We need Rice
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Think he was the best player, at least from midfield and attack on the pitch last night. Some of those passes were glorious especially the one for the first goal and then the one for the disallowed goal. Brilliant.
I don't thinks it's motivation but the respective quality in the two teams. At France he has just the right kind of team set up with a couple of midfielders who are better defensively than him, but also have quality unlike our glorious McFred combo. Then in attack he is left to just create rather than be some all in one playmaker who runs the game which he'll never be. And he has players like Mbappe to create for. Other than that France are defensively strong so he doesn't have to worry about making a mistake or two, and of course France are a confident team who win rather than one that's always in a struggle.
Rashford also plays better for the NT. Are we doubting his motivation for Utd?
Some players play better for their NT. As for Pogba, yes he plays better for France. Maybe that has something to do with with playing with Kante/Tolisso over McFred? The way you guys do mental gymnastics to justify not praising a good performance, it seems like y'all are talking about a opposition player
Anyway. Good performance, Pogba. Still think we should sell him though.
Some players play better for their NT. As for Pogba, yes he plays better for France. Maybe that has something to do with with playing with Kante/Tolisso over McFred? The way you guys do mental gymnastics to justify not praising a good performance, it seems like y'all are talking about a opposition player
Anyway. Good performance, Pogba. Still think we should sell him though.
If you compare French team with United. The two key differences are, He plays beside Kante there and he has Mbappe up front. The rest of French side and United don't have that much of a difference.
When was the last time Rashford did anything significant for England?
What? Pavard is better going forward than AWB. They have a CB pairing that is easily better than United in Varane and Kimpembe. The midfield is balanced with a 3rd central mid. And he has Benzema up top with Griezmann kind of just floating. How's that not much of a difference?!
Wait what? Their CBs and defence in general is far better than ours. They are better managed than us. Rabiot at least based on yesterday is miles better than McFred. Benzema up top better than anyone we have. Griezmann as a support attacker leaving his Barcelona period aside is a top player. They have a RB who is actually decent on the ball. Plus they're a proper team.
Bit much to think just 2 players are the difference between the world champions and a team that's trophyless for 4 years.
Many players play better for their NT and thats dependent of many factors. Boiling it down to "doesnt care while playing for the club" is reductive and foolish.
I've said for a while he's wasted his time at OT. He actually should be forcing his way out of the club, and his first choice should be Man City.
Stay in the league, the same city and prove how badly misused you were for 5-6 years by taking Man City up another level.
Stay in the league, the same city and prove how badly misused you were for 5-6 years by taking Man City up another level.
I agree France is a more balanced and better managed team but player for player the major difference is Kante and Mbappe only. Add these two in United team and we can easily win the league next year. You can not say that about any other French player or more than one players.
You aren't doing a good job of pretending to be supporter of Man United your cover would be blown if you continue in this vein .
Jokes apart we have clearly been unable to utilise Pogba to his full talent we never got the balance right in the midfield, mostly pairing Pogba with average players Like Herrera , Fred and over the hill Matic but I think it's time for Both Club and Player to move for their own sake .
Are you reading my posts?
He was motm again for France, in Euro against Germany. We need to figure out quick how to utilize him properly. There must be a reason why he is always worldclass player for France but not for us.
It's easy. In the French team he has Kante to watch his back, and a fantastic defense, we on the other hand have a shitty defense and have to play 2 DMs (and we all know who unreliable they can be). Buy a proper DCM and a proper CB, and then Pogba and Bruno will do their magic and we can beat anyone.
I still don't believe that people want us to sell him...
I still don't believe that people want us to sell him...
Rolls Royce footballer
Had Kroos on a dog leash all game. Well deserved.
I'm sure these players definitely do care for their club sides. A number of factors come into play like quality of your team mates, system you're playing in, and you can't ignore the fact that focus and motivation are easier to uphold in a tournament setting where there are fewer games over a short period of time (focusing intensely over 7/8 games where each win gets you closer to a historic trophy is different from keeping motivated for 38 games where you may end up out of the reckoning for the winner's price by the half way stage or earlier), also, players stay together away from home distractions.
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France played Kante and Rabiot in a double pivot two defensively minded midfielders allowing their front 4 freedom of the attacking third. Pogba gets man of the match.
I wonder where have we seen a double pivot allow Pogba to thrive before?
I wonder where have we seen a double pivot allow Pogba to thrive before?
Kante and Rabiot are many folds better with the ball at their feet than Fred and Mctominay. They don't just defend and break down play. They were making themselves available for passes in tight spaces. They were carrying the ball or finding decent options well if pressed. Just because system is the same at United as it is for France doesn't mean we get to have the exact same performance at United.France played Kante and Rabiot in a double pivot two defensively minded midfielders allowing their front 4 freedom of the attacking third. Pogba gets man of the match.
I wonder where have we seen a double pivot allow Pogba to thrive before?
Yeah I think the biggest thing for Pogba is the focus / motivation. He’s had a few imperious spells over 6-8 games for us then gets knocked off course. Tournament football makes it much simpler to get his head right, some people need simplicity to get in their groove.
He's hinted a few times recently how to utilise him. Everybody knows too It's not rocket science (although some thinks all it takes is a DM).If we continue playing him at the double pivot next season he needs to be sold. I cant stand to see that talent wasted. For every good game he has at that double pivot, he would have been man of the match playing higher up the pitch
You can spout off all day about how brilliant he is for France, the fact is he isn’t for us so he needs to be sold.
He has so much talent - He is a great player for France. Such a shame he has basically dialled it in for most of his time at United. Im sure he will get his move sorted by January - and the circus will move on but I cant help feeling what might of been.
I agree and disagree. Fred and Kante are pretty similar.. it’s the other guy that needs upgrading on.
Rashford and Mbappe. Yes Mbappe is a level above but Rashford is still good enough. We literally just need better tactics and someone that can do the Rabiot role better than Rabiot. Which isn’t hard to find.
France played Kante and Rabiot in a double pivot two defensively minded midfielders allowing their front 4 freedom of the attacking third. Pogba gets man of the match.
I wonder where have we seen a double pivot allow Pogba to thrive before?
They are not the same duo though are they. Also you might not of noticed but he’s not playing LW
France played Kante and Rabiot in a double pivot two defensively minded midfielders allowing their front 4 freedom of the attacking third. Pogba gets man of the match.
I wonder where have we seen a double pivot allow Pogba to thrive before?
France currently doesn't play with a double pivot. Rabiot and Pogba play similar roles on each sides of a flat three man midfield and Pogba does his defensive job as a regular CM.
Let's wait and see how Bruno continues next season. I'm a huge fan but he was pretty wank the last months of the season. Probably fatigued though.
What I mean is that it might benefit the team if we manage to get both in the line up. Especially against deep sitting sides. We'd need a really good DM for that and better CBs.
He’s so good for his NT he can’t get on it
We don't need to wait for anything. Bruno is our best option as the most advanced midfielder.
Correct and all 3 are able / have the ability to attack while one of them holds the centre .
It is interesting watching France to see why he just seems better for them or just how it works. Watching last night just to see what they do different.
— I’d generally say they play 4 CB’s
_ Kante although many similar attributes to Fred just seemed to casually know where to be at any moment. Fred seems more frantic and sprinting all over the shop to put out fires.
-Griezman and I think he might be one of the main reasons Pogba works so well. The amount of work he put in defensively and making himself available for a pass or an option.
Just have far better players who know what they have to do and play in a much better and more organised fashion than we at United do.
— I’d generally say they play 4 CB’s
_ Kante although many similar attributes to Fred just seemed to casually know where to be at any moment. Fred seems more frantic and sprinting all over the shop to put out fires.
-Griezman and I think he might be one of the main reasons Pogba works so well. The amount of work he put in defensively and making himself available for a pass or an option.
Just have far better players who know what they have to do and play in a much better and more organised fashion than we at United do.
Hopefully some good displays will get us a buyer for a decent amount this summer. I can't see him staying at this point.
Yes, they're better coached/organised than us and have better players. Adding to that, Pogba is a player who has clear weaknesses that are more highlighted when his team doesn't have that, given he's tactically a bit of a challenge.
This. I don’t know how anyone can watch last night and think it was a double pivot. It was a flat three, with Kante pressing forward ahead of Rabiot and Pogba, who could then squeeze narrower when needed.
That system would not work the same with Rice lying as a deeper midfielder, because it would then leave Pogba needing to press, who clearly isn’t going to get back into shape quick enough (like in a double pivot).
I don’t know what the solution is for United, but it’s not as simple as buy a Kante, as Kante is not a traditional sitting DM.
Yep, Nani did stop before a take on. A bit like Rashford at the moment, I hope Rashford gets that driving moments back soon as he like Pogba is a very very good player.
I wrote the same comment about Veron a few pages back, but i think the pressing is even more intense now, than it was back then..
He does perform better for France but he has everything set up perfectly for him there. World class players around, playin in a better midfield set up, and only for a few games which makes him motivated and focused more consistently
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He’s a genuinely world class level player, one of only a few in our squad and we’ve wasted his time here with dross in midfield.
If he renews, it will be as good as a new signing - but we can’t rest on our laurels, we simply need a better midfield. McFred is not going to win us titles & cups.
Sure, they can do the dirty work against the better teams in the league, but the irony of recognising this fact is accepting that we aren’t the best team in the league.
We need a DM, Pogba & Bruno can play alongside - Bruno drops deeper all the time anyway, we just need an anchor back there.
If Pogba doesn’t renew, who can blame him?
If he renews, it will be as good as a new signing - but we can’t rest on our laurels, we simply need a better midfield. McFred is not going to win us titles & cups.
Sure, they can do the dirty work against the better teams in the league, but the irony of recognising this fact is accepting that we aren’t the best team in the league.
We need a DM, Pogba & Bruno can play alongside - Bruno drops deeper all the time anyway, we just need an anchor back there.
If Pogba doesn’t renew, who can blame him?
The debate is not just about motivation or quality of his teammates.
If the idea is to compare what Pogba did in the last 12 months for MUFC and what he is doing with France, then it's worth saying that 2020 was a difficult year because:
My two cents obviously but clearly football needs atypical players like him.
If the idea is to compare what Pogba did in the last 12 months for MUFC and what he is doing with France, then it's worth saying that 2020 was a difficult year because:
- He had a serious ankle injury
- He did contract the Covid so he started the season tired and needed time to find his rhythm
- Cultural ones - There are several French players who think alike so he really feels at home
- Pressure - shared with other super stars like Mbappe, Benzema and Kante. These 3 players make other players better.
- Coaching - Difficult relationship with Mourinho that limited his personal development at MUFC
My two cents obviously but clearly football needs atypical players like him.
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I don’t think it’s fair to say he’s amazing for France and rubbish for us. He’s played well this season and we dropped off massively when he got injured. It’s something that probably held more truth under Mourinho, under Ole he’s tended to do much better.
It’s a different sort of good though. For France there is no doubt in mind that he tries harder. For whatever reason, he sprints for balls, puts himself about more and acts like his life depends on winning. At Utd, I hardly ever see that but of course he’s a great player so he will still do very good things. It’s a hunger thing and at Utd I never see the same desire that I do for France. Maybe he just really loves international football and his country, who knows.
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