So what's your point? Are you pointing out to how the agents are the main reason for the crazy inflation in player wages and the players have no idea how much they earn?
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Ehhh he is of Muslim faith. He doesn't drink alcohol and or want to promote it. What an odd take this is
There's also the point that I just straight up think Solskjaer doesn't want to do it. It's the fans who want a 4-3-3, the manager has never shown interest in not having a midfield two with Bruno as a straight up no.10. 4-2-3-1 is very much his ideal formation.
You can say Shaw was our most consistent player but no way did Pogba, Cavani or Rashford out perform him. Overall he was our best player last season and he was the season before that too (even though he was only here for not even half of it)
Disrespectful? The interview/press conference is about them, they can choose what message they convey to the world. Companies like Cola and Heineken shouldn't be so tone deaf to not realize that Pogba is Muslim and wouldn't want to advertise a beer company, and Ronaldo has always been against pop/anything unhealthy so wouldn't want cola advertised.
Big companies care more about the image they represent these days and a moral compass plays a big part in that these days. That's why Nike allied itself with Kaepernick. Global superstars like Ronaldo and Pogba have more power with those actions and they get paid well regardless.
I think that's how you really feel... these superstars can do whatever they want and still make bank. You think that little gesture affects his income? If anything it probably gave the brand some exposure.
That's not how France usually play with Pogba. They usually have water carrier with Kante like Sissoko or Matuidi. Kante is an elite midfielder and the perfect foil for Pogba.
What is odd is players expecting special treatment. He isn't there to promote his religion, noone is forcing him to drink alcohol or personally endorse Heineken.
These big companies have sponsorship deals that are needed for the financial future of the sport. There are contracts that need to be followed and I'm 1000% certain that what Pogba did is against the contracts.
So these big players want to earn 10-20-30 million pounds/euro/dollars a year, but then don't know or understand the financial implications of their own actions. I find both Ronaldo's and Pogba's antics very disrespectful, everything has to be about them 2 players suddenly.
Not about them. But they can choose what is advertised around them. Companies can't force what is advertised in front of each specific player, and its a big mistake on their part when they don't read the situation. Ronaldo doesn't drink and is very public about that. Heineken didn't advertize themselves in front of him. They can put themselves on the boards but the bottles in front of the players don't have to be there when they speak, the players are in control of what they want to be shown.
Then they have no honour and respect for the tournament or sponsors. Nobody is forcing Ronaldo and Pogba to drink or personally endorse anything. The setup for press conferences is agreed upon way before the tournament starts and the main sponsors have negotiated their terms.
Then the superstar players come in and just do what they want. I don't agree with that, there is no class in it and it's just made as a PR exercise.
The players are not in control when you have contracts. If contracts suddenly don't matter, the system we work under falls down. So you need to respect others if you want to be respected yourself.
The players don't have contracts with the specific sponsors if they don't want to. They aren't obligated to follow UEFAs contracts.
He's a Muslim. He doesn't want alcohol being advertised infront of him. Fighters do the same thing.
You are making a bigger deal than needed. It's the same as press conferences, if players don't want to participate the organizer can fine them. If the UEFA has an issue with it they most likely can fine the players and it doesn't concern any of us. The players are free to take a decision for themselves and to accept the consequences.
People are talking much more about the brands now than they would if they didn't remove the bottles, I'm sure the brands don't really care.
Not to mention that players aren't paid large amounts for playing for their national team. Tournament sponsorships goes to pay for hosting costs, incl prize money of course, which those teams who do well tend to give out a significant portion of as bonuses to players. But it's still a drop in the ocean of their league team salary and individual sponsorships.
Please won't somebody think of the poor likes of Heineken and Coca Cola 
These selfish players really think only of themselves instead of multimillion dollar corporate sponsors that they should be thinking of, the absolute state of them...
These selfish players really think only of themselves instead of multimillion dollar corporate sponsors that they should be thinking of, the absolute state of them...
Played really well last night. Made a comment about going forward & getting into the box being his priority for France but defending being his priority for United. Interesting.
No honor or respect? Come on. Don't be so out of touch. The companies aren't the big guys at play here, the players are. The companies should have respected the opinions of these players before fecking up.
PR exercise? Players these days are a lot more socially aware and ready to speak their mind on issues they believe in, rightfully so. Ronaldo is against drinking soda as its unhealthy. Him moving a coke out of the way and saying drink water, as simple as it sounds, will lead fo some more people cutting out soda. Have you seen Ronaldo in loads of coka cola ads in the past? Probably not as he doesn't drink it. Pogba doesn't drink alcohol. Why the feck would he want alcohol to be advertised to the world? What kind of message does that send?
It's not disrespectful at all. The players run the show. The companies are fortunate to be able to advertise their products. They should know when, and when not to show certain items. Companies care more and more about sending the right core values then before. Of course it's all about money in the end for them, but they do it by telling a story with their core values and being very socially aware. The companies that fail at that, fail as companies. Heineken and Coke Cola both fecked up, nothing huge but it's a feck up on their part and the players are well within their rights to say "feck that, I don't want this bottle in front of me when I'm speaking".
Of course they are, players are registered with UEFA and FIFA. They have to comply with UEFA and FIFA rules. And UEFA are obliged to follow their contacts with their sponsors.
Maybe Coca-Cola and Heineken won't take legal actions, but they most definitely can if they felt the need for it. But I just find these acts so self-righteous and self-centered. I don't care if it's morally the right choice, I don't drink any alcohol either and very rarely have a Coke or fizzy drink these days. The basic principles are more important for me in that case, the sponsors help the tournament and create the financial environment where teams or players don't have to worry about organisation.
Making such gestures and then using your agents to make the clubs pay you more and more money is very hypocritical.
Totally disagree. It's about basic principles, as I said in one of my previous posts. I don't drink alcohol and barely have fizzy drinks these days, but out of respect for the tournament and for the sponsors that provide these opportunities for the sport, I would never act like this.
It's my personal view and I feel strongly about it, I don't want to try and argue with someone, in order to convince him about my stance. I just wanted to elaborate more on my opinion, of course players can do whatever they want and I can think that they are being assholes and self-centred pricks.
Nah it's not. If there was less money in the game I doubt you'd see them complain. Did people complain 20 years ago? No. They still played and loved it. A bigger pie demands that of course more of that pie should go to the players. The amount of money in the game is exponentially growing, and it would be fecked up if their pay didn't scale up with that. I'd much rather the players and coaches get the bulk of it and the owners get feck all. If sponsors suddenly started withdrawing, others would take their place first of all, but also clubs would just adjust how they operate. But if the money is there (which it is), it should go to the players.
People aren't sheep. Just because they get paid by something, if they don't agree with the message it sends they can be publicly against it. It's better that they are allowed to speak their minds. The world is a better place for it. Part of the reason things like BLM took so long to really start happening was because too many people in the past were too scared to say anything that might upset people in power. With greater social media reach and awareness, the roles have completely reversed, and the world is better off for it.
It's not interesting. He wants to leave and will likely follow his agent's lead and talk shite until it happens. Hopefully he has a good tournament and we can find a club willing to cough up decent fee.
I disagree again. Clubs should always have bigger power than players, Sir Alex warned many times that he will never allow a player to become bigger than the club or the manager.
The fact we have allowed this to happen is why players and their agents can stick their whole arms in our asses and we just smile back to them.
Who should get the money then? The owners? That's not what sir Alex meant. The players play the game. The coaches help. The owners? They are background money men and the sport would exist without them.
And it's only logical their wages increase. If a team made 50m a year before, and 50% of their revenue went to the players, that would be 25m split between a 25 man squad. If that same team now makes 200m a year, isn't it only fair that their pay rises as well? After all, without the players, the clubs would be nothing.
There is nothing interesting about it. He had an interview with Vieira and Vieira said that he preferred him in a different role something closer to what he did for Juventus than what he does for France or United and asked Pogba what was the difference in terms of instructions.
The club. Not the owners, the club. The whole community around the club. Easier to understand now?
And what did Sir Alex mean in your mind?
It was disrespectful that whoever was responsible put an alcoholic drink in front of a Muslim player to advertise. They are hardly being assholes or self-centred for upholding their religious beliefs.
Pogba should refuse the press conference. He should refuse to play in a tournament that the main sponsor is a company producing alcohol, if Islam is so much more important to him. He should also refuse to fly with our club, because we are sponsored by Aeroflot, a company with ties to the Russian government. Shall I continue?
He’s not really talking shit though he’s just talking about the differences in his role. He only plays with one midfield partner when he plays there for United. He had 2 for France.
Power is not money. The community around the club I agree should get a larger slice of pie then they do. But that doesn't happen anyway. The players can get their increases with the community getting theirs as well with a rise in revenue. It is the 2 most deserving parts of football that deserve the money.
Sir Alex meant no player should be bigger than the club, so in no player should be catered to above all else. No player should run how a club operates, no player should be above benching, no player should put their needs ahead of the clubs (for footballing matters, not personal values and beliefs). Anyway, the world adapts. Players were much more like sheep who just listened and played football and shut up about any social issues back in the day. It's not the case anymore and the world is better now, and most older athletes praise all current athletes who speak up. Guys like Zlatan are tone deaf when he criticized LeBron for speaking up about social/political issues.
The sponsors aren't the big thing either, which is what I think you are missing. You seem to be of the belief that everyone should cater to what the sponsors want to do which is 100% wrong, thankfully.
You're definitely trolling. I hope so anyway.
Heineken isn't the tournament. He doesn't have to necessarily be that strongly against it for him to not want a bottle in front of his face on the table (which is pretty disrespectful for muslims). He does not have to have it in front of his face if he doesn't want to actively advertise it while he's speaking. There's levels to everything. There's a much greater sense of unease about the world cup going to Qatar because of all the ethical issues there. And I suspect you'll see much stronger and more vocal protests during the tournament from the players as well. And they'll be in the right even if they get fined. The companies shouldn't be so tone deaf and feck up like they do.
Also, like I said previously. They don't put the bottles out in front of every player. Heineken knows Ronaldo is against alcohol. So they don't bother putting alcohol in front of him. They were tone deaf with Pogba. Their problem.
Meh I think people focus far too much on managers these days. The players can work it out on the pitch if they're given the right foundations. I would rather someone other than Ole but I wouldn't put it past him to get those two in sync. They've shown glimpses of it and if we get the right investment to make Ole's job a bit easier, I'm quite hopeful.
I suspect Pogba will leave after another great tournament anyway.
Who is supposed to give them the right foundations?
This is just such a poor take im not even going to respond if im honest with you. Expecting special treatment? What... Ronaldo expecting special treatment for moving coke away because he believes it to be unhealthy? yeh such a poor take this is.
Starts with the manager but the manager doesn't have to be a genius. Definitely needs to at least understand team balance in terms of personnel though. Zidane I'm really still not convinced is some genius. But he understood team balanced, or learned to, and could bring a great group of players together. Ole I don't see why he can't do that. Zidane had Modric and Kroos playing together at first and struggled, then brought in Casemiro and it knitted it all together perfectly. United need that Casemiro and a way of setting up Pogba and Bruno together. I'd agree with @Brwned in that playing Bruno deeper where he's excelled before makes a good balance for that. Pogba can also be a roaming #8 and they both take turns pushing up or dropping, but you need the right #6 behind them.
You have contracts. You are supposed to follow them and honour them. If you don't like it, you renegotiate, before or after the situation. You don't act like a spoilt brat and make a public scene of removing one of the main sponsors. It shouldn't work like that.
The most tone deaf thing is that if we lived in a fairer society, these players would earn 1% of what they do now. Here is some food for thought.
I think that's a bit of a leading question to be honest. The manager is obviously the one that's supposed to do it. But it can develop organically largely in spite of the manager too. Some great teams have had unspectacular managers, with strong personalities on the pitch knitting things together and the momentum carrying them forward while the manager keeps things steady. At United we don't have the foundations to reach that "great" level as things stand, and a strong manager could turn it around quickly, but maybe the current foundations are enough to reach that second-tier level (real challengers, possibly fortunate winners) with Ole managing the personalities and the players taking a bit more leadership on the pitch.
I don't get why optimism about our current situation is met with such friction here, it's so quickly shot down. I understand why people don't necessarily share it but why people think it can't go unchallenged...I find that a bit strange.
Don't underestimate the role of Fernandinho in their success. He provided the security to let them do their thing plus his own passing ability is massively underrated. You can see why we are looking at a defence mid. Whether we are looking at the right options is another thing. You see how much more comfortable Pogba looks playing in a midfield with Kante than he typically does for us
Very fair points.
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