Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

[Adam-Utd]

Even if Solskjaer wasn't doing a brilliant job, there isn't exactly a guaranteed world class manager out there to take over straight over.

We need to be patient and allow him to mould the team into how he wants, and get a team that fits that image.

He's aiming to play the right way for modern football, so that's all I care about. Results will come.

 

[Wumminator]

Eighth actually. But Klopp is a poor comparision given he reached Europa League and Capital One Cup final in his first season without making any new signings. Plus, changes in his style was pretty evident.

Under Ole, its same old sleep inducing football as we played under Jose.

What!

Have you watched our footy this year?

 

[Treble]

For me all Ole has to do is get the team playing consistently entertaining and attacking football that gets the fans out of their seats week in, week out - if he does that he will find the results take care of themselves after a while. Remember Klopp's first season at Liverpool ended with him finishing sixth or something like that? I think all the fans want to see is some tangible progression on the pitch.

Not sure about that. Balance is needed between defence and attack for results to take care of themselves and nice to watch attacking football does not automatically provide balance between attack and defence. Look at Arsenal.

 

[wolvored]

The top players won't stay with us during that time though. Can you see Pogba staying here to fight for 4th place? No top player will come as well without CL football making that rebuild really, really impossible.



Perreira is not a striker. Who is our striker option apart from Martial when he gets injured? What if Pogba gets injured?

Then you make new signings in the window just passed. You had all Summer to come up with three signings selling more senior players in the process. It doesn't cost a lot of money to identify and bring up a backup option.

Pogba might not, but we may get Maddison, Fernandes etc. Players who look to Utd as still a step up and want to play, improving us rather than just come for a big payday and bring nothing. Fergie rarely bought the top foreign players. He chose players who wanted to come to play for the shirt. Players who had the opportunity to improve themselves, the team and become top players.

 

[redmanc]

He's done the right thing getting energy back in our game, it's also pleasing to see players being told they are not in his plans. Next steps are to start working Lingard back into a sub role rather than a starter, and also i would like to see our subs being made a lot earlier. I get the feeling he's learning on the job a little but not many other suitable options out there so he's certainly going to get time yet. I think he'll get longer than some think once or if we appoint either a dof or comity.

 

[Withnail]

Its not about appeasing disgruntled fans but simply to force the board to do their job rather then expect the manager to take the blame of their feck ups.

We'll have to agree to disagree here. The board will not act because he goes crying to the press and will always hide behind the manager. That's the nature of football. I really don't think you are being realistic.

 

[Sarni]

Pretty much, you only have to look back through his posts to see what a hypocrite he is slagging off the squad one minute and then mocking others for wanting another signing the next. As for this positive spin on LvG it's just laughable.

It's not the managers job to get rid of dross when the board approve a signing they do so with consideration of offloading if needed. When a player fails you move them on, if you don't then you get an inflated wage bill as we have now.

Under LvG the board did a good job of moving on the likes of Di Maria, Depay, Schneiderlin but they've failed in that regard lately. That's not something you can praise LvG for or criticise Jose with.

I'm all for positivity but this isn't positivity it's someone wanting to push their agenda as usual.

I don't know how he can say van Gaal made us better and won us FA Cup, but not acknowledge that Mourinho got us into our highest points total since Fergie left, highest league finish and won us two cups in the meantime including European competition that we hadn't won before. If Moyes delivered the same results he would have praised him and would have wanted him to stay for 20 years.

 

[Kush]

Well in similar logic, why are you counting Herrera? He already had his mind set on leaving by the time Ole arrived and Mourinho hadn't done enough to keep him. That was on Mou and Ed. Pogba is an improvement yes, but the rest of our midfield isn't. Fred and a finished Matic haven't exactly shown they're better than prime Herrera/Schneiderlin.

I'm counting Herrera because he was a key player for us, if Ole was desperate enough for him he'd have told the board to sign him up like Jose did with Fellaini. Also, Herreras' mind was made up because we were too slow to offer him a new deal, he'd seen likes of Lingard, Rashford, Martial all being offered a lucrative deal without putting in same work as he did. The only 'prime' we ever saw of Schneiderlin was at Southampton, he was hot garbage for us. Even worse than Schweinsteiger, and that is saying something.

I have no idea where the bolded part comes from, I certainly wasn't of the opinion that our squad was anywhere near City-level even though I do think Pep would get more out of any squad than Jose would. I do agree that the squad we have now isn't as shite as some make it out to be but I do think our squad is significantly worse than that of City and Liverpool, and also not as good as Spurs and Arsenal. Not sure about Chelsea.

It was a pretty popular opinion, 19 points gap soured plenty on here who thought 2nd placed finish was nothing to be happy about as this team was capable of much more if allowed to express. Martial/Rashford were continuously compared with Sane/Sterling, who went on a different trajectory under Pep. Coming to the squad, ours was never on the level of City. Liverpool surpassed us in last 18 months. Spurs/Arsenal went only ahead because of our shocking squad management this summer. You don't weed out the deadwood and not replace them, that's not how a rebuild process works.

 

[fps]

Yet, we have people saying Jose left behind a worse squad of players.

Yes, well, it was a very, very poor squad. The only reason I'd suggest it was less depressing is the level of potential within it, the potential being Rashford and Martial.

 

[GM K]

Now first of all yes, this thread title is overly emotive, but I think some balance is needed here to address how well Ole is doing after inheriting the absolute shitshow that is Manchester United.

When Jose Mourinho arrived at Manchester United, most of the fanbase was over the moon. Seen as a 'serial winner' despite having Chelsea hovering near the relegation zone in his last stint as a manager, Jose was seen as a 'guarantee' of success after the tenure of LVG and Moyes. Almost 90% of this forum said they were happy with his hiring. He arrived at the club who had just finished fifth in the league and won the FA Cup. Fans weren't happy with LVG's style of play and his downturn in results.

At the time Mourinho was given unprecedented funds that he would spend turning Manchester United into a worse team. Far from not being backed, Mourinho would take United to the highest wage bill in world football and spend hundreds of millions.

In his first tranfer window, United fans celebrated having the best transfer widow in the prem. Jose broke the world transfer record, signed Eric Bailly and Mikhytaryan. The next year he would take his net spend to 250 million. In his first two years at the club Mourinho spent 325 million pounds. Of those players, only two have played any minutes in the Premier League this season. The next year he spent another 75 million. If a manager spends 400 million and only has Lindelof and Pogba to show for it, the next manager is not going to turn it around overnight.

During this time, Mourinho also increased our wage massively. Fans may complain about the fact that Darmian and Rojo are taking up wages, however Mourinho's own desire to 'complete our attack' with Sanchez remains one of the worst bits of business ever done in the Premier League. From 2015 to 2018 (not just Mourinho's tenure, but the vast majority of this money would be Mourinho's) our wagebill increased by 93 million (or 46%). Mourinho almost doubled our wage bill and left the club further away from the title/top four and in a lower position than where he took over.

Enter Solskjaer. United fans are currently complaining that Ole Gunnar has not been backed, despite spending over 150 million pounds since his arrival at the club. Many United fans feel this way because our squad on paper in thin in so many areas. However, if the club is going to get back to the top, it is a necessary part of the rebuilding process. United have drastically lowered their wage bill, with the departures of Fellaini, Valencia, Lukaku, Sanchez and Herrera. This had to happen, we can not continue spending so much money on players who are not good enough.

If Mourinho hadn't have messed up so badly, we wouldn't be in this position. However, the signs are positive. Maguire, AWB and Daniel James have started their careers well. We are signing players for the long term in Hannibal Mejbri. Our Under 23s have been completely redesigned and are currently bossing the league. Recent work for the Athletic has shown how meticulous Solskjaer has been in redeveloping the club. Our style of football has improved.

Ole needs time. He can not possibly rectify this club in a season. People will point to other clubs who have rebuilt in a quicker time throughout recent seasons, however no club has ever ended up with such a horrendous financial position. With the money flowing through the game nowadays, every signing has to be successful and unfortunately we have been massively far off.

Jose took us to second position post Fergie. If he had been backed FULLY, he would have probably won us the league.
Let's keep talking about how much he spent without the contexts. 1. It was an era spending in football experienced a tsunami starting with the Neymar transfer. Transfer fees generally seemed to double.
2. Our team desperately needed an overhaul. Didn't Pep change his backline twice? What was the big deal in buying again where a purchase went south?

I am fine with blaming Jose as part of the problem because he was. But I find it odd when we try to blame him solely for where the club is right now. He was not even close to being our biggest problem. How will you rate those who failed to fire him after we came second yet failed to back him the very next season?

 

[Leftback99]

In fairness I've only read the title and not the OP but of all our managers post SAF it's LVG that did the most damage to the club not Mourinho

Very true.

 

[roonster09]

I'm counting Herrera because he was a key player for us, if Ole was desperate enough for him he'd have told the board to sign him up like Jose did with Fellaini. Also, Herreras' mind was made up because we were too slow to offer him a new deal, he'd seen likes of Lingard, Rashford, Martial all being offered a lucrative deal without putting in same work as he did. The only 'prime' we ever saw of Schneiderlin was at Southampton, he was hot garbage for us. Even worse than Schweinsteiger, and that is saying something.

“I was very happy, I have a lot to thank the club for, the fans and also Solskjaer. He did a lot for me to stay, but things didn’t happen. They arrived late and, by then, I’d already made the decision to play in Paris.

There isn't much Ole could have done, Herrera made his decision because of how club approached his renewal. Its not on Ole.

 

[Enigma_87]

I don't know how he can say van Gaal made us better and won us FA Cup, but not acknowledge that Mourinho got us into our highest points total since Fergie left, highest league finish and won us two cups in the meantime including European competition that we hadn't won before. If Moyes delivered the same results he would have praised him and would have wanted him to stay for 20 years.

Blaming Jose is easy. He's not our manager anymore and he's not exactly a likable chap.

People always like a good excuse and someone else to blame for the current shortcomings.

 

[United58]

Now first of all yes, this thread title is overly emotive, but I think some balance is needed here to address how well Ole is doing after inheriting the absolute shitshow that is Manchester United.

When Jose Mourinho arrived at Manchester United, most of the fanbase was over the moon. Seen as a 'serial winner' despite having Chelsea hovering near the relegation zone in his last stint as a manager, Jose was seen as a 'guarantee' of success after the tenure of LVG and Moyes. Almost 90% of this forum said they were happy with his hiring. He arrived at the club who had just finished fifth in the league and won the FA Cup. Fans weren't happy with LVG's style of play and his downturn in results.

At the time Mourinho was given unprecedented funds that he would spend turning Manchester United into a worse team. Far from not being backed, Mourinho would take United to the highest wage bill in world football and spend hundreds of millions.

In his first tranfer window, United fans celebrated having the best transfer widow in the prem. Jose broke the world transfer record, signed Eric Bailly and Mikhytaryan. The next year he would take his net spend to 250 million. In his first two years at the club Mourinho spent 325 million pounds. Of those players, only two have played any minutes in the Premier League this season. The next year he spent another 75 million. If a manager spends 400 million and only has Lindelof and Pogba to show for it, the next manager is not going to turn it around overnight.

During this time, Mourinho also increased our wage massively. Fans may complain about the fact that Darmian and Rojo are taking up wages, however Mourinho's own desire to 'complete our attack' with Sanchez remains one of the worst bits of business ever done in the Premier League. From 2015 to 2018 (not just Mourinho's tenure, but the vast majority of this money would be Mourinho's) our wagebill increased by 93 million (or 46%). Mourinho almost doubled our wage bill and left the club further away from the title/top four and in a lower position than where he took over.

Enter Solskjaer. United fans are currently complaining that Ole Gunnar has not been backed, despite spending over 150 million pounds since his arrival at the club. Many United fans feel this way because our squad on paper in thin in so many areas. However, if the club is going to get back to the top, it is a necessary part of the rebuilding process. United have drastically lowered their wage bill, with the departures of Fellaini, Valencia, Lukaku, Sanchez and Herrera. This had to happen, we can not continue spending so much money on players who are not good enough.

If Mourinho hadn't have messed up so badly, we wouldn't be in this position. However, the signs are positive. Maguire, AWB and Daniel James have started their careers well. We are signing players for the long term in Hannibal Mejbri. Our Under 23s have been completely redesigned and are currently bossing the league. Recent work for the Athletic has shown how meticulous Solskjaer has been in redeveloping the club. Our style of football has improved.

Ole needs time. He can not possibly rectify this club in a season. People will point to other clubs who have rebuilt in a quicker time throughout recent seasons, however no club has ever ended up with such a horrendous financial position. With the money flowing through the game nowadays, every signing has to be successful and unfortunately we have been massively far off.

I like your positivity. I really hope you're right.

'Our Under 23s have been completely redesigned and are currently bossing the league. Recent work for the Athletic has shown how meticulous Solskjaer has been in redeveloping the club. Our style of football has improved.'

This is Alex Ferguson-esque, if true. Regardless of whether Ole's a success or not, I really hope we are finally going for a long term model - the signs with the youth teams are very good.

 

[ArjenIsM3]

I'm counting Herrera because he was a key player for us, if Ole was desperate enough for him he'd have told the board to sign him up like Jose did with Fellaini. Also, Herreras' mind was made up because we were too slow to offer him a new deal, he'd seen likes of Lingard, Rashford, Martial all being offered a lucrative deal without putting in same work as he did. The only 'prime' we ever saw of Schneiderlin was at Southampton, he was hot garbage for us. Even worse than Schweinsteiger, and that is saying something.



It was a pretty popular opinion, 19 points gap soured plenty on here who thought 2nd placed finish was nothing to be happy about as this team was capable of much more if allowed to express. Martial/Rashford were continuously compared with Sane/Sterling, who went on a different trajectory under Pep. Coming to the squad, ours was never on the level of City. Liverpool surpassed us in last 18 months. Spurs/Arsenal went only ahead because of our shocking squad management this summer. You don't weed out the deadwood and not replace them, that's not how a rebuild process works.

You are proving my point. We were too slow to offer Herrera a deal under Mourinho and by the time Ole came in he was already free to speak to other clubs and as a result had extortionate wage demands. It's not Ole that wasn't desperate to keep him, it was Mourinho. Agree with the rest, though to be clear the not replacing the ones that left bit isn't on Ole but on Ed. Ole clearly stated that he wanted replacements if anyone left but didn't get any. Bit like how Mourinho was crying out for us to sign Maguire last summer but Ed refused to. Ed being in charge of recruitment is still our biggest issue. He's the factor that's slowing down our rebuild the most.

 

[roonster09]

How do new contracts for Mata, Jones, Rojo fit with a big rebuild?

I didn't want Mata to be extended, but what does extending Mata's contract has anything to do with big rebuild? Going by the reports, Ole wants to offload few players he thinks as bad influence and not offering much to the team. So how does extension of Mata change anything?

 

[Sarni]

Also I don't really but 'giving youth a chance' as an argument that much. Ole hasn't really promoted anyone bar Greenwood, who is probably not ready anyway. Other guys are yet to get a run and we shall see whether they will eventually get one under Ole. It's early days but it seems that experience will be preferred over youth. We did extend Rojo, Jones and Mata who we could have replaced with Williams, Tuanzebe and Gomes technically, even with a loss of quality in the short term that would have still indicated the desire to build our team around younger players with room to growth. This is yet to happen.

 

[roonster09]

Also I don't really but 'giving youth a chance' as an argument that much. Ole hasn't really promoted anyone bar Greenwood, who is probably not ready anyway. Guys like Gomes, Tuanzebe, Williams are yet to get a run and we shall see whether they will eventually get one under Ole. It's early days but it seems that experience will be preferred over youth.

Making McTominay as regular first team player should surely count? Yes Jose promoted him but he didn't play him regularly, whereas now he is regular player. Also Rashford used to play around 50% of the mins before, now he will be one of the first names in the team.

I think it should be more this season considering we have Europa league. Hopefully players like Gomes, Tuanzebe, Chong will get regular playing time.

 

[Ban]

I didn't want Mata to be extended, but what does extending Mata's contract has anything to do with big rebuild? Going by the reports, Ole wants to offload few players he thinks as bad influence and not offering much to the team. So how does extension of Mata change anything?

Mata should had left the club long time ago. I don't see any logic whatsoever in signing a new contract. Same with Jones.

 

[Zhagzi]

For how long should we be patient? If there were good signs it would have been another story, but what do we see now? Lingard starts every game, Mata off the bench every game, Gomes doesn’t make the squad. This has to stop, or this manager won’t last.

It doesn’t require one to be an Einstein to see that Lingard is a nothing player - still the manager stubbornly persists with starting him EVERY GAME. Is it a sign of a good manager if he rewards mediocrity and absence of required skills with a starting spot?

Kloop took over Liverpool in October after they sacked Rodgers. He took them to 8th. Second season, it was 4th, then 4th again. Then 2nd last season. So you could argue, that we should be giving Solskjaer at LEAST 2 full seasons before we actually say anything. Look at the new signings. They're all playing good football - better than most on that pitch. If Ole is the manager, that brings in 3-4 new players in the next two windows, he'll have a different position as most players would have been brought in by him, unlike him coming in as a new manager with some of our players having been through 3-4 managers throughout their United-career. It's a different mentality if he's the one brining new players in.

 

[Sarni]

Making McTominay as regular first team player should surely count? Yes Jose promoted him but he didn't play him regularly, whereas now he is regular player. Also Rashford used to play around 50% of the mins before, now he will be one of the first names in the team.

I think it should be more this season considering we have Europa league. Hopefully players like Gomes, Tuanzebe, Chong will get regular playing time.

It's largely out of necessity though as our midfield is extremely short in numbers. Jose promoted him against odds too, he did not play regularly because he was nowhere near ready (arguably he still isn't) but he was not even tipped to make a step up in the immediate future when Jose gave him his first run.

He doesn't seem hesitant to extend minutes of players who were in our first team rotation before, the reluctance is more for giving a shot to players who weren't promoted before he joined. It's a worry for me. I think the only way we are back at the top in the next five years is if we get a lot of young talent developing from within.

 

[roonster09]

Mata should had left the club long time ago. I don't see any logic whatsoever in signing a new contract. Same with Jones.

Yeah, even I don't see. But not sure how that changes anything with respect to rebuilding squad. Rebuilding doesn't mean we have to offload everyone. Ole can believe Mata is needed and still can rebuild his squad by offloading players like Lukaku, Sanchez, Fellaini and few others.

 

[Ramshock]

Now first of all yes, this thread title is overly emotive, but I think some balance is needed here to address how well Ole is doing after inheriting the absolute shitshow that is Manchester United.

When Jose Mourinho arrived at Manchester United, most of the fanbase was over the moon. Seen as a 'serial winner' despite having Chelsea hovering near the relegation zone in his last stint as a manager, Jose was seen as a 'guarantee' of success after the tenure of LVG and Moyes. Almost 90% of this forum said they were happy with his hiring. He arrived at the club who had just finished fifth in the league and won the FA Cup. Fans weren't happy with LVG's style of play and his downturn in results.

At the time Mourinho was given unprecedented funds that he would spend turning Manchester United into a worse team. Far from not being backed, Mourinho would take United to the highest wage bill in world football and spend hundreds of millions.

In his first tranfer window, United fans celebrated having the best transfer widow in the prem. Jose broke the world transfer record, signed Eric Bailly and Mikhytaryan. The next year he would take his net spend to 250 million. In his first two years at the club Mourinho spent 325 million pounds. Of those players, only two have played any minutes in the Premier League this season. The next year he spent another 75 million. If a manager spends 400 million and only has Lindelof and Pogba to show for it, the next manager is not going to turn it around overnight.

During this time, Mourinho also increased our wage massively. Fans may complain about the fact that Darmian and Rojo are taking up wages, however Mourinho's own desire to 'complete our attack' with Sanchez remains one of the worst bits of business ever done in the Premier League. From 2015 to 2018 (not just Mourinho's tenure, but the vast majority of this money would be Mourinho's) our wagebill increased by 93 million (or 46%). Mourinho almost doubled our wage bill and left the club further away from the title/top four and in a lower position than where he took over.

Enter Solskjaer. United fans are currently complaining that Ole Gunnar has not been backed, despite spending over 150 million pounds since his arrival at the club. Many United fans feel this way because our squad on paper in thin in so many areas. However, if the club is going to get back to the top, it is a necessary part of the rebuilding process. United have drastically lowered their wage bill, with the departures of Fellaini, Valencia, Lukaku, Sanchez and Herrera. This had to happen, we can not continue spending so much money on players who are not good enough.

If Mourinho hadn't have messed up so badly, we wouldn't be in this position. However, the signs are positive. Maguire, AWB and Daniel James have started their careers well. We are signing players for the long term in Hannibal Mejbri. Our Under 23s have been completely redesigned and are currently bossing the league. Recent work for the Athletic has shown how meticulous Solskjaer has been in redeveloping the club. Our style of football has improved.

Ole needs time. He can not possibly rectify this club in a season. People will point to other clubs who have rebuilt in a quicker time throughout recent seasons, however no club has ever ended up with such a horrendous financial position. With the money flowing through the game nowadays, every signing has to be successful and unfortunately we have been massively far off.

Great post Wum but a lot of our supporters have the patience and logic of petulant children and thats the truth.

 

[roonster09]

It's largely out of necessity though as our midfield is extremely short in numbers. Jose promoted him against odds too, he did not play regularly because he was nowhere near ready (arguably he still isn't) but he was not even tipped to make a step up in the immediate future when Jose gave him his first run.

He doesn't seem hesitant to extend minutes of players who were in our first team rotation before, the reluctance is more for giving a shot to players who weren't promoted before he joined. It's a worry for me. I think the only way we are back at the top in the next five years is if we get a lot of young talent developing from within.

Ole created that position. During preseason when he was asked about Fellaini and Herrera's replacement, he said there will be no signings. McTominay and Pereira are the replacements and both will start 20 plus games. Wouldn't call that as out of necessity, more like promoting them from smaller role to bigger one.

Agree with your second paragraph. He said once Europa league starts, others will get chances. Now it's hard as we have only 1 game per week. Lets see how he rotates when Europa league starts.

 

[Ban]

Yeah, even I don't see. But not sure how that changes anything with respect to rebuilding squad. Rebuilding doesn't mean we have to offload everyone. Ole can believe Mata is needed and still can rebuild his squad by offloading players like Lukaku, Sanchez, Fellaini and few others.

I'm just sceptical about that rebuild stuff. I hope I'm wrong but it's just the usual Ed saying what fans want to hear if he even mentioned that. All the while we have the same scatter gun approach to transfers.

 

[wolvored]

Woody said its a 3 year rebuild? I might have missed that.
He also said we'll get a DOF. I guess in 3 years time.

I read when Ole got his contract that Woody said something like Ole has been given a 3 year contract and will be given this time to rebuild the squad in the Utd tradition utilising the youth. He also mentioned Ole had a deep understanding of the club and whats needed after a successful career here. (after all the money spent on scouting and youth setup and players is logical), so as long as we are moving forward I think he will be given 2 years to make top 4 and the 3rd to consolidate, maybe even a challenge for the title. Certainly this will be expected after the 3 years. The amount of money spent on scouting and the youth, Woody also wanted someone who would start to utilise this resource.

 

[roonster09]

I'm just sceptical about that rebuild stuff. I hope I'm wrong but it's just the usual Ed saying what fans want to hear if he even mentioned that. All the while we have the same scatter gun approach to transfers.

Maybe that's true but I believe we are heading in right direction. Wish we offload Darmian and Rojo too, that would be good starting point for next window, where we can add players instead of worrying too much about offloading and squad positions.

 

[Mainoldo]

Mourinho won us a European trophy and finished second. And now the same people who think he made such a mess of the club also think Ole needs 16 transfer windows to replicate those results. Something doesn't add up here.

Sounds like when Moyes took over Fergie to a lower extent. I’m all for time but feel some people’s view of it is ridiculous.

I’m still of the opinion your either a good manager or not.

 

[Ban]

I read when Ole got his contract that Woody said something like Ole has been given a 3 year contract and will be given this time to rebuild the squad in the Utd tradition utilising the youth. He also mentioned Ole had a deep understanding of the club and whats needed after a successful career here. (after all the money spent on scouting and youth setup and players is logical), so as long as we are moving forward I think he will be given 2 years to make top 4 and the 3rd to consolidate, maybe even a challenge for the title. Certainly this will be expected after the 3 years. The amount of money spent on scouting and the youth, Woody also wanted someone who would start to utilise this resource.

It all sounds nice but in the same time Ed says a lot of things, mostly ridiculous stuff. He wouldnt bat an eyelid to sack Ole if results won't be good.

 

[acnumber9]

During this time, Mourinho also increased our wage massively. Fans may complain about the fact that Darmian and Rojo are taking up wages, however Mourinho's own desire to 'complete our attack' with Sanchez remains one of the worst bits of business ever done in the Premier League. From 2015 to 2018 (not just Mourinho's tenure, but the vast majority of this money would be Mourinho's) our wagebill increased by 93 million (or 46%). Mourinho almost doubled our wage bill and left the club further away from the title/top four and in a lower position than where he took over

Well that link only shows an increase of 32 million or 12% and you’ve deliberately left out where it says this is largely in part due to increases for participation in the Champions League. Something Van Gaal couldn’t do in his second year. When talking about signings you also choose to ignore Falcao, Schweinsteiger and Zlatan for some reason. You talk about the age of Mpurinho’s signings and LVG’s but fail to acknowledge 6 of the 11 players signed by Mourinho were 25 or under. Of the other five one was a back up goalkeeper and two others already gone. These old players signed by Mourinho we can’t shift amount to Sanchez and Matic. One almost about to leave and one we can’t sell because we decided not to sign any midfielders.

Van Gaal spent 79m per transfer window to Mourinho’s 84m. And this came after a huge rise in transfer fees. In short your ‘facts’ lack any objectivity.

 

[RedPed]

Great post Wum but a lot of our supporters have the patience and logic of petulant children and thats the truth.

100% this. That couldn't have been more evident after the meltdown from the Palace result last weekend.

 

[Lentwood]

I agree with your some of your broader points @Wumminator but I can't have the blame lying at the managers door (any of our managers) for the following reasons;

- Our problems run much deeper than any one manager. It also seems odd to blame the one who achieved BY FAR our best finish post-SAF and won two half-decent trophies.

- The reason 99.99% of major football clubs now have 'transfer committee's' or 'recruitment Director's' or DoFs or whatever you want to call them is precisely because giving a manager free reign over who comes and who goes is an incredibly short-term strategy and is asking to be abused. If you're a a football manager with a £10m a year salary and your reputation on the line, what's your incentive to plan for the future when you could be gone after a run of 5-10 bad games?

- It's been highlighted time and time again that our Scouting & Analysis departments are not up to much. I suspect we neglected this area for a long time because we were comparatively wealthy enough to cherry-pick the best players from other PL sides, without the added competition of the 'new money' clubs. If you look back at the majority of our transfers under Moyes, LvG and Jose, we often selected either players managed by, or well-known to that manager (Fellaini, Mata, Matic, Lukaku, Blind, Di Maria, Falcao, Schweinsteiger, Depay, Sanchez etc....) or players we know were recommended by the manager or contacts of the manager (Lindelof, Dalot, Rojo).

If we look at players we know, or where probably, recommended by our Scouts, we have Fred, Darmian, Bailly, Herrera, Schneiderlin.....hardly inspiring is it

I do, however, agree that the club seemed to have learned something from Jose. His admittedly short-term and selfish thinking seems to have woken them up to the fact that they need some kind of filter/long-term strategy to ensure decisions are being made in the best interests of the club and not the individuals sat in the dugout

 

[Wolff]

So tell me why didn't we get rid of Alexis and Lukaku earlier so we have time to get at least one replacement?

Oh oh oh i know the answer to this one!! Because Inter didn’t have the money and Alexis was paid like Donald Trumph!?

 

[wolvored]

It all sounds nice but in the same time Ed says a lot of things, mostly ridiculous stuff. He wouldnt bat an eyelid to sack Ole if results won't be good.

Agreed if we feck up badly. We are only 3 games in and Ole has said we are learning on the job. Lets see where we are after 10

 

[Ban]

Agreed if we feck up badly. We are only 3 games in and Ole has said we are learning on the job. Lets see where we are after 10

Agreed. It's a big risk.

 

[Mercurial]

I blame it all on Moyes! He killed our image, turned our backroom into... Everton, fired our culture bearers and rubbed that lingering midtable stench all over the club. His appointment was rubbish on so many levels, and sadly was endorsed by Sir Alex. I was ashamed and wanted to hide at all the cringeworthy drama surrounding Moyes. By my book Mou (from a distanced emotionally detached position) before his whatever theory fallout with the board, jumpstarted our slightly tarnished image, for a while got other emotions back into the mix than despair, got us a Europan (best of what was available to us) trophy, and then somehow finished us 2nd. He might have his flaws and so on and on but wysiwyg with Mourinho. In my book It took Jose 2 seasons to bring us back to winning ways and put us on the periphery of the European radar again before the inevitable lack of structure and other personality flaws of his and at the club blew chunks. I wish Ole all the best and hope his naïve tactical and managerial ways can survive long enough to rebuild us into a robust coherent unit over time, he is a softy and unproven but very sympathetic and rebuilding the club less mercenaryesque in his short time. I like what I see so far, we are thin in the squad but I blame the board for that, not Ole.

 

[crossy1686]

Agreed if we feck up badly. We are only 3 games in and Ole has said we are learning on the job. Lets see where we are after 10

Ole will get this season regardless of what happens. As long as the team continue to play the way they are it won't matter where we finish in the league (within reason) because it will be seen as progress, despite what the caf says.

 

[Massive Spanner]

Well that link only shows an increase of 32 million or 12% and you’ve deliberately left out where it says this is largely in part due to increases for participation in the Champions League. Something Van Gaal couldn’t do in his second year. When talking about signings you also choose to ignore Falcao, Schweinsteiger and Zlatan for some reason. You talk about the age of Mpurinho’s signings and LVG’s but fail to acknowledge 6 of the 11 players signed by Mourinho were 25 or under. Of the other five one was a back up goalkeeper and two others already gone. These old players signed by Mourinho we can’t shift amount to Sanchez and Matic. One almost about to leave and one we can’t sell because we decided not to sign any midfielders.

Van Gaal spent 79m per transfer window to Mourinho’s 84m. And this came after a huge rise in transfer fees. In short your ‘facts’ lack any objectivity.

Absolutely f*ckin' rekt.

 

[ArjenIsM3]

Oh oh oh i know the answer to this one!! Because Inter didn’t have the money and Alexis was paid like Donald Trumph!?

 

[Kush]

What!

Have you watched our footy this year?

I assure you, I have. Every minute of it. We still play shit on a stick football like we did under Mourinho. Before you start yapping about 4-0 versus Chelsea, here is a heatmap for the said game.

Spoiler

Notice, how little possession we have in Chelsea half? Setup to play only on the break, Lampards naivety seems them slaughtered. This is ditto of the setup we used to see from Jose in big games as well, here's an example versus City and Spurs.

Spoiler

Spoiler

I can also post heatmaps of how we play versus bottom feeders, it's identical under both Jose and Ole. Loads of possession at mid-way line and wing, but little in and around the box.

At the end of day, there are ways to rebut these stats and heatmaps but you can't deceive the eyes. I have no affinity to either Jose or Ole as a manager, and I see football of the two being identical. Out of ideas and creativity when in possession against a packed opponent.

You are proving my point. We were too slow to offer Herrera a deal under Mourinho and by the time Ole came in he was already free to speak to other clubs and as a result had extortionate wage demands. It's not Ole that wasn't desperate to keep him, it was Mourinho. Agree with the rest, though to be clear the not replacing the ones that left bit isn't on Ole but on Ed. Ole clearly stated that he wanted replacements if anyone left but didn't get any. Bit like how Mourinho was crying out for us to sign Maguire last summer but Ed refused to. Ed being in charge of recruitment is still our biggest issue. He's the factor that's slowing down our rebuild the most.

Mate, Mourinho was not in-charge as to the timing of when contract renewals were offered. Why would he be desperate when there were 7 months still to go where these things could be sorted? If the club were too late and player was to be left on a free, he'd force their hand like he did with Fellaini. Once again, we don't exactly know what ticked Herrera off. Was it lack of CL football, was it the wages, was it how slow club were to offer renewal. I don't think the timing can be adduced to the manager, but persuading a player to stay is something within managers reach.

“I was very happy, I have a lot to thank the club for, the fans and also Solskjaer. He did a lot for me to stay, but things didn’t happen. They arrived late and, by then, I’d already made the decision to play in Paris.

There isn't much Ole could have done, Herrera made his decision because of how club approached his renewal. Its not on Ole.

Thanks for pointing that out to me.