Presume it's fatigue because he looks really slow aswell.
6
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Presume it's fatigue because he looks really slow aswell.
Who is this year's "We need X to unlock Pogba" ?
It's also up to him. He was up the field plenty of times, but in positions where you couldn't get the ball to him. He knew it as well.
I am not botheted to go into detail here as it’s too obvious, but you are obviously and objectivly wrong. Not his best game and not one where he dictates everything going forward, but as usual comfortably better than most of our players when we win. Solid 7 out of 10 from me, in a role that tames him quite a bit.
Took responsibility today, good performance. I look forward to hopefully an injury-free campaign from him next season.
Please, go into detail by all means.
1. Pep would bite his head off for not picking up the yellow and stopping a 3 on 2 counter.
And that slooow running....wtf was that.
2. Getting caught in possession in our half is a big no no for any midfielder, it's just inviting pressure for no reason.
3. That pass i was referring to, that's just atrocius. Again, inviting unnecessary pressure, hell, if it was a better counterattacking team - that's a goal every time.
That's at least 2 major mistakes in a must win game.
I'm sorry, but that's just not good enough for me.
And i'm being objective.
No giving the ball away cheaply in bad positions, no getting dispossessed in our half, so a marked improvement in performance today when we needed one.
Clearly we want a lot more going forward but a good performance today none the less.
Clearly we want a lot more going forward but a good performance today none the less.
We are talking about Paul Pogba and that's where I say he didn't play well by his standard. There were plenty of times when he was slow to move to intercept. Yes it may be the midfield itself is not helping his game but then he should realise that he should never be caught in possession.
After posting on Instagram celebrating Champions League. A hint that he'll be here next season for it?
He wasn't good today, hope he gets his head straight.
He's been very average lately, and it's sort of coincided with Bruno's dip in form as well, pretty much the whole team has looked out of sorts except for Martial who's been the only consistent player at least on the offense. I'm looking forward to seeing how he plays next season with a full pre-season and hopefully no more injuries.
I have been one of his biggest critics, even though I have always maintained the ability is there with him, but thought he did fairly well today. One of our better players on the day.
Definitely need more from him next season though.
Definitely need more from him next season though.
It definitely is up to him as well, and I don't want to be making excuses for Pogba's shortcomings. But I do think that he's naturally more of a box to box midfielder than a deep lying midfielder that we're using him as.
He's had to sacrifice quite a bit of his attacking play, especially in the tighter game, and I felt he did this very well today.
One average game and Pogba fan club can sing again!
His dip in form (he still hasn't been terrible, despite what some of the maniacs claim) just shows how integral he is to our attacking play. Let's not forget he has come back after a hell of a long lay off from a serious injury. Get some legs in there next to him and we've got a midfield that can compete with anyone.
Even with a below par performance he's still our best all round player.
He does not seem to consider the risk when making some of his passes or when he attempts to dribble out of press on our own half. Could look like he was more interested in creating clips for a highlight video than contributing to the team. Some of the times he has lost possession or made a bad pass since the restart has looked like a player that does not care if the team wins or loses. I am more in doubt now about his commitment to the club than I was 6 months ago.
With Bruno and potentially Sancho here, we will have 2 other players able to create... Having PP as one of the sitting midfielders is risky and somewhat a misusage of his abilities. If we got a sensible offer or a good swap deal with some £££ to spend on a more suiting midfielder we should consider it.
With Bruno and potentially Sancho here, we will have 2 other players able to create... Having PP as one of the sitting midfielders is risky and somewhat a misusage of his abilities. If we got a sensible offer or a good swap deal with some £££ to spend on a more suiting midfielder we should consider it.
So he came back we got 3rd. Enough said.
Sign that contract PP. Hands down our best player with Martial a close second now.
Sign that contract PP. Hands down our best player with Martial a close second now.
I view it the other way. I think he now plays it too safe that it gives out the impression that hes underperforming
That narrative has to stop, it's just so ridiculous. Pogba's a professional player, he's got plenty of clips about him, he's not thinking one second let me go for the highlight, he just believes he has the ability to break out of those situations which puts the defense in a precarious position without as much time to adjust than if he passed it around to his teammates, and he has the ability to deliver the right pass at that time to create something. It's all in the name of contributing to the team, regardless whether it pans out or not.
When he played as the attacking minded midfielder as part of a trio, then playing high risk football is ok as he would have two midfielders behind him able to stop the counter after a ball loss. Now he only has Matic, which is not a mobile player, and the potential risk of a ball loss is much higher. He still plays like he has two midfielders behind him, not an aging Matic beside him.
Yeah, that sentence was badly phrased by me. Still, based on the last few games, the contribution or ROI on his high risk football has not been very positive. If he was still our main creator and attacking oriented midfielder, then some of his actions on the ball would have been justifiable, but some of the passes and attempts to dribble out of a two man press during recent games have been really bad... And caused situations that could have easily become big chances for the opposition. He is either making some really bad decisions in-game, his instructions from OGS are high risk or his current abilities on the ball are not what they were before his injury...
We created 3 chances from open play in the first half. One was a chip pass, the other was a dribble in midfield and a nutmeg pass, and the last one was a weird looping pass into the box. All three were high risk choices, all three resulted in shots, all three were by him, and no other player created anything that half.
Credit where it’s due. I thought he did well today. Can’t fault his effort anyway. Got stuck in with a few committed sliding tackles too. Good to see.
@GifLord can we get a clip of that step over pass? That shit was sexy.
I thought he was mainly excellent despite constantly being man-marked. We need a motivated Pogba. Hope he signs a new deal soon and we add more quality to the squad. Him not having to be a leader (which he isn't) really helps his game.
Haven't heard from his agent in a while. I wonder what he's up to?
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Fair, and I agree that it's worked out poorly more often than not, but I do believe it's all because any professional player of his ability will think they can always come out on top. I don't think OGS is instructing that, but I could be wrong, and I also don't think his abilities are affected much post-injury because they don't depend on peak physical shape as much as some other players out there. Pogba is best to try and create danger in the opposition's half, but he's also created very dangerous opportunities pulling off the stunts that we're discussing because Rashford or Martial will jump at those long range peaches of passes by Pogba on the counter, but as you've said the ROI just hasn't been there in that area since his return, and arguably this whole time he's been here. He just brings so much that gets swept under the carpet because the mistakes he makes are easily avoidable and it's frustrating for a lot of folks, even a big Pogba defender like myself can recognize that and I think it's fair.
I do think he needs to phase this out of his game, I understand it's a natural instinct by players that talented but it has cost this team points and it will continue to do so, he has to pick better spots to pull off these attempts in a safer way for the rest of the team.
Thought he was much better today. Controlled midfield, plenty of tackles and blocks and aerially did very well defensively.
Still not convinced Matic is the best partner for him as they're both big and a bit slow to get going.
Lovely ball for the Fernandes offside goal and made a chance for us in the 1st half with some great quick feet.
People still moaning about him today are just being stupid tbh.
Still not convinced Matic is the best partner for him as they're both big and a bit slow to get going.
Lovely ball for the Fernandes offside goal and made a chance for us in the 1st half with some great quick feet.
People still moaning about him today are just being stupid tbh.
Good today and has been overall considering he has come into this crazy schedule while missing almost the entire season before it. I'd like to see him more involved closer to the opposition goal but he's played his role well with how the team currently is. I like Matic and am happy for him to stay but I can't help but feel that in this formation to really unlock Pogba fully than we need a partner for him with the legs to cover ground and get a foot in. Basically a Roy Keane type that can both defend well, be aggressive but can also control the game from deeper positions. I'm not making excuses for Pogba, he is still prone to stupidity in bad positions but I honestly feel that to unlock him to be most effective along with Bruno then we need that deep playmaking player who doesn't need to drop between the centre backs to receive the ball. The thing is though that its worth it because we will never find another available player who can come in and offer what an in form Pogba can.
He's been either man-marked or boxed in for almost every game we've played this month. Matic has been much more cumbersome on the ball, Fernandes has been much less threatening on the ball so it's been much easier to prevent Pogba from picking up the ball and initiating plays from deep. On top of that we've run ourselves into the ground and Pogba is just one of those players, like Yaya Toure, that has a much lower base fitness level than you'd expect for a centre mid. We should hold him individually responsible for his failings but we can't overlook the tactical and team conditioning issues that are entirely outside his control.
Ole alluded to the exceptional circumstances that he felt necessitated going at this full throttle and running the team into the ground. After finishing third it's hard to argue. Individuals made personal sacrifices for the team, and they should be applauded for that rather than held accountable for its negative side effects.
Tactically it's easy to see that teams have packed the middle and cut off space for him. Every big team faces that to some degree but it's been particularly effective against us because our fullbacks are so clueless on the ball, particularly since Shaw's injury and AWB suffering more than most from fatigue. Rashford has had to initiate so many of our plays because we funnel the ball out wide so early. No doubt Pogba's failings feed into that but every midfielder struggles under those conditions.
For me, the jury's still out on whether Bruno's an elite #10. Assuming his inconsistency is mostly fitness related, then most of those issues should disappear next season. Teams can't pack the midfield when Bruno's so threatening in the hole, and if they want to double up on Pogba than a fit Matic is clearly capable of exploiting that with his passing. Ideally we'd have someone like Rice and Grealish stepping in at either end to do the same, but even without that we're in a good position to beat most teams most weeks, with Pogba playing a central role.
Ole alluded to the exceptional circumstances that he felt necessitated going at this full throttle and running the team into the ground. After finishing third it's hard to argue. Individuals made personal sacrifices for the team, and they should be applauded for that rather than held accountable for its negative side effects.
Tactically it's easy to see that teams have packed the middle and cut off space for him. Every big team faces that to some degree but it's been particularly effective against us because our fullbacks are so clueless on the ball, particularly since Shaw's injury and AWB suffering more than most from fatigue. Rashford has had to initiate so many of our plays because we funnel the ball out wide so early. No doubt Pogba's failings feed into that but every midfielder struggles under those conditions.
For me, the jury's still out on whether Bruno's an elite #10. Assuming his inconsistency is mostly fitness related, then most of those issues should disappear next season. Teams can't pack the midfield when Bruno's so threatening in the hole, and if they want to double up on Pogba than a fit Matic is clearly capable of exploiting that with his passing. Ideally we'd have someone like Rice and Grealish stepping in at either end to do the same, but even without that we're in a good position to beat most teams most weeks, with Pogba playing a central role.
And he lost the ball a number of times as well. When he was our only creator (pre-Bruno) and played with two of Fred, McT and Matic around him, the risk associated with losing the ball was not as great as it is now with only Matic. And if we get Sancho coming in as well, taking high risk actions in the build up is not as needed(many other factors influences the need for this as well)... If he could better choose the times to take the risks and when to play it safe, then him as one of two midfielders could work. Should be noted that our fullbacks inability to do something productive on the ball and our struggles to have a functioning way of progressing the ball impacts PP high risk play in a negative way. I.e. sometimes he is put in bad situations by his teammates...
Amazing that people criticize him for being high risk.
I suppose he should just pass it sideways and backwards like the rest of the squad then?
He'd probably get blamed in that regard too.
I suppose he should just pass it sideways and backwards like the rest of the squad then?
He'd probably get blamed in that regard too.
I thought that was a better performance, more so in the first half.
But it is still not a 90 million pound performance. We have to accept that he is not a 90 million pound player.
But it is still not a 90 million pound performance. We have to accept that he is not a 90 million pound player.
He's not hands down our best player at all. This needs to stop guys. It's getting absolutely ridiculous.
He's definitely one of our better players for sure. That's undeniable. The best though? Nah not for me. Bruno has had a much bigger impact on us getting 3rd place. Anyone who can't see that may as well just start supporting Paul Pogba FC and not MUFC.
Call it fair guys. He's still a good player. He's not our best.
By "we" you mean "you" because a large amount of people have accepted that before the transfer even happened.
This is an indication on far he has fallen, that we take notice when he doesn't make mistakes, something you'd hope is taken for granted for the world most expensive transfer.
Lmfao I’d love to see what you’d say about Pepe then. Or Coutinho. Or Griezmann this year. Or Dembele. Or god forbid we buy Sancho and he has just a decent game. As if every great footballer only puts in world class performances day in and day out. Christ Bruno was definitely worse today but since he’s worshipped for being great since being brought in he gets a pass.
So sick of these narratives.
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