Like how we were geniuses in refusing to penny pinch with the extra £6m that could have brought Hazard here, or behaving like smartasses when the Ronaldinho deal had been sewn up? History and football reality has always proven that its better to have a 'once in a generation' talent than a few more millions in the bank!
Paul Pogba | Undergoing Medical | Helping out the Laundry Ladies
- Thread starter KM
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We won't be signing him. Hope that helps.
If there was a price tag Juve would accept we should just offer it. We have plenty of money.
No CL football though means he wouldn't come anyway.
No CL football though means he wouldn't come anyway.
Hazard was going for like 30mill though with a few mill agent fees, not 90mill+ before agent fees.
He's frustrating to watch. Clearly got all the tools to do well but just isn't doing enough for the level of player he's supposed to be.
It'll be interesting to see what happens this summer. Any club splashing the sort of money on him that's being thrown around will expect the finished article. Not sure he's that good just yet.
It'll be interesting to see what happens this summer. Any club splashing the sort of money on him that's being thrown around will expect the finished article. Not sure he's that good just yet.
Still if he is good enough to fill a Paul Scholes size hole in our squad who would be thinking of '90million plus'? Do you hear anyone talk about Martial's fee anymore? Thats how the football industry works, trophies drive the growth of a club and great players guarantee trophies - simple math.
If Pogba agrees to come back then we shouldn't think twice about paying whatever Juventus demand.
I dont think hes a 90mill talent, Martial was £36 and had/has to complete specific criteria before the fee went up, Pogba is going to be a new world record upfront, Hazards fee was propotional to the talent you were getting, which is why a few mill over agent fees seemed silly.
If Perez is balking over the cost of bringing Pogba to Madrid you know the total fee we'd have to pay would be something astronomical. I just don't see him being in that category of class.
Anyway whatever, in a world where 25mill for Troy fecking Deeney is getting rejected who knows anymore.
Last summer, the media reported these inflated prices. I think he'll move but it's possible it's not this summer and i think Juventus don't really want to sell him.
They don't.
Spanish media on the other hand reporting that Juve want a €120 mil plus Kroos.
Juve don't have to/want to sell. Only way he moves is if someone pays that exorbitant fee which looks unlikely as good as Pogba is.
Thought he was impressive in the first half today, but clearly faded in the second half. Probably could have had much more of an impact if he didn't keep slipping all the time.
Exactly. They make it up because they know it's difficult for anyone even Madrid to match these ridiculous demands. Juventus is one greedy club and they find it difficult to pay good prices even for quality players, and to think that they basically got Pogba for free is quite irritating to me. Regardless, I don't think Pogba is pushing well enough for a move.
Can't deny it hasn't worked for us though. All about penny pinching
That would be the only way I could see him actually returning to United - if Juve persist with such a ridiculous price that even Real won't pay it, then there's a chance we might actually be stupid enough to pay it. And if we did pay it, then maybe Pogba would go for it, since given how young he still is he could easily spend a few seasons with us and then maneuver a move to Real as he hits his prime - run-down his contract with us to a couple of years so Real can pay a much lower price to sign him. That way Juve get their money, Real get their man, and Pogba joins the sacred Real Madrid that every player wants to join.
Everyone's a winner.
But I expect Juve will drop to a more sensible (yet still crazy) price for Real to get their Galactico.
Raiola has dealt with them before with Zlatan.
I think it's because he is currently at the Euros and wants to focus on that. Things will kick off after the tournament. Im sure Real will remind them how they got Morata on the cheap. Juve could do with a few Madrid castoffs so I can see some sense entering these negotiations .
Good performance tonite.
Juventus can keep dreaming if they think anyone will pay above 100m euros for pogba. He isn't that player that they think he is.
Juventus can keep dreaming if they think anyone will pay above 100m euros for pogba. He isn't that player that they think he is.
Losing a world record signing on a free wouldn't be a win in my book.
And I wouldn't want him here if his heart wasn't in it.
Was better tonight because he was playing as the more advanced midfielder on the left, where he seems to be a lot more comfortable. Having said that, he was very quiet in the second half, but I guess that was more based on how the game went.
It's just an extension of the Di Maria precedent - only with Real in the PSG role, and Juve in the Real role of the Di Maria farce
We would remain in the same role though, obviously
The first thing I noticed with him as a young United academy player was his presence and self confidence. Always able to create magic out of nothing, often in the middle of the heath. Great technique, stunning ability to hit the ball both on the ground and in the air and a impressive physique.
I was very disappointed when he left us for Juventus.
A couple of years later my impression of him is the same. A little bit more matured, more experienced but still he has this special aura around him. Like a young Prince who knows he some day is going to be the next King.
He's not a playmaker, nothing special as a defensive mid but as a b2b with freedom and energy to drive 30-40 meters in full pelt he's a monster of player. Good in the air, sensitive passer and great one on one.
Taking all in to concideration he's soon going be a world class player, probably on of the best in his position. Almost there. He's one of Adidas future stars. He's a cool guy with style and grace. A marketing dream boy.
Judging his economical value is very very difficult. Lots of different factors to take in to concideration.
As a player he's in the same bracket as Kroos, Racitić, Verratti and Alcantara. Probably worth £50-60m upfront. Only 23 years old add his value another €10-20. Poster boy for Adidas and a idol for many young men (and women) probably add another €10-20m. So without competition from Real Madrid a fee between €80-100m shouldn't be far off. If we're interested in him then I suppose a initial fee of €50m would be expected, two installment of €15-15m in the next two years and then a final €20m depending on adds ons and then I think Juventus are tempted.
With Mino Raiola as a agents I expect his wage demands would be close to 200-250k/week, split regarding image rights. A 6+1 year contract would be suitable regarding the fee.
That's my take on this. Probably I'm up in the clouds but neverless I decent shot IMO.
I was very disappointed when he left us for Juventus.
A couple of years later my impression of him is the same. A little bit more matured, more experienced but still he has this special aura around him. Like a young Prince who knows he some day is going to be the next King.
He's not a playmaker, nothing special as a defensive mid but as a b2b with freedom and energy to drive 30-40 meters in full pelt he's a monster of player. Good in the air, sensitive passer and great one on one.
Taking all in to concideration he's soon going be a world class player, probably on of the best in his position. Almost there. He's one of Adidas future stars. He's a cool guy with style and grace. A marketing dream boy.
Judging his economical value is very very difficult. Lots of different factors to take in to concideration.
As a player he's in the same bracket as Kroos, Racitić, Verratti and Alcantara. Probably worth £50-60m upfront. Only 23 years old add his value another €10-20. Poster boy for Adidas and a idol for many young men (and women) probably add another €10-20m. So without competition from Real Madrid a fee between €80-100m shouldn't be far off. If we're interested in him then I suppose a initial fee of €50m would be expected, two installment of €15-15m in the next two years and then a final €20m depending on adds ons and then I think Juventus are tempted.
With Mino Raiola as a agents I expect his wage demands would be close to 200-250k/week, split regarding image rights. A 6+1 year contract would be suitable regarding the fee.
That's my take on this. Probably I'm up in the clouds but neverless I decent shot IMO.
Strikes me as a Lampard type, perhaps not in terms of style but in terms of the kind of effect he can have on games, and the areas of the pitch he can occupy. Ideally he'd have strong support alongside him in midfield, but in the right set-up he'd flourish in any league.
Ditto, looks like he'll progress into a marauding Lampard/Yaya Toure type attacking midfielder, who excels with a mid or two behind him to do the majority of the donkey work. He's too economical with his running to ever be a true box to box midfielder for me and I don't see him seeking the ball out enough to become a Modric type heartbeat player.
Don't get me wrong the real Yaya Toure of yesteryear was a quality performer compared to todays cake connoisseur version, but is that type of player, who doesn't boss a game and likely never will, worth the current fees bandied about? Well, it's certainly a question of opinion.
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Was going to say this. "Everyone's a winner" - except us, that scenario would be terrible for us.
Real will probably stump up the cash once no "James" signing appears out of the dust from EURO2016 … and then Real and Pogba will both proceed to fail each other.
We lost him once (for whatever reason) and we'd be (and look) incredibly stupid to pay a fortune to buy him back.
Unless he publicly states this is the only club he wants to play for then in my opinion he can feck off, we don't need him!
I reckon, undoubtedly talented though they both were, he's just a Ballotelli in a French jersey … too emotionally fragile and he comes with too much baggage.
Fergie saw something he didn't like and the great man's reaction has always been painted in a rather poor light (IMHO) which is a pity. What if he was right and, talented maverick though Pogba is, his inclusion would ultimately be too disruptive to be a benefit?
We lost him once (for whatever reason) and we'd be (and look) incredibly stupid to pay a fortune to buy him back.
Unless he publicly states this is the only club he wants to play for then in my opinion he can feck off, we don't need him!
I reckon, undoubtedly talented though they both were, he's just a Ballotelli in a French jersey … too emotionally fragile and he comes with too much baggage.
Fergie saw something he didn't like and the great man's reaction has always been painted in a rather poor light (IMHO) which is a pity. What if he was right and, talented maverick though Pogba is, his inclusion would ultimately be too disruptive to be a benefit?
I agree but as you also said, he needs the right set up. He's not someone who can dominate and dictate a game, rather make the small differences for a side. Hence I feel the fundamentals need to be right for him. I'm not sure he'd be perfect for us plus I wouldnt spend that amount of cash for him
You what mate? Fergy wanted to keep him and it was Pogba who decided to leave. And what has he done to show you that he is mentally fragile or even anything close to Ballotelli.
Theres one thing not to like him as a player, but this seems personal.
To me Pogba is an overrated player..what is even his position..? a number 6 or 8 or 10 ?
Fergie obviously saw something he didnt trust or he would have played him more, certainly in that notorious game where he preferred Da Silva and Park in midfield, in which case Pogba wouldnt have pushed for a move in the first place.
I was in this thread arguing how amazing it would be to get Pogba back a few weeks ago and what Ive seen of him in the last week or so has only reinforced my view he is a great player. But as the quoted prices for him spiral upwards I am losing enthusiasm I have to admit. Let Madrid have him for a record breaking fee, or let Juve keep him. There have to be better options out there.
Fergy is but a man. He can make mistakes too and he clearly did in that game and tried to save himself by the end of the season. He went to Pogbas house to talk to him and his mum but by then it was too late.
The funny thing, that 'failure' at United might have been something he needed at the time to push him on.
I am happy Real ar no ing in nice and early. We don't need fantasies about him on this forum all summer.
Your assumption is that SAF's consistent refusal to play him was a mistake, something he regretted and tried to rectify by pleading with him to stay. Its an interpretation and it might well be the right one. But another interpretation is that he decided not to play him for some reason, consistent with his own selection criteria. Im speculating here but something along the lines of showing a lack of discipline or concentration, or not working hard enough in training. And when he went to plead with him to stay, it might not have been in recognition of his own mistake, but his hope that Pogba would recognise his own mistakes and mature into a better player at United.
The one thing you cant really argue with is that Pogba made the right decision for him, he has been completely vindicated and now has the football world at his feet, pretty much. And yes, with hindsight Im sure SAF would agree, privately at least, that he made a mistake in the way he handled him. But I dont think its necessarily the case that he saw it that way at the time. If youd asked SAF days after he left, rather than years, whether he would do things differently if he had the chance, would he (again, privately)? Im not sure. Maybe youre right and he would, or maybe @SqueakyWeasel is right and he felt Pogba was more hassle than he was worth. We'll probably never know.
The only way he is joining us is if he really sees us as the best 'project'. Because lets face it we are a work in progress now and probably will be for another few seasons.
Cant blame Juve for naming a stupidly high price, he is their prized asset and know he is going to leave at some point so may as well make the most out of it like us with Ronaldo (though we didn't charge anywhere near what he was worth )
Cant blame Juve for naming a stupidly high price, he is their prized asset and know he is going to leave at some point so may as well make the most out of it like us with Ronaldo (though we didn't charge anywhere near what he was worth
)http://www.espnfc.com/story/2898004...l-pogba-talks-with-juventus-agent-mino-raiola
Raiola stated Madrid opened talks with Juve for Pogba.
I think its only a matter of time before Real get their man, which means Kroos is off most likely.
Raiola stated Madrid opened talks with Juve for Pogba.
I think its only a matter of time before Real get their man, which means Kroos is off most likely.
I'm sorry but where does this bad attitude thing with Pogba come from? How is he comparable to Balotelli who is a really poor professional. Is it because he's black?
120 - 140 million is ridiculous. The top teams front load their strike force and use the midfield to maintain the cohesion and dictate play. Pogba disrupts that.
He is a talent and would be worth more ten years ago but with the way football has evolved this is nonsensical.
Benzema drops deep to allow Bale and Ronaldo to cut infield, he basically plays the position that Pogba is suited to.
He is a talent and would be worth more ten years ago but with the way football has evolved this is nonsensical.
Benzema drops deep to allow Bale and Ronaldo to cut infield, he basically plays the position that Pogba is suited to.
Im really not all that keen on him to be honest. Obviously a very good player with huge potential, but as a midfielder he is very oberrated. Isn't close to the likes of Modric and that's more along the type we need. Where he goes, he will need to be the more advanced of a midfield 3, but he isn't agile or creative enough to be a proper #10. Doesn't look like he will develop into a controlling type of midfielder to dictates the tempo of games either.
Saying that, of course he is a very good player and has a ridiculous shot on him, and that's his stand out quality. Is that worth the prices being mentioned though? Not a chance IMO (not that I would complain if we got him in the end). As a midfielder, Kante is better for me and has a much bigger impact on games, though not being as talented. Then there are other attacking mids who have a lot more talent on the ball to be more creative, without the shooting ability Pogba has. Payet for example.
Whoever said Lampard is the perfect example. Probably has it in him to get 20 goals per season from midfield, but more in that style compared to a playmaker like scholes or a more energetic box to box like Gerrard.
Saying that, of course he is a very good player and has a ridiculous shot on him, and that's his stand out quality. Is that worth the prices being mentioned though? Not a chance IMO (not that I would complain if we got him in the end). As a midfielder, Kante is better for me and has a much bigger impact on games, though not being as talented. Then there are other attacking mids who have a lot more talent on the ball to be more creative, without the shooting ability Pogba has. Payet for example.
Whoever said Lampard is the perfect example. Probably has it in him to get 20 goals per season from midfield, but more in that style compared to a playmaker like scholes or a more energetic box to box like Gerrard.
Payet seems to be doing his level best to push his case.