's records & achievements and the reason he covets the Utd job is that he wants to do it in the exact same environment to 'prove' he's better.
Worst comes to worst - he stays here s couple of years, improves us and then leaves under a cloud. This gives us time for Giggs/Poch/Simeone etc to become ready.
Your guess is as good as mine of course but personally I doubt that, for the Glazers it is all about the bottom line and as far as revenues and profitability are concerned Woodward is doing a great job. Obviously his next appointment is crucial and if he gets that one wrong then it will call his judgement into question as far as the football side of things goes, which will eventually matter. But for now I think they would be happy to put it down to unfortunate and difficult circumstances and give him the benefit of the doubt.
I can understand the stance on wanting Giggs as manager but to want giggs over Mourinho is plain and utter stupidity, If Giggs goes out and learns the trade first hand and is successful then yes we give him his apportunity but to turn down Jose Mourinho who is possibly the best modern manager in football today for a man with no experience bar 4 games is absolute stupidity and I hope our board have there heads screwed on when making such a decision.
It could be that he is relieved of his duties on the football side of things and is left to deal with the commercial aspect of the club, which he is clearly extremely talented at.
If and when performances on the park start affecting the bottom line, then action will have to be taken. If Woodward can't get the footballing side right and that affects the club financially then I can see him being moved sidewards.
Is Giggs even still an option? As in, is the press still speculating that it will happen? It all seems to have gone a bit quiet on that score now and I kind of assumed that idea had been shelved.
I really hope its been shelved, if there was no top manager available then maybe just maybe United could take a punt, but as its widely known that Jose is busting his hole for the job there should be only one outcome
ESPN sources claim its Mourinho with a bit of Glazer interest in Pochettino.
http://www.espnfc.co.uk/manchester-...inho-increasingly-confident-in-man-united-job
http://www.espnfc.co.uk/manchester-...inho-increasingly-confident-in-man-united-job
Wait for the next two losses and it'll be back.
Giggs should manage Wales, or should have shown an interest in the Swansea job before being anywhere near consideration for United.
Agreed. But again, I think it will be his next appointment that determines whether that happens.
Obviously if we dont quality for the CL this season then the football side WILL have affected the bottom line. But my guess is that, as I said, Van Gaal would carry the can for that, not Woodward. He would be expected to get the next decision right, if he didnt that would establish the pattern of incompetence, as far as the football side goes.
It is an interesting question as to whether Woodward would accept a sideways move, given it would in truth be a downward move, as he is effectively the CEO, in practice if not in title. The risk for the Glazers would be that he would feel demoted and insulted and would leave, thus killing the golden goose.
This is why the DoF route might appeal. I am interested in this question, in that I read a lot of stuff on here from people who understand the implications of it much better than I do - arguing on both sides of it. I havent got anything to add in terms of whether it is a good idea or not. But it would have the advantage of putting a football man in a position of authority in football matters, while keeping them very clearly below Woodward in the hierarchy. So Woodward remains de facto CEO, with ultimate responsibility for everything, including the football. But someone else gets to make the actual decisions, all he has to do is go along with it.
interesting, United interest in Mourinho has really intensified to the point it seems its a matter of when not if, lets hope so anyway I fully believe he could have a Cantona affect, interesting summer coming up
Although I found him entertaining at Chelsea the first time he was there, I never wanted him at United.
On his second stink at Chelsea he seemed a different person, and this season seemed to have a self destruct button, and he coudnt get his Champions to perform on the pitch this year.
Despite all that, I think he is the best proven manager available at the moment, if it was only for 2 or 3 years, that is stability compared to many clubs these days.
On his second stink at Chelsea he seemed a different person, and this season seemed to have a self destruct button, and he coudnt get his Champions to perform on the pitch this year.
Despite all that, I think he is the best proven manager available at the moment, if it was only for 2 or 3 years, that is stability compared to many clubs these days.
Yep, it's a matter of when IMO and I couldn't be happier that club is seeing the light. Giggs needs to earn his stripes elsewhere.
This will be the start of our fight back, lets get it done ED.
Agreed. I think he was jealous of Wenger having complete control at Arsenal too which is why he constantly criticised him.
I dont understand this bit about caretaker manager. Why would he not join until the summer, even if he has agreed to take on the job? Why would we need someone else in place until the end of the season?
This is not his mess to clean up, he has also had a bad year and it would only be bad for both him and the club if he came here and lost a few matches, he needs a fresh start witha summer of putting his own team together