Out of control dogs/dog attacks

Fortitude said:
You cited the Alsatian, but what about Rottweiler’s, whom can be categorised in the same class (alongside Doberman’s, etc.)?

Your bolded:

I don’t wish to sound like some mad advocate for the breed as I’m not one, but the point still stands about them and it’ll always be a given that attacks by them are highly likely to be life-altering or fatal.

I was curious so quickly googled and most normal sites aren’t dissimilar in their lists to this.

Do you know why that is (in my opinion, why)? It’s because the proliferation of truly lethal dogs in homes is low as Cane Corso’s, Dogo Argetinos, Tibetan Mastiffs, Fila Brasileiro’s, Tosa’s, Presa Canario’s (just list a bunch of mastiffs to go alongside the larger terriers) and so on are rare, expensive and not easy to source. These are truly lethal, like pit bulls and Rottweiler’s but there are so few of them in normal homes that their data point is negligible. The biggest mistake was having a powder keg breed bred, bastardised and farmed all over the world; you’ve an outlier breed - one that should be classified with the aforementioned - in homes as one of the most popular breeds… what could possibly go wrong with that?

Crux of my argument is if the same was done with any of the above, they’d be the infamous demon dog because all of these breeds are way beyond the remit of normal people, let alone the incompetents most likely to own them (in the case of the Pit and XL).

If you were to liken it to guns, it’d be the equivalent of asking why any citizen needs full or semi-automatic weapons and yet they’re the weapons of choice on so many murder sprees.

The data will always be skewed. Does that matter? I don’t know… why? Because the issue of lethality cannot be ignored and these episodes will continue to happen even if attacks are relatively low compared to other breeds.

As I said before, I know of a few homes with the demon breed in them with zero incident, but it doesn’t betray the likelihood it only takes one go in any of those homes for another horror statistic.

Banning the breed sounds like a fantastic catch-all statement, like cheering when the figurehead of an evil organisation is felled, not realising the institution has other branches and a new evil to readily take its place. Ban these breeds; unscrupulous, clever breeders will concoct something new and equally threatening that has no legislation but isn’t a Pit or XL. And further to that, the huge hole in the market would open the doors to a massive race to fill said hole. It would be a bigger boom economy than the one for these breeds. Unless a proper plan is put in place that has no loopholes or exploitation points, this dangerous breed problem will just be a case of kicking the can down the road.

Another way to put the above paragraph is likening it to banning an extremely popular drug. The moment that happens the race is on to gobble up the newly open market space and it’s a free for all with regulations lagging way behind. Illegal drug, the same; remove anything dominant in the market and it becomes a race to fill the void.

As an aside, all those lethal breeds are the same size or even bigger than XL’s. Most humans haven’t a prayer against any of them.
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To the bolded, plenty of media outlets running with this: https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/new-powerful-dog-breed-could-31798953

So predictable, and any dog breeder who was dealing in pits and XL's will now be flooding the market with Cane Corso's.

I'll give it about 18 months before we start hearing about horrific attacks by this breed around the UK.
 
HTG said:
The thing about these dog breeds is, that I have never met a person owning or wanting a dog like this of whom I thought they could responsibly handle them. And I simply don't see the appeal for a reasonable person to own these breeds. Why does your dog have to be huge and potentially dangerous? Why is a typical, "normal" dog not good enough? They display all the positive characteristics of other dogs, but without the immense potential dangers. So the potential danger is usually the point. Most people having these dogs, have them for precisely this reason.
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We met a bloke of the beach the other day with a largish young muscle dog of some sort. It probably weighed almost as much as him (as he was built like a glass of water) and when it wanted to play with other dogs he could only stop it by grabbing it and sitting down. Luckily it seemed very friendly but there is zero chance he could control it if it got into a dog fight. And even the nicest dogs do sometimes get into disputes with other dogs. But with most pet dogs it is just the equivalent of kids pushing and shoving with the crowd yelling "fight", but with many of the breeds of concern this is not the case. Once things start dogs (and in some cases people) get badly hurt and/or die.

Identifying breeds is obviously not 100% straightforward but looking at this list it also isn't irrelevant.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_Kingdom

One of the outliers is stunning. A 3 month old was killed by a husky her parents were exercising in a public off-leash area - one of 19. 19 off-leash huskies and a very small child. Who could have seen that coming? Kinell.
 
Wibble said:
We met a bloke of the beach the other day with a largish young muscle dog of some sort. It probably weighed almost as much as him (as he was built like a glass of water) and when it wanted to play with other dogs he could only stop it by grabbing it and sitting down. Luckily it seemed very friendly but there is zero chance he could control it if it got into a dog fight. And even the nicest dogs do sometimes get into disputes with other dogs. But with most pet dogs it is just the equivalent of kids pushing and shoving with the crowd yelling "fight", but with many of the breeds of concern this is not the case. Once things start dogs (and in some cases people) get badly hurt and/or die.

Identifying breeds is obviously not 100% straightforward but looking at this list it also isn't irrelevant.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_Kingdom

One of the outliers is stunning. A 3 month old was killed by a husky her parents were exercising in a public off-leash area - one of 19. 19 off-leash huskies and a very small child. Who could have seen that coming? Kinell.
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Wow, there's just so much wrong with your last paragraph, what a toxic mix of idiocy, ignorance, & immaturity those people displayed
 
Wibble said:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_Kingdom
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Helston, Cornwall, England – It was determined that the victim had had an epileptic seizure and her dog had attempted to pick her up by the scruff of the neck as a mother dog would lift a puppy. There was no evidence of a 'savaging' of the victim, and victim's 22-month-old daughter was in the same room unharmed. The dog, 13-month-old Frentzen, which had previously acted confused when victim was having a seizure, was euthanized.
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:(
 
As an aside, it's cases like this which are the basis for the "all dogs kill" argument that's been used in this thread a few times (I think by @langster ?)

England – Mr McCall was playing tug of war with his 16 months old female springer spaniel when she accidentally bit the back of his hand. Mr McCall became unwell the following day, and sought treatment at the out of hours service where he got antibiotics prescribed. Upon returning home Mr McCall’s symptoms worsened and he was admitted to the Royal Hampshire County Hospital on November 15, where he died three days later.
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Technically, that's one fatality awarded to the Springer Spaniel breed. Compare and contrast with the fatalities from breeds like pitbulls and rotweillers detailed on the same wiki page.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
As an aside, it's cases like this which are the basis for the "all dogs kill" argument that's been used in this thread a few times (I think by @langster ?)



Technically, that's one fatality awarded to the Springer Spaniel breed. Compare and contrast with the fatalities from breeds like pitbulls and rotweillers detailed on the same wiki page.
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Utter bullshit even including such an event. Spaniels and setters are as dangerous as rabbits.
 
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I'm at a large dog show event today, no issues and you have about seventy different breed types here.

I'm a dog person, involved in dog community stuff and I support the ban.
 
Some drill rapper who was also a dog breeder owned the XL bullies which killed that poor woman in Jaywick. There was also a litter of puppies. The owner must have known the new law was coming into place, and still bred these monstrous animals. Now there's 6 more puppies which will presumably also be destroyed.

Rest in peace Esther Martin, it was a horrible and avoidable tragedy.
 
The comments on twitter are nauseating.So much defending of these shit beasts and absolutely no sympathy for the poor woman who was savaged
 
MiceOnMeth said:
The comments on twitter are nauseating.So much defending of these shit beasts and absolutely no sympathy for the poor woman who was savaged
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She shouldn't have wondered into their territory. When venturing into the wilderness you have to accept the risk that wild animimals might atttack you. Where did this happen again?

Edit - being unfair to dangerous wild animals here. They generally avoid confrontation with humans. These geniticaly engineered monsters have had that disposition bred out of them.
 
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Seeing as it's now an offence to breed these animals (they're all supposed to have been neutered or spayed by now) or sell them, I hope people who ignore the law will get an appropriately heavy prison sentence when someone is maimed or killed by their dog. I won't hold my breath, though.
 
Weird that you don't have a licensing requirement in the UK. Local councils look after it here and there are usually annual renewal or lifetime registration options. Microchipping is compulsory and registration is usually much cheaper if you dog is desexed. Rangers will give you a ticket of you don't register a dog although enforcement varies. If however your dog does attack then you will cop a far bigger fine/sentence of your dog is also unregistered and your dog will have far greater chance of being put down. Dogs that are deemed dangerous can have special conditions placed on them including annual expensive licensing, approved/inspected fencing/enclosures enforced, muzzling in public and any further incidents will be costly (or involve prison if really serious) and your dog risks being put down.

And attacks still happen of course. We have banned a number of breeds, American Pit Bull Terrier, Japanese Tosa, Dogo Argentino, Fila Brasileiro, and Perro de Presa Canario, and I assume there are more to follow. I have no idea how they enforce it with cross breed complexities and other issues.
 


Music video featuring the dog owner and probably the dogs that mauled Esther Martin.
 
Damn those beats are as cold as his dogs are now.
 


Mentioned this in the thread before about people I know sitting on the same potential powder keg in their home.

In this instance, it sounds like the dogs were triggered by the partial stranger handling their pups... probably acting in protection. Obviously protection with two of those at you - especially as a defenseless granny - is likely to be fatal.

I think the guy is being truthful, except the bit he omits where he is breeding the puppies for a fortune. There's no way he'd leave his son in a scenario where he believed he could lose he life, no matter what he thought of the granny (unless he's a psychopath), so it's yet another cautionary tale that I don't think moves the dial for many who own these as pets.
 
Fortitude said:


Mentioned this in the thread before about people I know sitting on the same potential powder keg in their home.

In this instance, it sounds like the dogs were triggered by the partial stranger handling their pups... probably acting in protection. Obviously protection with two of those at you - especially as a defenseless granny - is likely to be fatal.

I think the guy is being truthful, except the bit he omits where he is breeding the puppies for a fortune. There's no way he'd leave his son in a scenario where he believed he could lose he life, no matter what he thought of the granny (unless he's a psychopath), so it's yet another cautionary tale that I don't think moves the dial for many who own these as pets.
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That’s a tough watch. Impossible not to feel for him.
 
A friend of mine has one of these dogs, she's continually asking me to come over with my 2 year old to see her and her kids. Feck that!
 
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