[Jaap]

If he's gone by Monday, we're screwed.

Zidane‘s quotes worry me; saying that „one, maybe two, „bombs“ will be signed before the end of the transfer window“.

 

[Treble]

That first half was terrible. Dispossessed again and again.

 

[redshaw]

We'll have been done up like a kipper if Pogba is gone by tomorrow. Lukaku gone not replaced, Herrera gone not replaced, Matic gone physically, if Pogba goes too that would leave us dreadfully short.

I would feel sorry for Maguire leaving Leicester for this.

Don't see Pogba getting sold tomorrow though but I think we'll have to accept next season a price of 90-120 million due to our struggling situation and him agreeing to stay for one more. We won't be getting 150+ million and rebuilding our squad, the demand for him isn't that great.

 

[SaintMuppet]

We'll have been done up like a kipper if Pogba is gone by tomorrow. Lukaku gone not replaced, Herrera gone not replaced, Matic gone physically, if Pogba goes too that would leave us dreadfully short.

I would feel sorry for Maguire leaving Leicester for this.

Maguire is fine. He is young enough and desirable enough to move on in a year or so. Also he is securing his families future while here.

I do wonder if he regrets the move on footballing grounds though.

 

[1988]

He's not solid enough and I hope he'll be gone next summer. Obviously he'll need replacing. I just can't stand his carelessness anymore. He's such a liability and I don't care how brilliant he can be. Hope he proves me wrong and becomes the absolute dominant midfielder he can be.

 

[redshaw]

Maguire is fine. He is young enough and desirable enough to move on in a year or so. Also he is securing his families future while here.

I do wonder if he regrets the move on footballing grounds though.

It's footballing grounds I'm talking about. He's getting paid well and long term a move to us could work out well but this requires the club to start functioning.

He's not solid enough and I hope he'll be gone next summer. Obviously he'll need replacing. I just can't stand his carelessness anymore. He's such a liability and I don't care how brilliant he can be. Hope he proves me wrong and becomes the absolute dominant midfielder he can be.

This is our problem, expecting him to be this dominant midfielder. Paul Scholes wasn't, Pogba is very much like Scholes in his passing and vision but both can get caught on the ball and cost goals. Pogba may have the tools to be more but really would we be asking Scholes to be a Keane or Gerrard, no he's in the team create. We've failed for 4 seasons in getting midfielders around him so he can do his natural game.

 

[SaintMuppet]

It's footballing grounds I'm talking about. He's getting paid well and long term a move to us could work out well but this requires the club to start functioning.

Like I said nothing to stop him moving on, he will be gone in a couple seasons I guess. I would be surprised if he did not have some regrets now he sees what he has to work with....

 

[1988]

This is our problem, expecting him to be this dominant midfielder. Paul Scholes wasn't, Pogba is very much like Scholes in his passing and vision but both can get caught on the ball and cost goals. Pogba may have the tools to be more but really would we be asking Scholes to be a Keane or Gerrard, no he's in the team create. We've failed for 4 seasons in getting midfielders around him so he can do his natural game.

I disagree. Scholes, Keane, Gerrard, Lampard or whoever you want to mention were far more professional, dedicated and just rock solid. I can't even hold count to how many times Pogba has lost possession due to sloppiness and dumb arrogance in our last 4 games. Pogba has the potential to reach their tier but he's just not dedicated enough. Head's not right.

 

[Steve 007]

I grew up with fergies united and had the luxury of Scholes and Keane for years being the central midfield.
The attitude and desire of those two was as good as anybody anywhere.

Pogba does not want to be here, yesterday showed it.

Maguire misplaced one pass the whole game and he’s a defender, how many times in that first half did Pogba miss place a pass or get tackled? If he was a youth player and that was his first performance we’d want him sent out on loan.

There was one point that he got tackled in the Southampton half and McT and Perraira who where further up the field had to sprint all the way back to our box to recovery it whilst he casually jogged back pretending he was interested.

I’m not scapegoating him but he’s clearly not got the mentality or desire of our great midfielders of the past. I’ve no idea why Madrid would pay £150 million for him.

I hope he goes next summer (even if he does get better) and we the money for a midfield rebuild of players who actually want to be here.

 

[In Rainbows]

I disagree. Scholes, Keane, Gerrard, Lampard or whoever you want to mention were far more professional, dedicated and just rock solid. I can't even hold count to how many times Pogba has lost possession due to sloppiness and dumb arrogance in our last 4 games. Pogba has the potential to reach their tier but he's just not dedicated enough. Head's not right.

So what you're saying is that instead of adding more quality to midfield, we should just replace Pogba with a guy who can carry our midfield?

 

[1988]

So what you're saying is that instead of adding more quality to midfield, we should just replace Pogba with a guy who can carry our midfield?

Our midfield obviously needs a revamp, no arguing there. I'm saying Pogba isn't the character to build around.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

This again...

Replace McTominay with Verratti and we'll instantly improve. Make a 3 man midfield and pair up Verratti and a legit DM and we'll instantly improve. What are you saying here? You consistently do not get what we're lacking in midfield and instantly attribute that to Pogba.

It's been clear for a while now that we do not have a midfielder who can run the game through their passing, and safety in possession. It's been clear for a while now that we do not have a legitimate defensive midfielder. If you replace Pogba with a slightly less creative midfielder, but someone who can retain possession, we're still not better in regards defending the back four, and we've gotten worse going forwards. Your hypothetical does not solve our midfield, it's just a cheap shot aimed at Pogba as if he's the sole reason why we're not good in midfield.

What is the point of McTominay? My guess is that he balances out Pogba's lack of energy in the middle. But what else does he provide? He's not a particularly great defensive player. He's not great going forward. He's not the best passing option to retain possession, nor can he run the game through his passing.

If we take out Pogba and put in Herrera to be paired with Mata how have we solved our midfield crisis? We got worse going forward. Herrera can't run the game through his passing. We became more energetic at the expense of creativity. Still lack in 2 key areas.

Pogba is not the problem. The problem is we're lacking in genuine quality in midfield in 2 current areas. All you're saying is that you prefer a different flavor of a midfield crisis (us to become better in 1 area, but be mediocre in 2 other areas). Same as right now.

And to be even more clearer, try to make a combination of players that makes our midfield shine in as many areas as possible

Chance creation
Distribution
Defensive aptitude
Energy

You can't do it with Pogba, or with a Pogba replacement. And why do we need to replace Pogba in particular, and not add a quality midfield to be beside him? Why the hell can't we have a stacked midfield like Juve had, France has, Barca had, or Real Madrid? Some parts of the fan base is so weird and think we need 1 midfielder to carry our entire midfield.

Our midfield is definitely a problem. I never said Pogba was the main cause. Believing Verratti would improve us doesn't attribute the entirety of blame to Pogba.

McTominay is not a good player IMO. I think he should be nowhere near the starting XI.

However, McTominay is not at fault nor anyone else when Pogba loses the ball 3 times in 30 seconds. It's inexcusable. He himself needs to be better on the ball.

But yes ideally, we'd have a better midfield. Pogba isn't THE problem, but when he's losing the ball as much as he has to start this season, I'm not going to excuse him for it. He should be much better than that.

 

[In Rainbows]

Our midfield obviously needs a revamp, no arguing there. I'm saying Pogba isn't the character to build around.

Why do we need to build around Pogba? We should be getting more quality alongside him because that's what all teams want, to get better. Liverpool had Gerard surrounded by Xabi and Mascherano. Scholes had Keane. Modric has Kroos and Casemiro. Xavi had Iniesta and Busquets. Pogba had Vidal and Pirlo in the past.

For the life of me, I cannot understand how we need to replace Pogba, It's a rampant idea amongst our fan base to look at the midfield as being built around 1 person because it's a way to pin the dismal midfield performances on his shoulders. Why not just treat him like a regular #8 that could use more help? If you don't like him in a deeper role because he isn't disciplined and gives the ball away, just say it. Why does that require him being shipped off?

Literally had a real life example of a top 2 midfield in the world involving Pogba and yet apparently he's not good enough to be in another world class midfield at United. It's just not possible. How in the world did Juve achieve that? Maybe they had quality and not players like McTominay (good squad player), Matic, Fred, and Pereira?

Our midfield is definitely a problem. I never said Pogba was the main cause. Believing Verratti would improve us doesn't attribute the entirety of blame to Pogba.

McTominay is not a good player IMO. I think he should be nowhere near the starting XI.

However, McTominay is not at fault nor anyone else when Pogba loses the ball 3 times in 30 seconds. It's inexcusable. He himself needs to be better on the ball.

But yes ideally, we'd have a better midfield. Pogba isn't THE problem, but when he's losing the ball as much as he has to start this season, I'm not going to excuse him for it. He should be much better than that.

The problem comes from the fact that many treat Pogba as the biggest liability when it's the complete opposite of reality. Him losing the ball and not being arsed to track back doesn't erase his quality.

Why would you replace Pogba with Verratti, instead of just outright partnering him with Pogba? Verratti in our midfield with Pogba pretty much solves a lot of our midfield problems and we would only lack a DM, doesn't matter what kind. This idea is just backwards to me.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Why do we need to build around Pogba? We should be getting more quality alongside him because that's what all teams want, to get better. Liverpool had Gerard surrounded by Xabi and Mascherano. Scholes had Keane. Modric has Kroos and Casemiro. Xavi had Iniesta and Busquets. Pogba had Vidal and Pirlo in the past.

For the life of me, I cannot understand how we need to replace Pogba, It's a rampant idea amongst our fan base to look at the midfield as being built around 1 person because it's a way to pin the dismal midfield performances on his shoulders. Why not just treat him like a regular #8 that could use more help? If you don't like him in a deeper role because he isn't disciplined and gives the ball away, just say it. Why does that require him being shipped off?

Literally had a real life example of a top 2 midfield in the world involving Pogba and yet apparently he's not good enough to be in another world class midfield at United. It's just not possible. How in the world did Juve achieve that? Maybe they had quality and not players like McTominay (good squad player), Matic, Fred, and Pereira?

All of this is moot though.

Pogba will be sold next season(presuming Real meet our valuation).

He doesn't want to stay here.

 

[In Rainbows]

All of this is moot though.

Pogba will be sold next season(presuming Real meet our valuation).

He doesn't want to stay here.

That's a different argument. I can understand that logic. It's when people want him replaced for performances and acting like our midfield crisis still wouldn't be in need of 2 more signings after replacing him.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

That's a different argument. I can understand that logic. It's when people want him replaced for performances and acting like our midfield crisis still wouldn't be in need of 2 more signings after replacing him.

I mean I'd sell him for the right money, but we'd definitely need 3 first choice midfielders afterwards.

Whether Woodward would actually get 3 that would improve us though is a different story. I worry we'd pocket the Pogba sale and just get Longstaff, and then call it a day.

 

[1988]

Why do we need to build around Pogba? We should be getting more quality alongside him because that's what all teams want, to get better. Liverpool had Gerard surrounded by Xabi and Mascherano. Scholes had Keane. Modric has Kroos and Casemiro. Xavi had Iniesta and Busquets. Pogba had Vidal and Pirlo in the past.

For the life of me, I cannot understand how we need to replace Pogba, It's a rampant idea amongst our fan base to look at the midfield as being built around 1 person because it's a way to pin the dismal midfield performances on his shoulders. Why not just treat him like a regular #8 that could use more help? If you don't like him in a deeper role because he isn't disciplined and gives the ball away, just say it. Why does that require him being shipped off?

Literally had a real life example of a top 2 midfield in the world involving Pogba and yet apparently he's not good enough to be in another world class midfield at United. It's just not possible. How in the world did Juve achieve that? Maybe they had quality and not players like McTominay (good squad player), Matic, Fred, and Pereira?

I'm just done with Pogba and in my opinion he just doesn't add to the team. As said he's a liability. Improving our midfield won't stop Pogba from not having his head in the game, won't stop him from being easily disposed and being careless. Moving him further up the field isn't going to solve what's fundamentally wrong with Pogba. Don't care if he's an 6, 8 or bloody 10.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

The problem comes from the fact that many treat Pogba as the biggest liability when it's the complete opposite of reality. Him losing the ball and not being arsed to track back doesn't erase his quality.

Why would you replace Pogba with Verratti, instead of just outright partnering him with Pogba? Verratti in our midfield with Pogba pretty much solves a lot of our midfield problems and we would only lack a DM, doesn't matter what kind. This idea is just backwards to me.

I don't see him as a liability(unless he repeats that 1st half performance which is unlikely).

Him losing the ball and not being arsed to track back shouldn't be acceptable though. He's not Messi. He needs to track back when he loses the ball.

Re: the Pogba/Verratti thing, it was merely a comment.

I mean yeah I'd ideally partner the two.

Our midfield lacks a player to dictate tempo/control the game.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Zidane‘s quotes worry me; saying that „one, maybe two, „bombs“ will be signed before the end of the transfer window“.

Woodward and the Glazers should be faced with a global protest if they sold Pogba this late without a replacement.

It would be complete lunacy.

 

[Terminator]

The protection of Scott McT is doing my head in. There were multiple instances yesterday when Scott was completely free but Pogba had 2-3 men around him and Mata still passed it to Pogba. Just trust Scott ffs.

 

[Jaap]

Woodward and the Glazers should be faced with a global protest if they sold Pogba this late without a replacement.

It would be complete lunacy.

True but would you be surprised?

 

[Marcelinho87]

True but would you be surprised?

Fans will no doubt blame Ole and the glorious regime up top will come out unscathed yet again.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

After what happened today, I’ll be surprised if Ole doesn’t play him in advanced role next game. Clearly playing him deep doesn’t suit him in this league, best is playing him in advanced role. When he plays poor he will somehow find a way to create something out of nothing for our forwards to score. There is just no point playing him deeper when we have Maguire to play from the back.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

True but would you be surprised?

I honestly would be.

This would be a whole different level of lunacy compared to past showings.

 

[Rocknrolla69er]

He's sulking as he doesn't like playing the deeper role

Watched him countless times decide he couldn't be arsed

He's shite, the great deceiver

 

[Bestietom]

Woodward and the Glazers should be faced with a global protest if they sold Pogba this late without a replacement.

It would be complete lunacy.

Nothing would surprise me now, and anyway is Pogba any good to us the way he is strolling around the pitch and losing the ball most of the time. Everyone can see he doesn't want to be here, and IF we had someone to come in for him, he would be better gone. We have been let down again in transfer window.

 

[Jig1234]

Ole needs to stop treating Pogba like Pirlo. He is not a deep lying midfielder. He is not having any positive impact to our attack at all operating this deep. He was terrible in possession yesterday. Why does he keep using him in this awful system. Get him further up the pitch. I would much rather see Pogba at no.10 or left of a 4-3-3.

 

[Garebo]

I think he will be gone come January and it's the right decision for everyone. The thing is that his value will have dropped by then, because his stats won't be the same as last year's.

So yet again we are loosers or Ed is an idiot because he cannot make any profit from the sales. He even kept De Gea this summer, instead of selling him for 60m and he will leave for free next summer.

At least, I hope they spend the money on two midfielders because we are so thin over there.

 

[In Rainbows]

I'm just done with Pogba and in my opinion he just doesn't add to the team. As said he's a liability. Improving our midfield won't stop Pogba from not having his head in the game, won't stop him from being easily disposed and being careless. Moving him further up the field isn't going to solve what's fundamentally wrong with Pogba. Don't care if he's an 6, 8 or bloody 10.

It actually does matter though as his defensive responsibility lessens and when he does lose the ball, it isn't as bad as in deeper areas. No he is not a liability. You could literally point to a couple of players as a liability. It's lost all meaning with this team as we're not a great team filled with quality. What's stopping you from calling McTominay a liability? Lingard? Rashford? Pereira? Matic? We can go down the list.

 

[1988]

It actually does matter though as his defensive responsibility lessens and when he does lose the ball, it isn't as bad as in deeper areas. No he is not a liability. You could literally point to a couple of players as a liability. It's lost all meaning with this team as we're not a great team filled with quality. What's stopping you from calling McTominay a liability? Lingard? Rashford? Pereira? Matic? We can go down the list.

I hold Pogba to way higher standards than those you mention. Yes we need a revamp, we have far too much mediocrity on the team. It's totally fine that we don't see eye to eye when it comes to Pogba but I simply can't grasp how you can defend his sloppiness and lack of professionalism (We can call it focus for the sake of it). And your solution is moving him further up the field and letting others cover his losses.

 

[UnitedFan93]

Why is he playing so deep? Pogba has never played well in a holding role and more often than not he will lose the ball as he tries to dribble out.

If we are short of goals up front surely Pogba should be pushed further forward where he can make late runs into the box and chip in with goals (like his header against chelsea in the cup last season).

It's really bad management from Ole. Get Matic back in the team and push Pogba further forward ffs.

 

[Bestietom]

Why is he playing so deep? Pogba has never played well in a holding role and more often than not he will lose the ball as he tries to dribble out.

If we are short of goals up front surely Pogba should be pushed further forward where he can make late runs into the box and chip in with goals (like his header against chelsea in the cup last season).

It's really bad management from Ole. Get Matic back in the team and push Pogba further forward ffs.

Sooner we play players that want to play here than a player that doesn't. Be brave and try Garner and Gomes.

 

[Ralph1386]

Nothing would surprise me now, and anyway is Pogba any good to us the way he is strolling around the pitch and losing the ball most of the time. Everyone can see he doesn't want to be here, and IF we had someone to come in for him, he would be better gone. We have been let down again in transfer window.

Honestly, it could have been better for the team if we had sold him in the summer for like 150M pound and bought in about three decent players who actually want to be here. Like 2 midfielders and a right winger, or two world class players instead of 3 decent ones. He gets his dream move, leaves on good terms, and we are better as a team. But of course, who knows if the Glazers would have reinvested all of the money from his sale.

Liverpool lost Coutinho and Suarez when they wanted out, and they still managed to become a better team than they were before they sold them.

 

[Alexit]

Why is he playing so deep? Pogba has never played well in a holding role and more often than not he will lose the ball as he tries to dribble out.

If we are short of goals up front surely Pogba should be pushed further forward where he can make late runs into the box and chip in with goals (like his header against chelsea in the cup last season).

It's really bad management from Ole. Get Matic back in the team and push Pogba further forward ffs.

Bingo!

I've read a lot of people slating Matic, but given the position we've put ourselves in, he needs to start so that Paul can be higher up the pitch to help us out in attack. There's nothing in the cameo he made yesterday that suggested, again, given our options, he shouldn't be starting. Scott is not very good but we've put ourselves in a position where he's now nailed on in a midfield two. You really can't make this up. Since Ole insists on a 4231, Pogba needs to be further up the pitch in that formation. This is Jose all over again!

Pogba was not very good in the first half admittedly but he's clearly our best player and it doesn't help him when certain clowns pass the ball to him when he's surrounded by two or three opposition players. He's good but he's no magician.

 

[Bestietom]

Honestly, it could have been better for the team if we had sold him in the summer for like 150M pound and bought in about three decent players who actually want to be here. Like 2 midfielders and a right winger, or two world class players instead of 3 decent ones. He gets his dream move, leaves on good terms, and we are better as a team. But of course, who knows if the Glazers would have reinvested all of the money from his sale.

Liverpool lost Coutinho and Suarez when they wanted out, and they still managed to become a better team than they were before they sold them.

Agree, The monies Liverpool received for these players went back into team building. Not replacing Lukaku will prove to be our downfall as we have no prolific CF and neither of Martial or Rashford will get us 25/30 goals a season. We need a fox in the box for the crosses and tap ins, someone to sit on the shoulder of the last defender all the time. Rashford and Martial seem to roam out wide too often. Yes, we should have sold Pogba this summer and brought in 2 midfielders in his place as well as replacing Herrera.

 

[In Rainbows]

I hold Pogba to way higher standards than those you mention. Yes we need a revamp, we have far too much mediocrity on the team. It's totally fine that we don't see eye to eye when it comes to Pogba but I simply can't grasp how you can defend his sloppiness and lack of professionalism (We can call it focus for the sake of it). And your solution is moving him further up the field and letting others cover his losses.

I do too, but when it comes to who stays at the club I readjust that standard so that everyone is under the same standard.. It doesn't make sense to have a different standard in that context. Otherwise, how would you end up with a squad as good as 2008-2009?

I'm not defending his sloppiness in and of itself. I'm defending his overall quality which includes his good moments and his bad moments. I'm suggesting moving him forward because you yourself stated that he loses the ball which can cost us in deeper areas. Fact of the matter is, Pogba is not Modric, Xavi, or Scholes. He's not going to be that constant source of passing always gravitating towards the ball to receive passes and bail out his partners to help the side retain possession. Quite clearly he likes getting forward from time to time. Nor is he some defensive specialist. He's not disciplined which is why I feel like Gomes if you were to look at 18 year old Pogba in the reserves and Gomes in the reserves, I would be more inclined to believe Gomes could do the job that Pogba can't. Not necessarily a bad thing.

If we recognize this, why would you not want to compliment him with 2 other midfielders who are of that high quality, but for their roles? Midfielders aren't robots who are all well rounded and who are equally good at all facets of the game, with the only difference between midfielders being quality. There are players like Kante who is not that great at passing, but is brilliant at disrupting play. There are players like Modric, who run the show through their passing and are the side's best passing option due to being technically brilliant and disciplined. There are passing specialists who are a bit slow, so become holding midfielders. There are midfielders who have energy as a really big asset to the team. There are jack of all trades midfielders.

If we had Kante instead of Pogba, we instantly become a rock solid side. Thing is, we lose creativity and we still lack a player who can distribute the ball constantly. You don't get rid of Kante because he lacks in those areas. You compliment him with players who are brilliant in those other areas. You compromise by complimenting him with players who their best traits are those things Kante isn't good at, but aren't world class in that department.

This is what we had with Herrera and Matic. Herrera is not prime Vidal, nor is he Keane. He was very valuable to us because he complimented Pogba, but you could still easily upgrade. He was a compromise to an ideal United midfield. McTominay is currently a compromise and he is more useful next to Pogba, then he is if you were to play him next to Vidal and Herrera. His best trait is that he's energetic, but if Vidal and Herrera are already providing that in abundance, you're going to want someone who is a better distributor or someone with Magic to unlock defenses.

Similarly, Matic was a compliment to Pogba only because he was more defensive oriented than our other midfielders. He wasn't some defensive titan like Kante. And because we know Pogba isn't some energetic player (which understandably can frustrate fans), Matic actually is a pretty bad compliment because he's incredibly slow. As a result our midfield still lacked in several areas. He was a compromise, not some ideal Pogba partner meant to solve our midfield.

This is how I view midfields and I would venture a lot of managers view it the same way. It's the same reason why Gerard, Xabi, and Mascherano worked well together. It's the same reason why Busquets complimented Xavi, as he was more defensively gifted, and why Iniesta complimented all 3 by providing more of an attacking asset to the team in the final 3rd. This is why Juve's midfield was largely thought of as the best in the world or 2nd best to Barca's midfield at the time. Vidal complimented Pogba and Pirlo because he provided energy when they lacked it. Pirlo was the passing maestro from deep and would try to break up plays more often by positioning himself as he was the deepest player, and Pogba provided magic from time to time, while chipping in all the other areas, but not being the primary source of those assets.

It's a lot harder to find someone to replace Pogba's production than it is to replace Matic's production, or McTominay's production. If we had Verratti, it would be very hard to find someone to replace him. If we had Kante it would be incredibly hard to replace him. That's why quality is important and teams are scrambling to find those talents.

Sooner we play players that want to play here than a player that doesn't. Be brave and try Garner and Gomes.

This is where I agree and disagree with you. I think Pogba would love to stay here, on the condition that United were good enough to compete for the biggest trophies.

And I'm in agreement that we need to try Garner and Gomes. I believe so because they're compliments to Pogba provided they take to men's football like Rashford did initially. A tall ask, but we have no other internal options who fit the profile or have the potential to provide in key areas we lack with or without Pogba.

 

[Jeppers7]

I do too, but when it comes to who stays at the club I readjust that standard so that everyone is under the same standard.. It doesn't make sense to have a different standard in that context. Otherwise, how would you end up with a squad as good as 2008-2009?

I'm not defending his sloppiness in and of itself. I'm defending his overall quality which includes his good moments and his bad moments. I'm suggesting moving him forward because you yourself stated that he loses the ball which can cost us in deeper areas. Fact of the matter is, Pogba is not Modric, Xavi, or Scholes. He's not going to be that constant source of passing always gravitating towards the ball to receive passes and bail out his partners to help the side retain possession. Quite clearly he likes getting forward from time to time. Nor is he some defensive specialist.

If we recognize this, why would you not want to compliment him with 2 other midfielders who are of that high quality, but for their roles? Midfielders aren't robots who are all well rounded and who are equally good at all facets of the game, with the only difference between midfielders being quality. There are players like Kante who is not that great at passing, but is brilliant at disrupting play. There are players like Modric, who run the show through their passing and are the side's best passing option due to being technically brilliant and disciplined. There are passing specialists who are a bit slow, so become holding midfielders. There are midfielders who have energy as a really big asset to the team. There are jack of all trades midfielders.

If we had Kante instead of Pogba, we instantly become a rock solid side. Thing is, we lose creativity and we still lack a player who can distribute the ball constantly. You don't get rid of Kante because he lacks in those areas. You compliment him with players who are brilliant in those other areas. You compromise by complimenting him with players who their best traits are those things Kante isn't good at, but aren't world class in that department.

This is what we had with Herrera and Matic. Herrera is not prime Vidal, nor is he Keane. He was very valuable to us because he complimented Pogba, but you could still easily upgrade. He was a compromise to an ideal United midfield. McTominay is currently a compromise and he is more useful next to Pogba, then he is if you were to play him next to Vidal and Herrera. His best trait is that he's energetic, but if Vidal and Herrera are already providing that in abundance, you're going to want someone who is a better distributor or someone with Magic to unlock defenses.

Similarly, Matic was a compliment to Pogba only because he was more defensive oriented than our other midfielders. He wasn't some defensive titan like Kante. And because we know Pogba isn't some energetic player (which understandably can frustrate fans), Matic actually is a pretty bad compliment because he's incredibly slow. As a result our midfield still lacked in several areas. He was a compromise, not some ideal Pogba partner meant to solve our midfield.

This is how I view midfields and I would venture a lot of managers view it the same way. It's the same reason why Gerard, Xabi, and Mascherano worked well together. It's the same reason why Busquets complimented Xavi, as he was more defensively gifted, and why Iniesta complimented all 3 by providing more of an attacking asset to the team in the final 3rd. This is why Juve's midfield was largely thought of as the best in the world or 2nd best to Barca's midfield at the time. Vidal complimented Pogba and Pirlo because he provided energy when they lacked it. Pirlo was the passing maestro from deep and would try to break up plays more often by positioning himself as he was the deepest player, and Pogba provided magic from time to time, while chipping in all the other areas, but not being the primary source of those assets.

It's a lot harder to find someone to replace Pogba's production than it is to replace Matic's production, or McTominay's production. If we had Verratti, it would be very hard to find someone to replace him. If we had Kante it would be incredibly hard to replace him. That's why quality is important and teams are scrambling to find those talents.

Exactly. Well said. You don't improve, especially from where we are, by selling your best players. You buy players you need and lose the ones who aren't good enough.

 

[doriandun]

I don't see him as a liability(unless he repeats that 1st half performance which is unlikely).

Him losing the ball and not being arsed to track back shouldn't be acceptable though. He's not Messi. He needs to track back when he loses the ball.

Re: the Pogba/Verratti thing, it was merely a comment.

I mean yeah I'd ideally partner the two.

Our midfield lacks a player to dictate tempo/control the game.

It's not playing Pogba deep doesn't suit him, Pogba himself said, when asked about tracking back, Messi and Ronaldo don't track back, basically implying, why should he, Pogba see's himself as a truly elite player, and those sort of responsibilities should be shouldered by others.

The problem you have playing him further forward is he also has no interest in pressing, which shunts any managers idea of playing the pressing game, hence the reason why MOurinho and Ole opted for Linguard, and to compound issues he has a knack of loosing the ball, which leave the team susceptible to counters, maybe he should be shunted to the left of the three as it is less risky if he looses the ball on the touch line and try James thru the middle [silly idea thinking about it].

I guess 433, with Paul part of a midfield three with Mc T and Maticor Fred till Jan, and push Rashford to the right with Martial up top.

 

[LJJT]

Any one got any stats on him for yesterday? Like his pass completion/ how many times he got tackled? Be interesting to see the others too as we did seem to struggle to pass to a team mate 5 yards away it felt like half the time

 

[BlueHaze]

Ole said he picked up " a bad knock" on his ankle yesterday. If he's out for a longer time our midfield will be even more comical than it already is.