Owen Hargreaves | 2009/10 Performances

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I am beginning to think the three weeks will be:

March 3rd-10th
August 22nd-29th
and November 11th-18th (2012)
 
Imagine your Hargreaves for a minute. Think how terrifying this stage of your recovery is. Everything seems to be working alright, and now it is just about time to hit the accelerator and make sure everything actually IS working alright.

It is sort of a go no-go for his career isn't it? If he lets out the throttle and his knees hurt he's basically done. He seems to be a guy who is playing football because he actually loves it, the prospect of his career being essentially over in what should be his prime has got to be a terrifying prospect.
 
TheReligion said:
When is he fecking back?
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We need a betting thread on this.

I reckon February. That's the latest he can come back to have any chance if going to the WC. Even that may be too late though.
 
Probably February or March 2010.

The cynic in me thinks the longer he stays out and avoids 'contact training on account of his confdience' the more people will talk about the end of his career as a footballer. I personally worry if we are getting back the same player we remember, and how long it will take him to reach the levels most of us expect him to play at.

People have this idea of how good Hargreaves was for united and England. They forget that he wasn't always that good, and that there's a good chance he will need a hell of a long time to even reach that level.

Worrying times ahead.
 
adexkola said:
A feat we have never been able to accomplish with a 2 player midfield ever since. Not Fletcher, not Carrick.
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Its a bit of a myth that they were 'outstanding' against Liverpool though. In that game we had just 39% possesion and 5 shots, compared to Liverpool's 20.
 
Sam#1 said:
Its a bit of a myth that they were 'outstanding' against Liverpool though. In that game we had just 39% possesion and 5 shots, compared to Liverpool's 20.
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A bit of a myth?

It's garbage. Our back four were the ones who were outstanding that day (possibly Rio's best game in a United shirt). Our midfield did their bit defensively but were completely unable to retain possession and offered nothing going forwards whatsoever. Something those stats illustrate as clear as day.

It's a myth that just won't go away though, for some reason. The power of wishful thinking?
 
This is our dear Obertan visiting a sick child and Hargreaves at the hospital, look on the smile at Owens face, I think he really appreciated a visit from the Obertan.

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Easy life for him...gets paid his wages for doing feck all but beeing in the physio
 
Pogue Mahone said:
A bit of a myth?

It's garbage. Our back four were the ones who were outstanding that day (possibly Rio's best game in a United shirt). Our midfield did their bit defensively but were completely unable to retain possession and offered nothing going forwards whatsoever. Something those stats illustrate as clear as day.

It's a myth that just won't go away though, for some reason. The power of wishful thinking?
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We played on the defensive for much of that game, Anderson and Hargreaves were very good at what they were asked to do - ie. tackle people. They didn't need to offer much going forward because we were defending a lead. Liverpool had 20 shots in that game but most of them were pot-shots because our midfield stopped them creating any chances in the penalty area. Maybe it's a distorted evaluation, good defensive work is easier to pick out than good passing and movement, but they certainly played well as far as I'm concerned.
 
kietotheworld said:
We played on the defensive for much of that game, Anderson and Hargreaves were very good at what they were asked to do - ie. tackle people. They didn't need to offer much going forward because we were defending a lead. Liverpool had 20 shots in that game but most of them were pot-shots because our midfield stopped them creating any chances in the penalty area. Maybe it's a distorted evaluation, good defensive work is easier to pick out than good passing and movement, but they certainly played well as far as I'm concerned.
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The best way to defend a lead is to hold onto the ball.

Retreating to the edge of our own box, allowing Liverpool over 60% of the possession and relying on Rio and Vidic to head clear cross after cross after cross is not what you expect from an "outstanding" midfield performance.

Both Anderson and Hargreaves did what they usually do well. They kept busy and ran round the pitch, harrying the opposition. This is something that Phil Neville did and Lucas also do very well but nobody would ever want them as our first-choice midfield pairing.

We need a midfield who can do much more than just harry. We need people who know how to pass the ball around and retain possession. I haven't seen any evidence of Hargreaves and Anderson being able to do this as a midfield two. feck it, I haven't seen any evidence of either of them being able to do this with anyone in a midfield pair.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
A bit of a myth?

It's garbage. Our back four were the ones who were outstanding that day (possibly Rio's best game in a United shirt). Our midfield did their bit defensively but were completely unable to retain possession and offered nothing going forwards whatsoever. Something those stats illustrate as clear as day.

It's a myth that just won't go away though, for some reason. The power of wishful thinking?
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You are embellishing Pogue. Our midfield were excellent that day. It was not set up to dominate. It was set up to restrain Gerrard, restrict Liverpool's movement, and rely on Rooney, Ronaldo or Tevez to get the needed goal to win. It worked. Would you describe our performance at the Nou Camp that season as poor?

Sometimes it's best to understand your limitations and work well within them. Hargreaves and Anderson did this well at Anfield and Emirates. It is not surprising all our games at these arenas have ended up in a loss since then.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
The best way to defend a lead is to hold onto the ball.

Retreating to the edge of our own box, allowing Liverpool over 60% of the possession and relying on Rio and Vidic to head clear cross after cross after cross is not what you expect from an "outstanding" midfield performance.

Both Anderson and Hargreaves did what they usually do well. They kept busy and ran round the pitch, harrying the opposition. This is something that Phil Neville did and Lucas also do very well but nobody would ever want them as our first-choice midfield pairing.

We need a midfield who can do much more than just harry. We need people who know how to pass the ball around and retain possession. I haven't seen any evidence of Hargreaves and Anderson being able to do this as a midfield two. feck it, I haven't seen any evidence of either of them being able to do this with anyone in a midfield pair.
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Like I said earlier, that tactic won us the Premier League and the Champions League against Barcelona. Right now, we don't have the personnel to boss games against the best midfields. We do have the personnel to shut up shop. As we had Ronaldo back then who could thrive on half chances, it wasn't much of a problem.

And against Arsenal that season, they did much more than harry. I would say only the Liverpool win showed that type of play. Obviously we would not try it against smaller teams.
 
adexkola said:
You are embellishing Pogue. Our midfield were excellent that day. It was not set up to dominate. It was set up to restrain Gerrard, restrict Liverpool's movement, and rely on Rooney, Ronaldo or Tevez to get the needed goal to win. It worked. Would you describe our performance at the Nou Camp that season as poor?

Sometimes it's best to understand your limitations and work well within them. Hargreaves and Anderson did this well at Anfield and Emirates. It is not surprising all our games at these arenas have ended up in a loss since then.
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Yes. It was anti-football.

It did the trick but I would hope we only ever employ those sort of tactics in games played over two legs, never in a league game.
 
kietotheworld said:
We played on the defensive for much of that game, Anderson and Hargreaves were very good at what they were asked to do - ie. tackle people. They didn't need to offer much going forward because we were defending a lead. Liverpool had 20 shots in that game but most of them were pot-shots because our midfield stopped them creating any chances in the penalty area. Maybe it's a distorted evaluation, good defensive work is easier to pick out than good passing and movement, but they certainly played well as far as I'm concerned.
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Spot on.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Yes. It was anti-football.

It did the trick but I would hope we only ever employ those sort of tactics in games played over two legs, never in a league game.
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I wouldn't expect Manchester United to shut up shop against Aston Villa or Wigan. Against the top 4 sides and against European opposition, the days of gung ho 4-4-2 football are over.
 
adexkola said:
I wouldn't expect Manchester United to shut up shop against Aston Villa or Wigan. Against the top 4 sides and against European opposition, the days of gung ho 4-4-2 football are over.
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Let me finish that for you:

are over when you don't have the right team.

Barca playing attacking until the final whistle because they have the team to do it. We used to, two years ago.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
A bit of a myth?

It's garbage. Our back four were the ones who were outstanding that day (possibly Rio's best game in a United shirt). Our midfield did their bit defensively but were completely unable to retain possession and offered nothing going forwards whatsoever. Something those stats illustrate as clear as day.

It's a myth that just won't go away though, for some reason. The power of wishful thinking?
Click to expand...

Pogue Mahone said:
The best way to defend a lead is to hold onto the ball.

Retreating to the edge of our own box, allowing Liverpool over 60% of the possession and relying on Rio and Vidic to head clear cross after cross after cross is not what you expect from an "outstanding" midfield performance.

Both Anderson and Hargreaves did what they usually do well. They kept busy and ran round the pitch, harrying the opposition. This is something that Phil Neville did and Lucas also do very well but nobody would ever want them as our first-choice midfield pairing.

We need a midfield who can do much more than just harry. We need people who know how to pass the ball around and retain possession. I haven't seen any evidence of Hargreaves and Anderson being able to do this as a midfield two. feck it, I haven't seen any evidence of either of them being able to do this with anyone in a midfield pair.
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Two excellent posts.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
...........

Both Anderson and Hargreaves did what they usually do well. They kept busy and ran round the pitch, harrying the opposition. This is something that Phil Neville did and Lucas also do very well but nobody would ever want them as our first-choice midfield pairing.
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What of the Arsenal game that we drew 2-2. away Did they just give the opposition the ball all day long?

Pogue Mahone said:
We need people who know how to pass the ball around and retain possession. I haven't seen any evidence of Hargreaves and Anderson being able to do this as a midfield two. feck it, I haven't seen any evidence of either of them being able to do this with anyone in a midfield pair.
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You make it sound like whenever they have played in a midfield two with whoever we have surrender all possesion the the opponents. Which is very untrue.
 
Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber said:
What of the Arsenal game that we drew 2-2. away Did they just give the opposition the ball all day long?
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Who cares Chief.

It doesnt take much sense to see that Hargreaves and Anderson simply aren't that good passing players. They are both harriers. I think it is an awful combination if they to be played in any game, especially at home.

Its worrying that Fergie splashed out nearly £40M on the two.
 
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