I thought that was going to be a shop job when it was spoilered. Great photo.Courtesy of Reddit. I don't even.
Phil Jones | 2013/14 Performances
- Thread starter The Don
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How was Gattuso on the ball? I can't really remember. I just remember him being a great tackler and a diving, cheating, complaining prick that used to fake injuries when the other team was gaining momentum.
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I get that Ozil is supposed to be in Jones' pocket but both his and Jones' expression make it seem like something else is happening.
Anybody else think Jones could be the answer to our midfield woes?.
Allow him in a 3 man midfield with Carrick and Kagawa, with Januzaj Rooney and RVP having a free role up top.
Jones having a destroyer role will more than make up for Kagawa being lesser defensively.
Allow him in a 3 man midfield with Carrick and Kagawa, with Januzaj Rooney and RVP having a free role up top.
Jones having a destroyer role will more than make up for Kagawa being lesser defensively.
I'd rather we kept the width in our game. We'd basically be playing 4312 if we did that. I think we need to face up to the fact we can't play Rooney and Kagawa in the same side and get the best out if them both.
Never though I'd say it, but yeah.. He's quite suited to the role. And it gets us playing Kagawa and Januzaj together. I think it could work well.
Our midfield woes have a lot to do with no orchestrator. Even if we do switch to a 4-3-3 regularly, which we won't do this season, it doesn't necessarily mean that our ball retention will increase. It just means that we're more defensively stable. If we can sign Cabaye in January, then we would have a great chance of dominating the big clubs. But to see us defend deep against Arsenal and lack control - though full credit has to be directed towards the defensive duties of the players - in the second half is not unexpected.
The BBC are making a big deal of Jones' comments in the Guardian about people hating United, though as usual the actual quotes are hardly outrageous:
"People want us to fail because we have won the league so many times," Jones is quoted in the Guardian. "Everyone hates the best clubs, it is as simple as that, and United won the league long before I was here. We enjoy that. We relish the test we get thrown at us every week.
"[Sunday's result] proves when people doubt us, we are more than capable of standing up for ourselves and proving to people that is why we were champions last season. We weren't champions for nothing. We thoroughly deserved all the points we got last season."
"People want us to fail because we have won the league so many times," Jones is quoted in the Guardian. "Everyone hates the best clubs, it is as simple as that, and United won the league long before I was here. We enjoy that. We relish the test we get thrown at us every week.
"[Sunday's result] proves when people doubt us, we are more than capable of standing up for ourselves and proving to people that is why we were champions last season. We weren't champions for nothing. We thoroughly deserved all the points we got last season."
Let's not get ahead of ourselves. While he's good to have in games where his role is to mainly nullify the opposition threat, I doubt he's going to solve the lack of creativity and ideas in midfield which we have.
Nothing at all controversial about Jones comments. He doesn't specifically say that people hate United. He says that everyone hates the best clubs
I haven't read what the BBC have said about Jones, but what is wrong with what he has said here? It's a good attitude, and it's true really. Carrick said pretty much the same thing on Sky Sports after the game, that United constantly get questioned and written off. We do. Pundits always predict us to fail. I think United's demise has been predicted year on year since the turn of the century, and United keep proving the critics wrong.
I think what he's said is bang on really. All week, the bookies and the pundits have favoured Arsenal. It must have been a relief for the players to silence alot of naysayers.
"Togetherness" comes to mind. Like I said...the self belief is back in the team and we will go on to retain the title at this rate.
Just had a quick scan of the replies on the BBC Sports day page. Obviously you're entitled to hate United. It's expected. But this is just mental:
Champions League, yeah. We are some way off. But not serious contenders for the Premier League? We're the current champions, with the same squad that won the league...
Champions League, yeah. We are some way off. But not serious contenders for the Premier League? We're the current champions, with the same squad that won the league...
Of course he's not going to sort out the creativity, but he certainly adds to the defensive organisation/ability of the midfield. Him playing would allow Carrick (and another midfielder) to concentrate more on creativity.
What I'm saying is that he's good in the shielding/destroyer role and shall only get better. He's never going to be our saving grace for midfield though, he's just another piece of the puzzle.
you re saying that at the back of fantastic performance where he played in a midfield two....bizzare
We should have a Phil Jones smiley by now surely, he's got so many classic facial expressions.
Aren't all the current ones various Phils?
Hopefully someone eventually makes one/two. I'd use it all the time.
And you really think he is going to be good enough in a 2 man midfield long term?.
We should be starting to move away from a 4-4-2 formation, sure he can do a job there, but I think taking the attacking weight of his shoulders and letting him concentrate on defending will be of benefit.
That also means being able to have a slightly more attack orientated midfield playing, without worrying we are going to get done on the counter every time.
Jones is equally adept in midfield or as a CB. He makes an excellent Defensive midfielder. I would put him there against the bigger teams. We still don't know what the best team will be until we see who Moyes brings in January.
I see Moyes' long term plan is to play 4-2-3-1 which IMO suits neither Carrick nor Jones. In theory you need two mobile players linking up defense and attack. None of our midfielders is tailor made for these two slots ( of course Carrick will adjust as he's great and that). Jones' energy is great but he doens't have vision nor spacial awarness to excel in midfield two. His long term future is a CB.
What i hope is that Moyes buys two midfielders both of whom will make life hard for Carrick not to mention other midfielders in our team.
For a neutral its a fair comment. We beat Arsenal and thats great, but we need to prove that we're still in the race by sticking with the top teams till christmas. Until now we havent managed that
I think it's fair to suggest that we might get pipped to the title, but to suggest we're not a "serious contender" - insinuating that we are outside contender, along with probably Spurs, Liverpool etc - is pretty ridiculous to me.
4231 with Jones and Carrick as the two, 3 of Kagawa/Rooney/Januzaj/Nani, floating behind RVP and interchanging, and Valencia if you need some genuine width to stretch teams. Looks fine to me.
i have no problem with jones at CM against the big sides now. he is somehow tailor made to stop all those world class playmakers that love to play through the center. he'll most probably end up as a CB but i can see him still getting picked to play that defensive midfield role from time to time.
but we still need to sign at least a top class CM this summer, if not january. the team need reinforcement, but it is not like we need to make 6 or 7 signings. we just need maybe 2 or 3 the most. a top class CM to join up with carrick, cleverley, fellaini, and jones. bring back powell, ando is most likely to leave but we got enough quality there once we get someone world class for that midfield area.
but we still need to sign at least a top class CM this summer, if not january. the team need reinforcement, but it is not like we need to make 6 or 7 signings. we just need maybe 2 or 3 the most. a top class CM to join up with carrick, cleverley, fellaini, and jones. bring back powell, ando is most likely to leave but we got enough quality there once we get someone world class for that midfield area.
Based on his performance the other day, this is a no-brainer. The question is whether he can do it on a regular basis against run-of-the mill opposition. He doesn't strike me as the sort who can gear down and put in the kind of cool and collected performance which is often what you need against teams United are expected to dispose of with relative ease: His was very much a high intensity performance against Arsenal - blood and thunder all the way: You can't play like that week-in, week-out.
Well, Phil Jones probably could - come to think of it. But just to be on the safe side, I'd like us to have an alternative. As per now, we don't - neither Fellaini nor Cleverley are players I trust right now next to Carrick against any sort of opposition. However, I agree with those who are skeptical about going for any old CM in January - someone, anyone who would be an upgrade on Cleverley/Fellaini. Unless we can land the big one - the top class CM Moyes no doubt wants - I think we should stick with what we have for the time being. Both Cleverley and Fellaini are players who can undoubtedly improve significantly - and both of them have the potential to be perfectly acceptable alternatives for us in the middle, their present shortcomings notwithstanding.
Go with Carrick/Someone as the regular combination - and Carrick/GHE against tougher opponents. See how this works out - and buy the big one first chance we get.
Well they arent outside contenders.
At this point its Chelsea and Arsenal with us on the fringe following our big win. A neutral will likely need more convincing than that one match that we're still the same side. We've definitely come closer to being undisputedly in the title race
Liverpool and Spurs are mentioned for the sake of it. Like the "Oh we'll have 4 or 5 teams in the title race this season" nonsense thats said every year, before 2 break away and fight it out.
Jones vs Arsenal (CM performance only):
Only his performance in CM. Not spectacular I know, but I really wanted something released...
Only his performance in CM. Not spectacular I know, but I really wanted something released...
I think his football intelligence gets underrated. Judging by the passes he attempts and the lack of hesitation when he does, Jones seems to be one of those players who has a decent picture in his head of what's happening on the pitch around him at all times. Granted, he's not always perfect at it, but given his age those few lapses can be worked on. Where he falls slightly short at the moment is with his pass execution, but even that gets overstated by his detractors. I reckon he'll make a fine midfielder if he concentrates on that over the next few years.
Thanks MoneyMay.
Jones is exactly the type of midfielder we've been missing since Fletcher picked up an unfortunate illness. He can really get on top of the opposition the way Fletch did, he can carry the ball with surging runs and most important of all, our back four doesn't look like a bunch of rabbits in the headlights when Jones is in front of them. His passing is also fairly underrated, and seeing as he's only 21, it can only improve.
Jones is exactly the type of midfielder we've been missing since Fletcher picked up an unfortunate illness. He can really get on top of the opposition the way Fletch did, he can carry the ball with surging runs and most important of all, our back four doesn't look like a bunch of rabbits in the headlights when Jones is in front of them. His passing is also fairly underrated, and seeing as he's only 21, it can only improve.
good post.
He's still young, and can develop in different ways. I think he'll need to work harder at his game if he wants to be become a good, complete midfielder, whereas he's already much more accomplished as a CB. But I some of us want him to succeed as a midfielder because his blood and guts type of play is something we sorely lack in midfield.
SAF had previously mentioned him as future captain material, and we can easily see why. His energy and determination is almost infectious, and that leadership and driving force will be so valuable in midfield. I get the sense that what he brings to central defense is good, but more easily replaceable in the transfer market.
SAF had previously mentioned him as future captain material, and we can easily see why. His energy and determination is almost infectious, and that leadership and driving force will be so valuable in midfield. I get the sense that what he brings to central defense is good, but more easily replaceable in the transfer market.
Actually third highest passing accuracy in our team, only Cleverley and Buttner above him. Fellaini comes in as fourth.
Not that it says everything, but it surely speaks volume about how well he has improved and having the 24th highest passing accuracy in the league is immense for a player known for being sloppy with his passing.
Of course Phil Jones passes, even if they end up at a team player, aren't very refined compared to most other real DM's. It usually requires his team-mate to run several steps which means momentum is often lost etc.
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How is this not getting a reaction? The players in the bottom right
He'll be our captain one day, I can sense that much.
Heh, he'll be captain of the world someday.
Hypothetically would people in here swap Jones for Fabregas? Thinking with my head it would be a good deal for both sides, they get their Puyol replacement who would instantly improve their defence and we get a great midfielder with Premiership experience who is still young for the position.
I wouldn't do it though.
I wouldn't do it though.
no. For one. Jones is English. 
Secondly Jones at just 21 is already an exceptional player. We aint seen nothing yet.
Secondly Jones at just 21 is already an exceptional player. We aint seen nothing yet.Seems crazy that he's only 21. 'kin hell.
I can see him develop into our de Rossi. Wanted to say 'the next Keano', but that would be a bridge too far for any young player.
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