Absolutely. Humans are very fallible as a species, myself included. It would pretty amazing if all those who both claim to be immune to unconscious bias and are able to correctly self reflect on that were all to be found on Redcafe.
Paul Pogba | Back in full training
- Thread starter Samid
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How complicated your days must be.
Challenging yourself with a bit of self reflection really isn’t that hard. It’s a little sad that you see it so.
Until we have a white Paul Pogba playing for United we will never know.
Cristiano as a very young player was wanted out the club by many fans who thought he was selfish, wasteful and all flash tricks and no end product. This was despite being young and precocious.
27 year old Pogba has more substance with regards to assists/goals than a young Cristiano but the flashy selfish bits are also evident.
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I'm all for self reflection. On here, though, I mainly like discussing football. That can be more straightforward than you're making it.
If Pogba signs a new deal, I hope it is a fair reflection of his mediocre contributions during his tenure with us. Anything unjustified is gonna be a kick in the teeth for the deserving players. That said, nobody including him should have a guaranteed starting place. He is no longer the sole creative source so either he bucks up, or we ship him out for a lucrative fee. Both scenarios can only be good for the club, which is highly dependent on continuing the buying of quality players capable of playing in the starting eleven.
Paul Pogba will start on the bench whenever he’s is 100% fit. A best case scenario is if we’re one up (or more) against Lask then Ole can give him 20-25 minutes to start with.
There are several formations that suits both Bruno and Paul. 4312, 4123, 4222 or 3412 just to mention a few. With two creative players in the middle our attacking options will increase enormously so having Pogba fit again gives Solskjaer only positive problems to solve.
I have been critical in the past but if Pogba is committed and willing to sign a new deal then I’m all in again. (If not then just sell him and reinvest) We don’t have the luxury to reject world class players at this stage of the season.
There are several formations that suits both Bruno and Paul. 4312, 4123, 4222 or 3412 just to mention a few. With two creative players in the middle our attacking options will increase enormously so having Pogba fit again gives Solskjaer only positive problems to solve.
I have been critical in the past but if Pogba is committed and willing to sign a new deal then I’m all in again. (If not then just sell him and reinvest) We don’t have the luxury to reject world class players at this stage of the season.
I’m in the perfect position of not being fussed either way. If he comes back and helps us get top 4 but still wants to leave then at least he’s driven his price up a bit, if he wants to stay then also great, we get to keep a top quality midfielder. The issue with Pogba is that people expect him to carry a poor team when in reality he’s best as the cherry on top to an already good side. With Bruno coming in, Fred and Scott kicking on and Matic regaining some magic, in my eyes he can come in and be that crowning piece.
As long as we get semi decent price for him I don’t care that much if he leaves, much better players have left this club and much better players will join in the future, you lot need to calm down and stop acting like what ever happens with Pogba will drastically change things.
As long as we get semi decent price for him I don’t care that much if he leaves, much better players have left this club and much better players will join in the future, you lot need to calm down and stop acting like what ever happens with Pogba will drastically change things.
The whole situation is sad really.
He’s a very talented player no doubt but this long term injury has been awful for us until Bruno was signed.
If he comes back in and puts in some great performances then all will be forgiven but if he comes back and shows very little then I could see him leaving in the summer.
He’s a very talented player no doubt but this long term injury has been awful for us until Bruno was signed.
If he comes back in and puts in some great performances then all will be forgiven but if he comes back and shows very little then I could see him leaving in the summer.
Bruno is better than Pogba
If we are being racist towards Pogba then how come Fred doesnt bear the brunt of it and all you read about Fred nowadays is love, admiration and praise? You know if this thread was Pogba vs Fred, I do think the majority at this point would side with Fred because he is actually playing great, playing hard and he has demonstrated great work ethic and great attitude, all the things that we are just not sold on when it comes to Pogba and for a good reason too.
You should really be careful when throwing racism accusations around. It should be the last resort but in the case of Pogba it just seems like another excuse.
He just hasnt worked out for us, were there unfavourable circumstances, yes at times they were but the cream always rises to the top, finds the way to flourish and Pogba for us just hasnt been what we needed him to be yet someone like Fred he was able to find his way.
We have now managed to build a good momentum without PP and he likely isnt the missing piece, its a holding midfielder. All in all it wasnt meant to be I guess.
As for Pogba vs Fred, Fred now. As for Pogba vs Bruno, Bruno. Its like comparing an ex that just wasnt right to a current girl that just is. Some things in life just are. As for Pogba, Bruno and Fred, not enough steel. Ideally we need a Matic replacement to complement Fred and Bruno as I dont think McTominay is that player either, am I being racist to him too?
Racist
Ok, apologies it came across a different way when I read it x
This
A leopard never changes its spots, a rolling stone gathers no moss and it's an ill wind that blows... Can't remember the rest
feck off to Madrid, Poggers. Oh, forgot.. They don't want you. Neither do we. We're doing ok without you.
This is only football, you're talking as if it's a matter of life and death or as if Pogba did an act of national treason level. You're taking it way too seriously, you can want him to be sold and that's fair but I don't think there is a need to go as far as you did
Some of you are taking this football thing way too seriouslyIf that happens, I can't wait to see a bunch of petty and overly sensitive clowns in tearsPogba about to sign a new contract?the tears will be glorious
Some of the reactions when it comes to him are really funny indeed.If that happens, I can't wait to see a bunch of petty and overly sensitive clowns in tears
So true! I’ll be delighted if he does.If that happens, I can't wait to see a bunch of petty and overly sensitive clowns in tears
Exactly as I see it. If he actually wants to stay then he is welcome. If not then bye bye all the best.
In this case(In Pogba extending his contract case), while some of us will be enjoying Pogba do awesome things in games, your typical bitter and petty overly sensitive fanboys who eat every single bit of media bullshit and obvious agenda against Pogba will be seething with anger inside, not being able to stomach Pogba shine for us.
Can't wait for the begrudged back handed compliments they'll be forcing themselves to throw around.
As much as I hate his off the pitch luggage and the people surrounding him, I can't wait to see him fully fit and playing alongside Bruno. Regarding the new contract, offer him 300K extension, any pay rise should depend on him performing, if not he his fat feck of an agent can bring a 100m offer from Real, or he can go and play with his brother in Mexico.
This whole thread is hilarious. The accusations of racism in particular, are both outlandish and grimly predictable.
I honestly cannot understand how any fan of man utd doesn't think this guy and his "entourage" are tosspots.
fecking mental the excuses some will make for this man and although I think that some try far too hard to denigrate the little bellend, we can't be honest and say he hasn't been disrespectful.
The funniest thing in all of this is that he wants to move to another club but no other club want him or think he is good enough to warrant his valuation. He, and his agent, clearly has ideas well above his station.
I honestly cannot understand how any fan of man utd doesn't think this guy and his "entourage" are tosspots.
fecking mental the excuses some will make for this man and although I think that some try far too hard to denigrate the little bellend, we can't be honest and say he hasn't been disrespectful.
The funniest thing in all of this is that he wants to move to another club but no other club want him or think he is good enough to warrant his valuation. He, and his agent, clearly has ideas well above his station.
Yes, on talent wise. But the impact Bruno has had on our players and all is way more than Pogba has had. Bruno leads by example imo whereas Pogba is just supremely talented.
So the fans who vote, voted for their favourite player or a sympathy vote?
I agree, if our options are those then 100% he starts ahead but Lingard and Perreira are no longer first choice. Even Ighalo is ahead of them.
Ok. And Pogba is better than the rest of the team.
No many dislike Pogba so would never vote for him. Therefore gave it to in my opinion the most improved player which was Shaw.
Also I don't think they do it on purpose they just have their rose tinted glasses on. I bet if you asked half of them they wouldn't even know Pogba topped so many stats. Although stats aren't everything of course.b
Hardly surprising really. No one was great last season but over the course of the season Pogba won us the most points. Had most assists , Most goals, most chances created , most ball recoveries and so on.
Shaw improved loads due to his previous showing but it's not like he was anything better than a 6 or 7/10.
It's not like these votes are gospel. Henderson is probably nailed on for PFA player of the year but not a chance he has been better than De Bruyne for instance.
Optics play a role due to human nature but ideally they shouldn't.
Where do people think Pogba and Bruno fit in the first team together? I can see only three probabilities.
1) Pogba gets played as deep CDM/Carrick type position that he has openly struggled with in the past and doesn't seem to enjoy = he starts moaning again.
2) They both play in advanced roles with ONE tackler/workhorse trying to cover both of them = our midfield gets ripped to shreds again.
3) They fight for the same position - its amazing to have depth in attack/creative midfield positions like City, I guess.
As far as I'm concerned, Bruno is Pogba's replacement. I cannot see him here next season, it makes no sense to me.
1) Pogba gets played as deep CDM/Carrick type position that he has openly struggled with in the past and doesn't seem to enjoy = he starts moaning again.
2) They both play in advanced roles with ONE tackler/workhorse trying to cover both of them = our midfield gets ripped to shreds again.
3) They fight for the same position - its amazing to have depth in attack/creative midfield positions like City, I guess.
As far as I'm concerned, Bruno is Pogba's replacement. I cannot see him here next season, it makes no sense to me.
4 3 3 one left one right easily. Especially the majority of games against any team that isn't Liverpool or City.
Also Pogba is grand in a 2 so could also do 4231 but I think 433 would be better.
It's not some complicated puzzle.
Also Bruno being Pogba's replacement would be idiotic. Means me went from having one creative player to having one creative player.
speak for yourself mate.
If Pogba was our best player, I would be happy to vote for him.
If you go back and look at my posts in August, I was defending Pogba and how badly we need him this season.
The pre-christmas team, Pogba would walk straight in because the form of Fred, Matic in particular were not all that and we have Lingard / perriera creating.
Now, I am not saying he shouldn't start but he should work his way in and be told you have to perform for the team.
Before this we were all about how to unleash pogba, who will get the best out of him, whereas now it should be how Pogba gets the best out of himself.
Pogba did far from grand in a two at the start of the season, he cannot function when he has defensive responsibilities, that's my point. He likes being the furthest advanced midfielder, so that would mean shunting Bruno further back where that nullifies his biggest strengths.
Doesn’t he play next to Kante for France? With another midfielder advanced?
Whether or not that works next to Matic, Fred or McTominay we don’t know yet.
Bruno could also play deeper.
PogBack for Mourinhos funeral . You love to see it
I just hope he comes back soon and him and Bruno together allow us to breakdown teams sitting back in a low block easier.
He doesn't deserve a pay increase though.
He doesn't deserve a pay increase though.
Good sunmary, and I agree. It’s a funny game football, before Christmas I’d have said our number one priority should be to get Pogba going, now that we look like a good team, without both him and Rashford, I’m less worried either way. Obviously, I’d like for as many class players as possible playing for United.
This team would scare practically every team in the P.L
DDG/Henderson - Shaw, Lindelof, Maguire, AWB - Fred, McT/Matic - Rashford, Pogba, Bruno - Martial
Raiola and Pogba will use the club to show his fitness and to guarantee his place with France for the euros. As soon as the League is over, he will be asking to leave again. imo.
I would love to see a Pogba that really wants to be with this club stay here, and be captain someday. But this is never going to happen as long as Raiola is his agent.
I would love to see a Pogba that really wants to be with this club stay here, and be captain someday. But this is never going to happen as long as Raiola is his agent.
Any charm offensive now will give way to a war with the club all summer to get his move on the cheap.
This is the most absurd notion of all. Pogba is the first name on the France teamsheet. They'd pick him with a broken leg.
Also Pogba is an athlete he ain't someone like Rooney or Shaw who's fitness goes to complete crap after s few months off.
He recovers in terms of fitness very quickly. Sure every summer here he cancelled his holidays came back early etc etc.
Do you really believe that Pogba wants to sign a new contract. If either of Real or Juventus offered the right money in the summer, he's off. Don't be ridiculous saying, France would pick him with a broken leg. France would certainly NOT bring an injured player in their squad no matter who or what he is.