[nesty]

In a class of his own. Him and De Gea doing almost all the heavy lifting at the moment.

How much longer can both realistically stay whilst watching others win domestic and European titles? Worrying thought.

 

[A-man]

How much longer can both realistically stay whilst watching others win domestic and European titles? Worrying thought.

Probably the last season.

 

[Web of Bissaka]

He’s the 5th most dispossessed player in the league and the only central midfielder in the top ten. Many of those dispossessions come from the strength battles that he likes to have. He needs to improve that.

Pretty sure it's the opposite.

 

[Web of Bissaka]

Pogba should be made permanent captain and at the same time have Valencia sit on the bench. Even Dalot would have been more useful and threatening yesterday on the right wing

Would prefer Captain De Gea, but yes Capt Pogba is a growing good candidate, certainly a lot better than Capt Valencia atm.

 

[Brightonian]

Just got round to watching the full Wolves game. He was excellent, head and shoulders above most of his teammates and really showing off the full breadth of his game. Didn't deserve to only earn a point.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Interesting stats from a piece by Barney Ronay today.

Because after six Premier League games no central midfielder in any team has been dispossessed more often than Pogba, or taken more unsuccessful touches.

Pogba is yet to make a single interception. Sixty-eight midfielders have made more tackles per 90 minutes, including Fulham’s Tom Cairney, who is a throwback to the strolling-playmaker golden age of the 1960s, and Bernardo Silva, whose manager’s best quote so far in England is “what is tackles?” If Mourinho really is worried about Pogba giving the ball away, not imposing himself and not working enough for the team, then maybe it’s because he gives the ball away, doesn’t impose himself and doesn’t work enough for the team.

And this is in the context of what most people - including me - would consider some of his best form since we signed him. For all his moments of brilliance there is still a feck of a lot of downsides to accommodating Pogba in the team

 

[Pogue Mahone]

He’s the 5th most dispossessed player in the league and the only central midfielder in the top ten. Many of those dispossessions come from the strength battles that he likes to have. He needs to improve that.

Beat me to it. Strength battles, taking too many touches, whatever. It’s a big flaw in his game.

 

[WR10]

Players try audacious passes maybe once or twice a game depending on the confidence and energy they have in their legs. More often than not they get it wrong because they lack the skill or they were just tired at that moment in the game and couldn’t replicate the passes they do in training. Pogba is an exception to that rule. It’s absolutely absurd the technical ability he displays effortlessly and consistently regardless of his energy levels in the game. I really do feel bad he is wasting his years here. He would make Real, Barca or Bayern a better team

 

[Canagel]

Pogba is expected to do the role of about 3 players I think. That’s why people are never happy. They want Lampard, Zidane and Xavi all in one. And some Toure for good measure. I know midfield is an all-round role, but Pogba is supposed to be the primary provider of all the aforementioned player’s best qualities in our team.

All creativity in the team starts and ends with Pogba. Teams know they can shut him down and nobody else will hurt them. I believe even Messi would struggle in this team.

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

All creativity in the team starts and ends with Pogba. Teams know they can shut him down and nobody else will hurt them. I believe even Messi would struggle in this team.

Which makes the Alexis situation all the more frustrating.

 

[El Jefe]

We're well aware of his flaws but I really do feel sorry for him at times. Too often we've seen him display a passing masterclass only for his good work to go wasted.

He has no one even close to his level in our attack. Poor movement and bad touches negate the effectiveness of his creativity. It's easy to see why he's a bit outspoken at present. At the WC with France, Mbappe and Griezmann's movement gave him so many options in midfield and reduced the need for unnecessary dribbling. Even at Juve, he knew his threaded balls into Dybala would stick and had a team that was constantly moving.

On Saturday it was extremely clear that anything we were going to create had to come from Pogba. In fact any passing move that didn't involve him was utterly pointless.

 

[Moonred]

Beat me to it. Strength battles, taking too many touches, whatever. It’s a big flaw in his game.

Pogba definitely lacks awareness many times. I don’t know if it’s the lack of an option that causes it or simply his focus dwindles from time to time. I’d guess it’s the latter. The frustration hence doubles considering the other good things he does.

 

[Cassidy]

Interesting stats from a piece by Barney Ronay today.



And this is in the context of what most people - including me - would consider some of his best form since we signed him. For all his moments of brilliance there is still a feck of a lot of downsides to accommodating Pogba in the team

The catch 22 is that he takes those risks in our team since the creativity in the team is solely his responsibility, which other midfielders in the league or on the list have such repressibility? Creative players lose the ball more often than safe CMs who wont get 10+ assists in a season. Couple that with the lack of movement in the side as a whole

I think he does need to improve but the stat needs to be looked at in context

EDIT: For instance last season KDB ranked 6th in the league for being disposed and Pogba was 27th.

With KDB in 1st for assists and Pogba 6th overall

https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/players/dispossessed

https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/players/goal_assist

It in itself as a stat doesn't tell the whole story, KDB also ranks highly because he is a highly creative player vs a Fernandinho who is more safe with the ball in the side.

He certianly needs to improve his tackling stats KDB ranked 22nd last season and Pogba 76th

 

[Canagel]

Which makes the Alexis situation all the more frustrating.

If we had the WC version of Alexis ie the Alexis from 2015/16 and 2016/17 we wouldn't be far from winning the league. There's a trend in PL winning teams. One star in midfield and one star in attack/or two. Kante and Mahrez for Leicester. Fabregas and Hazard/Costa. KDB and Aguero and so on... it's very frustrating because by the time we sort the attack out Pogba will have probably had enough by then and won't be here. We never seem to have everything at once.

 

[Jeppers7]

Amazing that your on the Lukaku thread defending him and on the Pogba thread posting negative stats.

I was in the Stretty Saturday and only one of the two was being criticised for his performance and workrate.

Lukaku was abismal. As bad a performance as I can remember from a United player. Pogba was almost a one man team.

Your bias is shocking. Why not leave criticism for when he doesn't play well ?

Interesting stats from a piece by Barney Ronay today.



And this is in the context of what most people - including me - would consider some of his best form since we signed him. For all his moments of brilliance there is still a feck of a lot of downsides to accommodating Pogba in the team

 

[Member 109952]

Beat me to it. Strength battles, taking too many touches, whatever. It’s a big flaw in his game.

That's because half the time he gets the ball the rest of the team are standing around, and even if they did make runs passing to Sanchez, Lingard and Lukaku is pointless as they'll do the square root of feck all with it.

Yeah he dallies on the ball but imo he's trying to create space, give some time for the forwards to make some runs so he can pick them up. If you watch France, every time Pogba gets the ball the front 3 are on their bike making runs. It might look like he's trying to engage in a 'strength battle' but for me it's him trying to compensate for the abject lack of quality in this team by trying to do something.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, he doesn't do one on one battles nearly as much for France, put him in a team like Barca or Real and he wouldn't need to either. He's stuck here being a midfielder, our sole creative outlet and the goal scorer/creator at the same time.

 

[el3mel]

Tbf, I think dwelling much on the ball can also help the opposing team to get back in their defensive positions in times, making the movement up front even more difficult with a parked bus behind them.

He needs to release the ball faster. In order to break down teams we need to catch them before they're already organized at the back, not being extremely slow on the build up like we have always been.

Move the ball fast and press fast.

 

[Jeppers7]

Tbf, I think dwelling much on the ball can also help the opposing team to get back in their defensive positions in times, making the movement up front even difficult with a parked bus behind them.

He needs to release the ball faster. In order to break down teams we need to catch them before they're already organized at the back, not being extremely slow on the build up like we have always been.

Move the ball fast and press fast.

Requires movement. When he has movement he plays it. He has the vision and ability. Something television doesn't pick up is the lack of movement.

 

[el3mel]

Requires movement. When he has movement he plays it. He has the vision and ability. Something television doesn't pick up is the lack of movement.

There's definitely severe lack of movement. I'm just saying if we're releasing the ball quicker and have a faster build up, we can catch the opposition before they get organized. We're a very slow team, and him dwelling on the ball much doesn't help too imo. We need to move the ball faster.

 

[hn4manunited]

From my perspective, our team struggles when Paul tries to influence the game too much. He takes too many touches and take too long to initiate his plays. He's too slow to get going. He can talk about attack attack attack all he wants but he needs to get the ball out of his feet quicker to get the offensive progression going. What's the use of spraying balls all over the field when it doesn't take much for the defenses of the other teams to adjust. The great midfielders work for their team mates, and makes others around them better. I would personally prefer a midfielder who doesn't have any flash or special moves, high work rate, and brings others into the game.

Moments of brilliance is really just that. He has moments and those moments are not consistently there enough to make the entire team better.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

The catch 22 is that he takes those risks in our team since the creativity in the team is solely his responsibility, which other midfielders in the league or on the list have such repressibility? Creative players lose the ball more often than safe CMs who wont get 10+ assists in a season. Couple that with the lack of movement in the side as a whole

I think he does need to improve but the stat needs to be looked at in context

EDIT: For instance last season KDB ranked 6th in the league for being disposed and Pogba was 27th.

With KDB in 1st for assists and Pogba 6th overall

https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/players/dispossessed

https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/players/goal_assist

It in itself as a stat doesn't tell the whole story, KDB also ranks highly because he is a highly creative player vs a Fernandinho who is more safe with the ball in the side.

He certianly needs to improve his tackling stats KDB ranked 22nd last season and Pogba 76th

Stats aside. From watching Pogba, he’s not losing the ball with fecking up risky passes (which Sanchez does umpteen times each match) and is the reason I presume KdB has similar stats. Pogba tends to lose the ball by trying to beat one too many people or taking one too many touches. Happens all the time. Our last goal conceded starting off with a classic example.

We can cope with creative players losing the ball by taking risks in the final third. What fecks us over is creative players repeatedly having their pocket picked deep in our own half. All the more so when said creative player is statistically awful at regaining possession once he’s lost it.

 

[Cassidy]

Stats aside. From watching Pogba, he’s not losing the ball with fecking up risky passes (which Sanchez does umpteen times each match) and is the reason I presume KdB has similar stats. Pogba tends to lose the ball by trying to beat one too many people or taking one too many touches. Happens all the time. Our last goal conceded starting off with a classic example.

We can cope with creative players losing the ball by taking risks in the final third. What fecks us over is creative players repeatedly having their pocket picked deep in our own half. All the more so when said creative player is statistically awful at regaining possession once he’s lost it.

My point was even though I agree he needs to improve, he does it at times because he wants to wait for / buy time for a pass. If you look at many times when we break or his picks a great pass it at times comes after he dwells a bit or dribbles and open up the space by beating one or 2 players.

Also we don't really have many creative players in the final third, thats half the problem

 

[Rozay]

Which makes the Alexis situation all the more frustrating.

Yep, they were meant to go halves on the attacking stuff. Yet people now want Pogba to be the main creative source, while ‘keeping it simple’ at the same time.

 

[Jeppers7]

There's definitely severe lack of movement. I'm just saying if we're releasing the ball quicker and have a faster build up, we can catch the opposition before they get organized. We're a very slow team, and him dwelling on the ball much doesn't help too imo. We need to move the ball faster.

If the move,met is better he will, and he does.

Whether it's tactics keeping shape, I don't know but our movement is awful

 

[el3mel]

If the move,met is better he will, and he does.

Whether it's tactics keeping shape, I don't know but our movement is awful

Don't disagree. We're a very static and slow team.

 

[Isotope]

He should be like Lingard; releasing the ball as soon as he got it, and keep it simple. No need to heads up, and see if there's a better channel available, or allowing your teammates the time to get to better position before releasing the ball.

super sarcasm alert.

 

[Andycoleno9]

He is half of our team. If he lose him, then we are in proper shit

 

[hn4manunited]

He is half of our team. If he lose him, then we are in proper shit

But we could potentially be better without him if he's only half hearted in his approach.

 

[Eugenius]

He is half of our team. If he lose him, then we are in proper shit

Basically. As frustrating as he is, he is the only player that actually moves us up the pitch (maybe Shaw). We would be utterly dog crap without him.

 

[RooneyLegend]

I still maintain he's trying to hard to be something he's not. Trying to be a Zidane or a Morrison when he's nothing like that. We need him to try to dominate games with his passing ala Kroos. I still maintain the most impressive performance by him remains his first one vs Southampton.

 

[Jib]

I still maintain he's trying to hard to be something he's not. Trying to be a Zidane or a Morrison when he's nothing like that. We need him to try to dominate games with his passing ala Kroos. I still maintain the most impressive performance by him remains his first one vs Southampton.

I strongly disagree.

He's looking more for the killer pass rather than the short pass that builds the game.

He plays more with his instinct than his brain. For me, he looks more like Zidane, Ronaldinho than Xavi, Kroos ...

That's why his best season was his last with Juventus when he played as LM/AM. He's a player with a lot of flair. He isn't a CM.

 

[El-Manos]

Time for other players to step up too. Getting sick of this half arsed effort by some of our players.

 

[RooneyLegend]

I strongly disagree.

He's looking more for the killer pass rather than the short pass that builds the game.

He plays more with his instinct than his brain. For me, he looks more like Zidane, Ronaldinho than Xavi, Kroos ...

That's why his best season was his last with Juventus when he played as LM/AM. He's a player with a lot of flair. He isn't a CM.

His game was much simpler at Jive, he certainly wouldn't dribble into blind alleys and trying to hold the ball, killing the pace of a move on the counter. He played that position in basically all his years at Juve but was a simpler player than now. Mind you at Juve he was played in pretty much all midfield positions from time to time and looked good in all of them. I've even seen Allegri use him in a Pirlo role. He's always had the flair but he wouldn't try to impose it on a match the way he does now.

 

[lawliet354]

Stats aside. From watching Pogba, he’s not losing the ball with fecking up risky passes (which Sanchez does umpteen times each match) and is the reason I presume KdB has similar stats. Pogba tends to lose the ball by trying to beat one too many people or taking one too many touches. Happens all the time. Our last goal conceded starting off with a classic example.

We can cope with creative players losing the ball by taking risks in the final third. What fecks us over is creative players repeatedly having their pocket picked deep in our own half. All the more so when said creative player is statistically awful at regaining possession once he’s lost it.

Doesn't that correlate to our lack of movement as well? A lot of time he tries to beat the man simply because there simply is no other option to pass the ball so he need to beat the man first. I may be wrong about this but with France he simply release the ball quicker, especially with Mbappe and Griezman in the team. Those two have such a good movement off the ball that it's easier for Pogba to not over-complicating things. While with us 3-4 players will just move to the middle and overcrowding the middle of the pitch.

 

[Canagel]

His game was much simpler at Jive, he certainly wouldn't dribble into blind alleys and trying to hold the ball, killing the pace of a move on the counter. He played that position in basically all his years at Juve but was a simpler player than now. Mind you at Juve he was played in pretty much all midfield positions from time to time and looked good in all of them. I've even seen Allegri use him in a Pirlo role. He's always had the flair but he wouldn't try to impose it on a match the way he does now.

Simpler? Are you sure? Judging from that video his game was anything but simple. A lot of flicks and tricks. His position was very different though. I've always thought he was better on the left wing where he can afford to play with that extra flair and at the the same time team doesn't lose anything. Right now his position which is deeper in CM doesn't allow him to make any kind of mistakes otherwise we risk conceding like we did at the weekend. Add that to our poor movement upfront and it's even worse. He can make it work still but only if there is movement ahead of himl like we saw at the world cup. Our movement for the best part of 2 years has been shocking.

 

[Jeppers7]

But we could potentially be better without him if he's only half hearted in his approach.

Didn't look half hearted Saturday and hasn't all season. So not sure why you'd say that ?

 

[11101]

Requires movement. When he has movement he plays it. He has the vision and ability. Something television doesn't pick up is the lack of movement.

Came in here to post something similar.

The below video came up on my youtube feed. Interesting as it shows a compilation of his best long range passes over this season. By my count he played 8 forward passes to France's strikers compared to only 4 with United. He plays the passes when they are on but our forwards, Lukaku in particular, just do not make runs.

You can see how France attack in numbers and move across the pitch. Our forwards runs are isolated and straight.

 

[DWelbz19]

In a class of his own. Him and De Gea doing almost all the heavy lifting at the moment.

Without a shadow of a doubt.

Even in terms of goal contributions he’s actually the highest - 4 goals and 2 assists in 7 games.

 

[RooneyLegend]

Simpler? Are you sure? Judging from that video his game was anything but simple. A lot of flicks and tricks. His position was very different though. I've always thought he was better on the left wing where he can afford to play with that extra flair and at the the same time team doesn't lose anything. Right now his position which is deeper in CM doesn't allow him to make any kind of mistakes otherwise we risk conceding like we did at the weekend. Add that to our poor movement upfront and it's even worse. He can make it work still but only if there is movement ahead of himl like we saw at the world cup. Our movement for the best part of 2 years has been shocking.

He's always had the tricks but you'd never see him completely stop the momentum of the game by standing on the ball. The only time you'd see him do that would be in a 1 v 1 situation high up the pitch when he's be trying to generate space for a shot. Nowadays he seems to do it at all times. Maybe it is because of the lack of options as we all know this teams has no idea of which spaces to be in.

 

[izec]

Enjoy him while you can lads, i dont think he will be here for much longer. He is a great player and we are heavily reliant on him, shame with his attitude though.